Thread: Alcohol question in regards to dieting

well alcohol has many more negative effects than just calories.
When alcohol is in your system your body will stop burning fat completely until all alcohol calories are burned.
Additionally drinking lowers your testostrone for minmimum the following day.

As for dark vs clear liquor, i havent heard that. Whiskey is probably the easiest on your stomach.

Ok thanks, so it doesn't matter if i drink beer or liquor then correct? there both just as bad

How often do you drink and how much?

Originally Posted by pbzhb

If all that matters is calories in vs calories out then why is it that when people diet they always prefer to drink liquor, more specifically clear liquors rather than beer? I drink twice a week and if I keep my food plus alcohol calories below my maintenance I should be fine then correct? thanks in advance

cals in vs cals out is 1970's science...the source of those calories is very important in terms of the quality of weight gain. dirty cals consumed over time result in a greater increase in the ratio of fat:muscle gained as insulin sensitivity decreases.

in terms of digestion, the body will try to metabolize ethanol first. this is why drinking then eating causes substantial weight gain in many. the whole clear vs brown alcohol, etc. has to do with the effects of polyphenols on the health the cals are the same.

the main problem with drinking and weight training is that the higher the BAC the lower serum test levels will be. alcohol consumption suppresses test production this would obviously allow estrongen to have a greater effect by changing the ratio of the main sex hormones. the main problems from decreased androgens are reduction of the BMR to slow and also decrease CNS output.

so..... I am a high ball girl (though I know alcohol is not GOOD for me...) but im wondering if my 1.5 ounce shot in my nightly drink is doing more damge than I think??????

Originally Posted by LAM

cals in vs cals out is 1970's science...the source of those calories is very important in terms of the quality of weight gain. dirty cals consumed over time result in a greater increase in the ratio of fat:muscle gained as insulin sensitivity decreases.

in terms of digestion, the body will try to metabolize ethanol first. this is why drinking then eating causes substantial weight gain in many. the whole clear vs brown alcohol, etc. has to do with the effects of polyphenols on the health the cals are the same.

the main problem with drinking and weight training is that the higher the BAC the lower serum test levels will be. alcohol consumption suppresses test production this would obviously allow estrongen to have a greater effect by changing the ratio of the main sex hormones. the main problems from decreased androgens are reduction of the BMR to slow and also decrease CNS output.

CANT REP ANYMORE! GOOD post!

drink is my downfall i find my self drinking more then ever now some time to sleep (which is good idea at the time till u wake up) or just out of bordom i need to stop i seriously am getting a taste for it now... sorry it doesnt help the op question but i just thought id share lol....

Originally Posted by jimm

drink is my downfall i find my self drinking more then ever now some time to sleep (which is good idea at the time till u wake up) or just out of bordom i need to stop i seriously am getting a taste for it now... sorry it doesnt help the op question but i just thought id share lol....

youve built a mindset that makes you believe drinking will relax you.
This is a terrible way to think. You need to either stop drinking completely or just straightup moderate it to once a week.
Perhaps try smoking bud? it helps me go to sleep much easier.

Originally Posted by fraseram

so..... I am a high ball girl (though I know alcohol is not GOOD for me...) but im wondering if my 1.5 ounce shot in my nightly drink is doing more damge than I think??????

I would like to know also.

Originally Posted by LAM

cals in vs cals out is 1970's science...the source of those calories is very important in terms of the quality of weight gain.

You say this, but I need to understand where you get your information. Now, I'm not talking about a condition of insufficient protein or fatty acid intake; if those are covered, what is it exactly that you're getting at?

And before you begin, if you're talking about the metabolic effects some foods have on us, I agree with you with regard to transfat (not really a food) and fructose (should be consumed very sparingly; both fructose and transfat impact upon insulin resistance among other things), as well as the impact of foods like soy and flax on thyroid and sex hormones.

If you mean something other than this, kindly expand, and give me something peer-reviewed to read, thanks.

Originally Posted by LAM

dirty cals consumed over time result in a greater increase in the ratio of fat:muscle gained as insulin sensitivity decreases.

Same point as above - what do YOU mean by "dirty" cals? They mean different things to different people. To me, dirty calories come from grains and fructose. Clean calories come from white rice, dextrose, steak, and butter.

Originally Posted by LAM

in terms of digestion, the body will try to metabolize ethanol first.

It is indeed a preferred fuel.

Originally Posted by LAM

this is why drinking then eating causes substantial weight gain in many.

Not so fast. This still doesn't change "calories in, calories out"; last time I checked, Newton's laws of thermodynamics hadn't been refuted.

Originally Posted by LAM

the whole clear vs brown alcohol, etc. has to do with the effects of polyphenols on the health the cals are the same.

I'm seriously glad I hate the taste of alcohol. It's bad enough that I like the taste of chocolate!

Originally Posted by LAM

the main problem with drinking and weight training is that the higher the BAC the lower serum test levels will be.

This is a big deal for males, to be sure. I'm not so sure it's a big problem for women; our testosterone levels are so much lower. Not arguing, just sayin'. I really don't know if it's an issue. It's still empty calories that stops all fat burning until they're gone.

Originally Posted by LAM

alcohol consumption suppresses test production this would obviously allow estrongen to have a greater effect by changing the ratio of the main sex hormones.

Surprisingly, not necessarily. Estrogen goes up in men when testosterone rises - testosterone is the prohormone for estrogen.

You'd be correct, though, if alcohol increases aromatase expression. I know prolonged elevated insulin levels do this, so it's certainly possible.

Originally Posted by LAM

the main problems from decreased androgens are reduction of the BMR to slow and also decrease CNS output.

This is interesting. I was aware that ethanol is a CNS depressant, but does the drop in CNS persist after it clears the body?

Originally Posted by careless22

youve built a mindset that makes you believe drinking will relax you.
This is a terrible way to think. You need to either stop drinking completely or just straightup moderate it to once a week.
Perhaps try smoking bud? it helps me go to sleep much easier.

Or try melatonin.

dr oz ( lol ) health experts tend to agree
everything in moderation is good
coffee was BAD (now deemed good in moderation ) and now alcohol .... one drink a day for women and two for men they are saying is not only OK but good
I'm not talking special wines that have antioxidants (which would obviously be the best choice) but all drinks
it has something to do with the effect on the blood and heart (like taking your one baby aspirin a day)

I use 2 binge drink I would say I'm going out for a drink or two but had
No self control and wound up drinking until 3@m I did this about 2-3 times a week for a while.I started loose muscle feel like shit and get depressed.One day I decided enough and havent drink since.self control is the key.

Originally Posted by jimm

drink is my downfall i find my self drinking more then ever now some time to sleep (which is good idea at the time till u wake up) or just out of bordom i need to stop i seriously am getting a taste for it now... sorry it doesnt help the op question but i just thought id share lol....

this was me too. but I go through stages...sometimes I won't drink for months, other times I'll have a couple 4-5 days a week. I can definitely tell the difference in my workouts though, and I don't sleep near as well when drinking. my diet tends to turn for the worse when I drink more often also. all in all, the less I drink the better it is for my training.

I quit drinking for several reasons. could not lose weight. Felt like vrap every day cause I drank every day, waaaay too much. I haven't drank alcohol for 5-7 months.

It is funny to be the designated driver and see how friggin stupid people get then they drink too much!

I have one beer on really rare occassions, that was not always the case. After my wife passed away, I spent a year inside every beer or liquor bottle I could get my hands on. I'd drink anything that had alcohol in it. When I decided that I needed to change my life and made the gym a priority, I cut way down. Within a few months of seeing results I decided that bodybuilding was more important then booze. My girl has a glass of wine on rare occassion, in the last 6 months I think I have had 3 beers. Just don't need it.

Originally Posted by careless22

youve built a mindset that makes you believe drinking will relax you.
This is a terrible way to think. You need to either stop drinking completely or just straightup moderate it to once a week.
Perhaps try smoking bud? it helps me go to sleep much easier.

Im not drinking from this day forth, i have some smelly bud here so a lil joint tonite should help went ona bit of binge when i lost my job u know how it goes more u drink more shit u feel lose motivation wassnt ating nearly enough ect... its comeing back now jus a day off the drink eating right again and im feeling better! Its a learning curve, its all about ups and downs you will always pass failure on the way to succsess, all the best....

don't do it!

Originally Posted by Built

You say this, but I need to understand where you get your information. Now, I'm not talking about a condition of insufficient protein or fatty acid intake; if those are covered, what is it exactly that you're getting at?

And before you begin, if you're talking about the metabolic effects some foods have on us, I agree with you with regard to transfat (not really a food) and fructose (should be consumed very sparingly; both fructose and transfat impact upon insulin resistance among other things), as well as the impact of foods like soy and flax on thyroid and sex hormones.

If you mean something other than this, kindly expand, and give me something peer-reviewed to read, thanks.

Same point as above - what do YOU mean by "dirty" cals? They mean different things to different people. To me, dirty calories come from grains and fructose. Clean calories come from white rice, dextrose, steak, and butter.

It is indeed a preferred fuel.

Not so fast. This still doesn't change "calories in, calories out"; last time I checked, Newton's laws of thermodynamics hadn't been refuted.

I'm seriously glad I hate the taste of alcohol. It's bad enough that I like the taste of chocolate!


This is a big deal for males, to be sure. I'm not so sure it's a big problem for women; our testosterone levels are so much lower. Not arguing, just sayin'. I really don't know if it's an issue. It's still empty calories that stops all fat burning until they're gone.

Surprisingly, not necessarily. Estrogen goes up in men when testosterone rises - testosterone is the prohormone for estrogen.

You'd be correct, though, if alcohol increases aromatase expression. I know prolonged elevated insulin levels do this, so it's certainly possible.

This is interesting. I was aware that ethanol is a CNS depressant, but does the drop in CNS persist after it clears the body?


Or try melatonin.

in regards to a calorie being a calorie...the ratio of insulin to glucagon effects various hormones and neurotransmitters, etc. so the size of meals and the glycemic load effect the levels of those and many other hormones down the line. the amount of body fat that a person has is a direct indicator of the bodies current ability to metabolize nutrients efficiently. the amount of body fat also dictates the levels of leptin released, etc. high GI meals cause insulin to increase which decreases SHBG (which frees up more test) and decreases glucagon, etc.

there are lots of studies out there on the subject, I don't have any bookmarked on my new computer.

that video that you posted the other day is a perfect example of nutrient partitioning. it showed that different sugars effect blood lipid levels, etc.

the ratio's of many hormones are hard coded in our DNA but diet and exercise can have just as much if not a greater effect (see research on epigenetcs, etc.).

I've been reading a little on epigenetics, and it's interesting shit. Speaking of interesting shit, wasn't that a great video? Fructose is teh devil!!! Of course, mostly what I focus on is satiety. If you can't feel fed at maintenance, what hope do you have of dieting?

I just saw the video yesterday. I knew fructose was bad I just didn't know how bad/why.
I used to be a IIFYM kinda dude early in bb'ing then I got screwed with IBS, auto immune skin problems, and a whole bacthery of crap. A carb isn't really a carb, and we should know this because we get a lot of different substrates within that realm of macronutrient. Just like how we like different proteins and different fats. The thing about calorie is a calorie gets MUCH deeper when you consider all the different chains of aminos, sugars, and lipids....

Lemme pull up the video, it's on Youtube. Might make you more paranoid but it was an hour half well worth the watch for me.

Originally Posted by jimm

drink is my downfall i find my self drinking more then ever now some time to sleep (which is good idea at the time till u wake up) or just out of bordom i need to stop i seriously am getting a taste for it now... sorry it doesnt help the op question but i just thought id share lol....

I use to drink until I pass out. It was not a fun time and got in trouble too many time with that shit. I decided to stop drinking for now and I will have to legally anyway. Just stop drinking and learn how to relax yourself and you maybe having a lot of stress in life and need to learn how to deal with it. You don't want to end up being one of those AA people.

Originally Posted by feinburgrl

You don't want to end up being one of those AA people.

And that would be because...?

Originally Posted by pbzhb

If all that matters is calories in vs calories out then why is it that when people diet they always prefer to drink liquor, more specifically clear liquors rather than beer? I drink twice a week and if I keep my food plus alcohol calories below my maintenance I should be fine then correct? thanks in advance

Clear liquors do tend to have calories, but you can't just go by this rule. A single malt scotch contains less cals than vodka. Even worse drinking a flavored vodka, which they generally use sugar to sweeten.

Best thing is to really cut it out for a few months till you reach your goal. Then I usually stick with Bacardi lite and diet coke. 55 cals and no carbs at all.

Originally Posted by Built

And that would be because...?

General people who take AA seriously will make there life everything around AA. More important over job family and social life.

Alcohol has about 7 calories per gram. These are considered "empty" calories because alcohol contains no beneficial nutrients, such as vitamins and minerals.
A 12-ounce beer contains about 150 calories. Sugary, carbonated beverages and fruit juices contribute additional calories when mixed with alcohol in a cocktail.
Beers, wines, and liquors all contain different amounts of alcohol. In general, a 12-ounce beer, a 5-ounce glass of wine, and a 1.5-ounce shot of liquor have about the same amount of alcohol and the same number of calories.
Beer is 3 - 8% alcohol. "Light" or lower-calorie beers are closer to 3% alcohol. "Hard" liquors contain about 40% alcohol and tend to be higher in calories.
White wines average 12% alcohol, and red wines average 14% alcohol.
"Proof" means the alcohol content of distilled liquors. It is the percentage of alcohol multiplied by two. For example:

• 50% alcohol = 100-proof
• 100% alcohol = 200-proof

• Reviewed last on: 5/2/2009
• Linda J. Vorvick, MD, Medical Director, MEDEX Northwest Division of Physician Assistant Studies, University of Washington, School of Medicine. Also reviewed by David Zieve, MD, MHA, Medical Director, A.D.A.M., Inc.

source: University of Maryland Medical Center | Home

Originally Posted by feinburgrl

General people who take AA seriously will make there life everything around AA. More important over job family and social life.

Well, if the only choices in your world are "get loaded" or "go to a meeting", it's a bit of a no-brainer, hey?

I don't think it's as simple as calories in versus calories out...beer has a high carb content which gets transformed into fat (as I understand it), maybe thats why people try to stay away from beer...

Originally Posted by feinburgrl

General people who take AA seriously will make there life everything around AA. More important over job family and social life.

As an "AA person" with almost 16 years of sobriety, I've got to say this is complete and utter horseshit. In sobriety the key is to learn that the only way to a happy, fulfilling life is to learn to live without alcohol. Period. It is not some kind of cult. Alcoholism is a disease, and abstinence is the cure. A support system is a crucial element, but in no way limits the rest of your life. It fact, it makes life possible. I love my wife, I value my family and friends, and I have a very gratifying career, as do the majority of people I know with long-term sobriety.