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do natural BB's need more protein??

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Posted by: bigbrownbear

I'm natural, i train 3x weights - for 1 hour and do cardio for 30-40 mins at a low intensity on my off days. I'm currently on a clean bulk.
If i eat less than 2g per lb of body weight (im around 178 - 7%) then i aint growing, but if i increase it upto about 2.5g per lb i feel my gains are better. my diet is 50% protien 30% carbs 20%.


I was pondering why would a natural bodybuilder need less protein than someone on AAS. Surely i need more of the best anabolic substance i ve got - PROTEIN - to help with growth. Has anybody ever tried 3 or 4g per lb of bodyweight, whilst still having 40/50% of their diet come from (esssental) fats and carbs.


Posted by: naturalguy

You wouldn't need that much protein if you ate more carbs. Carbs can be "protein sparring". If you don't take in enough carbs your body will convert some of your protein into glucose anyway.

To answer your question...........a bodybuilder that is on drugs can utilize more protein than a natural bodybuilder. I don't think you need any more than 2 grms. per lb. Remember excess protein will get stored as fat, some will get excreeted.


Posted by: calalily1972

1.5-2G of Protein is all you need. Anything more is a waste IMO! Your body will turn excess protein into glucose so its a waste of money and time


Posted by: bigbrownbear

i know everybody says its a waste of protein etc etc, and u only need 1.5 - 2g per lb of body weight - but wheres the evidence, to say above that is bad, have u tried it, i mean if you have an opinion coz u have tried more than 2.5g per lb of bodyweight then fine, lets hear about it, what did you expereince first hand, not what your mate did, or what u read.

Even serrano and poliquin have been quoted as using 2.25g per lb of body weight if cardio activity is involved with their athletes.

Also my carbs are at about 300-400g on training days and 75-100g on non training days.


Posted by: hardasnails1973

Big bear
As long as you are eating intervals of 50 grams every 2-3 hours around the clock you can train your body to utilize that much protein. Now are you talking protein from lean animal sources or combined. I can eat 500 grams of protein and can have up to 100 grams of that come from oats oatbrand,potatoes extra. list your diet and let us analyze to give feed back on your eating pattern. like i stated before most protein should be taken in post workout and at breakfast time with half the carbs , little essential fat, even on your non workout days protein can be dropped becuase you don't need all of it

protein go 2 grams per lbs of body mass training days, then 1.5 times on non training days. From research I have done caloire drop of 10-20% would sufficnet non training if you do cardio drop it more towards lower end no cardio more towards higher end

me training days
3300 caloires protein 430
non 2700 - protein 360-380


Posted by: naturalguy

Quote:
Originally posted by bigbrownbear
i know everybody says its a waste of protein etc etc, and u only need 1.5 - 2g per lb of body weight - but wheres the evidence, to say above that is bad, have u tried it, i mean if you have an opinion coz u have tried more than 2.5g per lb of bodyweight then fine, lets hear about it, what did you expereince first hand, not what your mate did, or what u read.

Even serrano and poliquin have been quoted as using 2.25g per lb of body weight if cardio activity is involved with their athletes.

Also my carbs are at about 300-400g on training days and 75-100g on non training days.

I can only tell you that I have tried it from personal experience and have found that I don't need to take in more than 2 grms. per and when I did I gained fat, now that being said there are many factors that go into gaining fat so it is hard to point to that one thing.


Posted by: Mudge

Quote:
Originally posted by bigbrownbear
I was pondering why would a natural bodybuilder need less protein than someone on AAS.
We could argue both ways.

- You grow faster with steroids than naturally
- You retain nitrogen better with steroids

So do we say you need more since your growing faster or do you not because you are retaining nitrogen better anyhow? Typically though yes you see more, but over 2g is usually going to be a bulker. I seem to be pretty fine with 1.5g but have long since looked back at 1g as worthless to me.


Posted by: bigbrownbear

Thankyou for the great responses

I wont be experimenting with a long period of super high protein intake. Although im sure like carb loading, fat loading, there must be a positive from shocking the body with a protein loading effect for a day or 3. i.e 3-4g per lb of body weight.

Just a thought.


Posted by: plouffe

Hell yes... I've seen people consuming 700 + grams of protein daily, though that's a little excessive.


Posted by: bigbrownbear

Actually ive upped it to around 2.5g 3g per lb of body weight and im actually growing again................never say never hey.


Posted by: P-funk

Quote:
Originally posted by bigbrownbear
Actually ive upped it to around 2.5g 3g per lb of body weight and im actually growing again................never say never hey.
Make sure you are really drinking a lot of water at that amount of protein. Otherwise you are going to wake up one night and find your kidney lying next to you.


Posted by: bigbrownbear

Kidneys are working fine on around 1 gallon of water per day, ive felt real kidney pain from taking PH's - all natural for me for past 3 years. I dont believe all the kidney hype anyhow, as long as water is around a gallon and your healthy ill keep the protein high and then some


Posted by: P-funk

good luck


Posted by: Tha Don

damm what are your meals looking like?

3g of protein per lbs of bodyweight? how much you weigh?

do you use lots of protein supps.?

i've heard 1-1.5g of protein per lbs, anymore i would sturggle to fit in! unless i took whey shakes all day

peace


Posted by: Tha Don

Quote:
Originally posted by hardasnails1973
me training days
3300 caloires protein 430
non 2700 - protein 360-380
why reduce protein on non-training days?

I was told that you need just as much (if not more) protein on non-training days, as this is when your body is growing

i'm assuming the extra protein on your training days just the pre/post WO shakes or something?


Posted by: calalily1972

Quote:
Originally posted by P-funk
Make sure you are really drinking a lot of water at that amount of protein. Otherwise you are going to wake up one night and find your kidney lying next to you.


Just be careful and monitor yourself brownbear. drink plenty of water and watch for excessive fat gain. Remember too much protein can in fact stimulate gluconeogenesis.


Posted by: Twin Peak

Quote:
Originally posted by bigbrownbear
I was pondering why would a natural bodybuilder need less protein than someone on AAS. Surely i need more of the best anabolic substance i ve got - PROTEIN - to help with growth.
Because AAS increases protein synthesis.







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