Tha Don

i shot 0.3ml (which is just under 500iu as its 1500iu per ml) just below my hip at the top of my leg/arse, went subQ, what do you normally notice from hcg? i've heard i should shoot this 2-3 times a week up until 5 days before pct starts and my balls are back to size, sound ok?

bit happier after that, hopefully the hcg use will ensure swift recovery, my balls aren't really shrunk at all yet (maybe a tiny bit, but hardly noticable) but i've heard 500iu is too little a dose to cause any desensitization, so it can only be beneficial right?

Tha Don

oh and it ain't half a bitch trying to draw from an amp with a 0.5inch slin pin!

musclepump

What made you shoot there? Most people shoot 2-3 inches to either side of their navel.

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gococksDJS

I've read conflicting views on whether or not HCG helps you recover quicker in PCT. It without a doubt helps on cycle, but HCG mimics LH, it doesn't signal the secretion of LH, meaning your hypothalamus and pituitary gland are still shut down. Your pituitary gland has two lobes. The anterior lobe and posterior lobe. The anterior lobe is where hormones are secreted in response to signals from the hypothalamus, so your hypothalamus (which has been shut down on cycle) has to sense the drop in LH, signal the anterior lobe of your pituitary gland (which has also been shut down) to produce LH which in turn stimulates the leydig cells in your testes to produce testosterone.

19-chief

yeah, why there? the waistline is much easier to see and pinch. you could always just jab it IM too... in which case i'd just shoot the slin pin in the delt.

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Tough Old Man

I must be a sick person. I just shoot the shit. Sometimes in the forearm, leg, tricep, stomach. Fucking doesn't matter to me. Hell a 29 x 1/2 every 3-4 days compared to jabbing EOD with a 23 x 1.5 is a piece of cake

Pirate!

Your dosing is a bit on the high side if they aren't shrunken. 500 iu every 4 or 5 days would work fine. Drawing from a vial--as opposed to an amp--would be ideal. You could also use a 1.5" IM pin and shoot either sub-Q or IM.

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Tha Don

sounds silly, but i didn't want to shoot around my abs

19-chief

that is silly. just shoot it IM to the delts or quads then!

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Tha Don

apparently you can shoot sub Q anywhere, as long as it goes under the skin, apparently the back of the arm is another popular place, but it would be tricky with 1 hand, i seem to have this little pocket of room under my hip, i can grab a fair bit of skin without pinching any muscle, so i'll just stick with that, it was a piece of cake, no need to create any additional scar tissue with unnecessary IM shots

PWGriffin

So what do you recommend for PCT then?? Just nolvadex or what??

kraziplaya

for my only two cycles i ran hcg leading up to pct and never felt any real shutdown during pct.. dont know if its me or the hcg

kraziplaya

i know what shutdown feels like too...funny thing is...i got shutdown bad on 1-ad... for 2-3 months i had no sex drive and felt funny down there

gococksDJS

Some people do use HCG during PCT, but I personally don't agree with it because it is counter-productive. Your goal in PCT is to get your HPTA up and running again as quickly as possible so that you can hold on to as much of your gains as possible. So you want to get your hypothalamus, pituitary gland and testes working again, but HCG mimics LH to produce natural testosterone and is also suppressive to your hypothalamus and pituitary gland, so when you drop the HCG, you will still be suppressed. I have just used nolvadex in the past, and it has done fine for me.

Tha Don

sorry just to clear things up i'm still on the test/eq, i'm planning my last test/eq shot tomorrow, and next week i'll drop the eq and it will just be the test, then i'll leave it 2 weeks and begin pct, so hcg therapy will finish well before pct starts

PWGriffin

I've read the rule of thumb (foremans' rule) is 60/40/40/20 starting 14 days out...how does that strike you?

PWGriffin

Dude how much could ur testes have POSSIBLY atrophied in like 4 or 5 weeks??

gococksDJS

That sounds find to me but you'll most likely be able to tell if you are dropping the nolva too quickly. On my last cycle, I started at 60, dropped to 40 for 2 weeks then to 20, but had a gyno scare so I upped it back to 30 for 2 weeks, and 20 for a week and a half, so my PCT ended up being about 5.5-6 weeks after a 13 week cycle.

TrojanMan60563

Just a thought you could pre-load 3 slin pins with the 500iu and throw them in the fridge until you want to use them....I have to do that since my amps are 5000iu....get 10 pins ready to roll.

gococksDJS

same here. I get 5000iu and load 500iu into per pin all at once and store them in the fridge.

Mudge

Tilt the amp

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HANK-VISSER

i do the same thing

PWGriffin

So you don't use HCG for PCT but during ur cycle??

Pirate!

Can it be called "Post Cycle" if you are still using suppressive hormones?

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PWGriffin

Yeah I guess ur right...just alot of people have different opinions on HCG use and when to use it and how much...what is the standard use anyway? Seems like everyone just does what they want...

gococksDJS

Yes. Think of your body as a machine. Machines operate on the basis of mechanical advantage, or the ratio of output force to applied force. So your body is trying to operate as efficiently as possible. To produce testosterone, your hypothalamus has to signal your pituitary gland to produce LH which in turn signals the leydig cells to produce testosterone. So it's basically a three pathway production, but why use 3 when injecting HCG eliminates the need for two of those pathways (hypothalamus and pituitary gland) so in order to operate more efficiently, the two pathways shut down, and as long as you are injecting HCG regularly, your body has no need to produce it's own LH. This is the same for any source of exogenous hormone. People who think HCG is a good choice for post cycle therapy most likely do not know how the human endocrine system operates and what HCG is actually doing to their bodies. The goal of PCT is to get your HPTA back up and working, because testosterone is not produced naturally in the absence of the hypothalamus and pituitary gland.

PWGriffin

Ok thank you for the analysis...So what would be a good model to go by in the use of HCG?? (dosages and when to start it....this is where I've seen so many differences of opinion)

gococksDJS

That all depends on you, and how quickly you shut down, but you will be able to tell. The first week or two your libido will be sky high and you will be walking around with a board in your pants, but soon enough you will still be horny but not hard, and as soon as I start having trouble keeping it up is when I start it. I also vary my dose depending on whether or not I can perform, but I start with 500iu every 4 days or so, but sometimes need more. You'll be able to tell.

TrojanMan60563

Without bloodwork I cannot say for certain, but my last aborted cycle of 5 weeks test e/deca I never got past being hard all the damn time. I felt like a natural born porn star the entire time. I did no PCT and never had a libido problem or anything like that. I didn't do a PCT because I didn't want anymore drugs in the mix as I was starting BP meds because of high HP issues on cycle.Anyways I don't think that 5 weeks of 500mg test/400mg deca shut me down much if any. I am sure it did to some degree but not enough for me to notice any problems.as it is I have a libido thats insane.

Pirate!

You're a lucky man. Even test can lower my libido. I was only good for about two week on test/npp.

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