musclepump

Has anyone actually seen or have access to a report of any kind that actually links steroids to death? I'm trying to see how many deaths steroids cause each year, but I can't even find one in history

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TJ Cline

See if you can find any from marijuana also...I don't think you will find any for either drug unless other drugs are involved....I did read in the PDR that Anadrol has been the cause of some liver tumors.

musclepump

Yeah, I've never thought pot to be a killer either, unless you count those useless brain cells as actual deaths...

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Mudge

It takes time to die from steroids, cholestrol doesn't kill you overnight, as an example.

If you want to die quickly, you need to screw up with your insulin useage.

Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench
Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin
When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu
I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

musclepump

But have you ever seen any direct evidence linking steroids to death, Mudge?

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Mudge

Mike Matarazzo was close to death at 39 years of age, but he had his arteries cleared in time.

So steroids, no. Its not something that can kill you overnight unless you already have very high BP and it somehow sets you over the edge and you die of a heart attack or brain hemorage.

Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench
Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin
When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu
I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

JACKED

Hey fellas, I was just reading in on the thread and I have an interesting mag about 21/2 years old called, "planet muscle" by the one guy (can't remember his name until I find the mag) married to the bber chic. Anyway the article was huge about roids and the basic tenet was about making an informed decision about using. Anyway it has a list of roids and what they will do to you in their LONGEST TERM EFFECTS i.e. I do remember the anadrol saying that it had to be ingested for 11 months straight until bloody cysts emerged. As I type this i'm looking for the mag in my box cuz i'm sure it had something in there in relation to the question and when I find it i'll qoute it and put up the bibliograph so guys can read it.

musclepump

Obviously it's not an overnight thing. But like tobacco is linked to 420,000 deaths a year, I'm just trying to find any actual stats that link steroids to death. They can't link steroids to cancer, so those deaths go unaccounted for, you know?

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TJ Cline

Thats information copied out of the PDR....it's a great read if you have access to one

musclepump

Pdr?

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TJ Cline

Physicians Desk Reference

musclepump

ah

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JACKED

HEY FELLAS!! I Found It!!! Lemme read it real quick and I'll post it.

JACKED

Planet Muscle Volume5 #3. Medical ...Literature by Jeff Everson

Rumors of serious side effects related to steroid use, and particularly oral steroid use, in otherwise healthy individuals, begun in the early seventies. However, the bulk of actual data revolved around hospitalized patients.

In a landmark literature review in 1975, researchers reported 12 cases of cancer development associated with steroids. Again, the caveat was that these subjects were already hospital patients, compromised in some medical manner and subsequently treated with steroids.
For example researcher Johnson reported a case of Fanconi Anemia where a 20 year old male received 10 months of treatment with ANADROL 50 (oxymehylone). The patient developed liver cancer with bloody cysts and Died. One patient who Dr. Johnson reveiwed developed l...eukemia after being treated with 300mg. Per day of ANADROL (ouch!) for a NINE-MONTH period. A different patient with a case of non-descended testicles, treated with Methyltestosterone, developed primary cancer, which then spread.
Doctors have also noticed that liver tumors often shrink and disappear with cessation of steroid administration.

Here is Dr. Johnsons orginial list of the oral anabolic steroids, doses and time length of use, associated with side effects of a serious nature in hospitalized patients:

Anadrol 10-250mg/day 10-51months Liver cysts, tumor, leukemia

Methyltestosterone 20 to 50mg/day 1-165 months Liver tumors

Winstrol 2.5 to 15mg/day 18 months Liver tumors

Dianabol 20 to 150mg/day 12-18 months Liver tumors

Halotestin 15 to 80mg/day 4-16 months bloody cysts

Nilevar 20 to 30 mg/day 2-9 months bloody cysts

TJ Cline

My brother in law was hospitalized years ago ( for what I cant remember) and they put him on a 10 day Anadrol cycle. And get this the first day was 800mg.......yep. every day they decreased the dose...no wonder people in hospitals die from steroids. Hell 4 % of all drug related deaths in America are due to prescription drugs.

musclepump

Methyltest pretty bitching at 1 month

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JACKED

Another snippet from this same article states a death attributed to steroid use according to author Bob Goldman in a Flex Magazine article and in his book DEATH IN THE LOCKER ROOM; the case of Daniel Baroudi, a serious bodybuilder who had self-prescribed a series of different anabolic steroids over a 5-7 year period. Baroudi developed primary liver cancer and his doctors concluded that it was his heavy use of oral steroids that had induced his cancer. Sadly Mr. Baroudi died in 1984.

In 1985 another serious recreational bodybuilder, William Loomis, was hospitalized with cancerous tumor of his liver. Mr. Loomis had been using doctor-prescibed Anadrol, non-stop, for almost 2 years. It was not a high dose but Anadrol is a notorious Liver-unfriendly, oral steroid. Mr. Loomis did have periodic blood exams, which ofted do not detect the presence of a tumor which was the case here.

Mudge

There is a famous case with a woman on anadrol who also developed lesions on the liver. We trust these people with our lives sometimes and look at the STUPID shit they do. I had my own blood work done during one of my anadrol runs and I know what my limits are, and its nowhere near 10 months at high doses.

Morons.

PDRs are outdated by the time they hit the shelves by the way, and they dont include speculative data that could be up to the minute stuff. I have one anyway, just for kicks.

Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench
Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin
When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu
I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

JACKED

Boys this stuff tells me two things. Don't let DRs perscribe you juice, and Drugs are drugs no matter who prescribes em.

Mudge

Kind of like, an apple is an apple not an orange. Yeah.

Doctors working with accutane are supposed to show restraint when prescribing it, and they are supposed to monitor your liver values. I have heard people say they are tested as often as twice a month.

Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench
Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin
When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu
I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

JACKED

From the same article, a run down of the tests one should get while on the sauce:

1) Blood Glucose

2) Blood Urea Nitrogen (BUN)

3) Creatinine

4) The BUN/Creatinine ratio

5) Total Protein

6) Albumin

7) Globulin

8) Albumin/Globulin ratio

9) Total Bilirubin

10) Alkaline Phosphatase

11) GGTP

12) AST (SGOT)

13) ALT (SGPT)

14) LDH

15) Cholesterol... DUHHHH!!

16) HDL and LDL cholesterol fractions

17) The Cholesterol/high Dnisity Lipoprotein

18) Triglycerides

19) Total Testosterone

20) Cortisol

JACKED

Hey try telling a Doctor to test for something they don't normall test for. They think you're trying to insult them. Their like "WHY DO YOU THINK YOU NEED THIS?" "SAYS WHO?" Or this one "I guess you went to school for 14 years blah blah blah"

I can't stand most doctors.

musclepump

These are all liver things, it seems. But would it be the steroids actually causing it, or just undue stress on the liver in general? Alcohol could be associated too, and it may be oral steroids in general just pushing the liver too far, not necessarily one specific type.

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JACKED

Thats sounds like it to me. It more than likely seems to be the undue stress caused by Alpha Alkalated drugs. Also paticular dosages for long periods of time. Thats is why I thought that chart would be useful because it gives us a concrete explanation as to how long one could push the envelope on these orals to get maximum results. IT DEFINATELY SAYS THAT ROIDS WERE THE DETERMINING CAUSE OF THESE AILMENTS. In reality looking @ it from the stand point of alcohol use mixed with an oral version one could say that it is still the roid causing the damage. I haven't known one alcoholic to develop bloody cysts, tumors, or Leukemia from Alcohol alone but we are reading that its happened from the juice. My Uncle actually is a heavy drug user and alcholic who just contracted some sort of liver infection and he's been drinking everday I've know him for 20 years. When I say Heavy drug use I mean HEROIN. He dosen't have bloody cysts and the like.

Mudge

It isn't the steroid that is eating the liver its that its an oral drug DESIGNED to resist liver breakdown which causes liver stress.

Look at Tylenol abusers, they helped put it #2 on the map for causes of cirrhosis.

Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench
Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin
When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu
I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

musclepump

nice facts

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musclepump

Intraveneous doesn't hit the liver like orals do

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