ngoldenm

Hi,

First of all I want to say thank you to everyone on this forum. I've been reading on here for the past couple of days. I think my eyes are about to bleed. I've tried reading through all of the stickies and everything like that, but if I missed something, I apologize. I'm new at this, and I just want to get my life straight.

Here's a little info about me. I'm 22 years old, about 220 pounds, and 6'4". I guess that I'm not ridiculously overweight, but I do have quite a bit of fat. I haven't worked out in probably 5-6 years. I have had a very poor diet for most of this time consisting of mainly fast food (I'm a college student, so it's convenient). During this time, I've been eating about 2200-2400 cals a day while eating 2 meals a day, lunch and dinner with a cereal bar in the AM. I have been holding steady at 220 for at least a year.

So, I've made up my mind to change my lifestyle. I've started working out. I'm doing a 3 day split with very light cardio on the off days. I want to cut my fat down first and foremost. Afterwards, I would like to build enough muscle to look fit. I don't necessarily want to look cut or ripped, just lean and strong. I've cut my calories to about 1800 give or take a little. I'll list what I ate today to give you an example.

Early AM Breakfast:
Special K cereal bar (same as before I started my diet)
Non-fat yogurt
Banana
Apple

Lunch:
Roast Beef Sub sandwich with veggies on wheat (some days I do a turkey sandwich)
Salad with Fat Free Italian dressing
Orange

Snack:
Peanut Butter Sandwich
Banana

Dinner:
Grilled Chicken Salad with grated cheese (Some days it's just grilled chicken or grilled fish)
Non-fat yogurt
Green Beans
Orange

According to FitDay, that's approximately 48g fat, 231g carbs, and 97g protein.

Firstly, my maintenance calories seem low for someone my size according to what I've been reading on here. But, that's exactly what they are because I've been fluttering between 215-225 for last year on that many cals a day. You could probably add some to it because I have been going out for drinks on the weekend, maybe 6-12 light beers spaced over the entire weekend.

I know that I need to increase the protein, but to what? And what about the other two? I don't really care what type of diet that I go on considering that I just started it less than a week ago. Do any of you have any tips/suggestions on things to add to my diet or what I should do differently.

If you've made it this far, thanks for reading my novel. I appreciate it.

bigsahm21

First of all, welcome and good for you man

There are a lot of really, really smart people here who will really be able to help you out. I'm not one of the experts by any means but I'll give it a shot.

First, that calorie total does seem low for a guy your size but if you were sedentary than maybe not...as you start working out more and eating right I'd expect that to rise a little. Also, eating only two meals a day might have had something to do with your metabolism slowing down...maybe...I don't know. 1800, though, at 6'4 225, is DEFINETELY low.

As far as your food choices go, they look pretty good. In the morning, though, I'd make sure to have a much more balanced meal of whole foods. That's very heavy on the carbs (particularly sugar) and lacking in protein and good fats.

The stereotypical good breakfast would be something like oats, whole egg(s) + egg whites, maybe some milk/fruit, maybe some natural PB. Whatever works for you. That breakfast has a good balance of whole grain, slow digesting carbs, protein, and healthy fats.

Also, be sure you get a good amount of EFA's in your diet as well; essential fatty acids. Fish oils (great for omega-3's), flaxseed, etc. are good sources of that.

As far as fats and proteins go, typical recommended ratios are something like:

Protein: 1-1.5g protein for every lb of LBM (lean body mass).
Fat: 0.5-.75g fat for every lb of LBM

Lean body mass can be found by subtracting your body fat percentage (in your case around) from 100% and multiplying that by your weight. So say your body fat was 15%. At 220 lbs, your LBM would be:

(1-.15) = .85 x 220 = 187 pounds LBM.

Keep in mind though that these ratios of carbs/fats/proteins are different for everybody. Some people like the high carb/high protein/low fat, others like the low carb/high protein/high fat, etc. If I were you, I'd just try out different diet patterns over a course of a few weeks, keep close tabs on everything you eat, and see what works out for you the best.

KentDog

You may believe what you've listed is your maintenance calorie range, but for someone at your weight, < 1750 calories a day is not a healthy calorie level. Additionally, you completely neglect proteins and fats in half or more of your meals.

Low calorie diets are not the best for losing weight. I would up your calories and try to balance each meal with protein/carbs/fats. You consume a lot of simple carbs, but barely any complex carbs.

Some quick suggestions:

Breakfast: Ditch the cereal bar if you have the time to make some oatmeal. Stir in some natural peanut butter for healthy fats. Drop either the apple or banana (for the purposes of dropping some calories from carbs, to balance your meal between protein/carb/fats). Add a protein source such as a whey protein shake or some egg whites.

Lunch looks decent, but you should elaborate on the breakdown of the p/c/f in the sub sandwich as well as overall meal if you can.

Snack: try to add some protein here.

Dinner: Doesn't look bad. However, if you can elaborate on p/c/f calorie breakdown, it would help with giving advice better.

The more detail you can give on calorie and p/c/f breakdown of each meal, the better.

ngoldenm

Thanks for the replies. I'll try to answer any questions here if I can.

That is really what I was thinking too after reading up on here. The problem is, once I started eating healthier lower calorie meals, I have to almost force myself to eat those 1700-1800 calories. I feel absolutely stuffed after each meal. Almost miserably stuffed. It's not that I feel bad about eating that often. I just feel like I can't hardly stuff another bite of food down into my stomach.

This morning I ditched the cereal bar as suggested. I had 3 whole eggs (mainly because I prefer the taste much more then just egg whites) and I made a protein shake with 1 scoop whey, one serving of oats, and I threw a banana in there and blended it all up. This was a total of 26g fat, 57g carbs, 50g protein for a total of 621 calories. Is this on the right track?

The old breakfast was 2g fat, 77g carbs, and 17g protein for a total of 342 calories.

I don't do the sub all the time, but it is usually some type of sandwich with low fat meat. It was 5g fat, 45g carb, 19g protein. Overall meal was 5g fat, 68g carbs, and 21g protein for a total of 410 calories.

So just add some protein to what I am already eating or replace something with a source of protein?

The one I listed for the other day is 17g fat, 65g carbs, and 13g protein for a total of 440 calories.

It was 14g fat, 44g carbs, and 70g protein for a total of 540 calories.

I hope this helps. I want to figure this out. If you need to know anything else, please don't hesitate to ask and I'll try my best to answer. Thanks.

KentDog

I know the feeling. "Clean" calories are more filling than empty/junk calories. Additionally, your stomach is accustomed to digesting far smaller amounts of food. I was at the same place you were a few years ago. I had to make sure I ate at certain times because I wasn't hungry and wouldn't normally eat otherwise. And yes, I did this while cutting weight as well.

Not bad. A bit high in fat from the egg yokes though. Have you tried taking out one yoke by hand? You lose a bit of flavor, but I still like the taste myself. Try to have each meal add up to about the same number of calories, and not too much coming from just one macronutrient.

Add ontop of what you have.

Now, some people may disagree with me, but I say try to have each meal match closely to the previous meal as far as overall calorie and macronutrient division. It develops consistancy and discipline (key in successful bodybuilding). The only exception to this rule would be your post workout shake. Many, including myself, believe you should leave fats out of your postworkout shake so that it does not slow down absorption of protein and carbs in replenishing your muscles. Some also say to drop fats preworkout, but I do not follow this strictly myself.

ngoldenm

Well, it's good to know that I'm not alone in this aspect. I feel like I'm gonna explode after some meals!


I'll do that tomorrow morning and try it out.


I think that mine have been following this. Sort of anyway. That's what I was trying to do. As far as my post workout shake, today it consisted of whey and oats. I also had to combine my snack with it because I just haven't had time today to get the snack in. So I ate an apple. Dinner is just around the corner too, and here I am not even hungry. This diet stuff sucks!

And by the way, my lunch consisted of a roast beef sandwich with cheese, some cottage cheese, and some peanut butter (because I didn't think that I would have time to get to my peanut butter sandwich later) with a one scoop whey protein shake to drink. Totals are 25g fat, 31g carb, 64g protein, and 620 cals.

What sort of numbers as far as grams fat, carbs, protein, and cals should I be shooting for per day since my 1800 cals is too low?

KentDog

You are definitely not alone.
I would set a subjective number to slowly increase up to. I would take what you believe your lean body mass is in pounds x 12 calories to get started.

As far as macronutrient breakdown, you can do it two ways:
Take your lean body weight, x1g = grams of protein to shoot for
Fats = 20-25% of daily calories
Carbs = remainder

Or you can do a split like 20% fat / 40% carbs / 40% protein

People will have various opinions on this, but I like to do this for consistancy purposes and have found that it works well.

Merkaba

my two cents.

I think the others have hit it on the head. Low calories, two meals a day = slow metabolism.

In the morning I would eat mostly protein, maybe some oatmeal or cheerios or decent cereal on the days you feel it is a must or you don't have time. Stop the meals where you don't have decent protein going in. Get your carbs later in the day around your workout. Before and after.

I'm a carb and bread a holic. Its easy to slap a sandwich together, convenient. If you can stop eating sandwiches and bread it will help. Precook some veggies for the next few days ahead of time. Try hearty home made soups. They are easy to make and fill you up. If youre lucky enough to like sweet potatoes go buy some. I dont like em much. Get some fish oil caps. Home made peanut butter and crackers and an apple used to be my staple for a mid day meal/snack. Home made because you can put way more peanut butter on them. Keep an eye on your intake and keep the protein and good fats high. If you hit the gym you'll do well. DO NOT try to catch up in a month. Start out easy. I say lots of high rep work, light weight for the first few workouts. good luck. Keep us posted.

Ban 2 1/2 's !!!!!!
--------------------------------------------
Some Pics. All Natural

ngoldenm

Ok, thanks. I've been following this the past few days and will try to keep it up. Thanks for the advice.

I'm a sandwich guy as well just because it is so easy and I'm very busy since I'm back in college now. I'll keep the soup recommendation in mind. I'm sure I could come up with something and throw it in the crock pot and have enough to last me 2-3 days or so. I'm having to do most of my workout at home with dumbbells, resistance tubes, and my own weight (pushups/pullups and the like). I plan to add some additional equipment as I build my strength back up.

And trust me, I tried to do way to many chest presses with too much weight the first time I started back and was in pain for days. Won't do that again! Slow and steady for me til I can handle the heavier weight.

Thanks for the tips. If anyone else has anything else that they want to add that could help me, feel free. Thanks again.

ngoldenm

Also, I guess my body is starting to acclimate to the new food schedule. I'm getting hungry now (which I haven't felt for the last week). After I get done with my dinner, I should be at about 2200 cals for the day, 57g fat, 231g carbs (damn those sandwiches!), and 215g protein. That comes to 22% fat, 40% carbs, and 38% protein for the day. Does it sound like I'm on the right track finally?

Built

Here's a rule of thumb: feed your lean mass the protein and fat it requires.
You currently weigh 220 and figure you're a bit soft, right? What weight do you think you'd need to be to see abs - maybe 190-200? Take 90% of this to be your assumed lean mass: 180 lbs. This will be close enough for our purposes.

Make sure you eat at least a gram of protein and at least half a gram of fat per pound lean mass. For you, this means at least 180g protein and at least 90g of fat daily. I'd personally go a lot higher on the protein, particularly while cutting. I only weigh 135 or so and I eat about 200g protein daily.

For you, 300g protein and 100g fat sounds about right.
I agree, that's too low. MY maintenance is about 2100, and my cutting calories are around 1800.

Meal frequency isn't associated with metabolic slowdown though. That one's a myth.
Also agree on the protein and fat - but ther's no need to eat a balanced meal - I personally don't eat starches in the AM.
Just make sure every meal centers around protein.
My version of a good breakfast is four or five eggs scrambled in butter, or about a cup of cottage cheese with half a tin of tuna and half an avocado. Choose something that works for you - ie something that sticks.

Fish oil is the shit! I get in 10g a day. Don't bother with flax. Waste of time.
Exactly - if you start from a non-fucked baseline, the scope of your search is narrowed considerably.

Again, not my idea of a healthy diet, but it CAN work if it's comfortable for you.
If this felt comfortable for you, you're golden.

I'd just do the eggs, personally. Maybe some buttered veggies with it.

Try this: Every time you open your mouth to eat, protein goes in - the other stuff is just a garnish.
I respectfully disagree. I don't like to eat a lot of carb through the day because it makes me hungry. So I don't. If you're comfortable eating this way you're fine. But there's no good reason to balance all your meals so they're the same size unless you happen to find it more comfortable and more satiating.
Alternatively, adopt a "feedbag" approach: pack a whole day's worth of food, carry it with you. Eat what you want when you want it. When it's gone, it's gone. Plan accordingly.

Prudent advise.
I do fats preworkout if the preworkout meal is a few hours before I train. If it's right before, I leave 'em out. Save 'em for another meal.

Or better yet, the LBM-targeted dosings suggested above, namely at least a gram of protein and at least half a gram of fat per pound LBM. There is no target for carbs - eat as much or as little as you like, given protein and fat minimums have been met and calories aren't exceeded. If you are one of those folks like me who gets hungry on higher carbs, target the small amount of carb you eat to the meal before and or the meal after you train.

As mentioned above, this one actually isn't true. You can just eat one meal or you can eat 19 tiny meals. Your metabolism won't mind either way. Pick a meal frequency that keeps you comfortable.
Exactly
Do you have a workout plan, ngoldenm?

ngoldenm

Wow, thanks Built. I'll try to answer your questions.

Well, I've been 185 before back in my first semester of college where my diet consisted of the occasional meal during the day accented by a whole lot of beer at night until the sun came. Rinse and repeat. I might have been able to see an outline of my abs but I still had a good bit of fat on them. But with my diet, I probably had practically no muscle. Very unhealthy to say the least.

As I said above, I have to work out from home at this time. Actually, I saw another post of yours on here (I think it was for SnowManSnow or something like that) and I tried it yesterday. I adapted it slightly to work with what I have at the moment. Below is the list and how I perform them.

squats - Right now, I use all of my resistance tubes linked together. It's the only thing that can supply enough resistance for me. Soon, I plan to add either some heavier dumbbells for some goblin squats or maybe add a barbell with some plates so that I can do lumberjacks.
Deadlifts - Again, I utilize all of my resistance tubes, the short ones this time and place them under my feet and pull against them. If I get a barbell later, I can incorporate it here as well.
lat pulldowns - For this one, I use my tubes (the ultra heavy and the heavy) and hook them against something up high. I sit down on something so that I can emulate a lat pulldown as closely as I can. I was rather surprised at how well this works.
Arnold press - For this I use my dumbbells.
One arm dumbbelll rows - Same as above.
flat or low incline db or barbell press - Same.
Pullups - I try to do them at least. For the time being I'm limited to two actual pullups. I do the rest as negative ones.

I do this on Monday, Wednesday, and Friday.

I also do pushups each morning when I wake up just to get the blood circulating. Sometimes, I'll go for a short jog as well. I also do some ab work on Mondays and Fridays.

I was skeptical that I would be able to actually perform these with the equipment that I have, but I was surprised to find that it gave me a much better work out then what I was doing on my own before. As soon as I add a few extra pieces of equipment, I should be able to perform these pretty well at home.

I'm not new to working out. It's just been a while since I've done it. I used to work out extensively when I played football, and none of these exercises are new to me. This diet stuff is completely new though. Thanks for all your help. If you need to know anything else, just let me know.

Built

Hey - you're moving with resistance, you're reading and applying good info...

Looks like you're covered! Good luck.

Wondering where to start? Confused? This will get you started.

Daredevils are Shredded
Find out why...
(Now you can find out why... in Hebrew!)

UD2.Built - My UD2.0 setup.

ngoldenm

I just figured that I would offer an update.

For one thing, I am gaining in strength much quicker than I anticipated. My resistance tubes are all but useless. I pull them as if they are rubber bands now. My dumbbells are also inadequate. None provide a good challenge without very high reps. I've never gained strength this quickly before. I started by not even being able to do one pullup, and I am now able to do 5-6. Looks like I'm gonna be buying some more equipment sooner then I thought. Mainly a barbell, olympic dumbbells (I think that's what they're called, the ones where you put plates on them), and some plates. I'll probably add a bench in there as well.

Secondly, I am beginning to notice a little bit of difference in the way I look. My arms are gaining a little definition as are my legs. My chest has shown the most difference. I'm not sure how to describe it. 2 weeks ago it looked very soft, but now it has some definition and is getting harder. Granted I haven't lost much fat in this short amount of time, but I am surprised with the results so far none the less.

Thirdly, I have dropped about 1-1.5 inches off my midsection measurement (which is my thickest/softest looking point, around my navel). So I am making progress. I'm taking in on average about 60-90g of fat, 100-130g carbs, 225-280g protein, and 2000 calories daily.

Let me know what you think.

Built

Happy news all around!

Nice work.

Wondering where to start? Confused? This will get you started.

Daredevils are Shredded
Find out why...
(Now you can find out why... in Hebrew!)

UD2.Built - My UD2.0 setup.

ngoldenm

Ok, so here's another update. (Should I just start an online journal on the forums? If this kind of stuff better belongs there, please let me know. If that's the case, if one of the mods could move it there for me I would much appreciate it.)

I went out and bought a 300 lb. plate and barbell set and "confiscated" some more dumbbells from a relative of mine who never uses them. Now all that I need is a bench and I should be set for a while.

I have one question though. I just weighed myself for the first time since I last did so. It registered 233 pounds as my previous weight. It was one of those digital scales that you can program to track 2-3 people's weight. This weight was recorded about 2 weeks before I started my diet and workout program, so I figure that you can consider that to be my starting weight. I registered 214 pounds this time. Both of these were measured first thing in the morning. That's about 6 pounds a week. I've read on here that 1-2 pounds a week is what is recommended. Is this ok?

Once again, I would like to say thank you for all of your help. I wouldn't even know where to start with all of this if it wasn't for this forum.