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Originally posted by gopro You can do what TP said or if you want "name brand" proteins with good casein in it: -PRO PEPTIDE -PRO FUSION -ISOMATRIX -GROW -MICELLEAN All are protein blends with micellar casein |
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Originally posted by kuso Good point...my thinking is though, why pay for a brand name ( particularly as we know they constantly try to rip us off somehow ) and for the distribution costs, advertising etc?? With someone like proteincustomizer.com you cut all those costs and get what you pay for. |
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Originally posted by dg806 Yeah if their label claims are up to par............At one point, protein factory was not. |
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Originally posted by kuso Thats true, though rarely are those of the reputable companies too! So once again, it comes down to price. |
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Originally posted by MeanCuts He didn't say sugar was a problem besides if you go non-fat there isn't that much sugar |
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Originally posted by kuso If its his final shake for the night one would assume he doesn`t want to be taking in sugar. |
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Originally posted by Prince why is that? |
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Originally posted by Prince just keep in mind the high sugar content in milk. |
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Originally posted by Prince you might want to drop some or all of that milk if you're trying to get leaner. |
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Originally posted by kuso As I said, an assumption. If he is worried about the skim milk as it is ( his second post ) then I assume he is worried of cals etc...hense I guess he`s cutting. |
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Originally posted by MeanCuts He's only worried because people are telling to worry and in my opinion if he ain't cutting it won't hurt him a bit and will probably help more than just adding casein powder. |
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Originally posted by kuso And that is an assumption on your part
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Originally posted by MeanCuts Right didn't you get the "in my opinion part"? |
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Originally posted by Twin Peak I have to agree with Kuso 100%. 1) If you are not cutting and don't have problems with storing too much fat, milk is not bad. .... 4) Paul Delia's comments are either completely out of context or assinine, or both. His point about drinking skim versus whole is a prime example of "fat fear" and sugar ignorance. At bedtime, you are far better consuming fat with your protein (to slow nightime absorption) than you are with sugar. |
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Originally posted by dg806 Yeah if their label claims are up to par............At one point, protein factory was not. |
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Originally posted by gopro EXACTLY! |
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Originally posted by Karlito Well, I have about another 10-15 pounds of fat to lose, most of it around the middle, and I'd read that the sugar in milk at night isn't helping... I'm not "cutting" yet per say, but I am trying to lose that fat to expose the abs as I slowly build mass at the same time.... |
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Originally posted by Karlito Well, I have about another 10-15 pounds of fat to lose, most of it around the middle, and I'd read that the sugar in milk at night isn't helping... I'm not "cutting" yet per say, but I am trying to lose that fat to expose the abs as I slowly build mass at the same time.... |
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Originally posted by Twin Peak And some fat, assuming you are not cutting. (please don't ask me why again....)
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Originally posted by kuso So, what caused the turn around?? http://www.ironmagazineforums.com/sh...highlight=milk http://www.ironmagazineforums.com/sh...highlight=milk And of course this entire thread Anyway, even though I believe its totals in vs out that count, I still wouldn`t want 13carbs in my final meal before bed. Here`s a couple of thoughts on it from mercola too. |
kuso
), I really do appreciate the info, but I asked about the best types of Casein protein.
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Originally posted by Prince First of all if I did change my opinion I have every right to do so. I do not need you dredging up all of my past advice. If you were to go searching for all of my past training advice you would also see that I have changed many of my theories there as well. So fucking what! |
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Originally posted by Prince Second I did not change my opinion, if you're CUTTING then limiting or even dropping milk consumption is a good idea, but it still depends on the type of diet you're following. kuso
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Originally posted by kuso You do have the right to change you opinion, which is what I asked you...."what caused the turn around?" I thought you were merely shit stirring
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| AND I happened to remember you made that somewhat anti milk thread quite recently which is all I went "looking" for.....to see whether you were pro, or anti milk at the time, and to confirm to myself if it was shit stiring or not. |
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Originally posted by Twin Peak Before bedtime? That IS what we have been talking about no? |
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Originally posted by MeanCuts While cutting I wouldn't advise eating fat before bed regardless if it slows down the already slow digesting protein.
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Originally posted by MeanCuts Yes before bedtime(while bulking) i'll eat a small meal that's got carbs,fat and high protein.While cutting I wouldn't advise eating fat before bed regardless if it slows down the already slow digesting protein.
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Originally posted by Karlito Not to sound like a cock (too late? ), I really do appreciate the info, but I asked about the best types of Casein protein.
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Originally posted by Prince Eating fat before bedtime is actually ideal, even if cutting (IMO). Remember, after that last meal you will be fasting for 8 hours (give or take a couple), so you want to have protein in your system and you want to slow down the digestion with some fat. |
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Originally posted by Prince Eating fat before bedtime is actually ideal, even if cutting (IMO). Remember, after that last meal you will be fasting for 8 hours (give or take a couple), so you want to have protein in your system and you want to slow down the digestion with some fat. |
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Originally posted by MeanCuts Very true you'll be fasting but your food requirements are not the same when you sleep besides when you fast you use your storage for fuel(fat) and this will lead to fat loss which is good for cutting
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Originally posted by MeanCuts Very true you'll be fasting but your food requirements are not the same when you sleep besides when you fast you use your storage for fuel(fat) and this will lead to fat loss which is good for cutting
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| Originally posted by MeanCuts Hey dude you eat all the fat you want before bed and you can claim this leads to weight loss and that's great if people believe you |
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Originally posted by MeanCuts Prince:Why not use the fat you already have and lose weight? |
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Originally posted by Prince well, said TP. I am still waiting for him to answer my questions.
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Originally posted by Twin Peak And why is it that you expect everyone to have the same opinion? There are more than one ways to skin a cat. Some ways are better than others. If you have the ability to logically reason, and you don't want to be a robot, then you should listen to the advice given, and based on its soundness (in your opinion, derived by the individuals statements, logical reasoning, explanation, and where appropriate, citation to references) then you can evaluate and apply what makes the most sense. If you want a single "best" answer, you won't find it. If you want a "single" answer then these boards are not the place for you. by a book, by a single author, and follow it to the tee. |
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Originally posted by MeanCuts Prince your food requirements while sleeping are very minimal since you are expending far less energy your body perpares for sleep through the day.Why protein before bed?I eat protein at all times of the day |
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Originally posted by Prince Here is Paul Delia's answer to the question of eating before bed: I have not seen and convincing research that shows consuming meals late at night before sleep has any extra effect on increasing fat stores. People think that just because they will be inactive for an eight hour period that whatever they eat prior to this will increase their chances of getting fat. This is just not so. You will not put on body fat by the timing of one meal. And the sleep period is a very important time for recuperation. Recuperation requires adequate nutrition to optimize the process. In fact, this time could be one of the most important times to eat. but I am sure your knowledge exceeds his, right?
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Originally posted by gopro Let me jump in here to say that Paul is 100% correct. During sleep we go into a repair and recuperation process wherein protein is necessary. Without some protein we will enter a catabolic state within a few hours. The protein should be slow acting, like casein, to provide a "trickle feed" effect of the amino acids. Fats will help slow the digestion of protein at this time and will rarely be stored unless you take in too much or the wrong kinds...EFAs are best. We don't generally want carbs at this time b/c we don't want an insulin surge before bed, especially if cutting. |
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Originally posted by Twin Peak GoPro, you are wrong, meancuts said so. (BTW GP, if you haven't read all the posts, as you often maintain is the case, this is not a dig, you in fact restated what Kuso, and Prince, and I have been saying). BTW, I bolded that portion because that is important and something we have yet to elaborate on. |
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Originally posted by MeanCuts First thing I said it's my opinion. You on the other hand act like your opinion is a fact and not just an opinion which it definitly is. |
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Originally posted by MeanCuts Well i could find plenty of different people on and off the net who would argue either way http://www.askmen.com/sports/bodybui...tness_tip.html http://www.ivillage.com/diet/feature...1541-4,00.html I just agree that eating fat before sleep doesn't help with fat loss and the only catabolic state it leads to is fat and carb reduction |
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Originally posted by gopro Let me jump in here to say that Paul is 100% correct. During sleep we go into a repair and recuperation process wherein protein is necessary. Without some protein we will enter a catabolic state within a few hours. The protein should be slow acting, like casein, to provide a "trickle feed" effect of the amino acids. Fats will help slow the digestion of protein at this time and will rarely be stored unless you take in too much or the wrong kinds...EFAs are best. We don't generally want carbs at this time b/c we don't want an insulin surge before bed, especially if cutting. |
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Originally posted by Britney If you are eatting those things it doesnt matter what time of day you eat, you will GAIN fat no matter what. What kind of diet is that?
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Great source of info 
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Originally posted by Britney excerpt from link: Believe it or not, eating late at night can also inhibit your calorie-burning potential the next day. Say, for instance, that you treat yourself to a big bowl of cereal topped with sliced bananas at 10 P.M. one night and are fast asleep by eleven. When your alarm goes off the next morning at seven, the last thing on your mind is going to be breakfast -- you're still full from the cereal and bananas you ate the night before. Chances are, you're going to skip breakfast and lose all the metabolism-boosting benefits you'd get from eating a morning meal. During sleep, digestion all but shuts down so that the food you've consumed has extended contact time with your digestive tract. That may increase your risk of various ailments and disease, including certain cancers. Consider, too, that fat and protein take longer than carbohydrate to digest so if you snack on a bowl of ice cream or a steak sandwich before bed, the contact time may be even longer. Eating late can also just make you feel plain lousy. If you are eatting those things it doesnt matter what time of day you eat, you will GAIN fat no matter what. What kind of diet is that?
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Originally posted by MeanCuts Well i could find plenty of different people on and off the net who would argue either way http://www.askmen.com/sports/bodybui...tness_tip.html http://www.ivillage.com/diet/feature...1541-4,00.html I just agree that eating fat before sleep doesn't help with fat loss and the only catabolic state it leads to is fat and carb reduction |
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Originally posted by Prince I do not know where you got that info, and to be honest I don't think I want to know, but that is such mis-information I feel ashamed for the misguided fool that wrote it. Honestly, I will not even bother replying to each sentence in that "quote" because it's so utterly rediculous. |
beaten to the punchline 
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Originally posted by Britney Prince, I got it from the article in the second link.......and the terrible info/advice was the point I ws trying to make. Which was obviously seen
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My ideas or "opinions" are not new by a long shot.Even if your right that's still crazy advice for a cutting cycle in my OPINION
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Originally posted by MeanCuts No you don't know cause I just grabbed those sites off a quick search and havn't even read them |
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My ideas or "opinions" are not new by a long shot. Even if your right that's still crazy advice for a cutting cycle in my OPINION
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Originally posted by Prince You obviously failed to read anything we said because we have all agreed (me, twin peak, kuso & gopro) that we would cut out the milk if cutting were our goal. |
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Originally posted by Twin Peak And he has NO idea how remarkable that is! Prince, let the poor fool wallow in his ignorance and bask in the glory that "others have said so." I am done here. The point is clear to those who choose to understand. |
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Originally posted by Prince As far as eating protein, fat and even carbs before bedtime, this can be done if you're cutting as well. You want to pay attention to the types of carbs, lactose would not be a good choice for cutting. |
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Originally posted by Twin Peak GoPro, you are wrong, meancuts said so. (BTW GP, if you haven't read all the posts, as you often maintain is the case, this is not a dig, you in fact restated what Kuso, and Prince, and I have been saying). BTW, I bolded that portion because that is important and something we have yet to elaborate on. |
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Originally posted by Karlito Thanks for the Casein suggestions Gopro..... I ordered 2 lb. jugs of both MICELLEAN and ProPeptide... The propeptide made some claims about micro-organisms? WTH is that? Like Acidophilous? Since I eat around 5:30, I plan on taking these at 8:30 or so with water.....(I go to bed around midnight)....too early? Does it really matter? |
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Originally posted by gopro Sorry to rewrite stuff that was said. You are right...I only read a couple of posts and then had to throw my 2 cents in. Either way, it just backed up your positions. |
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Originally posted by Prince Yes, that is what we have all been saying here. Although I do not think a little saturated fat at bedtime will hurt. |
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Originally posted by gopro I agree, it won't hurt. However, EFAs can actually increase the fat loss process by increasing insulin sensitivity. Also, EFAs perform several functions in the body that aid the repair process. So basically, while sat fats are ok, they are not optimal. |
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Originally posted by Karlito GoPro... I generally have dinner at 5:30, a Whey protein shake at 9:00....Should I now tack on this new Casein shake before bed (around 12:00) or should I replace it they Whey shake and just move the Whey shake up a bit (say like 10:00?) |
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Originally posted by Twin Peak Is that true for all EFAs? I know it is for Omega-3s (fish oil). Fish oil has also been show to increase ones sensitivity to leptin. |
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Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy I'm sure he would, but i don't like putting people out their way too much, and if i asked for, say, 10lbs of casein to be shipped to me (to avoid regular shipping, i'd get a bulk amount), then the shipping cost would be near extortionate. Any deal worked out would most likely leave him out of pocket. I'd feel a bit unfair to do that to him. |
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Originally posted by Karlito Ok...the debate over meancuts comments aside,....the bottom line from this thread is: Milk with your protein shakes generally isn't a good idea unless you're uber skinny and trying to pack on pounds no matter what. I should have my dinner at 5:30, drink a Casein protein shake at 8:30, and another at 11:30 before bed, and this won't reduce my chances of eliminating this extra 10-15 pounds of fat I have left around my middle....correct? It will in essence give my body proper protein fuel for rebuilding muscles while I sleep..... Am I following correctly? |
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Originally posted by Karlito Milk with your protein shakes generally isn't a good idea unless you're uber skinny and trying to pack on pounds no matter what. Am I following correctly? |
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Originally posted by IainDaniel Karlito, I would try and get in some good solid food sources, although shakes are convient, they don't provide as much as some solid proteins, slow burning carbs, and quality fats. JMO IDF |
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Originally posted by IainDaniel TP, Not really looking to start a debate, as I know you have quite a bit of knowledge from reading many threads. I am of the opinion that solid foods whether chicken, spinach, sweet potatos have benificial nutrients that are in them. If MRP's were able to provide these, then we would all be on shake diet. JMO please feel free to educate me otherwise, that is why I read many of these threads is to try and learn. IDF |
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Originally posted by IainDaniel Touché, I agree with you 100%, but posting in a forum like this is the opportunity to learn where you lack some knowledge. Hopefully from fellow members that exceed the general understanding but share similar goals and ideas like yourself, DP, w8, and GP and can then educate people like many on this board including myself to present solid examples to help themselves and newer members. I am always looking to learn, if you wouldn't mind, if you could present some links to better understand where my statement may or may not be true IDF |
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Originally posted by Twin Peak Also, I disagree that casien is *best* for your 8:30 shake. I don't think it matters at all. Whey, the fastest absorbed protein, keeps aminos at high levels for 4 hours before it begins to drop off, so, since you are eating in less than that time, any protein is fine. Could even be a few eggs, chicken, etc. |
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