Thread: Please point me in the right direction

[QUOTE=Gfy55;2273733]I just finished 14 weeks of test c (600mg weekly x 8 weeks then 750mg thereafter), EQ (600mg weekly 1-13) and 50mg of dbol ed till week 4. My AI of choice was adex .5mg ed and my PCT which i am about to start in 10 days (clomid 100/100/75/50 and Aromasin 25/25/25/12.5. I am also considering using GHRP-6 at 300mcgs 2-3 times daily to keep my appetite on full throttle.
This is my first successful run at AAS.
If you notice in the pic, i had arthroscopic surgery on my shoulder. I still have some soreness every now and then so i have deca on my mind for the aches but i here and read so much good about tren that im confused.QUOTE]

It would mainly depend on your goals.
if you wanted bulk deca may be best
cut/recomp tren would be better
or bulk minus the bloat NPP(short ester deca) may be best

depending on your weight increase from your first cycle i'd probably keep the test at the same dose, it should be plenty even with tren or deca

i'd prefer to see you use the deca than the tren. for 4 reasons.
1. it is only really your second cycle and tren is godly for gains(sides dicounted )so you may want to hold off a little longer.
2. due to the rapid strength gains of tren it could exacerbate the situation
3. tren i find personally crushes my appetite(not ran a full run just a little taster of ace) so if that is a concern deca is preferable
4. deca will only improve the shoulder and i've had ankle, shoulder, hip wrist problems all disappear with deca usage.

either one you choose you will need caber or prami, i prefer caber

never used GHRP-6 but will do when i use tren fully

if you were gonna use the tren you could either stick with the enth or use sust as your pinning eod anyway.

hope this helps some

I assumed that tren is a big jump for my second time around. Thanks for that good info. I have some GL deca sitting here. You think i can kick start with d-bol again for 6 weeks instead of 4 or do you recommend another oral?

no worries. If you grew well off dbol last time there isn't necessarily a need to change it. that being said dbol is fine run at 6 weeks with the right liver support in place.

however i prefer anadrol but many find it is incredibly harsh.
i have gone as high as 150-200mg ed with only bloat and a touch of prolactin gyno.

if you wanted to use the drol i suggest going in the 50mg range to begin with and stay on that for about 4 weeks. but run it with caber at .5mg e5d and nolva at 10-20mg ed.

other orals i ahve used are anavar and tbol

var is great for pumps and kicks in for me at least in a couple of days and will give great strength gains yet it quashed my appetite

tbol i didn't care for even at doses of 200mg ed i didn't like it, its a very slow kicker. but does give a slow increase in strength which may be best with your shoulder concerns and is actually better run for about 8 weeks, it is more expensive than dbol however. it did make me hungry as sin, i was eating every hour with snacks and still starving.

if it was me i would go with anadrol but, orals are very personal

Honestly i havent read much on anadrol. I'll take that under consideration and weigh out the pros and cons during my PCT. Thanks again for that info

Originally Posted by Gfy55

Honestly i havent read much on anadrol. I'll take that under consideration and weigh out the pros and cons during my PCT. Thanks again for that info

anadrol is my favorite oral. you should look in to it.

Seems pretty amazing to me. I was also double checking the compound of it, its 17aa where as deca is 19 nor which means i would be good to go. If i plan to use it for six weeks do i need to taper down? 100/100/75/75/50/25mg? or can i cruise at 100 the first six weeks?

Originally Posted by Gfy55

Seems pretty amazing to me. I was also double checking the compound of it, its 17aa where as deca is 19 nor which means i would be good to go. If i plan to use it for six weeks do i need to taper down? 100/100/75/75/50/25mg? or can i cruise at 100 the first six weeks?

you would still need caber on hand, as anadrol is real bastard it can cause all types of gyno, prolactin, progesterone as drol directly upregulates estrogen receptors and bind itself.
as far as dosages if anything i'd go; 50/50/100/100(then sides allowing)/150/150 but as you up drol dose i suggest you up liver support too, your liver will thank me
although i've never gone over 4 weeks due to liver problems not fun i ran out of liver 52, vomiting blood was not a planned part of the cycle.
you will want to run low dose nolva while on drol to prevent negative sides as AI's won't do shit as it is DHT based

I read that 150mg of anadrol would do the same as 100mg.

I found that Test/Deca/Anavar was a really good cycle for gains and joint injury recovery. I have bum joints and the triple combo really helped me recover from injury.

I need some more feedback. That tren from wp looks mighty good! ::sigh::

What do you want to hear? Run the tren?


Listen to these bros your asking input from. It's simple:

Bum shoulder - Deca

Only second cycle - don't use Tren


You already got the deca on hand, right? Get your test, get your kicker, done.

Originally Posted by Poopypants

What do you want to hear? Run the tren?


Listen to these bros your asking input from. It's simple:

Bum shoulder - Deca

Only second cycle - don't use Tren


You already got the deca on hand, right? Get your test, get your kicker, done.

gotta agree with Poops, if you want us to say use tren your barking up the wrong tree, it is not advisable for such an early cycle

Originally Posted by tupin

I found that Test/Deca/Anavar was a really good cycle for gains and joint injury recovery. I have bum joints and the triple combo really helped me recover from injury.

Tupin the best joint recovery wouldn't be far off that cycle, if you ran test at 250mg a week and then ran the deca at 400mg with var at 60mg ed the deca and anavar both improve joint care and without the test being at supra doses it does not negatively effect collagen synthesis but improves it and so you would have the best lubed joints on the planet, just a thought.

Originally Posted by Gfy55

I read that 150mg of anadrol would do the same as 100mg.

I beg to differ drol has a 8 hour half life if your dividing that eavenly at 100mg you will maintain a bloof level of a little over 30mg yet with 150mg ed your closer to double that figure.

I found 150 to be much more fun to play with in terms of weight gain and strength and pumps, size but is also a hell of a lot more toxic.

I mean it the only negative side i ever really encountred with drol is toxicity issues and they only occurr at 150mgs for me. research symptoms of liver failure i had all those symptoms at once when i last ran drol at 150mg.

even at 50mg or 100mg you will be blown away by drol

Its not what I want to hear. I can tell trapz knows his stuff, he's just the only one that chimed in. Nonetheless he gave valid points and I'm a Taurus...stubborn as hell lol! How's this?
Test C or E @ 600mg. weeks 1-7
Test c or e @ 750mg. 8-12
Deca @ 400mgs 1-11
Anadrol 1-6 50/50/100/100/150/150
Aromasin @ 12.5mg ed or eod?
Ghrp-6 300mcg three times daily

Trapz, you said something about taking low dose nova and caber. How would I go about implementing that in my cycle? I know it's for the anadrol. Thanks

Originally Posted by Gfy55

Its not what I want to hear. I can tell trapz knows his stuff, he's just the only one that chimed in. Nonetheless he gave valid points and I'm a Taurus...stubborn as hell lol! How's this?
Test C or E @ 600mg. weeks 1-7
Test c or e @ 750mg. 8-12
Deca @ 400mgs 1-11
Anadrol 1-6 50/50/100/100/150/150
Aromasin @ 12.5mg ed or eod?
Ghrp-6 300mcg three times daily

Trapz, you said something about taking low dose nova and caber. How would I go about implementing that in my cycle? I know it's for the anadrol. Thanks

lol Taurus indeed!!
i think the cycle for the most part looks fine just a couple of tweeks;

1. no need for the changing dosages start at one dose and stay at that with the test
2. with the GHRP-6 datbtrue says that over 200mcg a dose the increased benefits are almost none so just saving the pennies
3. I prefer longer cycles with deca and find it is best to run test 2 weeks beyond the deca
4. i prefer adex on cycle as it is not as potent and you can then switch to asin for pct to get the additional benefits that it brings to a pct

i will outline the caber dosage and nolva dosage in the cycle

tweaked cycle;
1-14 test c/e 750 mg
1-12 deca 400mg
1-6 anadrol 50/50/100/100/150/150(watch the liver)
1-14 adex .5mg eod
1-20 caber @.5mg e5d
1-6 nolva @10 mg ed
2 weeks after last test pin start pct;
15-20 asin @12.5mg ed
17-20 nolva @40/40/20/20
17-20 clomid @100/75/50/50

With the deca may be best to implement a HCG protocol aswell, i prefer shocks as opposed to cruises

some may say that is a lot of ancillaries and an excessive PCT but i would rather er on the side of caution

Originally Posted by trapzilla

lol Taurus indeed!!
i think the cycle for the most part looks fine just a couple of tweeks;

1. no need for the changing dosages start at one dose and stay at that with the test
2. with the GHRP-6 datbtrue says that over 200mcg a dose the increased benefits are almost none so just saving the pennies
3. I prefer longer cycles with deca and find it is best to run test 2 weeks beyond the deca
4. i prefer adex on cycle as it is not as potent and you can then switch to asin for pct to get the additional benefits that it brings to a pct

i will outline the caber dosage and nolva dosage in the cycle

tweaked cycle;
1-14 test c/e 750 mg
1-12 deca 400mg
1-6 anadrol 50/50/100/100/150/150(watch the liver)
1-14 adex .5mg eod
1-20 caber @.5mg e5d
1-6 nolva @10 mg ed
2 weeks after last test pin start pct;
15-20 asin @12.5mg ed
17-20 nolva @40/40/20/20
17-20 clomid @100/75/50/50

With the deca may be best to implement a HCG protocol aswell, i prefer shocks as opposed to cruises

some may say that is a lot of ancillaries and an excessive PCT but i would rather er on the side of caution

Some good advice here but a few things that I don't agree with. Nolva should not be used while using a 19-nor like Deca. Nolva can cause prolactin gyno to get worse. No need for Nolva in PCT either if you are using Clomid this was once a part of PCT protocol but is not considered outdated. Use Clomid and aromasin for PCT for 4 wks
Clomid at 100/100/75/50mgs a day Aromasin at 25/25/12.5/12.5 ed.
Hcg is best used while on cycle at 250ius 2Xs a week until the end of cycle stop before PCT. Limit anadrol to 4 wks only it is harsh on the liver and there is no need to run it this long since test will be kicked in by 4 wks. The drol dosages are high too. If you are experienced with it this will be ok but no need to go so high if you have never used it before it can cause a lot of sides that is why I prefer dbol. Dbol makes my appetite stronger where drol kills my desire for food. Drol gives me headaches and raises BP more so than Dbol. Dbol makes me feel good drol does not. Everyone is different there though. If I do use drol it is only 50-100 mgs a day. You may like more though but I wouldn't recommend going over 150mgs a day. Like Trapz said you can use adex during cycle if you would rather use adex instead of aromasin. I like aromasin at 12.5mgs eod myself but either is good. Aromasin is the best AI for PCT though. Everything else Trapz said is good advice. I think I covered the main things. I like that he has the test running longer than the deca. He included caber for prolactin. He has an AI the doses are a good starting point for everything. Good post Trapz just some minor issues. Most were ok a few years ago. Nolva specifically . The views have changed over the past few years regarding this SERM.

[QUOTE]Tupin the best joint recovery wouldn't be far off that cycle, if you ran test at 250mg a week and then ran the deca at 400mg with var at 60mg ed the deca and anavar both improve joint care and without the test being at supra doses it does not negatively effect collagen synthesis but improves it and so you would have the best lubed joints on the planet, just a thought.[QUOTE]



This would cause Deca dick in most people. That means no sex drive. You could add more of an androgen to try to combat it.

[QUOTE=TGB1987;2274851][QUOTE]Tupin the best joint recovery wouldn't be far off that cycle, if you ran test at 250mg a week and then ran the deca at 400mg with var at 60mg ed the deca and anavar both improve joint care and without the test being at supra doses it does not negatively effect collagen synthesis but improves it and so you would have the best lubed joints on the planet, just a thought.

This would cause Deca dick in most people. That means no sex drive. You could add more of an androgen to try to combat it.

True TGB but i was just taking it from my experience on test/deca ratios i.e deca has never really interferred with my libido. but the doagesa re easy enough to alter but, i would be more inclined to reduce the deca than bump the test due to the negative impact of supra physiological doses of test on collagen synthesis.

Originally Posted by TGB1987

Some good advice here but a few things that I don't agree with. Nolva should not be used while using a 19-nor like Deca. Nolva can cause prolactin gyno to get worse. No need for Nolva in PCT either if you are using Clomid this was once a part of PCT protocol but is not considered outdated. Use Clomid and aromasin for PCT for 4 wks
Clomid at 100/100/75/50mgs a day Aromasin at 25/25/12.5/12.5 ed.
Hcg is best used while on cycle at 250ius 2Xs a week until the end of cycle stop before PCT. Limit anadrol to 4 wks only it is harsh on the liver and there is no need to run it this long since test will be kicked in by 4 wks. The drol dosages are high too. If you are experienced with it this will be ok but no need to go so high if you have never used it before it can cause a lot of sides that is why I prefer dbol. Dbol makes my appetite stronger where drol kills my desire for food. Drol gives me headaches and raises BP more so than Dbol. Dbol makes me feel good drol does not. Everyone is different there though. If I do use drol it is only 50-100 mgs a day. You may like more though but I wouldn't recommend going over 150mgs a day. Like Trapz said you can use adex during cycle if you would rather use adex instead of aromasin. I like aromasin at 12.5mgs eod myself but either is good. Aromasin is the best AI for PCT though. Everything else Trapz said is good advice. I think I covered the main things. I like that he has the test running longer than the deca. He included caber for prolactin. He has an AI the doses are a good starting point for everything. Good post Trapz just some minor issues. Most were ok a few years ago. Nolva specifically . The views have changed over the past few years regarding this SERM.

i figured it would be okay to run the nolava with the deca and drol combo due to the caber being in there which should take care of the proalctin issue correct?
one thing i've never understood TGB is why it is seen as unnecessary to use nolva and clomid during a pct? it is jsut that from my persepctive you are introdcuing an additional estrogen via the clomid and so without anything to inhibit binding to receptors surely gyno is still and issue?
and in case IGF levels are a concern DatbTrue and dr.crisler have shown that nolva has a nigh on negligible effect on igf at reasonable doses.

was unsure of the drol length too, hence i was makign apoint of liver support and other ancillaries as these have been the issues prevetnign me from running it longer.

thanks for the back up though

So scratch the nolva all around and reduce anadrol to 4 weeks? Up dose depending on sides?

i'd follow what TGB says owing to him being around a bit longer than me and drop out the Nolva and keep the drol down to 4 weeks with a max dose of 100mg ed

[QUOTE=trapzilla;2274873][QUOTE=TGB1987;2274851]

one thing i've never understood TGB is why it is seen as unnecessary to use nolva and clomid during a pct? it is jsut that from my persepctive you are introdcuing an additional estrogen via the clomid and so without anything to inhibit binding to receptors surely gyno is still and issue?

I believe the answer is that clomid is a SERM as well, so it binds to estrogen receptors but doesn't cause an estrogenic response (in most tissues, I believe nolva actually acts as an estrogen in the liver but not sure about clomid). Nolva is similar to an estrogen as well which is why serm's block the estro receptor, adding nolva shouldn't have any additional effect as long as clomid dosage is high enough.


I would still keep the nolva around for gyno though, from what I've read it's more effective at preventing breast growth and it works at incredibly low dosages.

[QUOTE=Digitalash;2274931][QUOTE=trapzilla;2274873]

Originally Posted by TGB1987

I believe the answer is that clomid is a SERM as well, so it binds to estrogen receptors but doesn't cause an estrogenic response (in most tissues, I believe nolva actually acts as an estrogen in the liver but not sure about clomid). Nolva is similar to an estrogen as well which is why serm's block the estro receptor, adding nolva shouldn't have any additional effect as long as clomid dosage is high enough.


I would still keep the nolva around for gyno though, from what I've read it's more effective at preventing breast growth and it works at incredibly low dosages.

I thought it was that Nolva blocked the estrogen receptor completeley whereas Clomid acted as a milder estrogen, producing a lesser estrogenic response than normal estrogen.
hence i always but Nolva in my PCT's to cover as many possible angles, but maybe i won't anymore(if i do anymore pct that is)

[QUOTE=trapzilla;2274959][QUOTE=Digitalash;2274931]

Originally Posted by trapzilla

I thought it was that Nolva blocked the estrogen receptor completeley whereas Clomid acted as a milder estrogen, producing a lesser estrogenic response than normal estrogen.
hence i always but Nolva in my PCT's to cover as many possible angles, but maybe i won't anymore(if i do anymore pct that is)

Honestly you may be right though I've never heard that. I've heard of clomid causing "emotional side effects" so maybe that's the cause. Someone else would have to chime in here as I have no experience on the matter. First cycle and most likely using nolva and an AI for pct.

Also to OP I had forgotten you were using Deca so maybe nolva would not be a good idea for gyno. Make sure you have some caber or bromo though