Sleeping metabolic rate in relation to body mass index and body composition.

**LAM** · 06-23-2002, 12:01 PM

Zhang K, Sun M, Werner P, Kovera AJ, Albu J, Pi-Sunyer FX, Boozer CN.

Institute of Human Nutrition, Department of Medicine, Columbia University College of Physicians and Surgeons, New York, USA. kz6@columbia.edu

OBJECTIVES: To determine whether patterns of sleeping metabolic rate (SMR) are altered in obesity. Specifically to determine the relationship between changes in SMR and body weight, body mass index (BMI, kg/m(2)), and fat-free mass (FFM); and to compare resting metabolic rate (RMR) with SMR during different periods of sleep. SUBJECTS: Eighteen healthy, pre-menopausal, obese (BMI >30, n=9) and non-obese (BMI <30, n=9), female subjects (six Caucasians and 12 African-Americans), with an average age of 36 y (range 22-45). MEASUREMENTS: Total energy expenditure (TEE or 24 h EE), metabolic rate (MR), SMR (minimum, average and maximum) and resting metabolic rate (RMR) or resting energy expenditure (REE) measured by human respiratory chamber, and external mechanical work measured by a force platform within the respiratory chamber. Physical activity index (PAL) was derived as TEE/REE. Body composition was determined by dual-energy X-ray absorptiometry (DXA). RESULTS: SMR decreased continuously during sleep and reached its lowest point just before the subject was awakened in the morning by the research staff. Although averages for RMR and SMR were similar, RMR was lower than SMR at the beginning of the sleeping period and higher than SMR in the morning hours. The rate of decrease in SMR was faster with increasing body weight (-0.829, P<0.0001), BMI (correlation factor -0.896, P<0.0001) and FFM (-0.798, P=0.001). The relationship between the slope of SMR decrease and BMI (y=-5 x 10(-6)x(2)+0.0002x-0.0028) is highly significant, with a P-value of <0.0001 and r(2) value of 0.9622. CONCLUSIONS: The rate of decline in metabolic rate during sleep is directly related to body weight, BMI and FFM. Average SMR tends to be lower than RMR in obese subjects and higher than RMR in non-obese subjects.

Int J Obes Relat Metab Disord 2002 Mar;26(3):376-83

* I've been reading a lot of studies like this lately trying to find out why my appetite is so ravenous upon waking in the am. It's what wakes my up every morning, dam hunger pangs !!!

anyone else have any other good info on this ? TCD any input ?

**Dr. Pain** · 06-23-2002, 12:14 PM

LAM, this study is irrelevant considering the study group and n=9 X 2........

My sugeestion is that what you are experiencing is a combination of nocturnal catabolism...and a fired up metabolism.....
A high fat/protein.....no carb meal at bedtime may help this!

I am not a fan of casein, but there are studies showing the l-leucine stays with you for up to seven hours as compared to other aminos...

DP

**w8lifter** · 06-23-2002, 12:22 PM

Originally posted by Dr. Pain
LAM, this study is irrelevant considering the study group and n=9 X 2........

My sugeestion is that what you are experiencing is a combination of nocturnal catabolism...and a fired up metabolism.....
A high fat/protein.....no carb meal at bedtime may help this!

I am not a fan of casein, but there are studies showing the l-leucine stays with you for up to seven hours as compared to other aminos...

DP

Really? Sometimes I'm starving in the mornings, not so much on this diet though, but used to wake up ready to eat a cow

Why aren't you a fan of casein?

**LAM** · 06-23-2002, 12:23 PM

this is just one of many examples that I have found, I know it's not one of the best examples but physioligically speaking it makes sense.

I know it's not my diet as I'm losing bodyfat and gaing LBM currently. I have been like this my entire life (waking up starving !), recently it's just gotten worse...

**Robboe** · 06-23-2002, 01:07 PM

What does your current diet consist of? And do you feel hungry throughout the day also?

**LAM** · 06-23-2002, 01:15 PM

8:00 am - 45 minutes cardio

9:00 am - Lean Body MRP w/ additonal 25 grams of 0ptimum ProComplex , 10 grams L-Glutamine and 1/2 cup of 100% unprocessed oat or wheat bran - 412 cals, 60 grams protein, 40 grams carbs, 3 fat.

10:00 am - 1 serving EFA (either natty pb, hemp, flax or olive oil) - 10 grams fat

11:00 am - 8 oz chicken breast and 1 regular apple + 15 grams CFM whey in water, 60 grams protein, 20 grams of carbs.

12:00 pm - 1 serving EFA (either natty pb, hemp, flax or olive oil) - 10 grams fat

1:00 pm - 1 can tuna, 1/2 cup cottage 2% cottage cheese + 10 grams CFM whey in water, 60 grams protein, 2 grams fat.

2:00 pm - 1 serving EFA (either natty pb, hemp, flax or olive oil) - 10 grams fat

3:00 pm - 1 serving beef either lean steak or burger, 60 grams protein, 14 grams fat.

6:00 pm - 8 oz salmon steak, spinach salad, 60 grams protein carbs and fat ?

7:30 pm - 8 oz chicken breast and 1/2 cup oatmeal, 60 grams protein and 25 grams carbs, 3 fats.

9:00 pm - pre-workout 20 grams CFM whey in water

10:15 pm - post workout - 20 grams CFM whey in water w/ 75 grams of simple sugars (dextrose and maltodextrin mix), 10 grams micronized creatine, 10 grams L-Glutamine, 1 gram ALA, 6 grams BCAA's.

12:30 am - Lean Body MRP w/ additonal 25 grams of 0ptimum ProComplex , 10 grams L-Glutamkine - 412 cals, 60 grams protein, 7 grams carbs, 3 fat.

*As I'm constantly eating all day I mostly have to force myself to eat so I'm never really hungry...

I just changed my diet friday to account for my losses of bf and gains in LBM..so the diet is not exact, but basically I'm taking in.

50% from Protein = 1690 calories or 422.5 grams of protein = 70 per meal (6 per day)
30% from Carbs = 1014 calories or 253.5 grams of carbs = 42 per meal
20% from Fats = 676 calories or 75.1 grams of fats = 12 per meal

**Robboe** · 06-23-2002, 02:48 PM

With a shake before bed i'm not suprised you wake up with hunger pangs!

**w8lifter** · 06-23-2002, 03:07 PM

LAM...can you explain the purpose of that diet?

**LAM** · 06-23-2002, 03:46 PM

When cutting I have found that for myself not consuming carbs and fats in the same meal works best for me, as my body does not metabolize carbs well (any carbs even real low GI/GR). that's why I consume my fats seperately.

I eat constantly (protein every 2-3 hours) for the normal reasons. on my non-weight training days I do 1 45 minute am session of cardio and another 45 min session at night. to counter any possible effects of increased cortisol the frequent eating and related insulin response negates that. so muscle catabolism is not an issue. Originally I had different meal times on weight training and cardio days but decided to use the same for both for simplicity reasons.

It seems to be working well on April 1st I was 250 @ 18% bf on June first I was 220 @ 11% bf now I'm 228 @ 9.5% bf...

**w8lifter** · 06-23-2002, 03:56 PM

Thanks for explaining...congrats btw

Chest Rockwell · 06-23-2002, 04:25 PM

Yeah,
Congratulations on the BF loss Lam!
Good Work Man!

**LAM** · 06-23-2002, 05:59 PM

thanks w8 and Chest...

I wish I was happier about the progress but I'm just getting back to where I was last year after the worst bulking cycle ever ! I will never do a un-clean bulking cycle again, the uneccessary gains in bf are so not worth it.. the only thing that got big was my gut and my "ab" ! lol

**Dr. Pain** · 06-23-2002, 06:28 PM

LAM your bedtime Lean Body MRP should have about 12 grams of carbs....and getting it w/ony 3 grams of fat may be the problem!

Also you are not counting the glutamine in as protein, so with those totals (almost 80 P), you may be getting some hepatic gluconeogensis, which in turn, via an insulin surge, may be depleting your serum glucose levels a few hours later.

I would opt for 55 grams of Pro Complex with 4 Tbls of heavy cream and see if that makes a difference...or as TCD is saying, change to solids!

w8, I deal with a quite a few people that while not lactose intolerant, have no tolerance for for calcium or sodium cassienate, it tears them up, or at the very least makes then uncomfortable.

Actually had a guy yesterday with an egg allergy.

**Jane** · 06-23-2002, 06:30 PM

Originally posted by LAM
thanks w8 and Chest...

I wish I was happier about the progress but I'm just getting back to where I was last year after the worst bulking cycle ever ! I will never do a un-clean bulking cycle again, the uneccessary gains in bf are so not worth it.. the only thing that got big was my gut and my "ab" ! lol

Amen to that. After an unclean bulk, I'm coming down from my highest bf% ever...will never let it rise that high again. Good god, this is wasting so much time from my training.

**LAM** · 06-23-2002, 06:31 PM

thanks for the info Dr Pain ! I'll try it out tonight...

**LAM** · 06-23-2002, 06:34 PM

Jane...that was mine as well, it was the first time in my life that I had ever been over 12%...cutting absolutely SUCKS !!!

Chest Rockwell · 06-23-2002, 07:43 PM

I'm not down wit the dirty bulks.
My metabolism is too damn slow to handle alot of crappy food
and dirty bulks makes me go to the bathroom too often.

Clean bulkin is where it's at.
Plus the chicks don't dig the fatness even if there is muscle under
the layers and layers of fat.

I'm not scared to put on some fat but I have a built in fatness alarm
that tells me, "You Are A Fat Fuq, STOP EATING!"

**Jane** · 06-23-2002, 08:34 PM

Lesson learned the hard way, that's all I have to say.

**Duncan** · 06-24-2002, 02:36 PM

LAM

How well do you sleep and for how long?

The reason I ask is that poor or reduced sleep reduces serotonin levels which, in turn, leads to an increased appetite.

**LAM** · 06-24-2002, 02:51 PM

I sleep very soundly (crazy dreams that I remember every night)but don't need much mabye 6 hours a night, my life is 100% stress free as well.

I haven't slept good since I was in the miliatary, I wake up when an ant farts !

**WilliamB** · 04-15-2005, 05:46 PM

Hey you guys never finished this thread. Did the Dr. cure your morning hunger pains?

**Robboe** · 04-15-2005, 06:00 PM

Yup - turns out he was IR.

**Vieope** · 04-15-2005, 06:05 PM

I don´t think I ever saw more acronyms in my life.

**min0 lee** · 04-15-2005, 06:40 PM

Originally Posted by Vieope

I don´t think I ever saw more acronyms in my life.

Holy Acronyms, I need to learn them. I was lost.

**P-funk** · 04-15-2005, 07:17 PM

Originally Posted by TCD

Yup - turns out he was IR.

**BulkMeUp** · 04-16-2005, 08:58 AM

Hell! that was one cryptic post!!! Never thought i would see a question thread from LAM. IMO, he is the one of the 'go-to' guys for answers

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