No cardio! Diet doing it all!

**gopro** · 05-16-2003, 08:52 AM

I have been experimenting with my diet quite a bit during this contest cutting cycle in terms of types of carbs, carb timing, and carb amounts...fats and proteins have remained consistent (although my pre and post workout protein intake is higher than ever before).

I have been using a plan whereby 75% of my daily carbs are coming at my post workout insulin spike meal, and the rest exactly 3.5 hours before training. Either brown rice or oatmeal is used at the "pre-workout" meal, and white rice at the post-workout meal.

Fats are highest at breakfast and my small meal 30 min before training, and as mentioned above, the largest protein feedings are wrapped around my workout.

Anyway, I have been doing ZERO aerobics during the past 12 weeks and have been cutting up just as effectively as ever before, BUT, my lean mass retention and strength during training are BETTER than ever.

Just thought I'd share

**DaMayor** · 05-16-2003, 09:39 AM

Sounds good to me, boss.

Can you expound on the protein content of your pre and post w/o shakes?
So, basically you're doing a sort of mini-depletion/carb up cycle daily? Does that sound entirely stupid? Don't answer that.

**Fit Freak** · 05-16-2003, 10:13 AM

Gopro...I know what you mean...I have been manipulating my eating lately and doing NO cardio...getting leaner, staying strong, and keeping my fullness. I honestly think this is the way to go...or at least until a plateau comes and you need to get rid of the last bit of stubborn fat!

Good luck with your pre-comp diet and training!

**Prince** · 05-17-2003, 05:23 PM

damn gopro, you just now figured out that cardio is not necessary for cutting.

**J'Bo** · 05-18-2003, 08:30 AM

I like this plan....going to try it for a photo shoot scheduled in Sept. I will let you know how it goes...then you will have a females perspective...does sex count as cardio? do i have to cut that out?

**gopro** · 05-18-2003, 03:44 PM

Originally posted by J'Bo
I like this plan....going to try it for a photo shoot scheduled in Sept. I will let you know how it goes...then you will have a females perspective...does sex count as cardio? do i have to cut that out?

You DO NOT have to cut out sex...I REPEAT...You DO NOT have to cut out sex...ummm, what was my point??

**gopro** · 05-18-2003, 03:47 PM

Originally posted by Prince
damn gopro, you just now figured out that cardio is not necessary for cutting.

Getting "cut" is one thing. I want to see if I can hit competition shape with zero cardio...3-4% BF.

**gopro** · 05-18-2003, 03:54 PM

Originally posted by DaMayor
Sounds good to me, boss.

Can you expound on the protein content of your pre and post w/o shakes?
So, basically you're doing a sort of mini-depletion/carb up cycle daily? Does that sound entirely stupid? Don't answer that.

My pre-workout shake has 75 g of protein from pure whey isolate. My post-workout shake has 90 g of protein and comes from hydrolyzed whey.

I guess you can call it a "daily" carb deplete and load, although I have a small carb meal timed at just 3.5 hrs before training, which works best for me after experimenting with several other times.

My off training days do not have any carb spike in them at all though. I'm sure you knew that

**J'Bo** · 05-18-2003, 04:40 PM

thank goodness.

**gopro** · 05-19-2003, 06:38 AM

Originally posted by J'Bo
thank goodness.

You said it

**Twin Peak** · 05-19-2003, 08:41 AM

Originally posted by Prince
damn gopro, you just now figured out that cardio is not necessary for cutting.

LMAO. My 2002 journal here discussed this at length.

**Robboe** · 05-19-2003, 09:04 AM

If you've been that low before then it probably is possible to get back without cardio.

Those who have trouble getting there first time round may find a lot of use in employing cardio - there's even potential that cardio burns mostly sub-Q bodyfat and diet alone burns mostly visceral bodyfat.

There was a study conducted with women that seemed to demonstrate this.

**Prince** · 05-19-2003, 09:24 AM

Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy
There was a study conducted with women that seemed to demonstrate this.

wow, that sounds conclusive.

**Twin Peak** · 05-19-2003, 09:28 AM

Prince, the study only shows this if you hold it to the proper light.

**gopro** · 05-19-2003, 09:32 AM

Originally posted by Twin Peak
LMAO. My 2002 journal here discussed this at length.

Oh man it did! Holy moly, I'm so sorry. You da man!

Some people on this board make me laugh. There are even a few on here that haven't posted in this thread that I KNOW are all like, "wow, I've known this for years...he is just realizing this?"

Please...first compete against the people that I compete against and then talk about getting into that type of shape without cardio. There is a huge difference between being cut, or even "ripped," and being in stage shape...especially at national level (that goes for naturals and drug users).

And TCD...I don't think you are correct in what you said, and also you must realize that I am not talking about simply "getting back" to a particular BF%, but getting there while holding far more muscle size, vascularity, and fullness!

**Twin Peak** · 05-19-2003, 09:39 AM

I have been saying since the day I started posting here that cardio is overrated. That while an important tool for some, it is not necessary for most.

You make it sound like you have discovered America. Many top levels bodybuilders get in contest shape without cardio.

And as to the implication that it will be more difficult for you, then for someone relatively less muscular, that is a joke. In fact, it is far easier to RETAIN LBM without doing cardio.

**Robboe** · 05-19-2003, 09:41 AM

I thought i had a link to the abstract of the study i was referring to, but i can't find it and i can't be arsed to scan pubMed right now, else i'd let you view it for yourself, Prince.

I'm not saying you need cardio or you don't need cardio to get to a certain low bodyfat percentage. Some can easily hit low bodyfat without much effort (the bastards) whereas some may find good use in emplyong the method. Notice the key word here and in my previous post - "may". I'm not stating or defending anything. I'm just viewing the situation from several angles.

I said that there is at least one study, using women, showing that cardio seemed to cause more subcutaneous bodyfat loss in the test subjects compared to those without it. There may be more. Or maybe not, i dunno.

Quite frankly, i don't care whether you use cardio or not.

**Robboe** · 05-19-2003, 09:44 AM

Fucking hell, I am laughing here.

**Prince** · 05-19-2003, 09:47 AM

I admit that I have never been below 6% bf, but when I was I did it with zero cardio.

Naturally, I cannot imagine one (or at least the average person) could get below 5% without sacrificing quite a bit of LBM, cardio or not.

**gopro** · 05-19-2003, 10:47 AM

Originally posted by Twin Peak
I have been saying since the day I started posting here that cardio is overrated. That while an important tool for some, it is not necessary for most.

You make it sound like you have discovered America. Many top levels bodybuilders get in contest shape without cardio.

And as to the implication that it will be more difficult for you, then for someone relatively less muscular, that is a joke. In fact, it is far easier to RETAIN LBM without doing cardio.

Never made it sound like I discovered America. What an assinine comment! Read my original post. It was meant to simply inform some people here what I am up to. Nowhere did it say...Hey, I'm great...I do no cardio. Man has your attitude changed toward the side of arrogance in the past few months.

Next, I have been around natural and non natural competitors for 18 years now and I know of only a handful that don't use cardio to get ready for shows. Some use on the low end 3-4 days per week for 30 minutes, up to the high end of twice daily for an hour! The ones that use none usually have incredible metabolisms and can stay lean even when eating junk.

Finally, my implication WAS NOT that someone less muscular than me will have an easier time, but that at the level I currently compete on, the conditioning of the athletes at the top is totally insane...some because they are incredible, dedicated, gifted BBers and others b/c they cheat and use pharmaceuticals.

**Fit Freak** · 05-19-2003, 11:16 AM

GP....don't let it bother you...you're just trying to keep people informed....we appreciate it!

As for getting in contest shape.....I agree....most BBers....even the not so gr8 ones use cardio....I have to say it's VERY difficult to get your glute striations to show with no cardio.

Again...we all have to look at this from a perspective that GP is not getting cut...he's gettin' FREAKING RIPPED

Good luck and let's ease up a bit on the harshness of the posts...can't we all just get along

**Twin Peak** · 05-19-2003, 11:19 AM

Amusing. Quite.

**Prince** · 05-19-2003, 11:41 AM

Originally posted by Fit Freak
Again...we all have to look at this from a perspective that GP is not getting cut...he's gettin' FREAKING RIPPED

I have always considered the term "cutting" to mean the process towards getting "ripped".

**Fit Freak** · 05-19-2003, 04:01 PM

I guess what I meant was that he's getting abnormally cut...anyway...that's all I have to say.

I wasn't intending to flame anyone...I've just been noticcing that a lot of posts have been getting "nasty" lately.

Sorry if I upset anyone by my post...

**gopro** · 05-19-2003, 06:52 PM

Thanks Fit Freak. I would never be "harsh" with anyone unless they deserve it or act out at me first. Even then, I try to keep it to a minimum. There are just a few members on this board that have attitude problems and other "issues" they haven't worked out yet. Its all good though...I will keep doing my thing here for as long as I can. Everything I have learned and continue to learn will be shared!

**J'Bo** · 05-19-2003, 07:02 PM

k lets get back on topic here boys...i am interested to see how this works out gp....keep us up to date.

**gopro** · 05-19-2003, 07:15 PM

Originally posted by J'Bo
k lets get back on topic here boys...i am interested to see how this works out gp....keep us up to date.

I will for sure keep you posted. I will be doing a little more tweaking soon (with training as well as diet...supps too). My main goal is not so much to get more ripped than ever, but achieve my same BEST condition with far more mass, better proportions, and more fullness.

**J'Bo** · 05-19-2003, 08:50 PM

sounds good. i am sure it will work out just fine. if you dont cut out all your cardio

**gopro** · 05-20-2003, 06:41 AM

Originally posted by J'Bo
sounds good. i am sure it will work out just fine. if you dont cut out all your cardio

Every time I look at your avatar it reminds me that SOME cardio is necessary

**J'Bo** · 05-20-2003, 06:50 AM

your funny..... btw how do you conquer hunger pangs during the last couple of days?

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