For who like to play with calories read need to read this

hardasnails1973 · 02-04-2004, 01:57 PM

After my contest everything was normal till about 4 weeks later. I dieted on 3 ius of gh a day 5 days on 2 days off for about 9 weeks. I did no cardio during the approach to try to save my lean muscle mass. I was on no t-3, but ECA 3 times a day as standard dieting procedure. I was on low caloires (about 2200- 2400 caloires) for an extended amount of time (8 weeks) with a carb up every 3-4 days (400 grams) , but after the show I slowly raised caloires and after about 3-4 weeks I noticed getting bloated and having severe constipation and feel cold all the time, getting severe joint pains and my self esteem went to shit. I went to the GI specialist and said I do to dieting I had used super dieters tea becuase constipation got so bad not because of diet but i think becuase of stress levels at my job, so 2-3 times a week I would use this tea to releive blaoting. after the contest I also stop on EC stack from 3 times a day yo just on workout days and then stopped all the gh and chem as well. from this time I have been very cold, lack of selfesteem, and constipated like crazy, and just about falling into every hypo thyroid symptoms joint pains,thickness of skin and steroid moon face , fever, constantly sick, sensitiveity to light plus many others there are. Any suggestion will be greatly aprecaited. My hr is 50 and bp is 101/59 core temp in morning was 95.9 today and when i ate it raised to 98 !!

any help be appreciated
Thanks brio

**Jodi** · 02-04-2004, 03:14 PM

Have you had a blood test done?

Things to check for hypothyroidism or hyperthyroidism would be T4, TSH, T3, PBI.

Here are a few things that may help:

Make sure you vitamins are without iron - they can interfere with thyroid function as well.

Stop eating raw greens and cook them instead. I know this sounds silly but I recall reading this before that over eating raw veggies can affect thyroid levels. Also soy products can cause issues as well.

Make sure you are getting sodium and iodine in your diet. I don't recall the specific affects to the thyroid - but I do know that you need to make sure you are getting some.

I was reasearching this last year when I thought I was becoming hypo again. Thankfully that was not the case.

Another thing to keep in mind is that if your blood does not show hypothyroidism it may show the opposite, hyperthyroidism. Many people have similar symptoms of hypothyroidism, including myself, even though its hyper.

I went back and forth with a stretch of Hypo, then with medicine became hyper. I came off the medicine and I stayed hyper for a few years and they almost burnt out my thyroid. I had Graves disease. Instead, they tried a different drug Tapazole for a year and that seemed to take care of it. I have not had any issues since but my symptoms while I was hyper were the same symptoms as hypo. This doesn't happen often but common enough that the doctors recognized it.

This was years ago and since then I have had no thyroid issues.

Keeping track of your morning tempature is good. Your temp will change throughout the day but the morning temp is what to go by for tracking purposes.

greekblondechic · 02-04-2004, 04:03 PM

We always have the same symptoms, its eerie

I wish I knew how to help hon!

atherjen · 02-04-2004, 04:16 PM

hmmm does having a low heart rate and BP be concerned?
my HR is 51 and BP is 98/52, sometimes a tad higher but not by much. always been this low tho.. .not norm?
hmm temp in the morning is 97.7 usually. norm?

HANS, I really hope that you can get things worked out and that there is something they can do for you..

this entire comp dieting thing is scaring me more each day already with that I am feeling in my body..

**Dale Mabry** · 02-04-2004, 04:38 PM

Borderline morning body temp is 97.8. I would not worry about the low BP and heart rate as a symptom of Hypo, it can mean so many different things. I know that Drs give GH to up a metabolism so maybe you are getting some negative feedback from that. Bump on the iodine, it is one of the things that your thyroid absorbs to make T3 and T4. Well, actually, it is reduced to iodide and then absorbed from the small intestine, same thing. I heard once before that if you rub iodine on your abdomen and it disappears rather quickly that you are prolly deficient in it. Don't know the validity of that, but I suppose it makes sense. Also, if you are accustomed to having iodized salt and then conpletely cut it out, you may become deficient. I would assume you took a multi, so that shouldn't be the case.

Also, excess cortisol production blocks the conversion of T4 to T3, which could be another issue. I don't know how stressed you have been prior to this, but considering you where dieting pretty hard this could be the case. This could also be linked to the GH, but I am not sure what the relationship would be.

Forgot to tell you, check out this site and if you feel this could be the case, bring it up to your doctor.

http://www.providentmedical.com/medf...nsSyndrome.pdf

bigbrownbear · 02-04-2004, 04:53 PM

HAN

sorry to hear about your situation bro. I dont know why your in the position your in, but I do know u like your ALA and you do crazy doses like 3000mg with lots of carbs, however i think this isnt gonna help you and can cause problems with your joints and your brain, as you could be driving away glucose for the brain and even starving it, tothe point brain cells will die. I would keep the ALA to a minimum for a while bro or even stay off it.

hardasnails1973 · 02-04-2004, 05:27 PM

ala actually helps to regenerated tissue. after my blood test if it is low i'm going to start on iodine, gugguls, corefolsin and get thing back in line so i look half descent for the body rock !!

donescobar2000 · 02-04-2004, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by hardasnails1973
After my contest everything was normal till about 4 weeks later. I dieted on 3 ius of gh a day 5 days on 2 days off for about 9 weeks. I did no cardio during the approach to try to save my lean muscle mass. I was on no t-3, but ECA 3 times a day as standard dieting procedure. I was on low caloires (about 2200- 2400 caloires) for an extended amount of time (8 weeks) with a carb up every 3-4 days (400 grams) , but after the show I slowly raised caloires and after about 3-4 weeks I noticed getting bloated and having severe constipation and feel cold all the time, getting severe joint pains and my self esteem went to shit. I went to the GI specialist and said I do to dieting I had used super dieters tea becuase constipation got so bad not because of diet but i think becuase of stress levels at my job, so 2-3 times a week I would use this tea to releive blaoting. after the contest I also stop on EC stack from 3 times a day yo just on workout days and then stopped all the gh and chem as well. from this time I have been very cold, lack of selfesteem, and constipated like crazy, and just about falling into every hypo thyroid symptoms joint pains,thickness of skin and steroid moon face , fever, constantly sick, sensitiveity to light plus many others there are. Any suggestion will be greatly aprecaited. My hr is 50 and bp is 101/59 core temp in morning was 95.9 today and when i ate it raised to 98 !!

any help be appreciated
Thanks brio

I am confused here Nails, did this happen to you or are you just posting this as a heads up for dieters?

greekblondechic · 02-04-2004, 05:33 PM

it happened to him

im also experiencing something similar..

donescobar2000 · 02-04-2004, 05:34 PM

Greek have you been checking your temp every morning?

greekblondechic · 02-04-2004, 05:37 PM

no not yet..should i do it orally or underarm?

atherjen · 02-04-2004, 05:40 PM

orally is fine IMO. thats how I do it.

greekblondechic · 02-04-2004, 05:41 PM

for 10minutes like mercola recommends?

donescobar2000 · 02-04-2004, 05:44 PM

You want to be between this target range 97.8 to 98.2. If you are below that then you definitley wanna see a doctor. 10 minutes will do.

donescobar2000 · 02-04-2004, 06:01 PM

This thread is gonna make go on a 2 week bulk just to make sure I don't fuck up my thyroid.

greekblondechic · 02-04-2004, 06:46 PM

I've been seeing a doctor, she said my thyroid is normal

but I just dont believe her..

donescobar2000 · 02-04-2004, 06:48 PM

Time for a second opinion. Never just get one.

hardasnails1973 · 02-04-2004, 07:15 PM

Glad I give people food for thought. Because i don not want same thing to happen to them as it did to me

donescobar2000 · 02-04-2004, 07:30 PM

I assume you do recomend eating the same but just adding more activity just as you told sentrycyphen? I would agree with eating maintenence and just adding more activity as well. It makes perfect sense.

hardasnails1973 · 02-04-2004, 09:24 PM

well what i suggest is to take in concideration nutrient timing and meals macro breakdowns for optimal hormone assimuation through natural food. and then eat according toy your maintence level which is usually 15-18 times LBM (suport muscle NOT FAT tissue) and not over all body weight (give or take 10% margin of error) I would rather error more towards the higher side of caloires becuase you can always decrease later or increase your activity level to compensate. If you read tom venutos articles this is what he is preaching and also MAX OT preaches this as well. FEED THE MUSCLE WITH NUTIENTS AND LET CARDIO AND DAILY ACTIVITY BURN UN NECEESARY FAT !!

sentricyphen · 02-05-2004, 12:25 PM

what about carb cycling--is it possible that refeeds and no/low carb days are difficult on the thyroid--as opposed to keeping macros the same the whole cycle?

greekblondechic · 02-16-2004, 02:26 PM

Bump

I'm also curious about this, my symptoms seem worse on my no carb days..

02-04-2004, 01:57 PM	#1
hardasnails1973 www.Bodyfactoryllc.com Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Pa Posts: 1,740	For who like to play with calories read need to read this After my contest everything was normal till about 4 weeks later. I dieted on 3 ius of gh a day 5 days on 2 days off for about 9 weeks. I did no cardio during the approach to try to save my lean muscle mass. I was on no t-3, but ECA 3 times a day as standard dieting procedure. I was on low caloires (about 2200- 2400 caloires) for an extended amount of time (8 weeks) with a carb up every 3-4 days (400 grams) , but after the show I slowly raised caloires and after about 3-4 weeks I noticed getting bloated and having severe constipation and feel cold all the time, getting severe joint pains and my self esteem went to shit. I went to the GI specialist and said I do to dieting I had used super dieters tea becuase constipation got so bad not because of diet but i think becuase of stress levels at my job, so 2-3 times a week I would use this tea to releive blaoting. after the contest I also stop on EC stack from 3 times a day yo just on workout days and then stopped all the gh and chem as well. from this time I have been very cold, lack of selfesteem, and constipated like crazy, and just about falling into every hypo thyroid symptoms joint pains,thickness of skin and steroid moon face , fever, constantly sick, sensitiveity to light plus many others there are. Any suggestion will be greatly aprecaited. My hr is 50 and bp is 101/59 core temp in morning was 95.9 today and when i ate it raised to 98 !! any help be appreciated Thanks brio

02-04-2004, 03:14 PM	#2
Jodi Super Moderator Super Moderator Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 22,265 Photos: 1	Have you had a blood test done? Things to check for hypothyroidism or hyperthyroidism would be T4, TSH, T3, PBI. Here are a few things that may help: Make sure you vitamins are without iron - they can interfere with thyroid function as well. Stop eating raw greens and cook them instead. I know this sounds silly but I recall reading this before that over eating raw veggies can affect thyroid levels. Also soy products can cause issues as well. Make sure you are getting sodium and iodine in your diet. I don't recall the specific affects to the thyroid - but I do know that you need to make sure you are getting some. I was reasearching this last year when I thought I was becoming hypo again. Thankfully that was not the case. Another thing to keep in mind is that if your blood does not show hypothyroidism it may show the opposite, hyperthyroidism. Many people have similar symptoms of hypothyroidism, including myself, even though its hyper. I went back and forth with a stretch of Hypo, then with medicine became hyper. I came off the medicine and I stayed hyper for a few years and they almost burnt out my thyroid. I had Graves disease. Instead, they tried a different drug Tapazole for a year and that seemed to take care of it. I have not had any issues since but my symptoms while I was hyper were the same symptoms as hypo. This doesn't happen often but common enough that the doctors recognized it. This was years ago and since then I have had no thyroid issues. Keeping track of your morning tempature is good. Your temp will change throughout the day but the morning temp is what to go by for tracking purposes.
	Essence EFA

02-04-2004, 04:16 PM	#4
atherjen DS Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: MS Posts: 5,757	hmmm does having a low heart rate and BP be concerned? my HR is 51 and BP is 98/52, sometimes a tad higher but not by much. always been this low tho.. .not norm? hmm temp in the morning is 97.7 usually. norm? HANS, I really hope that you can get things worked out and that there is something they can do for you.. this entire comp dieting thing is scaring me more each day already with that I am feeling in my body..
	" To dream anything you want to dream: That is the beauty of the human mind. To do anything you want to do: That is the strength of the human will. To trust yourself to test your limits: that is the courage to succeed." NPC Southern Classic, June 3rd NPC Cajun Classic, June 10th NPC Mississippi State July 22nd

02-04-2004, 04:38 PM	#5
Dale Mabry Moderator Moderator Join Date: May 2003 Location: Elsewhere Posts: 13,844 Photos: 10	Borderline morning body temp is 97.8. I would not worry about the low BP and heart rate as a symptom of Hypo, it can mean so many different things. I know that Drs give GH to up a metabolism so maybe you are getting some negative feedback from that. Bump on the iodine, it is one of the things that your thyroid absorbs to make T3 and T4. Well, actually, it is reduced to iodide and then absorbed from the small intestine, same thing. I heard once before that if you rub iodine on your abdomen and it disappears rather quickly that you are prolly deficient in it. Don't know the validity of that, but I suppose it makes sense. Also, if you are accustomed to having iodized salt and then conpletely cut it out, you may become deficient. I would assume you took a multi, so that shouldn't be the case. Also, excess cortisol production blocks the conversion of T4 to T3, which could be another issue. I don't know how stressed you have been prior to this, but considering you where dieting pretty hard this could be the case. This could also be linked to the GH, but I am not sure what the relationship would be. Forgot to tell you, check out this site and if you feel this could be the case, bring it up to your doctor. http://www.providentmedical.com/medf...nsSyndrome.pdf
	If sense were common, everyone would have it. 4/2007-Current 75th Ranked most popular image 1 spot behind Prince's bulge...

02-04-2004, 05:40 PM	#12
atherjen DS Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: MS Posts: 5,757	orally is fine IMO. thats how I do it.
	" To dream anything you want to dream: That is the beauty of the human mind. To do anything you want to do: That is the strength of the human will. To trust yourself to test your limits: that is the courage to succeed." NPC Southern Classic, June 3rd NPC Cajun Classic, June 10th NPC Mississippi State July 22nd

02-04-2004, 04:03 PM	#3
greekblondechic I'm special :) Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: NJ Posts: 7,791	We always have the same symptoms, its eerie I wish I knew how to help hon!

02-04-2004, 04:53 PM	#6
bigbrownbear Registered User Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: uk Posts: 52	HAN sorry to hear about your situation bro. I dont know why your in the position your in, but I do know u like your ALA and you do crazy doses like 3000mg with lots of carbs, however i think this isnt gonna help you and can cause problems with your joints and your brain, as you could be driving away glucose for the brain and even starving it, tothe point brain cells will die. I would keep the ALA to a minimum for a while bro or even stay off it.

02-04-2004, 05:27 PM	#7
hardasnails1973 www.Bodyfactoryllc.com Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Pa Posts: 1,740	ala actually helps to regenerated tissue. after my blood test if it is low i'm going to start on iodine, gugguls, corefolsin and get thing back in line so i look half descent for the body rock !!

02-04-2004, 05:33 PM	#9
greekblondechic I'm special :) Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: NJ Posts: 7,791	it happened to him im also experiencing something similar..

02-04-2004, 05:34 PM	#10
donescobar2000 The Gym's Disciple Elite Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Your girlfriend bedroom. Haha! Posts: 1,586 Photos: 7	Greek have you been checking your temp every morning?
	]

02-04-2004, 05:37 PM	#11
greekblondechic I'm special :) Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: NJ Posts: 7,791	no not yet..should i do it orally or underarm?

02-04-2004, 05:41 PM	#13
greekblondechic I'm special :) Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: NJ Posts: 7,791	for 10minutes like mercola recommends?

02-04-2004, 05:44 PM	#14
donescobar2000 The Gym's Disciple Elite Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Your girlfriend bedroom. Haha! Posts: 1,586 Photos: 7	You want to be between this target range 97.8 to 98.2. If you are below that then you definitley wanna see a doctor. 10 minutes will do.
	]

02-04-2004, 06:01 PM	#15
donescobar2000 The Gym's Disciple Elite Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Your girlfriend bedroom. Haha! Posts: 1,586 Photos: 7	This thread is gonna make go on a 2 week bulk just to make sure I don't fuck up my thyroid.
	]

02-04-2004, 06:46 PM	#16
greekblondechic I'm special :) Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: NJ Posts: 7,791	I've been seeing a doctor, she said my thyroid is normal but I just dont believe her..

02-04-2004, 06:48 PM	#17
donescobar2000 The Gym's Disciple Elite Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Your girlfriend bedroom. Haha! Posts: 1,586 Photos: 7	Time for a second opinion. Never just get one.
	]

02-04-2004, 07:15 PM	#18
hardasnails1973 www.Bodyfactoryllc.com Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Pa Posts: 1,740	Glad I give people food for thought. Because i don not want same thing to happen to them as it did to me

02-04-2004, 07:30 PM	#19
donescobar2000 The Gym's Disciple Elite Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Your girlfriend bedroom. Haha! Posts: 1,586 Photos: 7	I assume you do recomend eating the same but just adding more activity just as you told sentrycyphen? I would agree with eating maintenence and just adding more activity as well. It makes perfect sense.
	]

02-04-2004, 09:24 PM	#20
hardasnails1973 www.Bodyfactoryllc.com Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Pa Posts: 1,740	well what i suggest is to take in concideration nutrient timing and meals macro breakdowns for optimal hormone assimuation through natural food. and then eat according toy your maintence level which is usually 15-18 times LBM (suport muscle NOT FAT tissue) and not over all body weight (give or take 10% margin of error) I would rather error more towards the higher side of caloires becuase you can always decrease later or increase your activity level to compensate. If you read tom venutos articles this is what he is preaching and also MAX OT preaches this as well. FEED THE MUSCLE WITH NUTIENTS AND LET CARDIO AND DAILY ACTIVITY BURN UN NECEESARY FAT !!

02-05-2004, 12:25 PM	#21
sentricyphen Hungry for SIZE Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: pa Posts: 737	what about carb cycling--is it possible that refeeds and no/low carb days are difficult on the thyroid--as opposed to keeping macros the same the whole cycle?

02-16-2004, 02:26 PM	#22
greekblondechic I'm special :) Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: NJ Posts: 7,791	Bump I'm also curious about this, my symptoms seem worse on my no carb days..

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