Total Testosterone

HardTrainer · 05-25-2005, 08:46 AM

My total testosterone was only 14.7 is that shit or can it vary much depending on how you feel (mood etc)

HardTrainer · 05-25-2005, 08:47 AM

is a free testosterone check better?

LAM · 05-25-2005, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HardTrainer

My total testosterone was only 14.7 is that shit or can it vary much depending on how you feel (mood etc)

that can't be right. the range for total T levels should range from about 260-1500 ng/dl. for males from the ages of 20-49 yo the median range is about 625 ng/dl.

what other results from your blood work do you have ?

HardTrainer · 05-25-2005, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LAM

that can't be right. the range for total T levels should range from about 260-1500 ng/dl. for males from the ages of 20-49 yo the median range is about 625 ng/dl.

what other results from your blood work do you have ?

none but its is 14.7 dunno the range what do you think it is?

HardTrainer · 05-25-2005, 09:19 AM

This is just off the net saying total test levels just read the BOLD

We(1) and others have established that men with coronary heart disease (CHD) have lower serum testosterone levels than men with normal coronaries. Hypotestosteronaemia is associated with dyslipidaemia, visceral obesity, insulin resistance, hypertension and a prothrombotic state.
The aim of this study was to determine the prevalence of hypogonadism in men with CHD proven by either greater than 70 per cent stenosis of one or more epicardial or greater than 50 per cent stenosis of the main stem of the left coronary artery. Patients with an elevated CRP were excluded.
1146 undergoing elective coronary angiography were recruited of which 831 patients fulfilled the criteria above. Androgen status was assessed by total testosterone (TT)(normal range 7.5 - 35 nanomoles per litre) and bioavailable testosterone (BioT)normal range less than 2.5 nanomoles per litre.
Results - 14.1 per cent had TT less than 7.5 nanomoles per litre, 19.9 per cent BioT less than 2.5 nanomoles per litre. 23.4 per cent had either low TT and/or low BioT. Repeat testing showed close correlation between samples (r=0.89, p=0.0002). TT and BioT levels were significantly lower in subjects with obesity (p less than 0.000001)and a history of hypertension (p=0.036). Hypogonadal symptom scores (ADAM questionnaire) were positive in 93.5 per cent of patients retested with low TT and/or BioT.
This study shows a high prevalence of hypogonadism in men with angiographically proven CHD. This has wide clinical implications suggesting that men with CHD should be screened for hypogonadism and considered for testosterone replacement if indicated and that there are no contraindications.
(1) English et al. Eur Heart Journal 2000; 21: 890-4.

HardTrainer · 05-25-2005, 09:20 AM

mine was 14.7

brogers · 05-25-2005, 09:33 AM

Notice it says 7.5-35 NANOMOLES per --LITRE--

Whereas LAM's units were ng/dL

Different units. You do the calculation/conversion yourself

LAM · 05-25-2005, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HardTrainer

mine was 14.7

ng/dl x .03467 > nmol/L

so 14.7 nmol/L divided by .03467 = 423.99 ng/dl

424 ng/dl is definetly low for a guy your age

**Mudge** · 05-25-2005, 09:37 AM

I've seen "normal" males with low 200s, so while it may be low some people just dont pump out that much. Unless you go to a VERY liberal HRT clinic, a regular MD and even many endos wont want to change that for you.

Free T tells you what is actually useable, SHBG soaks up almost everything else.

LAM · 05-25-2005, 09:59 AM

if you have the values from SHBG you can determine your Free Androgen Index (FAI) or free test with this formula.

FAI = 100 x TT (in nmol/L) / SHBG (in nmol/L)

* where TT = total testosterone

HardTrainer · 05-25-2005, 10:43 AM

what should i do? could i somehow supress my test level futher and then have another test for TT which would give the doc no choise to give me HRT?

**dg806** · 05-25-2005, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LAM

is definetly low for a guy your age

Which is?

**Mudge** · 05-25-2005, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HardTrainer

what should i do? could i somehow supress my test level futher and then have another test for TT which would give the doc no choise to give me HRT?

So they can give you a lousy androgen patch to make you high normal? They will test you again later most likely anyway to see where the andro patches put you.

Even if they put you from 400 to 600, what is that going to do for you? Virtually nothing.

**Prince** · 05-25-2005, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LAM

424 ng/dl is definetly low for a guy your age

it is a bit low, but when was the test taken, what time? that can be a factor as well as many other things, i.e. stress.

you should get at least one more test done and make sure it is first thing in the morning.

BronzeGuy · 05-25-2005, 12:28 PM

So... Alcohol, time of day, and stress can impact your T levels. How big of an impact can stress be?

Would Anabolic Matrix help much if T is abnormally low because of stress?

Thanks

**Prince** · 05-25-2005, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BronzeGuy

So... Alcohol, time of day, and stress can impact your T levels. How big of an impact can stress be?

sure, so can a poor diet.

HardTrainer · 05-25-2005, 12:34 PM

i dont drink acohol and my diet is good, i am a bit stressed and it was at 2 pm i think.

**Mudge** · 05-25-2005, 12:35 PM

T is always highest at wakeup, thats why you get morning wood (and it keeps things functional). Raw T has no ester, so its up and down through the day.

**Prince** · 05-25-2005, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HardTrainer

i dont drink acohol and my diet is good, i am a bit stressed and it was at 2 pm i think.

go get one done at 8am.

HardTrainer · 05-25-2005, 12:58 PM

i know that test eth is used for HRT but at what dosage and do you just jack for ever?

**dg806** · 05-25-2005, 01:03 PM

Probably 100/200mg a week. It is for the rest of your life.

LAM · 05-25-2005, 01:07 PM

Males 20-49, median @ 625 ng/dl, central 95% @ 286-1,511
Males >50, median @ 438 ng/dl, central 95% @ 212-742

**Prince** · 05-25-2005, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HardTrainer

i know that test eth is used for HRT but at what dosage and do you just jack for ever?

you're not going to find a doc that will Rx you testosterone at 424 ng/dl because that falls within the "normal" range.

**Mudge** · 05-25-2005, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HardTrainer

i know that test eth is used for HRT but at what dosage and do you just jack for ever?

Testosterone Cypionate is used in the US, and yes, HRT is for life unless something magical happens and you suddenly discover normal hormone levels. Not likely to happen when you hit your 50s and 60s.

**Mudge** · 05-25-2005, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert DiMaggio

you're not going to find a doc that will Rx you testosterone at 424 ng/dl because that falls within the "normal" range.

I know a guy with one testicle, and he only got HRT through an online clinic. His regular doctor flatly refused because there was no reason, and he was nowhere near 400s.

400+ is not that low. Like I have said on this board before, I have seen EARLY 20 year old white males scoring LOW 200s. Do they get HRT? Almost NEVER.

And HRT is going to be an andro patch first, or a doctors visit every 2-3 weeks for a shot. If you are doubly "lucky," you get do do your own shots. Find yourself a liberal endo and maybe you will get lucky, but what for? Again I say you are fine. Thats the genetic luck of the draw.

HardTrainer · 05-25-2005, 02:47 PM

I dunno what doc are like in america about roids but in england they arnt looked at so bad, i just been on a uk website were guys with level of 450+ were given HRT because of low libio (cant spell) and depression, tiredness etc, i mean what does you Doc do if you keep coming back and saying your very depressed and have bad libio he gonna give you anti depressents and viagra for the rest of your life or a bit of test and stay in the natural range?

05-25-2005, 08:46 AM	#1
HardTrainer Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 472	Total Testosterone My total testosterone was only 14.7 is that shit or can it vary much depending on how you feel (mood etc)
HardTrainer Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 472

05-25-2005, 08:47 AM	#2
HardTrainer Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 472	is a free testosterone check better?
HardTrainer Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 472

05-25-2005, 09:19 AM	#5
HardTrainer Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 472	This is just off the net saying total test levels just read the BOLD We(1) and others have established that men with coronary heart disease (CHD) have lower serum testosterone levels than men with normal coronaries. Hypotestosteronaemia is associated with dyslipidaemia, visceral obesity, insulin resistance, hypertension and a prothrombotic state. The aim of this study was to determine the prevalence of hypogonadism in men with CHD proven by either greater than 70 per cent stenosis of one or more epicardial or greater than 50 per cent stenosis of the main stem of the left coronary artery. Patients with an elevated CRP were excluded. 1146 undergoing elective coronary angiography were recruited of which 831 patients fulfilled the criteria above. Androgen status was assessed by total testosterone (TT)(normal range 7.5 - 35 nanomoles per litre) and bioavailable testosterone (BioT)normal range less than 2.5 nanomoles per litre. Results - 14.1 per cent had TT less than 7.5 nanomoles per litre, 19.9 per cent BioT less than 2.5 nanomoles per litre. 23.4 per cent had either low TT and/or low BioT. Repeat testing showed close correlation between samples (r=0.89, p=0.0002). TT and BioT levels were significantly lower in subjects with obesity (p less than 0.000001)and a history of hypertension (p=0.036). Hypogonadal symptom scores (ADAM questionnaire) were positive in 93.5 per cent of patients retested with low TT and/or BioT. This study shows a high prevalence of hypogonadism in men with angiographically proven CHD. This has wide clinical implications suggesting that men with CHD should be screened for hypogonadism and considered for testosterone replacement if indicated and that there are no contraindications. (1) English et al. Eur Heart Journal 2000; 21: 890-4.
HardTrainer Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 472

05-25-2005, 09:20 AM	#6
HardTrainer Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 472	mine was 14.7
HardTrainer Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 472

05-25-2005, 09:33 AM	#7
brogers Registered User Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 1,401	Notice it says 7.5-35 NANOMOLES per --LITRE-- Whereas LAM's units were ng/dL Different units. You do the calculation/conversion yourself
brogers Registered User Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 1,401

05-25-2005, 09:37 AM	#9
Mudge Dieting I swear! Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Here Posts: 23,149 Photos: 1	I've seen "normal" males with low 200s, so while it may be low some people just dont pump out that much. Unless you go to a VERY liberal HRT clinic, a regular MD and even many endos wont want to change that for you. Free T tells you what is actually useable, SHBG soaks up almost everything else.
	Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

05-25-2005, 09:59 AM	#10
LAM Gym ratt/Part-time pimp Join Date: May 2002 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 7,384 Photos: 2	if you have the values from SHBG you can determine your Free Androgen Index (FAI) or free test with this formula. FAI = 100 x TT (in nmol/L) / SHBG (in nmol/L) * where TT = total testosterone
	Dumbest statement made in the Anabolic Zone for Nov TBD ----------------------------------------------------- What you talking about Willis ?

05-25-2005, 10:43 AM	#11
HardTrainer Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 472	what should i do? could i somehow supress my test level futher and then have another test for TT which would give the doc no choise to give me HRT?
HardTrainer Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 472

05-25-2005, 12:28 PM	#15
BronzeGuy Registered User Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 27	So... Alcohol, time of day, and stress can impact your T levels. How big of an impact can stress be? Would Anabolic Matrix help much if T is abnormally low because of stress? Thanks
BronzeGuy Registered User Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 27

05-25-2005, 12:34 PM	#17
HardTrainer Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 472	i dont drink acohol and my diet is good, i am a bit stressed and it was at 2 pm i think.
HardTrainer Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 472

05-25-2005, 12:35 PM	#18
Mudge Dieting I swear! Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Here Posts: 23,149 Photos: 1	T is always highest at wakeup, thats why you get morning wood (and it keeps things functional). Raw T has no ester, so its up and down through the day.
	Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

05-25-2005, 12:58 PM	#20
HardTrainer Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 472	i know that test eth is used for HRT but at what dosage and do you just jack for ever?
HardTrainer Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 472

05-25-2005, 01:03 PM	#21
dg806 Guardian of The Homeland Super Moderator Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Charlotte NC Posts: 17,510	Probably 100/200mg a week. It is for the rest of your life.
	www.sbmuscle.com

05-25-2005, 01:07 PM	#22
LAM Gym ratt/Part-time pimp Join Date: May 2002 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 7,384 Photos: 2	Males 20-49, median @ 625 ng/dl, central 95% @ 286-1,511 Males >50, median @ 438 ng/dl, central 95% @ 212-742
	Dumbest statement made in the Anabolic Zone for Nov TBD ----------------------------------------------------- What you talking about Willis ?

05-25-2005, 02:47 PM	#26
HardTrainer Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 472	I dunno what doc are like in america about roids but in england they arnt looked at so bad, i just been on a uk website were guys with level of 450+ were given HRT because of low libio (cant spell) and depression, tiredness etc, i mean what does you Doc do if you keep coming back and saying your very depressed and have bad libio he gonna give you anti depressents and viagra for the rest of your life or a bit of test and stay in the natural range?
HardTrainer Member Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 472

05-25-2005, 03:14 PM	#27
Pirate! Gatekepper Moderator Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Texas Posts: 5,817