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BiggT
04-05-2008, 11:47 AM
Im seriously persuing becoming a pro and i have the right genetics and ability to do so i think.

I want to know what kind of steroid regimen i should start and when? I have heard that 20 is when you should start, i have heard 24-25? When?

Aside from [I]when[I] i want to know [I]what [I] more.

Even though i may not start now, at age 20, i still want to know what i should take.

Thanks

ZECH
04-05-2008, 01:35 PM
You have to have a great foundation first

soxmuscle
04-05-2008, 01:56 PM
Steroids at age 20 is stupid, unless you started training at age 10 or earlier.

quark
04-05-2008, 03:48 PM
Steroids at age 20 is stupid, unless you started training at age 10 or earlier.

Don't get him going (http://www.ironmagazineforums.com/anabolic-zone/83476-deca-dbol.html) again! *lol*

Mudge
04-05-2008, 07:39 PM
Cutler was already a monster by age 22. Guys who have the real desire and ability to do so generally get very far in a very short period of time.

primo1
04-06-2008, 04:12 PM
what are your numbers? pretty amazing you already know u have what it takes to be a pro someday at the age of 20.

tomuchgear
04-06-2008, 05:56 PM
i think you should wait till you are older to start. you are only twenty if you think you have the potential to go pro seek it out naturaly first. always build on your own juice should be a later resort. like some one else said build a good foundation first. all the juice in the world will not help you if your training is not spot on.

Irons77
04-06-2008, 08:07 PM
How do you know your "genetics" are that good?

BiggT
04-07-2008, 01:21 PM
Well i have been doing a lot of research lately about steroids [mainly from steroid.com] and according to that site, you should be at least 18 before starting up on steroids. The only reason it might be a little to soon to start for me is that i have only been seriously persuing bodybuilding for about a year and a half [although ive been lifting for much longer but not seriously]. Since starting my own training and eating regimen, i have gone from 160lbs to my current 215, at 5'9, naturally. I estimate my bf% somewhere between 10 and 15.


the reason i think i have the proper genetics is just how well i build and hold solid mass that is very proportionate and symmetrical. i have a pic of my back from a few weeks ago that i will try to get up on my profile.


I think im going to just follow the cycles listed on steroid.com because they explain everything very well and has cycles for beginners to intermediate and advanced, in-depth.

BiggT
04-07-2008, 01:31 PM
i just posted a couple pics of me in the member gallery. check em out =]

and btw i watched a vid of cutler at 22 on youtube. he was on roids then no question.

i also saw a vid of him at age 19. its obvious that in between 19 and 22 he started using.

this is where im at now so how am i too young?

tomuchgear
04-07-2008, 02:11 PM
well you have to look at the long run here. right now your body has not reached its peak, your body will continue to pump plenty of test on its own. some thing to think about you have made up your mind either way. i personaly think you should wait and do alot more research, and more training. since you are able to keep making gains naturaly why mess things up or try and speed them up.

ZECH
04-07-2008, 03:07 PM
Some good posts by Trouble and something to think about later in life. Is your steriod useage worth it??



In the appropriate context and duration, steroids have a place in developing a platform for superior althletic performance. The working assumption on conditions pre-steroid use: stress is low, glucose metabolism is highly efficient (and I've demonstrated elsewhere that this is supported elegantly in the biomedical literature and in practical application), and the body is as optimized and at its maxiumum natural bodymass- a jump point for careful use of a few selected cycles to readjust bodymass controls, and allow the frame to accomodate a higher lean muscle mass, with proportionate stength, than it would other carry. Trade off: shortens lifespan if allowed to continue as a practice for decades. Why? Only so many cell divisions in your body, and you are burning them at a faster rate than evolutionary controls allow to happen naturally. Plus, with added miles of duct work, the heart must enlarge to meet the extra blood volume demand. Meanwhile, the brain is paying in price in elevated testosterone and reduced estrogens through atrophy.

Again, know your tradeoffs, benefits and costs. Also note, that what you are tweeking with steroids can be tweeked by other means nuclear receptor ligands and gene transcription factors. The chemistry boyz know this. Thats the next generation of legal chemicals that will (or is) be in widespread use. They will afford the steroid user an intelligent alernative to both long-term xenobiotic chemical use and pct, and afford on their own a happy medium between 'natural maximum' and 'chemically enhanced maximum', circumventing many of the negatives of the latter and promoting liver and brain health.

1. Gear is used at supraphysiological doses.

2. It has a marked dose-dependent effect - on many tissues, not just skeletal muscle. At a "trade-off point", the costs of higher dosing begin to become evident. Worst tradeoffs? Suppression of LH release and supression of endogenous test.

Evidence of increased cancer risk, associated with age, diet, stress, sleep, and liver health, primarily via liver drug metabolism (PXR) receptor and CYP genes responsible for normal function of the cholesterol biosynthesis pathway.

Fuck with these long enough, at high enough doses, and you're courting real risk of fatal direct and indirectly AAS-promoted adverse effects.

ZECH
04-07-2008, 03:11 PM
Know this: EITHER longterm intense training (at least 5-7 yrs) under optimal glucose tolerance OR several years use of AAS will promote changes in the polymorphic expression of the androgen receptor (eg, you achieve a near permanent, highly stable, change in natural bodymass maximum over the lesser trained individual, who will revert fairly quickly if training is ceased for several months).

However, if you use AAS before this condition naturally occurs (in your early to mid 20s), you will gain LESS net excess lean body mass (LBM), because you will not have fully maximized your androgen receptor number in muscle tissue. This maximim AR number is a function of the number of years of maximum androgen concentration effect on maturation of muscle quality and fully developed muscle matrix support tissue.

To put this more simply: if you use androgen excess before the entire neruomuscualr system is naturally optimized by careful diet and longterm training, you will limit the extent of the total net benefits gained from AAS use, but you will still incur the total net costs at supraphysiological dosing.