Thread: Cycle and HRT adviced needed

Originally Posted by Lone Wolf

Well doc gave me 100mg a week to start, blood work every 3-6 months for awhile I guess.
So I would like to run a cycle:
50mg anadrol wk 1-5
750mg Test wk 1-15
500mgs Deca week 1- 15

Now if I am off two months before my bloodwork will all still check out good so I may continue with hrt?

After 2 months off T will be pretty low unless you do PCT or cruise. Are you planning either?

heavyiron, he's on 100mg HRT anyway, right? No need to "turn the boys back on" - to the OP, I would think you could just run your cycle, then go straight to the 100mg per week HRT while you initiate PCT.

Thoughts?

Originally Posted by Built

heavyiron, he's on 100mg HRT anyway, right? No need to "turn the boys back on" - to the OP, I would think you could just run your cycle, then go straight to the 100mg per week HRT while you initiate PCT.

Thoughts?

So should I run a pct? because I am going to continue with the 100mg test a week after cycle, I just do not want to screw my hrt bloodwork up and get discharged.

If you want to run nolva for a month with a nat test boost you could. I think Built is right . If you are to continue hrt any way just go right back to 100mg wk. you will level off after a month any way.Since you're already low I don't see gyno or any of that being a prob. but watch out for the anadrol.

Originally Posted by dave 236

If you want to run nolva for a month with a nat test boost you could. I think Built is right . If you are to continue hrt any way just go right back to 100mg wk. you will level off after a month any way.Since you're already low I don't see gyno or any of that being a prob. but watch out for the anadrol.

Thanks guys I will just run the hrt dose after cycle no pct.
If my test comes back low they will just increase dosage.
What about estrogen level? in bl;ood work.
Also being on hrt and no pct sorta like cruising, will I be able to keep most gains?

I think with deca and anadrol you'll probably lose some water weight when you stop the cycle;but most post cycle losses come from your t levels dropping.I think with you going back to hrt that wont be a prob.I'd like to hear what the others have to say.Built ,Heavy Iron ,Mudge.etc.

Originally Posted by Lone Wolf

So should I run a pct? because I am going to continue with the 100mg test a week after cycle, I just do not want to screw my hrt bloodwork up and get discharged.

Oh, I see. No PCT is needed. If you go on your HRT dose 2 months is plenty. T and Estro drops rapidly once you lower dose. Gains are usually not a problem however your HRT dose is very low. I imagine you will have some losses. Let me dig up a science article for you.

Lone wolf, I think you need to be clear about what will happen at the end of your cycle.

Under "ordinary" (read: non-hrt) cycles, you go on, your levels are high, then you go off, your levels drop to below-normal and then back up again as your boys turn back on.

This will not happen to you. Your boys will NEVER turn back on. That's why you're on HRT, because they weren't making enough for you to begin with. You aren't going to try to turn them back on. From the time you begin your cycle, I'd like you to consider what would happen if you were castrate: your level will be whatever you take.

If you go to supraphysiologic dosing, you will be supraphysiologic.

If you go off, you'll be hypogonadal.

If you go to HRT-dosing, you'll be "normal".

Your choice to use PCT or not will have nothing to do with coaxing your body to return to producing normal levels because it won't have to - that's what your HRT is for.

(It's more complicated than this because of SHBG and androgen receptor up and down regulation, but let's just consider endogenous test production for this point)

The one caveat I'll add is that the oral may leave you with elevated SHBG, which won't affect total test very much but WILL affect bioavailable free test - not something you want when your HRT dose isn't all that high. In your situation, I'd suggest simply frontloading the test and ditching the oral entirely.

What ester are you running?

Originally Posted by heavyiron.

Oh, I see. No PCT is needed. If you go on your HRT dose 2 months is plenty. T and Estro drops rapidly once you lower dose. Gains are usually not a problem however your HRT dose is very low. I imagine you will have some losses. Let me dig up a science article for you.

thanks bro.I think that the doc may actually up his hrt dose if he plays it right.

Testosterone dose-response relationships in healthy young men -- Bhasin et al. 281 (6): E1172 -- AJP - Endocrinology and Metabolism

Testosterone dose-response relationships in healthy young men -- Bhasin et al. 281 (6): E1172 -- AJP - Endocrinology and Metabolism

These charts show what affects 125mg and other doses of T have on the human body. Look at the 125mg group as it should give you a good idea what to expect after 16 weeks on that dose. As you can see 125mg of T had these guys around 570ng/dl. The labs were taken 7 days after the last T inject at week 16. My doc likes to see my Total T around 1,000ng/dl so I use 200mg weekly for that value.


Full study
Testosterone dose-response relationships in healthy young men -- Bhasin et al. 281 (6): E1172 -- AJP - Endocrinology and Metabolism

so 100 mgs wk isn't enough to even really normalize anyone? I thought that dose sounded low,but its a crapshoot asking for a higher amount depending on the doctor.Some just don't get it.

Originally Posted by dave 236

so 100 mgs wk isn't enough to even really normalize anyone? I thought that dose sounded low,but its a crapshoot asking for a higher amount depending on the doctor.Some just don't get it.

100mg T weekly is a joke. Especially when you consider that the referrence ranges used by labs included sick and elderly men. Who wants the Total T levels of a 60 year old. It makes no sense.

Originally Posted by heavyiron.

100mg T weekly is a joke. Especially when you consider that the referrence ranges used by labs included sick and elderly men. Who wants the Total T levels of a 60 year old. It makes no sense.

amen

Originally Posted by dave 236

thanks bro.I think that the doc may actually up his hrt dose if he plays it right.

I am hopeing thats the case, I really appreciate all the great info you guys have given me.
I have a blood test coming up in a month to see if my dose hould be raised
hopefully they raise it to 200mg a week then I will start my cycle.
Now the doc told me if it was low still that they will put me on 200mg per week, should I just not inject my 100mg a week before testing to insure that it gets raised?
Also do these hrt clinics make you come in alot for blood work is there a time they stop testing?

The studies heavyiron posted and the ones I've read tested individuals just before their weekly shot - that is, when blood levels will be at their lowest. Since the goal is to keep the individual both comfortable AND no lower than the low-end of the normal physiologic range, with a once-a-week pinning schedule, your doctor should tell you to come in just before your weekly shot.

If you are pinning twice a week, my suggestion would be to switch to weekly pinning the week before your bloodwork.

In other words, if you are currently pinning 50mg Thursday and Sunday, and plan to have your bloodwork drawn on a Thursday AM, try this:

Two weeks before:
Sunday: 50mg
Thursday: 50mg

One week before:
Sunday: skip
Thursday: 100mg

Testing Week :
Sunday: skip
Thursday: get bloodwork drawn, then pin 100mg. This will bring your blood levels up again, like a small frontload.

Subesquent weeks:
Sunday: 50mg
Thursday: 50mg

Etc

Make sense?