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Stretching


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Posted by: racoon02

Ok, I was shaving erlier and I noticed that I am extremely stiff now than when I used to play football. As my muscles get bigger from BB'ing I get more stiff. Is it good to stretch alot or should I just let my muscles recover naturally. I am noticing this with my legs also.

I guess what im asking, will stretching hinder my bulking? Thats ok if so, I dont mind being non-flexible if my muscles keep getting bigger.


Posted by: gr81

you will build a substantially larger amount of muscle in the long run if you stretch. you definately want to stretch your muscles


Posted by: racoon02

Thanks


Posted by: Prince

yes, stretching is good.


Posted by: ClayEdgin

Yoga. It's not just for leotard-wearing fruitcakes anymore. Take yoga. Seriously.


Posted by: eskimo515

All the hardcore BB's take yoga at my gym. It may have something to do with the fact that all of the cute girls take it.


Posted by: Prince

although I do not believe in "hard" stretching to the point where you get sore, which you often do in Yoga.


Posted by: racoon02

Yea yea, Ive watched SNL.. we all know everyone takes yoga so they can eventually suck their own D*ck


Posted by: gopro

Stretch the muscles you train after the workout is over. Not before or during. Wait until you are done. Stretching at this time can enhance, not hinder, growth!


Posted by: jasonbrunt

GP...curious, I have always heard it is good to stretch before working out. Don't get me wrong, I will probably take your advice, but why not before aswell?


Posted by: Malachor

i'm curious to hear why not before or during. i always do.


Posted by: gr81

There is no way I could train the legs without stretching them prior. I probably have 2 or 3 different 15 min stretching sessions on leg day before I train them, just to get them loose and ready, and so as not to pull anything. GP, your saying you should train them cold? why is that?


Posted by: gopro

To the above 3 posts...

No, I don't think that a muscle should be trained cold. There should be a warmup to get the body temp up...bike, treadmill, etc...plus warmup sets for the muscle being trained and those that surround it. However, stretching the target muscle before training it, and even during the session has been shown to DECREASE its strength/power output!

"Warmup" before, but stretch after.


Posted by: eskimo515

Quote:
Originally posted by Prince
although I do not believe in "hard" stretching to the point where you get sore, which you often do in Yoga.
That sounds like some horrible yoga classes you've been to, Prince. I have not had that experience and I used to take yoga seriously twice a week. If my muscles were already sore (especially my shoulders), taking a yoga class would usually loosen them up.


Posted by: sawheet

Quote:
Originally posted by gopro
To the above 3 posts...

No, I don't think that a muscle should be trained cold. There should be a warmup to get the body temp up...bike, treadmill, etc...plus warmup sets for the muscle being trained and those that surround it. However, stretching the target muscle before training it, and even during the session has been shown to DECREASE its strength/power output!

"Warmup" before, but stretch after.

Yes warm up slightly then stretch Inbetween movements. Never stretch cold, the Golgi tendon needs time to release. I personally never stretch legs until I am well into workout. gopro


Posted by: Prince

Quote:
Originally posted by eskimo515
That sounds like some horrible yoga classes you've been to, Prince. I have not had that experience and I used to take yoga seriously twice a week. If my muscles were already sore (especially my shoulders), taking a yoga class would usually loosen them up.
actually, I have never taken a Yoga class, that is just what I have heard from people.


Posted by: gr81

hey go pro, I am having a hard time believeing what you are saying about not stretching before training. I have read a study stating that stretching actually releases like %10 more GH in your body than would be released without stretching, plus not stretching a muscle increases the likeliness of injury.


Posted by: P-funk

gr81, what gopro says is true. A streched muscle is strongest at a 110% range of flexibility. This means that if the muscle doesn't reach that 110% it is not being streched efficiently enough to cause the muscle spindle to transmit information to the spinal cord to sitmulate the golgi tendon organ and cause autogenic inhibition which will relax the muscle and let it strech a bit more. If the muscle is cold, as it is pre-workout, then it can't be streched to its maximum potential and you are wasting your time. . After your workout the muscle is warmed up and can be taken back to that 110% range that is needed to increase surface area of the muscle which will help to build more muscle size. Pre workout ballistic streching is best becuase you are not holding a strech, you are moving through a range of motion and helping to warm the muscle up and get blood into it. The only time I would say static streching pre workout can be helpful is if you need to strech a really stiff muscle which may inhibit range of motion of a particular exercise. For example, streching out your soleus, if it is really tight, so that you can get a full range of motion during squats.

can you post your study please?


Posted by: gopro

Quote:
Originally posted by gr81
hey go pro, I am having a hard time believeing what you are saying about not stretching before training. I have read a study stating that stretching actually releases like %10 more GH in your body than would be released without stretching, plus not stretching a muscle increases the likeliness of injury.
There are so many studies out there that claim you can release more GH by doing this and more Test by doing that...its almost as if soon there will be study saying that when you sneeze you release more IGF-1.

Anyway, what P-funk says above is true, but also remember that stretching a cold muscle can cause injury on one hand, and on the other it will reduce that muscles strength during a workout. I wouldn't want that, would you?

I believe stretching is very valuable and can cause more muscle growth through various mechanisms. I think that exercises that have a strong stretch component are very important for building mass, and that a hard stretching session AFTER training has tons of benefits as well.


Posted by: firestorm

Quote:
Originally posted by gopro
remember that stretching a cold muscle can cause injury on one hand,

Sorry to disagree with you here GP but having an extensive martial arts background that spands over 32 years (started at age 8) this is incorrect. Stretching a cold muscle will not cause injury IF DONE PROPERLY (just the opposite) The only time an injury would occur is if the the individual is bouncing or over stretching too quickly. Like any excercise, you perform warmup stretches prior to performing full stretches.

***************************

and on the other it will reduce that muscles strength during a workout. I wouldn't want that, would you?

On this matter I AGREE totally!!!! Stretching itself is a workout in itself.

***************************

I believe stretching is very valuable and can cause more muscle growth through various mechanisms. I think that exercises that have a strong stretch component are very important for building mass, and that a hard stretching session AFTER training has tons of benefits as well.
I totally AGREE once again for all the reasons you (GP) and P-FUNK.


Posted by: gopro

Thanks Fire...





(your check is in the mail...shhhh)


Posted by: firestorm

hahahaha GP!!! You are a wealth of knowledge my friend. It's kinda freeky!!! I hope people here appreciate all your input. I sure do!!!!


Posted by: gopro

Quote:
Originally posted by firestorm
hahahaha GP!!! You are a wealth of knowledge my friend. It's kinda freeky!!! I hope people here appreciate all your input. I sure do!!!!
Fire, it is people like you that make me WANT to help.


Posted by: firestorm

Why thank you GP. With that said don't be surprised if I show up at your door with my gym bag one day. hahahahaha


Posted by: gopro

Quote:
Originally posted by firestorm
Why thank you GP. With that said don't be surprised if I show up at your door with my gym bag one day. hahahahaha




Posted by: The Berg Master

Is it also important to stretch for the joints and ligaments etc.?


Posted by: gopro

Quote:
Originally posted by The Berg Master
Is it also important to stretch for the joints and ligaments etc.?
Yes, but do it after training, not before.


Posted by: DIVINITUS

I'm not doubting it, but my only problem with p-Funk's statement above about being more flexible after you lift (because you warm up the muscle) is...well...I (personally) am not at all more flexible. In fact, I am much stiffer and less flexible AFTER lifting do to the "pump" I get. Sometimes, depending on the muscles I've worked that particular day, there are certain places on my body (like right hand over left shoulder trying to touch left shoulder blade) that I simply cannot reach after working out.


Posted by: gopro

Quote:
Originally posted by DIVINITUS
I'm not doubting it, but my only problem with p-Funk's statement above about being more flexible after you lift (because you warm up the muscle) is...well...I (personally) am not at all more flexible. In fact, I am much stiffer and less flexible AFTER lifting do to the "pump" I get. Sometimes, depending on the muscles I've worked that particular day, there are certain places on my body (like right hand over left shoulder trying to touch left shoulder blade) that I simply cannot reach after working out.
I know what you are saying, but that lack of flexibilty is only b/c your muscles are pumped and therefore "getting in the way" of eachother. The joints, tendons, ligaments, and muscles THEMSELVES are more flexible when warm.

Regardless, if we are talking about muscle hypertrophy, which is the specific interest of most on this board, then stretching after a workout is far more productive.


Posted by: DIVINITUS

Thanks, GP. On the other hand, when it comes to joints, tendons, etc. I do feel more limber. I usually shoot hoops for about 15-20 minutes after I lift and after that I feel much looser (sp?).


Posted by: gopro

Quote:
Originally posted by DIVINITUS
Thanks, GP. On the other hand, when it comes to joints, tendons, etc. I do feel more limber. I usually shoot hoops for about 15-20 minutes after I lift and after that I feel much looser (sp?).




Posted by: firestorm

I have no Idea how you can shoot hoops directly after a workout. I've tried it and if I did arms,, I had absolutely no control shooting and couldn't even hit the backboard. After legs, it was almost impossible to run. My legs would give out. I prefer a shower and a gallon of water. hahahaha


Posted by: DIVINITUS

Don't get me wrong here, I couldn't exactly "compete" after lifting, but it does get me loose. I like to use the comparison that after lifting, it feels like I am shooting with someone else's arms!!!!


Posted by: firestorm

Very Good analogy there Divinitus. I feel like one of Jerry's Kids. hahaha


Posted by: Dero

While we are on the topic of stretching,GP,you have any good reads on the burning of "lactic acids" prior to a good work out or for me a good bike ride.The what,why and why not!!!
In the case of Mountain bike riding, Road riding,I know it's recomended to spinn afterward to burn those acids,what happens if you don't...(high cadense/low resistance)
Always good to understand why you're doing something,as oppose to just doing it because somebody told you to do so.


Posted by: firestorm

I can answer that for you Dero,, you spin afterwards cause somebody told you to and that is that. Just do as your told bitch!!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA


Posted by: Dero

Quote:
Originally posted by firestorm
I can answer that for you Dero,, you spin afterwards cause somebody told you to and that is that. Just do as your told bitch!!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
BUTT I wanna understand why I'm doing it...

It's my nature to want to understand!!!



Posted by: firestorm

I know buddy. I totally agree with you. I wish I had the real answer for you but in this case I don not. We'll have to wait for GP for this one buddy. I look forward to the answer myself.
PS GP put your response in laymens terms so I can understand the answer too) hahahaha


Posted by: Dero

Here's one... Lactic acid


Posted by: firestorm

Excellent Dero my man. Thank you!!!!


Posted by: gopro

Quote:
Originally posted by Dero
While we are on the topic of stretching,GP,you have any good reads on the burning of "lactic acids" prior to a good work out or for me a good bike ride.The what,why and why not!!!
In the case of Mountain bike riding, Road riding,I know it's recomended to spinn afterward to burn those acids,what happens if you don't...(high cadense/low resistance)
Always good to understand why you're doing something,as oppose to just doing it because somebody told you to do so.

Not sure what you're asking my friend? Are you asking why its a good idea to do low resistance riding AFTER high resistance riding in terms of flushing out existing lactic acid in the used muscles??


Posted by: Dero

I was trying to understand the whole concept off why the lactic acid,why flush it and what happens if you don't.
But I think it's all explained in the article I found (which I did a link to)If you know of other good article,it would be greatly appreciated!!!
Thanks GP!!


Posted by: firestorm

I did some thinking regarding stretching prior to a workout. I think the best term here for pre workout is "warming up" the muscles. I'm thinking in regards to legs for example. If your not a very flexible person and your planning on performing an excercise such as lunges, I think performing a front split to loosen up the groin area is a good idea before you start your leg workout. This should only take a maximum of 2 minutes not a full stretching regime. Just enough to loosen up that groin area. As for chest for another example, I personally will bring my arms in front of me and flex the chest hard a few times and then bring elbows back behind me a few times just to get the blood flowing. This takes about 30 to 60 seconds. That's it!! Then I'll start with a quick warmup set for 1st excercise and off to the races from there.
One point a little off the subject of pre stretching here: I constantly flex the muscles I'm training between sets and shake them out a little. It seems to keep me loose and muscles working a little bit all the time.


Posted by: Kuzinbo




Quote:
and on the other it will reduce that muscles strength during a workout. I wouldn't want that, would you?
Damn... That explains why I ain't gettin no stronger.... Or maybe it is the pre-beer plan I follow... Have 2 think on dat.



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