Thread: Advise for first cycle

Honestly, and this is just my opinion, you're still too high in BF to begin a cycle. You're much more likely to put on more bf than lean muscle with a calorie surplus, regardless of using gear or not.
Not to mention 6 weeks isn't a long enough cycle to put on any noticable mass. Based on your goals of wanting a hardened, chisled look, you're not going to achive that. Gear simply will not help you get rid of that much bodyfat, especially while eating enough to build muscle.

A few points need to be made;

17% BF is waaay too high i'm sorry to say. The benefits of cycling lean are many, you have clearly done some research so i'd carry on reading up on stuff until your a bit leaner like at least sub 12%.
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You also have 4 different compounds there which all interact with the body in a different way, how are you going to know if you need to cut back the tren for example if you have 3 other compounds in your system
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Ancillaries - you have none. Research Aromasin/Exemastene, Arimidex even HCG for a longer cycle etc.. i do not consider proviron an ancillary.
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Tren is NOT for first timers. You have to earn that shit!
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Eq needs to be run at least 12 weeks and probably would be better pinned twice a week and in reasonably high doses i know this from personal experience.
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Proviron? why.

Go back to the drawing board and go look at running a 10 week cycle of Test cyp/enth 500mg (250mgx2/week), Include an AI like Aromasin @12.5mg/day and HCG too. Nolva will be fine for PCT. Jobs a good'un.

ROAST

This is a shit load of pinning for your first cycle. And mixing that many compounds your first time out is not recommended. And as FMJ said, the cycle is not long enough. The EQ wont kick in until week 5 or so. And your also going to want to run HCG during cycle at least 2x's per week until your ester's clear, so your going to be shooting way to much.

I would recommend going with Cyp at 500mg (250mg twice per week) for 10 weeks along with .5mg Adex EOD and 250iu's twice per week. Get your PCT in order and see how your gains are and if you have any sides. If things run well, take 3-4 months off and then try your Tren cycle. JMO

Good luck

Originally Posted by roastchicken

A few points need to be made;

17% BF is waaay too high i'm sorry to say. The benefits of cycling lean are many, you have clearly done some research so i'd carry on reading up on stuff until your a bit leaner like at least sub 12%.
+
You also have 4 different compounds there which all interact with the body in a different way, how are you going to know if you need to cut back the tren for example if you have 3 other compounds in your system
+
Ancillaries - you have none. Research Aromasin/Exemastene, Arimidex even HCG for a longer cycle etc.. i do not consider proviron an ancillary.
+
Tren is NOT for first timers. You have to earn that shit!
+
Eq needs to be run at least 12 weeks and probably would be better pinned twice a week and in reasonably high doses i know this from personal experience.
+
Proviron? why.

Go back to the drawing board and go look at running a 10 week cycle of Test cyp/enth 500mg (250mgx2/week), Include an AI like Aromasin @12.5mg/day and HCG too. Nolva will be fine for PCT. Jobs a good'un.

ROAST

Read the bold bro.

Everyone knows not to use tren on a first go, Just do testosterone champ, or testosterone and a kicker with Dbol or winni what ever your goals are.

Also like someone said drop a little more body fat %. I know a guy on another board who is huge and also knows his shit, and he always suggest's 14% or under.

but thats just him and he is full of good info.


Also your location says Oz....you a fellow Aussie?

I know you're excited to try your stuff now that you have it, but the other posters are correct.

IF you ran that cycle as planned you would be wasting gear, time and money.

What is your PCT plan?

You're not ready for this yet.

I would encourage you to read up on nolva and why it shouldn't be used with a 19 nor such as tren. You should also look into caber, pramipexole, aromasin, hcg.

Wait a little bit and get your BF down, you'll be happy you did. Good luck and welcome!

Thanks for your replies fellas,

Regarding my bf% I'm only going off an electric body compisition alalyzer and I highly doubt its accuracy. I'm fairly well defined it's just that I have a fair bit of lose skin around my stomach that has very soft spongy like fat tissue and it seems to be diet/cardio resistant. Its not noticable when I'm wearing a shirt to the point where fellow gym rats are telling me I'm lean enough to start growing again.

I'm eating about 2100 clean calories per day and only carbing before and after a workout. Zig zagging my calories has helped in the past but that trick no longer works.

I had incorporated 35 mins of fast paced cardio after every workout and lost 10kg of fat ( no muscle lost) over six months but it has now platued therefore it has become quite demotovating to do cardio, espeacially as my legs are usually that sore from squatting that I can hardly walk for three days a week.

I was thinking about throwing ephidrine into the mix to help me achieve my goals but didn't want to risk a loss of appetite and insomnia as this would be self defeating over an extended period of time. I looked into liposuction but that was too extreme and costly.
I'm just paying the price for once having a huge beer belly so I figure I may aswell grow into it lol.

@ Roast- Proviron is all I can get atm and although it is not classed as an AI there is plenty of research that shows it is very effective in preventing gyno related problems, increased libido and give a hardening look aswell. I have also been told by a regular user that it is all he and his associates has ever used but I realise that it may be a simple case of them not being prone to gyno.

As for the Eq I was planning to use a small dose to help with the pain of the prop injections aswell and stimulate the appetite as I've heard that it can be difficult to eat whilst using tren.

@ Mr BTB Yeah I'm from Aus bro.

@ChocThunder- Thanks for the welcome

I have researched about using Nolva with tren/test and I had no intentions of using is as an AI whilst on a cycle as tren gyno is due to prolactin/progesterone issues. It is for this reason that I thought I should start this thread to get some veteran advise.

My plan for PCT was Nolva one day after test injection @ 40/20/20/10 but have some on hand incase I needed more.

I see guys at the gym and they are big but they are smooth with no definition at all and it's for this reason I wanted to steer clear of the cycles that have been suggested to me on this thread however it seems that the responses I've received are pretty standard therefore I willl go back to the drawing board and start with a more basic cycle. If I respond well with not too many sides a can throw the tren into the mix next time.

Thanks guys.

Hey bro I was going to msg you but you wont be able to msg back yet with a low post count.

What state are you in brother?

Originally Posted by Mr.BTB

Hey bro I was going to msg you but you wont be able to msg back yet with a low post count.

What state are you in brother?

I'm sure that you can understand that I'm reluctant to give out any personal details as I'm new to discussing illegal substances in forums and I'm not really sure on the protocol. Is it common for people to ask those questions?
I'm sure you're fine but I would feel foolish to give out such info

mate . . you can trust Mr BTB . . he once gave Julia Gillard hard anal in an elevator . . but he still votes liberal

Your EQ 1-6 25mgs a day does not make any since at all. EQ for 12 to 16 weeks at 400 to 600 mgs a weeks then u will. Go straight test C AT 500 TO 750mgs a week for 10 to 12 weeks then hit your PCT, after that, then start stacking.

lol bro there are millions of people in every state, I was just curios, fair enough if I asked your name D.O.B and addy lol that is suss.

Thats all good though man, once you stick around longenough you'll see fellow aussie's like capt'n and myself are decent.

Originally Posted by TheCapt'n

mate . . you can trust Mr BTB . . he once gave Julia Gillard hard anal in an elevator . . but he still votes liberal

fucken a I did, she went off like a frog in a sock!

Does anybody know the shelf life of the compounds that I've listed? What is the best way to store them ( fridge maybe).

Sorry for the late reply but I was a bit pissed. Julia Gillard told me I was the only one that had given her anal.

BTW- I'm NSW BTB lol

Spoken to my mate who's a veteran with the gear and he said I'm good to go and have nothing to worry about. If this shit doesn't store well I'm gonna have to get my AIs and go for it however if it stores fine I can wait.

Mate you really dont wanna use tren if this is your first go, it will last til your next cycle, but do not...DO NOT put it in the fridge, keep it in a cool dark place, like the bottom of your cupboard or buy a small esky (thats a cooler box for you american guys) and put it in there and put it in the cupboard (obviously not on ice lol).

You would also be best off dor the sake of not looking liek a pin cushion this time round shoot 100mg prop eod, and maybe split the dose of eq into 2 shots.

Like I said the gear if it is legit will last a while. But you dont want to go the route of tren first go mate. You should leave it for your 3rd cycle at least.

All the best champ

And we can share the ranga

Ok, so what sort of results would a 6 week cycle of test prop/eq achieve?

Would it be worthwhile?

I'm thinking that I may get enough gear to make for an 8 week cycle but I only have enough proviron for 7 weeks and cannot get any more.

I've been assured that proviron works fine to combat estrogen related problems and in a sticky on another BB forum it states to "Make sure you have arimidex or proviron on hand during the cycle."

Do you guys use AIs from day one of a cycle or keep them as a back up for if gyno becomes an issue? I've read mixed opinions regarding this topic as some guys only take AIs when needed and others take them regardless.

Can I start taking proviron two weeks into my cycle? That way I can run an 8 week cycle and have some extra proviron incase I need to up the dosage.

Thanks

the EQ would be a waste to only use for 6 weeks bro. Test prop would be fine infact great for 6 weeks.

If you can get dbol a test prop dbol cycle for 6 weeks would be best.

Otherwise save your EQ for when you can get some more and run it longer bro.

I use an AI from day one . . preferably a suicidal like aromasin . . for whatever reason never had any dramas ordering AIs into Aus . . opened and all . .

Originally Posted by TheCapt'n

I use an AI from day one . . preferably a suicidal like aromasin . . for whatever reason never had any dramas ordering AIs into Aus . . opened and all . .

Can you PM me with a contact that won't stitch me up?

Do you use your credit card?

I'm a bit paranoid about customs, is it legal? If customs opened your package and sent it through why can't we order from Oz?

Can we get nolva through aswell?

Are you that saying that I shouldn't rely on proviron to stop gyno?

Nothing is 100% effective but Aromasin is your best bet. Use that shit from day 1 of cycle to last day of PCT. i can recommend researchstop.com ,they ship fast from the states to the UK ,they ship discreetly, you can pay card and i have completed half a dozen orders.

Do not rely on proviron

IMHO 6 weeks is a waste of injectables. Go longer or don't bother

It seems that 500mg of test a week is pretty standard for a first cycle. What if I was to do an 8 week cycle as follows:

Week 1-8 145mg Test Prop (EAD)
Week 1-8 70mg Eq (EAD)
Week 1-8 Aromasin
Week 9-12 Nolva

(Proviron on hand for libido)

Would that make more sense?

Originally Posted by BillHicksFan

It seems that 500mg of test a week is pretty standard for a first cycle. What if I was to do an 8 week cycle as follows:

Week 1-8 145mg Test Prop (EAD)
Week 1-8 70mg Eq (EAD)
Week 1-8 Aromasin
Week 9-12 Nolva

(Proviron on hand for libido)

Would that make more sense?

You got some good advice and cycle suggestions - BUT you don't listen to them? EQ less than 12 weeks is a waste of gear.

Originally Posted by roastchicken

You got some good advice and cycle suggestions - BUT you don't listen to them? EQ less than 12 weeks is a waste of gear.

To be honest I wanted to throw in the EQ as apparantly the Test prop stings like like bitch and I was told the the EQ takes away some of the pain and helps with the appetite.

To me thats not a good enough reason to just throw an extra compound in the mix!

Man up

You've never even experienced a prop injection so how can you speculate ?

Training hard will increase your appetite not a measly amount of EQ.

Originally Posted by roastchicken

To me thats not a good enough reason to just throw an extra compound in the mix!

Man up

You've never even experienced a prop injection so how can you speculate ?

Training hard will increase your appetite not a measly amount of EQ.

I train with 100% intensity, that's no problem. I was more concerned about the prop injections having a negative effect on my training as I've read stories of guys skipping training sessions due to painfull injection sites. Probably pussies but I'm new to this, there's only one way to find out.

Experiment with a few different sites.

I stick with quads and glutes, the glutes are pretty neutral cause their such a big muscle and quads are easy to pin and easy to get to.

The first few jabs are always the worst but then you kind of get used to it.

I could not stress enough the importance of using separate needles. One for drawing the oil from the vial and another for pinning yourself. This can make a huge difference to injection pain. Also use a shorter pin over a longer pin and a decent gauge can help 22/23g is good. Alcoholic swabs are a must if you are OCD about jabs

hope this helps

Originally Posted by BillHicksFan

I train with 100% intensity, that's no problem. I was more concerned about the prop injections having a negative effect on my training as I've read stories of guys skipping training sessions due to painfull injection sites. Probably pussies but I'm new to this, there's only one way to find out.

Since you are new to this why are you not listening to what numerous others have posted?

500mg test E and 400mg Eq wk1-12
That was exactly what i did for first cycle,with excellent results...
You have proviron as an Ai,nolva in case of gyno,you could add some HCG to keep the big boys working...
That's a simple and yet very effective first cycle!