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Originally posted by Mudge I still believe there is such a thing as safe use though, so feel free to group me in 
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This past weekend one of the bigger up and coming freaks in the BB world past away this weekend... and alot of us on here can learn a few lessons from this. No names will be named, but this guy was a top amateur, super heavy weight, last competed at 290 I think...was JACKED. Looked like Yates...but bigger. Always ran more crap than anyoen I ever knew...by far...plus in keeping with top-level BB tradition, also was known to partake in copious GHB/E/narcotic abuse... to a staggering degree... Last year, he blew out a kidney...I had heard from mutual friends that his stack at the time was 5 anadrol-50's a day (and I also know for a fact that they are the American ones, forget the name, the ones that are like $10 each but a true 50 mg unlike all the hemos, IP's etc.) 2 grams of sos-250 a week and 150 mg tren a day. Wound up in the hospital. HAd not heard much of him lately, but I did know his picture was routinely showing up on gay escort web sites (i have some gay friends who asked me about him, I looked it up) and he has neevr had a job but kept on using like literally thousands of bucks worth of shit a month, so I suspected the absolute worst... He ened up OD'ing on a speed ball over the weekend. I asked our mutual friend who called me, crying, to tell me what he weighed (just being curious, I thought he was probably all strung out at like 200 lbs.)--but I guess he weighed a hard 345 when he passed. A very sad day indeed, espeically for his family. |
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Originally posted by firestorm You look at a package at GNC and there is a picture of a bodybuilder on the label even................. I can't remember his name but I remember a certain pro bodybuilder who was noted for his freaky shreaded appearance that died on stage due to some form of diuretics. |
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Originally posted by Mudge Momo Benaziza, he was really short so his way to level the field was be the most ripped of that field. Paul Dillet came close doing the same thing, froze up on stage and couldn't move, had to be carried off. I agree on the lies part, that is what I dont like as well somewhat - you have kids trying desperately to gain mass blah blah, no problem give us your money buy this garbage and voila you will be HOOGE. I wanted my first weight set when I was around 7 or so, one of my friend's dads was a competitor, and my barber was a national competitor, so I had early exposure. I didn't end up getting my first weight set till I was 11 but I of course read the magazines. |
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Originally posted by firestorm YES your totally on the ball there Mudge that was the name I couldn't remember, Benaziza. Who was the other one I'm speaking of. he was tall blond, not very good looking and had very thin lips but shreaded beyond belief. |
| This also seems to have been the cause of death for Austrian bodybuilder Heinz Sallmayer, who passed away during the 1 980's, and for Mohammed Benaziza, who died in October 1992. |
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Originally posted by Flex Ya guys, Munzer and Benaziza died from a cocktail of bodybuilding drugs found in their systems. That is also why Flex Wheeler quit, he can't compete with the "big boys" naturally, so he retired. I just read his book "Flexability". The guy almost died at least 5 times. The book describes how he literally would leave the hospital (after being put on IV's and dialysis from the diuretics he was taking), hop on a plane to another show, take MORE diuretics on the plane, and passed out on stage. He's lucky he's still alive. Oh well, that's what these guys "live" for i guess.... |
My opinion is there can be balance in life.
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Originally posted by firestorm Here is what I just don't understand. You look at a bodybuilder or someone in the health and fitness field who looks fantastic and what comes to your mind. Wow that guy or gal is in great shape and excellent physical condition. You hear lots of talk about proper dieting and vitamins and mineral supplimentation. You look at a package at GNC and there is a picture of a bodybuilder on the label even. What we don't know (or actually we insiders of the sport do know) is there is alot of smoked mirrors. These same people injest large amounts of steroids, diuretics and what have you which is totally hypocritical. They walk around with distended stomachs, their internal organs are 3 times their normal size. Their livers probably tattooed with cysts. Half bald and they are only 25. You hear quite too often of these guys dying young. I can't remember his name but I remember a certain pro bodybuilder who was noted for his freaky shreaded appearance that died on stage due to some form of diuretics. He bled to death internally or something like that. Just earlier or a year after another one bit the dust for a similar reason. There were more but I can't remember their names. I won't even get into the mental side effects heavy steroid users suffer from. I'll only use the phrase "roid rage" beating their wives and girlfirends, bar fights, depression when they come off a cycle too quickly. Believe me I know, I've been there and done it. That to me is not what bodybuilding should be. It should be 100% Muscle and Fitness. Just as the title of the magazines portray. Mens Health, Shape. Not Muscle & roids, Iron needle, health in a bottle. give me a break and stop taking the easy way. That's all I have to say about this. |
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Originally posted by firestorm ANYTHING THAT MAKES YOUR BOYS SHRINK IN LESS THEN 30 DAYS TO THE SIZE OF SMALL GRAPES IS NOT A GOOD THING TO BE DOING TO YOUR BODY |
| So tell me Mudge what is the proper balance to steroid use? |
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Originally posted by Prince If you use injectables you're not putting your liver at risk, injectables bypass your digestive system. As far as distended guts, that comes from heavy HGH use, I thought we were talking about steroids? As mudge said there is a big difference between steroid USE, and steroids ABUSE. |
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Originally posted by firestorm oh Prince you didn't just compare a doctor doing a sugery to civilians subscribing themselves medications and administering it themselves too did you??? Does something called being a trained professional come to mind?? |
| Would the amount perscribed by that physcian be the same amount as what your average bodybuilder would and does take??? |
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Originally posted by firestorm Jesus Christ there is actually some shit out there that you make yourself!!! you boil this and smash up this tablet and mix it in a "special solution" filter it with a freeken coffee filter and then inject it into yourself!!!! |
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Originally posted by Mudge Baloons that have caused cancer and killed people versus light useage enhancing your own natural hormones and then some, I see a big difference, and I would argue further that there are alot of doctors that dont know two shits of what they are doing with drugs. I have plenty of mostly female friends that can attest to incorrect dosing causing all kinds of problems, random random random wild guesses. Well to be totally honest with you Mudgster, I have stated in other posts that I'm against implants but this doctor thing was really off the original subject. Believe me I know that if it were even remotely legal doctors would prescribe whatever your requested just to retain your business. They are all about money I know that. But even so,, here you mention over and over how doctors make all these mistakes. And YET... they have years and years of education behind them and they still make mistakes. So knowing you have trained professionals that don't know it all, how can you guys say you know more then them with ZERO medical knowledge???? You seem to talk average being some 300 pound person, I'm tall and I dont plan to hit that. I didnt' mention a weight. The study takes into account players dating back to the 70's I believe. Jack Hamm, Lambert Stalbach era. The average linemans weight back then was WELL below 300. they were in the mid to low 200s. Albert Beckles is still kicking around and he looks fine and dandy to me. |
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Originally posted by Mudge If you can get the powder, or if your talking fina (conversion) anything can be turned into an injectable at home. If people are dropping stuff on the floor who is the stupid one, them, why blame an entire culture for a few idiots? I would also argue that the coffee filter is not sufficient, people trying to save a couple dollars are doing that, not everybody. Well the company that is at the top of IM.com that Prince posted mentions using the supplied coffee filter with their kit. I did not see any alternative option mentioned. If I were to have bought that kit and tried to make my very own drug still, I would have used the filter. (then again I'd never even dream of making my own drugs and injecting them). It's insane. Just insane. Ephedrine kills people, or people kill themselves taking whole bottles of the stuff? Yup,, People abuse it. ( my point). Guns kill people, or people with guns kill people?\ Yes again People. Again my point. Yes people do orals and people drink alcohol too, not sure what the point is. If you have data that says 8 weeks of oral use out of the entire year is worse than being a party boy I'd like to see it. Mudge where did I say a controlled 8 week cycle of orals?? I don't remember saying that! If I were to say anything even remotely to such a thing I would say 8 weeks of orals,stacked on a bunch of other orals and injectable. You know the way most people use steroids??? Stacks of them at a time!!! I give up. You and prince win. Steroids will make you live longer and happier then the natural bodybuilder who lives the life of a true athelete. The one that wins and looses on his "own" abilities. He eats right, doesn't drink alcohol or if so very moderate, He sleeps right and suppliments his diet by natural means. The juice monsters will certainly benifit over this type of person. Ok? that is what you guys want to believe feel free. Live in a dream world |
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Originally posted by firestorm Here is what I just don't understand. You look at a bodybuilder or someone in the health and fitness field who looks fantastic and what comes to your mind. Wow that guy or gal is in great shape and excellent physical condition. You hear lots of talk about proper dieting and vitamins and mineral supplimentation. You look at a package at GNC and there is a picture of a bodybuilder on the label even. What we don't know (or actually we insiders of the sport do know) is there is alot of smoked mirrors. These same people injest large amounts of steroids, diuretics and what have you which is totally hypocritical. They walk around with distended stomachs, their internal organs are 3 times their normal size. Their livers probably tattooed with cysts. Half bald and they are only 25. You hear quite too often of these guys dying young. I can't remember his name but I remember a certain pro bodybuilder who was noted for his freaky shreaded appearance that died on stage due to some form of diuretics. He bled to death internally or something like that. Just earlier or a year after another one bit the dust for a similar reason. There were more but I can't remember their names. I won't even get into the mental side effects heavy steroid users suffer from. I'll only use the phrase "roid rage" beating their wives and girlfirends, bar fights, depression when they come off a cycle too quickly. Believe me I know, I've been there and done it. That to me is not what bodybuilding should be. It should be 100% Muscle and Fitness. Just as the title of the magazines portray. Mens Health, Shape. Not Muscle & roids, Iron needle, health in a bottle. give me a break and stop taking the easy way. That's all I have to say about this. |
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Originally posted by firestorm Speaking of which did you know that people that stay on the stuff for extended periods of time have become sterol? |
| SAY WHAT??? I have absolutely what your talking about. Your over my head now. lol |
| Hold on a sec Mudge. I don't want this personal. Were friends and I'm keeping it that way. I never said "you" so please don't get defensive. In fact I didnt' point out any specific individual. |
that is just how you feel.| Steroids will make you live longer and happier then the natural bodybuilder who lives the life of a true athelete. The one that wins and looses on his "own" abilities. |
I never said that and I dont believe that, same with working out, even if it does NOT extend my life it will improve the quality of it. People like to point and laugh at people who eat clean because they are not living to be 140 years old, thats not what its about IMO and it never was.|
Originally posted by Prince As far as distended guts, that comes from heavy HGH use, I thought we were talking about steroids? No actually Prince read the original post. we were talking about more then just steroids. As mudge said there is a big difference between steroid USE, and steroids ABUSE. |
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Originally posted by Mudge Oh man sorry, that really wasn't directed at you Mudge it was just me on my bandwagon. If I made suggestion to you that was a mental mistake probably because I've been speaking to you. I was a bit directed to Prince who comes across to me that Steroids do no harm. |
I never said that and I dont believe that, same with working out,
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Originally posted by firestorm I was a bit directed to Prince who comes across to me that Steroids do no harm. |
| Ok I'd like to know more about this HRT thing. Is this a legal thing??? I hope so. |
) that these are not casual solutions for bodybuilders at all. People try to buy out of the country if they can, you can see my thread on US drug companies: its not a judgement call or anything just an observation, but one that I think I can understand. You are trying to disuade people from doing this and thats going to happen.|
Originally posted by Mudge I still believe there is such a thing as safe use though, so feel free to group me in
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) that these are not casual solutions for bodybuilders at all. People try to buy out of the country if they can, you can see my thread on US drug companies: its not a judgement call or anything just an observation, but one that I think I can understand. You are trying to disuade people from doing this and thats going to happen.|
Originally posted by Prince I never said that steroids do no harm Mudge, any drug has the potential to do harm. |
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Originally posted by firestorm Yes your correct. I think I'm the only one that speaks the "other" side of the fence. I feel people need to know both sides. Sure you get big from the juice. You read that in ever thread in here. but you need that other voice sometimes to make people think. You know as in anything, there are negatives to every positive. I tell the negatives the other 600 member in this section talk the positive. |
| Believe it or not a few people PMed me asking for more info as to why they shouldn't use the stuff. If I can deter 1 or 2 people then I accomplished something. |
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Originally posted by Prince http://www.t-mag.com/nation_articles/247gear.jsp |
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Originally posted by Prince Just for the record I do not use steroids, the only thing I use is 1-test and 4-ad (legal pro-steroids). Well that is very good to hear. Seriously. IF anabolic steroids were legal, or at least available thru a doctor if someone wanted them (which I think should be the case) then I probably would use them. The main reason that I do not is because I have to much at risk. As we know it's a felony to posess without an Rx, and it's not worth it to me to take the risk of getting busted. Same here, not worth the risk for me either nor the "possible" long term health risks. But, I have no problem with those that choose to use them, and I also realize that their widely used in many sports, and I think that is fine. firestorm obviously has some personal issue with steroids I've said in posts how they effected me. Side effects for me were mainly the uncontrolable roid rages. that was the biggest thing for me and I was in fact an abuser as I've stated many times. I also have a clean bill of health thank God. I never said that using steroids you will get cancer or liver damage. I have said that it does raise the risk level expecially if cancer runs in your family. Prince I also have no problems with anyone that uses them. I've had many friends that continued to use them after I gave them up and I talk to everyone on here even those that use steroids. Sheit, GR8 is one of my main boys on here and he uses. but I think he is really blowing steroid use out of proportion. I have known many bodybuilders that used them and their health is fine. Prince sorry if I came on too strong my man. I only want people to know both sides. thats all. Yes I do get excited, this is true. Personality trait. Obviously there are some that ABUSE them, along with many other drugs and this causes long term health problems, even death. But I do not think that represents the majority of users. Well I can't comment on that because I don't know the majority of users. I only know of a few gyms worth in New Jersey and a few other places. firestorm read this article: http://www.t-mag.com/nation_articles/247gear.jsp |
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Originally posted by Mudge Sounds like heavy use, + recreational drugs, not my way of doing it. |
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Originally Posted by SJ69
I'm a libertarian at heart an believe that people should decide what is best for THEM, not the government.
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Originally Posted by TrojanMan60563
I have friends that drink and smoke(more then cigs) on a regular basis and they think I am stupid for wanting to be a bodybuilder and take steroids. They tell me how I am going to kill myself. The messed up thing is we know that drinking and smoking kills you no questions asked. Smoking causes cancer and kills thousands of people everyday, and drinking kills your liver.
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