Rich Protein foods

Rlo · 06-12-2002, 04:43 PM

What are some foods stacked full of natural protein? thanx

06-12-2002, 05:35 PM

Tuna is always a winner - 26% protein

All meats, especially Beef and red meat in general are high on Protein.

But why not just read the label?

w8lifter · 06-12-2002, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Rlo
What are some foods stacked full of natural protein? thanx

Obviously all animal meats are protein.

Dairy such as cottage cheese, cheese, milk, etc has protein, but also comes w/ carbs...mostly sugar.

You can also find protein of varying qualities in foods such as beans, tofu, nuts, etc.

john992 · 06-12-2002, 09:34 PM

Complete Proteins: Lean cuts of beef, chicken, Ostrich, Duck, venison, tuna (80% of energy as protein), salmon, orange roughy, trout, other fish, eggs, milk, lean cuts of pork etc.

Incomplete proteins: Peanuts, Walnuts, Almonds, other nuts, Whole wheat pasta, kidney beans, many types of grains and cereals etc.

It is also important to note that mixing an incomplete protein with another incomplete protein will inturn create a complete protein if the right proteins are mixed together. The key is knowing the missing amino acid in one food and picking it up in another.

Definitions:

Complete Protein: Are proteins that contain all 8-9(*) essential amino acids.

Incomplete Protein: Are proteins that are missing one or more of the 8-9(*) essential amino acids.

Good mixes for incomplete proteins to make complete proteins are: red beans/rice, Soybeans/sesame seeds, Green Beans/Almonds, Corn Tortillas/Pinto Beans etc.

*=Infants require 9 essential amino acids while adults only need 8. Histidine is the amino acid that is essential to infants and is not for adults do not.

Athlete Protein intake ranges from 1.2-1.6 grams of protein per kilogram of body weight.

This is just a brief overview of protein if you have anymore questions just ask. GOOD LUCK!!!

john992 · 06-13-2002, 06:00 AM

I should also add that 1 gram of protein=4 Kcal.

TJohn · 06-13-2002, 06:17 AM

I believe they've all pretty much been mentioned.

TJohn

**Mudge** · 06-13-2002, 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by john992
Athlete Protein intake ranges from 1.2-1.6 grams of protein per kilogram of body weight.

Are you sure? I've heard of people intaking much more than me, I'm using the 1.0 gram per pound "rule". I've heard anything from .8 grams per pound, to 3 grams per kilogram bodyweight.

1.6 per kilogram would put me at about only 156 grams per day, weighing 215 pounds.

I remember Flex Wheeler claiming 500 grams per day which was an insane amount even compared to guys alot larger than him, although he did have a fast metabolism, not sure that had anything to do with his decision.

**Jodi** · 06-13-2002, 08:37 AM

I am by far an expert but that sounds awfully low to me as well. I weigh 114 and I eat 180 - 200 grams protein a day.

w8lifter · 06-13-2002, 04:02 PM

Actually it is too low for BB standards. John likes to go by the book and only believes in what has been scientifically proven.

I think you'll find him in the minority in that belief in regards to BB.

Most in this sport eat at least 1-2 g lb of LBM. It has been shown that athletes under physical stress require more than the RDA for protein. Also, your needs for protein increase under calorie restriction.

**Mudge** · 06-13-2002, 04:50 PM

Oh, ok, so were talking based on a 1970's study of a college student and thier caloric needs, that clears it up

john992 · 06-13-2002, 05:19 PM

W8, your right in saying that athletes under stress ( being an athlete basically states that you are being put under some kind of physical stress) require more then the RDA, which is 0.8 grams of protein per kilogram of body weight for sedentary individuals. But if you are referring to the RDA for atheltes, which is 1.2-1.6 grams of protein per kilogram of bodyweight I will have to disagree with your statement. I can post many articles/position statements/scientific studies proving this if someone could tell me how to post them on here.

If a individual is experiencing DISEASE, ILLNESS or SEVERE MENTAL/PHYSICAL STRESS this may cause an individual to increase these numbers but only slightly. ANd when your health returns to normal it is important that you also return your protein intake to normal. EXcessive protein can cause your body to produce toxic byproducts like ammonia and uric acid. A very probable effect of excessive protein intake is the onset of bone demineralization (osteoporosis), Dehydration, kidney dysfunction etc.

**Mudge** · 06-13-2002, 05:28 PM

Lets not forget, that scientific study also proved that the 4 minute mile was not possible.

It seems the enthusiast often finds what is truth, before the feds.

john992 · 06-13-2002, 05:51 PM

Lets also not forget that thousands of people die every day because they are going against science and experimenting with what science has proved dangerous.

**Mudge** · 06-13-2002, 05:56 PM

True as well.

Quote:

Studies show weight lifters might need .72g/lb. of bodyweight, highly trained cyclists might need .8g/lb., rigorous exercise training might require 1.3g/lb., and world-class weight lifters may use upwards of 1.6g/lb.

john992 · 06-13-2002, 06:50 PM

The methodology that "more is better" is the basic theorizing of many protein supplement users, especially in the bodybuilding scene. Athletes(bodybuilders) often base their meal planning on nutritional advice from their friends, nonscientific mentors, heroes, or idols-rather than scientific evidence.

There has not been any evidence showing a constant, linear increase in muscle mass or performance when consuming high-protein diets as opposed to using the RDA athlete protein requirements (1.2-1.6 grams per kg of bodyweight) .

**Jodi** · 06-13-2002, 07:10 PM

Well I know I am doing fine with my protein intake at being 180-200 and I keep getting great gains so I don't give a crap what science says as long as it works for me.

kuso · 06-13-2002, 07:12 PM

Where is TCD??

john992 · 06-13-2002, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mochy
Well I know I am doing fine with my protein intake at being 180-200 and I keep getting great gains so I don't give a crap what science says as long as it works for me.

I dont know what your current body weight is, so its hard to judge whether that is a reasonable amount of protein or not. But im guessing by the demeanor of your statement that you are going with or beyond the typical bodybuilder scheme of things (1 gram of protein per body pound) correct me if im wrong. With that being said I suggest lowering your protein intake and seeing if your still receiving the same gains. Remember that You should still consume your daily caloric requirements, so, if you had that properly configured in the first place, replace the protein calories with carbohydrate calories. Also think about your future, just because your not experiencing any adverse side effects from the excessive protein intake now, doesnt mean you wont later down the road.

The following may be of use to you:
1 gram of protein= 4 Kcal
1 gram of carbohydrate=4 Kcal
1 gram of fat=9 Kcal
1 gram of alcohol=7 Kcal

w8lifter · 06-13-2002, 07:53 PM

May I suggest, Mochy, that you not listen to John, lol.

John...is ABC back up yet?

and where the FUQ is Chicken Baby!

Dr. Pain · 06-13-2002, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by w8lifter
May I suggest, Mochy, that you not listen to John, lol.

John...is ABC back up yet?

and where the FUQ is Chicken Baby!

I agree!

DP

**Jodi** · 06-14-2002, 06:40 AM

Quote:

I dont know what your current body weight is

I guess if you actually read the whole thread you would have seen that I already posted my body weight above. I also don't believe that I should be lowering my protein intake. I have come to trust w8 and DP's suggestions since I have joined IM and if my intake was too high I think they would have said something by now. Thanks anyway.

Robboe · 06-14-2002, 08:16 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by john992
A very probable effect of excessive protein intake is the onset of bone demineralization (osteoporosis), Dehydration, kidney dysfunction etc.

People recommend calcium intake of up to 1500mg to prevent osteoporosis and recommend increased water intake to fade off dehydration. Oh, and can you find me a study showing high protein causes kidney damage in an individual who doesn't already have shot kidneys?

Quote:

Originally posted by john992
Lets also not forget that thousands of people die every day because they are going against science and experimenting with what science has proved dangerous.

Yeah. Protein - it'll kill you as you sleep. I hear Hollywood are making a big budget horror movie about it.

Quote:

Originally posted by john992
if you had that properly configured in the first place, replace the protein calories with carbohydrate calories.

Now let's just think about this for a second. if someone is rather large, then they need a high calorie count to maintain weight and more to gain weight. If they need to replace protein with carbs, on top of all the other carbs they'll be eating for calories...well let's just say, that's a lot of carbs. Now, high carb intake cause more metabolites via the hexamine pathway of carbohydrate metabolism which contribute towards insulin resistance. Potentially (and that is a rather large "potentially", folks) leading to diabetes.

So on one side of the scale, we have too much protein which has been shown to worsen (is that a word?) kidney damage in patients with kidney damage. On the other side, we have carbohydrate - a non-essential nutrient which can cause muscle-building (a relatively healthy proceedure, except for extra free radicals - which can be delt with from a heathy diet of fruit and vegetables) to become harder via insulin resistance, and fat gaining (unhealthy, except for increased leptin) to become rather easy. Not to mention the pyschological degradation you feel when you get fat.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm not saying carbs are evil, but i AM saying that proper carbohydrate management can be pivotal towards health benefits and accquiring the body you want.

**Mudge** · 06-14-2002, 08:22 AM

...the ocean was parted, people were healed, and the curse was broken, when TCD and John disagreed, seemingly for the first time.

w8lifter · 06-14-2002, 08:29 AM

lmfao!

TCD...meet John....I think you'll like him a lot, he'll give you so much material you might not have time for gp and DP

lol

Robboe · 06-14-2002, 08:52 AM

It's not so much that i disagree (except for the apparent damage towards kidneys, which i'll happily reconsider if he can find studies showing problems in "normal" individuals, cause sure as hell can't find any) because it is possible to still gain weight (and muscle) on lower protein intakes providing your calories are in surplus.

I was merely pointing out that by trying to avoid one potential danger you open the door towards another one.

**Mudge** · 06-14-2002, 10:06 AM

I know my dad has mentioned the kidney thing, but I don't know where that theory came from. Another reason to drink lots of water.

Robboe · 06-14-2002, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by john992
There has not been any evidence showing a constant, linear increase in muscle mass or performance when consuming high-protein diets as opposed to using the RDA athlete protein requirements (1.2-1.6 grams per kg of bodyweight) .

well that's maybe not entirely true.

I've been shuffling around and found two studies:

Consolazio GF, et al. Protein metabolism during intensive physical training in the young adult. Am J Clin Nutr 1975; 28:29-35

Dragan GI, Vasiliu A, Georgescu E. Effects of increased supply of protein on elite weightlifters. In: Galesloot TE, Tinbergen BJ, eds. Milk Proteins. Pudoc, Wageningen, The Netherlands 1985:99-103

Only problem is that i can't get the full studies. Only short summaries. Anyone have access to medline where they may be able to get the entire studies?

john992 · 06-14-2002, 10:40 AM

I will bring up some studies for you when I get home i am at work right now. Regarding the kidney damage, i agree whole heartedly there are no studies done on those without preexisting kidney problems. However that is not to say that excessive protein intake does not cause kidney damage in those who have healthy kidneys.

06-12-2002, 04:43 PM	#1
Rlo Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Location: up state New York Posts: 8	Rich Protein foods What are some foods stacked full of natural protein? thanx

06-12-2002, 05:35 PM	#2
Cenox Guest Posts: n/a	Tuna is always a winner - 26% protein All meats, especially Beef and red meat in general are high on Protein. But why not just read the label?
Cenox Guest Posts: n/a

06-13-2002, 04:50 PM	#10
Mudge Pizza the Hut Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 23,027 Photos: 1	Oh, ok, so were talking based on a 1970's study of a college student and thier caloric needs, that clears it up
	Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

06-13-2002, 05:19 PM	#11
john992 Registered User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 121	W8, your right in saying that athletes under stress ( being an athlete basically states that you are being put under some kind of physical stress) require more then the RDA, which is 0.8 grams of protein per kilogram of body weight for sedentary individuals. But if you are referring to the RDA for atheltes, which is 1.2-1.6 grams of protein per kilogram of bodyweight I will have to disagree with your statement. I can post many articles/position statements/scientific studies proving this if someone could tell me how to post them on here. If a individual is experiencing DISEASE, ILLNESS or SEVERE MENTAL/PHYSICAL STRESS this may cause an individual to increase these numbers but only slightly. ANd when your health returns to normal it is important that you also return your protein intake to normal. EXcessive protein can cause your body to produce toxic byproducts like ammonia and uric acid. A very probable effect of excessive protein intake is the onset of bone demineralization (osteoporosis), Dehydration, kidney dysfunction etc. Last edited by john992 : 06-13-2002 at 05:27 PM.

06-13-2002, 05:28 PM	#12
Mudge Pizza the Hut Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 23,027 Photos: 1	Lets not forget, that scientific study also proved that the 4 minute mile was not possible. It seems the enthusiast often finds what is truth, before the feds.
	Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

06-12-2002, 09:34 PM	#4
john992 Registered User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 121	Complete Proteins: Lean cuts of beef, chicken, Ostrich, Duck, venison, tuna (80% of energy as protein), salmon, orange roughy, trout, other fish, eggs, milk, lean cuts of pork etc. Incomplete proteins: Peanuts, Walnuts, Almonds, other nuts, Whole wheat pasta, kidney beans, many types of grains and cereals etc. It is also important to note that mixing an incomplete protein with another incomplete protein will inturn create a complete protein if the right proteins are mixed together. The key is knowing the missing amino acid in one food and picking it up in another. Definitions: Complete Protein: Are proteins that contain all 8-9() essential amino acids. Incomplete Protein: Are proteins that are missing one or more of the 8-9() essential amino acids. Good mixes for incomplete proteins to make complete proteins are: red beans/rice, Soybeans/sesame seeds, Green Beans/Almonds, Corn Tortillas/Pinto Beans etc. *=Infants require 9 essential amino acids while adults only need 8. Histidine is the amino acid that is essential to infants and is not for adults do not. Athlete Protein intake ranges from 1.2-1.6 grams of protein per kilogram of body weight. This is just a brief overview of protein if you have anymore questions just ask. GOOD LUCK!!!

06-13-2002, 06:00 AM	#5
john992 Registered User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 121	I should also add that 1 gram of protein=4 Kcal.

06-13-2002, 06:17 AM	#6
TJohn Registered User Join Date: May 2002 Location: Southeastern Pennsylvania Posts: 445	I believe they've all pretty much been mentioned. TJohn

06-13-2002, 08:37 AM	#8
Jodi Super Moderator Super Moderator Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 22,265 Photos: 1	I am by far an expert but that sounds awfully low to me as well. I weigh 114 and I eat 180 - 200 grams protein a day.

06-13-2002, 04:02 PM	#9
w8lifter Join Date: May 2001 Location: Around..... Posts: 14,964	Actually it is too low for BB standards. John likes to go by the book and only believes in what has been scientifically proven. I think you'll find him in the minority in that belief in regards to BB. Most in this sport eat at least 1-2 g lb of LBM. It has been shown that athletes under physical stress require more than the RDA for protein. Also, your needs for protein increase under calorie restriction.

06-13-2002, 05:51 PM	#13
john992 Registered User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 121	Lets also not forget that thousands of people die every day because they are going against science and experimenting with what science has proved dangerous.

06-13-2002, 06:50 PM	#15
john992 Registered User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 121	The methodology that "more is better" is the basic theorizing of many protein supplement users, especially in the bodybuilding scene. Athletes(bodybuilders) often base their meal planning on nutritional advice from their friends, nonscientific mentors, heroes, or idols-rather than scientific evidence. There has not been any evidence showing a constant, linear increase in muscle mass or performance when consuming high-protein diets as opposed to using the RDA athlete protein requirements (1.2-1.6 grams per kg of bodyweight) . Last edited by john992 : 06-13-2002 at 07:01 PM.

06-13-2002, 07:10 PM	#16
Jodi Super Moderator Super Moderator Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 22,265 Photos: 1	Well I know I am doing fine with my protein intake at being 180-200 and I keep getting great gains so I don't give a crap what science says as long as it works for me.

06-13-2002, 07:12 PM	#17
kuso Um......get rooted! Elite Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: aka ( o Y o ) Posts: 15,033 Photos: 15	Where is TCD??

06-13-2002, 07:53 PM	#19
w8lifter Join Date: May 2001 Location: Around..... Posts: 14,964	May I suggest, Mochy, that you not listen to John, lol. John...is ABC back up yet? and where the FUQ is Chicken Baby!

06-14-2002, 08:22 AM	#23
Mudge Pizza the Hut Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 23,027 Photos: 1	...the ocean was parted, people were healed, and the curse was broken, when TCD and John disagreed, seemingly for the first time.
	Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

06-14-2002, 08:29 AM	#24
w8lifter Join Date: May 2001 Location: Around..... Posts: 14,964	lmfao! TCD...meet John....I think you'll like him a lot, he'll give you so much material you might not have time for gp and DP lol

06-14-2002, 08:52 AM	#25
Robboe Designer Supplements Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Newcastle Posts: 5,151	It's not so much that i disagree (except for the apparent damage towards kidneys, which i'll happily reconsider if he can find studies showing problems in "normal" individuals, cause sure as hell can't find any) because it is possible to still gain weight (and muscle) on lower protein intakes providing your calories are in surplus. I was merely pointing out that by trying to avoid one potential danger you open the door towards another one.
	Being held down by The Man

06-14-2002, 10:06 AM	#26
Mudge Pizza the Hut Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 23,027 Photos: 1	I know my dad has mentioned the kidney thing, but I don't know where that theory came from. Another reason to drink lots of water.
	Kinesiology Vote @ Top 25 Deads Comp Bench Motivation Bench form MaxCalc Charles Poliquin When I let go of what I am, I become what I might be. Lao-Tzu I don't know any sources so don't ask - thanks

06-14-2002, 10:40 AM	#28
john992 Registered User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 121	I will bring up some studies for you when I get home i am at work right now. Regarding the kidney damage, i agree whole heartedly there are no studies done on those without preexisting kidney problems. However that is not to say that excessive protein intake does not cause kidney damage in those who have healthy kidneys.