Thread: How critical is it to add dextrose to a PWO shake?

It depends on if you want to live or die. Easy choice if you ask me.

It isn't absolutely necessary to induce an insulin spike after a workout, no. I used to eat only oats and whey after a workout. Now I do the insulin spike thing; I do think it made a little difference, but that amount is hard to quantify. Overall caloric intake is far more important I think.

Originally Posted by bigsahm21

Is this detrimental to my recovery?

if compared to a shake of whey, dextrose and maltodextrin?.. possibly

No your recovery will have no effect. IMO you are better off without the huge insulin spike.

Originally Posted by bigsahm21

I'm bulking, and currently I use skim milk, whey, oats, and a banana. I don't use dextrose. Is this detrimental to my recovery?

Personally, I am partial to a partial insulin surge.

I like a mix of carb sources PWO - things like high glucose fruits, skim dairy (specifically milk), dextrose and maybe some faster digesting starch (eg: quick oats etc).

So your current meal looks pretty good (as long as the oats are quick oats?)
but if you are wanting to try dex then give it a go.

Something like:
skim milk
banana
dex
whey

Could be something that would work.

Thanks for the feedback...


...and yeah, they're quick oats

I notice a difference (in terms of recovery) when using simple sugar(s) PWO compared to a food source(s) such as oatmeal. I save that kind of source for the PPWO meal.

Been using maltodextrin for awhile with good results, but I just purchased dextrose (to mix in with whey), I hear good things about this combo.

The insulin 'spike' approach works for me; I want to replenish nutrients as quickly as possible so that I can make the most of my efforts in the gym...

Experiment and find/do what works best for you.

Originally Posted by furion joe

Experiment and find/do what works best for you.

That would make sense; we can't have that.

Originally Posted by CowPimp

That would make sense; we can't have that.

lol, yeah, I hear ya!

So how much dextrose is required to be effective? I know this is subject to debate

Originally Posted by shm353

So how much dextrose is required to be effective? I know this is subject to debate

This can't be given to a specific amount. Depends on your weight, your goals, your total diet, what else you were eating etc etc...

Originally Posted by shm353

So how much dextrose is required to be effective? I know this is subject to debate

Depends on your requirements...

Emma-Leigh gave a good calculation of carbs and protein in terms of LBM (lean body mass) here:

PWO carbs and glycogen stores

Originally Posted by Emma-Leigh

Generally, post-weight training I use:
0.5g x lean mass in carbs
0.25-0.33g lean mass in protein

I don't really change for cutting/bulking. For me, if there is one time you DO NOT want to take out food when cutting it is PWO - this is when you want to feed yourself to make sure you maintain your muscle mass.

But, for bulking, you could use 'desired LBM' for your figures.

You could also calculate it off how much volume you do in your workouts - I remember seeing a figure for roughly how much glucose per set you use... I **think** it was 5g per set, but I'll have to go look it up again to be sure.

The 2:1 ratio works well. So for me, that's 185 lbm X .5 for carbs = 92.5 grams; and then 185 lbm x .25 for protein = 46 grams. I consume approximately 90c/45p PWO shake with dextrose and whey protein.

Tried the dextrose today and it's like powdered sugar. Makes the shake pretty tasty.

The whole idea for this practice, in regards to using a simple sugar (monosaccharide) that has a high GI just made sense to me. Right now I am very interested in the recovery process, especially the initial phase of the recovery process. I am starting to believe that the overall recovery process has an equal value to the training stimulus itself.

The use of dextrose is debatable for sure and to each his/her own in regards to what works best. As stated previously by CowPimp, and in agreement I must say, a totally sound nutritional practice (overall calories and the correct ratio of macronutrients) goes a long way in determining the success or failure of one's goals. Nutritional support is key...

I've tried numerous approaches and I feel that the one I am now using is superior to what I have done in the past. The idea of someone using a combination of fruits, oats, milk, or whatever else is fine and I hope that works for that particular individual. But for myself, I want the absorption of nutrients to be quick, like BAM!, they're replaced and my muscles and total system can start to recuperate asap. That's why I always like to say "experiment" - there is no magic bullet. Well, on second thought, maybe there is, I just haven't seen it yet.

Another ratio I've seen to use is .8 grams of carbohydrates per kilogram of bodyweight and .4 grams of protein per kilogram of bodyweight. I believe this one is espoused by John Berardi, who is a big dog in the nutritional world.

I hit up accelerade before and during workouts. I'd rather have the insulin-related surge in energy during my workout than right after. Then I just eat a normal meal 30 minutes after.

Originally Posted by Dale Mabry

I hit up accelerade before and during workouts. I'd rather have the insulin-related surge in energy during my workout than right after. Then I just eat a normal meal 30 minutes after.

I think starting your PWO shake during your workout is also a really good idea as well, but it's still a good idea to take advantage of the enhanced protein synthesis and propensity for glycogen storage during that hour or so after a workout.

Originally Posted by CowPimp

I think starting your PWO shake during your workout is also a really good idea as well, but it's still a good idea to take advantage of the enhanced protein synthesis and propensity for glycogen storage during that hour or so after a workout.

I agree, I just don't think dextrose or anything like it is necessary. Although I loved Biotest Surge when it came out and it definitely helped, but that was for size as opposed to performance.

I remember doing a form of the anabolic diet where you were keto throughout the day, but hit up a high GI carb right before working out. Talk about an insulin surge.

Originally Posted by Dale Mabry

I agree, I just don't think dextrose or anything like it is necessary. Although I loved Biotest Surge when it came out and it definitely helped, but that was for size as opposed to performance.

I don't think it is necessary either. I have only been trying the insulin spike thang for the past few months. I can gain muscle mass with or without the insulin spike, but it does appear that the insulin spike provided slightly favorable results. They aren't groundbreaking, and I did just fine without it before, but significant nonetheless.

I remember doing a form of the anabolic diet where you were keto throughout the day, but hit up a high GI carb right before working out. Talk about an insulin surge.

Yeah, the anabolic diet does seem to make sense in that respect. However, I have a serious problem with low carbohydrate diets in general. One, I respond very poorly to low amounts of carbohydrates; I feel like shit without a reasonable amount of them. Two, I don't think largely reducing an entire category of foods is ever a good idea. There are all kinds of nutrients that are found largely in grain products that are probably only partially replaced with supplementation.