Thread: 400 lbs and In Need of Advice

Good choice to do something about the weight bro. I'd eat a light meal before doing cardio, such as some oats or toast, fruit, and egg whites. Yogurt should be cool as long as it's fat free, sugar free, and you're not eating an 8-pack in one sitting. Definitely hit the weights. It will help you add muscle mass and raise your metabolism, which is what you want when you're trying to burn off insane amounts of fat. A healthy lunch and dinner is a meal without all the shit you said you've cut out. Some lean meat, with moderate carbs, such as yams, brown rice, or whole grain bread. Some bread should be okay though, as long as it's a whole grain bread w/out sugar. Don't overdo it on the cardio; four fast walking sessions each week for 30-40 minutes should be enough to boost your metabolism and keep you in a fat burning mode.

The most important thing is consistency. If you keep it up and don't go back on couch potato/eating binges every 3-4 weeks, you should start to notice amazing results very soon. Just MHO.

GICH!

We are in similar situations, and sizes. I am 30 and I am 6'3" tall. On monday I weighed in at 401.2, today I weighed in at 394.6. Not much difference, and most could be the difference in time of day, but I am just glad to not see that 4.

I am keeping my calories under 2000 daily right now. I am keeping track with an application on my phone that syncs with a website.

I don't have the stamina problems you describe though. I can easliy do 45 minutes on the treadmill at 3.5-4mph. I also do the stationary bike for 30 minutes without trouble.

I am obviously no expert, but as I understand it (and someone will correct me if I am wrong), for the most part, cardio burns calories NOW, while you are doing it. Muscle mass burns calories ALWAYS. Neither of these are absolute truths, but generally, that is how I understand it. You need cardio, but don't forget the weight training.

Thanks Guys - I appreciate the input.

For a guy my size trying to lose, what type of oatmeal would be best prior to a workout? instant or regular?

also, regarding lifting - what is best to start with - less weight w/ a ton of reps? or more weight w/ less reps?

In my opinion, you should focus on your diet right now. What everyone says is true - weightlifting WILL help you to build muscle mass and keep the weight off. That said, weightlifting also adds a good amount of additional stress to your joints - stress that they may not be able to handle in their current state. You won't be at risk for much muscle loss until you've lost some more fat.

Hopefully Built (our resident nutrition god) will pop in to comment, but I think that you may want to focus purely on diet until you hit mid 200's. After that, you can start to incorporate some weight training when you're less at a risk of injury.

I'd also recommend sticking to the bike rather than the treadmill (for now) for the same reason. There's a lot of repetitive stress being put on your joints right now - minimizing that will probably be beneficial to you down the road.

Originally Posted by djturnz

I am obviously no expert, but as I understand it (and someone will correct me if I am wrong), for the most part, cardio burns calories NOW, while you are doing it. Muscle mass burns calories ALWAYS. Neither of these are absolute truths, but generally, that is how I understand it. You need cardio, but don't forget the weight training.

See my last post. Also, the calories burned from cardio are rather insignificant in the grand scheme of things. For fat loss, your diet is king. Dial in your diet properly and you will see changes relatively quickly.

That said, cardio is still beneficial for cardiovascular health.

A buddy of mine started out around 350 2 or 3 years ago. He is way down now. He started using the eliptical at the gym because the treadmill hurt his knees. I tried it a couple times, but I feel like I am trying to run down the UP escilator drunk (which I have done before). It just felt awkward. So I use the treadmill and the bike. I use the bike that has a regular chair type seat, not the one with the bicycle saddle.

Originally Posted by danzik17

See my last post. Also, the calories burned from cardio are rather insignificant in the grand scheme of things. For fat loss, your diet is king. Dial in your diet properly and you will see changes relatively quickly.

That said, cardio is still beneficial for cardiovascular health.

To put it a better way, (as I understand it) the cardio helps with the calorie deficiency that you set up with your diet.

Does the muscle mass essentially raise your maintenace calorie number? Thus increasing the deficet for a given number of calories?

Originally Posted by JohnnyBlob

1 - should I eat anything before doing my cardio in the morning - if so what? and if not, what/when should I eat after a "workout"?

Some lean protein is a good idea. I'd avoid anything high in fat purely because (personally) I find it to make me a bit nauseous if I eat it close to my workouts.

2 - for a fatguy like me...is yogurt a yes or no?

In limited quantities. Most yogurts are high in sugar/fructose which is exactly what you don't want.

3 - what is considered a healthy lunch and dinner while working out to lose weight?

Eggs, chicken, steak, etc.. Lean meats. Throw some veggies in there and something for fats whether it be butter, peanut butter, olive oil, whatever. The only rule is no man-made trans fats - those are bad for you in ANY situation.

4 - should I be doing any weight lifting? (my thought is drop 50lbs first with cardio & diet and the focus on lifting weights)

Good move. See my prior posts for my opinions on that.

5 - Is there anything I need to cut out of my diet? Ive already cut: salt, sugar, bread, butter, condiments (other than TX Pete hot sauce)

Sugar is great to cut out, but leave that butter in! Fat is NOT bad for you. It's highly satiating which will make dieting easier. Just make sure that it fits into your overall calorie intake.

.

Originally Posted by djturnz

To put it a better way, (as I understand it) the cardio helps with the calorie deficiency that you set up with your diet.

Does the muscle mass essentially raise your maintenace calorie number? Thus increasing the deficet for a given number of calories?

Think of it this way. Riding a bike or jogging for an hour will probably burn around 200 or so calories - maybe a bit more or a bit less. In order to lose 1lb of fat (3500 calories), you would need to do around 15 hours of cardio like that. I don't know about you, but I am not that motivated to do cardio (I HATE it).

It's much easier to achieve a deficit via diet and will actually set you up more for success in the future. If you depend on doing endless cardio for fat loss, then what happens in the future when you stop? Learn to diet and you will stay lean for LIFE!

Increasing your muscle mass does increase your maintenance calories, but not nearly as much as people would like to believe. Where weight training DOES come in for fat loss is that it acts as a traffic cop for calories. Without going into the nitty gritty details of what's happening, it basically is directing some calories towards your muscles (good!) rather than towards your fat stores (bad!). Weight training will also help to maintain your muscle mass which would otherwise be burned off, but that not something you need to worry much about at this point.

I am operating at a calorie deficiency, and doing cardio, and lifting weights. Once I track my macros for a week or two, I will then try to figure out what levels of protein, carbs, fat I need, and seek advice on how to correct the equation.

Carb And Calorie Cycling!

Originally Posted by ti6ko

Carb And Calorie Cycling!

not familiar.

awesome. Thanks again. Im still pretty lost regarding "good fats" like butter.

I plan to do more research on this. I need to educate myself on good/bad carbs...good/bad fats..... how many calories / carbs I need to take in a day.
So if anyone can point me in the right direction where I can lean about this stuff, I'd really appreciate it. My daily menu is something like this:

4am - 16.oz water and a 5 oz can of white tuna w/ some hot sauce.

Go to gym - do cardio
come home, walk a mile.

5am - 16.oz water and a handful or raisins.

9 / 10 AM - salad w/ fat free Italian dressing (or hot sauce)

snack the rest of the day on stuff like carrots, raisins, apples, MAYBE another 5 oz can of tuna. *drink a gallon of water between 10am - 7pm*

7pm - Dinner is usually 2 boiled or baked chicken breasts w/ hot sauce
green beans or corn and a salad.. 16 oz water.
If its not chicken, it may be a plain burger or 2 w/ a little ketchup.

I think you need to eat a bit more then that a day. Throw in some more chicken, fish or turkey.

I'm on my way to bed so i can't respond much. But congrats and making a change. Now the thing to learn is to first unlearn all the crap you've been sold over the years. You need exercise in order to increase you cardio vascular system. But being seriously overweight, just jumping on a treadmill or elliptical and trying to do a half hour of cardio or more is risky. get in the habit of tracking calories. It takes time and its a pain at first but you get used to it. The diet is the most important factor for weight loss, not cardio. You will see this repeated all around this board.

Cardio vascular system is best way to keep fit. Maintaining the diet and proper exercise will help you.

Originally Posted by danzik17

Think of it this way. Riding a bike or jogging for an hour will probably burn around 200 or so calories - maybe a bit more or a bit less. In order to lose 1lb of fat (3500 calories), you would need to do around 15 hours of cardio like that. I don't know about you, but I am not that motivated to do cardio (I HATE it).

It's much easier to achieve a deficit via diet and will actually set you up more for success in the future. If you depend on doing endless cardio for fat loss, then what happens in the future when you stop? Learn to diet and you will stay lean for LIFE!

It's not about how many calories you burn during a cardio session. The benefit of the cardio is that it elevates your metabolism so that you're body becomes more efficient at burning fat throughout the day, even resting.

Originally Posted by Merkaba

get in the habit of tracking calories. It takes time and its a pain at first but you get used to it. The diet is the most important factor for weight loss, not cardio. You will see this repeated all around this board.

Thanks. Forgive my ignorance...but what am I tracking? Im clueless as to how many calories I should be taking in. Same with carbs / fat / protein... Is there anywhere on this site/forum to learn HOW to track calories? and is there some kind of online chart I can refer to as to how much carbs, protein, fat I should be taking in?

Use an online tracker like fitday.

I recommend getting a little set of digital scales and weighing your raw foods too. You would be surprised what you think is a good portion actually weighs.

Or, just hang around people who are fatter than you. It won't make you any slimmer or healthier, but you'll feel better about yourself.

GICH!

Originally Posted by Roids1

Or, just hang around people who are fatter than you. It won't make you any slimmer or healthier, but you'll feel better about yourself.

GICH!

ha! good point.

Originally Posted by Roids1

It's not about how many calories you burn during a cardio session. The benefit of the cardio is that it elevates your metabolism so that you're body becomes more efficient at burning fat throughout the day, even resting.

That may be one of the benefits of HIIT style cardio yes. I would never ever recommend that kind of cardio to someone out of shape though.

The fact still remains that at this point in time, learning to diet correctly is paramount.

Originally Posted by JohnnyBlob

Thanks. Forgive my ignorance...but what am I tracking? Im clueless as to how many calories I should be taking in. Same with carbs / fat / protein... Is there anywhere on this site/forum to learn HOW to track calories? and is there some kind of online chart I can refer to as to how much carbs, protein, fat I should be taking in?

fitday.com is good for tracking calories.

As for what you should be eating, 1-1.5g protein per lb of lean body mass and 0.5g of fat per lb of lean body mass are considered minimums. From there, you would simply tailor make a diet to your own body's maintenance calories.

In this case since we don't know either your lean body mass nor your maintenance calories, let's choose something not too high but not too low. Run it for 1-2 weeks and report back on bodyweight, hunger, etc..

I'd say start with 2300 calories. No real science behind me choosing that number, it's just a nice middle of the road number to use as a starting point.

Since we don't know your lean body mass, let's use your goal weight as our target. Let's further assume that at that weight, you would be around 11% bodyfat - not unreasonable for 6ft at that weight I think. That would mean that you should be eating between 196-294g protein. Let's pick a nice middle of the road number again at 250g. Fat's should be around 98g.

Carbs = 4 cals per g
Protein = 4 cals per g
Fats = 9 cals per g

250g protein = 1000 calories
98g fat = 882 calories
1882 calories total

For the remaining 418 calories, pick whatever you want. Do that for a week or two and report back.

Originally Posted by danzik17

I'd say start with 2300 calories. No real science behind me choosing that number, it's just a nice middle of the road number to use as a starting point.

Since we don't know your lean body mass, let's use your goal weight as our target. Let's further assume that at that weight, you would be around 11% bodyfat - not unreasonable for 6ft at that weight I think. That would mean that you should be eating between 196-294g protein. Let's pick a nice middle of the road number again at 250g. Fat's should be around 98g.

Carbs = 4 cals per g
Protein = 4 cals per g
Fats = 9 cals per g

250g protein = 1000 calories
98g fat = 882 calories
1882 calories total

For the remaining 418 calories, pick whatever you want. Do that for a week or two and report back.

Will do - Thanks!! What about carbs? where do they fit in and how much? They spook they hell out of me. I miss bread

Just got back from the gym and was shocked that without even getting into the thick of things yet, Ive dropped 10 1/2 lbs in a week. Even more amazed that my fat ass could now ride the bike for 20 min and walk the treadmill for almost 10 lol. Pathetic? yes..but still kinda cool.

Per Danzik's recommendations, you have about 420 calories remaining after taking protein and fat into consideration. You are welcome to utilize those calories as you wish. If you were to invest all those calories into carbohydrates, you'd be allotted about 105g of carbs per day.

Thanks guys. Fitday dot com was a big help along with Danzik's numbers he provided. 20 lbs lost in two weeks. I feel great. Not starving.

120 minutes of cardio a week, 2 mile walk at night and working 20 lb dumbbells throughout the day.
I still feel like I havent even kicked in to working out yet. Just starting slow but this week I begin working with real weights in the gym.

Originally Posted by JohnnyBlob

Thanks guys. Fitday dot com was a big help along with Danzik's numbers he provided. 20 lbs lost in two weeks. I feel great. Not starving.

120 minutes of cardio a week, 2 mile walk at night and working 20 lb dumbbells throughout the day.
I still feel like I havent even kicked in to working out yet. Just starting slow but this week I begin working with real weights in the gym.

Great! If you're not hungry and still losing weight at a good pace, let's just stick with what you're doing currently then. I'd imagine that this same diet will work until you're sub 300lbs. I'm just guessing here, but I'll bet you hit sub 300 lbs within 3 months or so.

You may even find that as you get leaner and leaner, it becomes easier to lose fat (to a point). Adipose tissue (fat) tends to aromatize testosterone, meaning turn it to estrogen. As you get leaner, more of the calories that you eat will just naturally flow to your muscles. It will literally almost be as if you were injecting small amounts of testosterone into yourself.

Oh the other side effect of that is you miiight find yourself getting horny as hell for a bit as you adjust to the higher test levels - let's just say I did NOT expect that part when I went through it

JohnnyBlob PM me and give me your e-mail. I will be glad to send you some fitness and weight loss e-books