Thread: e-control by ironmaglabs

ATD for Estrogen Control & PCT

ATD (3,17-dioxo-etiochol-1,4,6-triene) is a recent introduction to estrogen control. It is thought to stop estrogen production in a manner similar to steroidal AI’s such as exemestane. Brand name ATD’s are Rebound XT, Rebound Reloaded, Novedex XT, Ultra H.O.T and Ultra H.O.T.ter.

ATD is technically an aromatase inhibitor, but with some interesting properties that make it a very useful addition to our estrogen control arsenals.

There are two negative feedback loops that we try to correct through post cycle therapy. The first is elevated estrogen levels from aromatase activity act on the hypothalamus to decrease GnRH production. The second is that elevated androgen levels stimulate androgen receptors in the hypothalamus causing decreased GnRH production. Decreased GnRH leads to reduced LH and FSH production, both of which are directly involved in testosterone production.

Typical PCT with SERM’s and AI’s address the estrogen component of this negative feedback, but do nothing for androgenic stimulation of the hypothalamus. ATD addresses the androgenic feedback loop. ATD has 90% androgenic activity in muscle tissue but only 10% androgenic activity in the hypothalamus.

ATD works for androgen activity the same way that tamoxifen works for estrogen. Tamoxifen blocks estrogen in breast tissue, but has positive effects in other tissue such as liver and bone. ATD blocks androgens in the hypothalamus, but allows it to be active in other tissue.

Because of this dual action estrogen levels are lowered while testosterone levels begin to rise. This is because ATD tricks your hypothalamus into thinking testosterone levels are low so it produces more. ATD provides benefits far beyond simply controlling estrogen in your body. Through its control over the androgen negative feedback loop testosterone production is restarted much faster. And the faster you recover your natural testosterone production the easier it is to keep muscular gains.

In addition to ATD’s benefits for post cycle therapy studies have shown that employing ATD during AAS use maintains significant HPTA function. This means reduced testicular atrophy and faster post-cycle recovery. This is something that you simply can’t get from estrogen control alone.

ATD can also be used by the natural athlete to increase testosterone production. In studies increases of up to 400% in testosterone have been seen. This is equivalent to injecting 400-600mg per week of testosterone enanthate or cypionate. This means continued growth for the natural athlete without the problems and side effects usually associated with injecting testosterone.

While there should technically not be any difference between the ATD ptoducts I have personally seen the best results using Rebound XT by Designer Supplements. I believe it is also the most cost effective of the ATD products out there. Your mileage may vary.

I’ve found the following discussion on running SERM’s inverse to ATD’s which is both informative and by all accounts very effective. It has been posted on many forums and the credit for it goes to Dr. D. Thank you Dr. D! “Discussion on running SERM inverse to ATD.

Estrogen only “rebounds” based on the mechanism of suppression. SERM, for example, only masks estrogen expression by occupying receptors but estrogen production is left unchecked and actually increases as testosterone levels increase. AI’s like letro inhibit inducible enzymes and just like a leaky faucet, they body will eventually try to balance the equation with increased aromatase activity. Steroidal AI’s like Teslac, Exemestane, and ReboundXT will not result in ‘rebound’ phenomena because the inhibition is non-competitive and irreversible. They act as false substrates, so aromatase is still happy to act on them (instead of androstenedione) and the body keeps no record of an imbalance. There is no leaky faucet. In fact, after prolonged use, steroidal AI’s often produce a protracted anti-e benefit even after being discontinued. This is why I suggest an inverse taper with SERM and RXT for PCT with an abrupt stoppage of RXT at the end. As the SERM elevates androgen/estrogen production, the AI dose is increased to compensate while the SERM is phased out. It works quite well to use this approach and rebound is not encountered. Adding LX and/or DHEA also really makes for a killer PCT in this scheme.

can you run this as cycle support (along with a cycle)??

Originally Posted by klc9100

can you run this as cycle support (along with a cycle)??

I do, I love this stuff!

Originally Posted by Prince

I do, I love this stuff!

is that the only AI you use?

the reason i asked is because the directions say to take 2 per day for no more than 6 weeks.

Originally Posted by klc9100

can you run this as cycle support (along with a cycle)??

Im runing it as an AI right now so far so good

Originally Posted by bknoxx

Im runing it as an AI right now so far so good

how are you dosing it? what is your cycle?

I am curious too because in its use instructions it says "Do not use this product for more than 6 weeks." So if you are running a cycle would you just stop using it?

I am sorry if my question was buried in everything else I said but what I had trouble understanding was what does it mean it is irreversible? Does it mean to permanently binds to the receptors rendering them occupied, fried or useless forever and if so, does the body overcompensate later? What is the benefit of irreversible or would it be considered a side effect instead?

Originally Posted by carmineb

I am sorry if my question was buried in everything else I said but what I had trouble understanding was what does it mean it is irreversible? Does it mean to permanently binds to the receptors rendering them occupied, fried or useless forever and if so, does the body overcompensate later? What is the benefit of irreversible or would it be considered a side effect instead?

It's not forever

Originally Posted by carmineb

I am sorry if my question was buried in everything else I said but what I had trouble understanding was what does it mean it is irreversible? Does it mean to permanently binds to the receptors rendering them occupied, fried or useless forever and if so, does the body overcompensate later? What is the benefit of irreversible or would it be considered a side effect instead?

i'm sorry bro. i didn't mean to hi-jack your thread. i just figured i would add my question in here instead of starting another one.

i don't understand how you can run it as cycle support but not use it for more than 6 weeks. . .

Originally Posted by klc9100

how are you dosing it? what is your cycle?

1 cap a day right now 4 weeks into test 500mg and 40mg dbol
so far works great i got 2 bottles when it was on sale along wiht metha-drol
im not sure abt the 6 weeks part but im gonna use it for my cycle i talked to HI abt it he said it would be g2g

Originally Posted by bknoxx

1 cap a day right now 4 weeks into test 500mg and 40mg dbol
so far works great i got 2 bottles when it was on sale along wiht metha-drol
im not sure abt the 6 weeks part but im gonna use it for my cycle i talked to HI abt it he said it would be g2g

cool, i guess he would know. i was just concerned since it said it on the label. thanks bro.

how is your cycle going by the way?

its going good i switched test the last couple pin's from gp to test c from my doc but im gonna go back to GP and see how it goes i was getting alot of pain from the gp test and none from the script test

Are you using the Enanthate or the cyp from GP? I used the cyp and had no pain until I got to the last injection left in the vial. Then on the last inject my leg swelled up and I thought it was infected luckily it was just irritation but it makes you wonder what causes that to happen sometimes. I do everything the same everytime. It is just odd.

thank u for the answer. I feel better knowing it wasnt frying my receptors or permanently binding to them forever....