N E 1 hear of the 15yr old football player dying of a helmet to helmet hit? [Forum Archive]

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N E 1 hear of the 15yr old football player dying of a helmet to helmet hit?

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Posted by: Johnnny

I saw this on tv the other day & then I found it online.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...lldeath08.html

Helmet to helmet hits should be completely banned & result in the player responsible being tossed from the game & have a one or 2 game suspension.

This is a very dangerous thing as it's happened to me a couple of times while playing & other teammates of mine, but thank God no one got seriously hurt.

What do all of you think of helmet to helmet hits?

Posted by: cmason2004

Truly a tragedy. Very sad.

Helmet to Helmet hits definitely need to be banned as you say. I'm not sure how easy a rule like this would be to enforce. Unfortunately I think it's part of the game, but steps need to be taken to minimize it.

Posted by: Johnnny

cmason2004

Quote:

Truly a tragedy. Very sad.

Helmet to Helmet hits definitely need to be banned as you say. I'm not sure how easy a rule like this would be to enforce. Unfortunately I think it's part of the game, but steps need to be taken to minimize it.

Yes H to H hits need to be banned.

In highschool & college games to enforce the rule of H to H hits, I'd suspend the player who intentionally did it for at least 2 games. & 2 games in college especially if you're a star player looking to be drafted, 2 games is a lot to miss with only 10 or 11 games in the entire season.

As for the NFL I'd fine the player who intentionally did it at least $3K if not more as that's quite a bit for a player to lose in one shot & those guys don't like to lose a cent.

This is what I would do.

Posted by: PreMier

Umm, H to H hits are banned. Banned in NFL, NCAA, and in my HS devision it wasnt allowed. Shit happens, its part of life.

Posted by: Johnnny

Premier

Quote:

Umm, H to H hits are banned. Banned in NFL, NCAA, and in my HS devision it wasnt allowed. Shit happens, its part of life.

That's not a good way to look at it.

Sh!t happens? WTF?

You wouldn't be saying that if it happened to your brother, best friend or you.

If it was my brother I'd want revenge on the arrogant jerk who did the H to H hit.

& the sh!t happens attitude IMO is unnacceptable.

If you tackle properly, H to H it's are avoidable completely, this is something our defensive coordinator taught our defense as one of his best friends in college had his career ended (but didn't die) b/c of a H to H hit.

If you tackle properly H to H hits are avoidable.

IMO from what I've seen while playing & in NCAA/NFL games someone who commits doing it on purpose to hurt the guy & that shows great arrogance as out of 5 college or NFL games I don't see many H to H hits & when there is the odd one, it's b/c it was a prick of a player trying to hurt the guy.

That's why it needs to be much more enforced.

Posted by: PreMier

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Premier

That's not a good way to look at it.

Sh!t happens? WTF?

You wouldn't be saying that if it happened to your brother, best friend or you.

If it was my brother I'd want revenge on the arrogant jerk who did the H to H hit.

& the sh!t happens attitude IMO is unnacceptable.

If you tackle properly, H to H it's are avoidable completely, this is something our defensive coordinator taught our defense as one of his best friends in college had his career ended (but didn't die) b/c of a H to H hit.

If you tackle properly H to H hits are avoidable.

IMO from what I've seen while playing & in NCAA/NFL games someone who commits doing it on purpose to hurt the guy & that shows great arrogance as out of 5 college or NFL games I don't see many H to H hits & when there is the odd one, it's b/c it was a prick of a player trying to hurt the guy.

That's why it needs to be much more enforced.

Dont be ignorant, they are 15 year old kids! It was an accident, purely un-avoidable. And do you know what? IT DID happen to my best friend, his neck is now broken. Dont ever assume what I have and havent seen, and like this, his was an accident too. How the fuck do you think that other kid feels? You dont think that knowing he killed someone weighs heavily enough on him? You think he needs to be punished? He is 15 for gods sake.
You said that you have played ball before, tell me... does shit not happen fast? Do accidents occure? You cant say that you have never seen someone injured. This is a risk you take when playing full contact sports.

It is sad, but again these things will happen. My prayers go out to his family. For you to think that this could have been prevented is assanine.

Posted by: soxmuscle

The kid should be punished? give me a fucking break. His life will forever be tarnished because of what happened in this high school football game, isn't that enough?

Posted by: Johnnny

Premier

Quote:

Dont be ignorant, they are 15 year old kids! It was an accident,
purely un-avoidable. And do you know what? IT DID happen to my best
friend, his neck is now broken. Dont ever assume what I have and havent
seen, and like this, his was an accident too. How the fuck do you think
that other kid feels? You dont think that knowing he killed someone
weighs heavily enough on him? You think he needs to be punished? He is 15
for gods sake.
You said that you have played ball before, tell me... does shit not
happen fast? Do accidents occure? You cant say that you have never seen
someone injured. This is a risk you take when playing full contact
sports.

It is sad, but again these things will happen. My prayers go out to
his family. For you to think that this could have been prevented is
assanine.

Yes you're right about me not knowing what you've experienced or seen that's why I put a question mark after each statement.

But sorry to hear that about your friend.

All I can say is yes accidents happen & yes things happen in a split second, but these H to H hits are avoidable.

If the defensive co-ordinator teaches his defensive players to tackle & hit properly this sort of thing won't happen.

The way our defensive/special teams players were taught to tackle & hit out of 5yrs our defensive players NEVER had a H to H hit on a opposing player.

& yes I still think that game suspension should be enforced on H to H hits & financial penalties placed on NFL players.

This way players will learn to be more careful not only for the player they're hitting, but themselves as well so this sort of thing doesn't happen.

Posted by: soxmuscle

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

If the defensive co-ordinator teaches his defensive players to tackle & hit properly this sort of thing won't happen.

...you dont think the defensive coordinator teaches his players how to tackle? man your truly having a bad day today.

Posted by: Johnnny

soxmuscle

Quote:

...you dont think the defensive coordinator teaches his players how to tackle? man your truly having a bad day today.

I'm not having a bad day, but I have seen many careless defensive
co-ordinators teaching his players poor tackling & hitting techniques that could be more prone to H to H hits. As I've visited different teams & seen their practices.

If you tackle & hit properly, H to H hits can successfully be avoided every hit.

Posted by: soxmuscle

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

soxmuscle

I'm not having a bad day, but I have seen many careless defensive
co-ordinators teaching his players poor tackling & hitting techniques that could be more prone to H to H hits. As I've visited different teams & seen their practices.

If you tackle & hit properly, H to H hits can successfully be avoided every hit.

Personally, I don't think all the teaching in the world could take the instict to nail somebody in that split second you have to think about it.

Posted by: Johnnny

Like I said with 7yrs of playing, our defensive players or special team players, not one player ever performed an H to H hit ever, not once.

Posted by: P-funk

Quote:

Originally Posted by soxmuscle

Personally, I don't think all the teaching in the world could take the instict to nail somebody in that split second you have to think about it.

I agree......It was not an intentional thing. As sad as it may be.

Quote:

This is a very dangerous thing as it's happened to me a couple of times while playing

well that explains a lot. All this time I just thought you were dropped on the head.

(j/king)

Posted by: camarosuper6

If if youve ever played football, you know that H to H hits are very often unavoidable. In the heat of the battle, your not focusing on NOT hitting someone else with your helmet, your thinking about getting the job done.

They should be banned, most definitely, and the story is very sad, but such is the risk in playing a rough sport like football.

Posted by: ALBOB

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

That's not a good way to look at it.

Sh!t happens? WTF?

You're going to get rid of helmet to helmet hits when you get rid of football. Let's get real here for a second, it's a FULL CONTACT sport. That means people get hit and they get hit hard. Do they go out there and intentionally try to hit helmet to helmet? Hell no. That's just as dangerous for the hitter as the Hitee. But again, it's a full contact sport and the only way to completely eliminate them is to completely eliminate the sport.

Posted by: Johnnny

All I can say is yes it is a sad thing, but I will say it could've been prevented.

Most of the players that I've seen commit H to H hits are usually arrogant jerks who run their mouths & are just out to hurt someone.

This may not be the case in this incident, but usually that's what happens.

This one guy for an opposing team we used to frequently play as a LB would always commit a H to H hit in many of the games he played in.

He was also known to start fights in the locker room & on the practice field with teammates.

LB Bill Romanowski is a perfect example of this type of defensive player. Especially what he did to that TE on his own team in practice after beating him & putting him out for the season.

Romanowski is an arrogant jerk who is someone who I've seen commit H to H hits more than once, but luckily no one was seriously hurt.

These are the types of players we don't need at any level.

This could've been the case with this incident, he could be that type of player.

As I've already said, out of the 7yrs I played, none of our defensive, or special teams players ever commited an H to H hit.

So they are avoidable, as a defensive player it's your responsibility to pay attention despite what's going on which I understand in the heat of the moment, but it's your responsibility to pay attention.

Posted by: Pepper

Albob is driving the correct motorcyle here.

Posted by: soxmuscle

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pepper

Albob is driving the correct motorcyle here.

I second that..

Posted by: RCfootball87

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

All I can say is yes it is a sad thing, but I will say it could've been prevented.

Most of the players that I've seen commit H to H hits are usually arrogant jerks who run their mouths & are just out to hurt someone.

This may not be the case in this incident, but usually that's what happens.

This one guy for an opposing team we used to frequently play as a LB would always commit a H to H hit in many of the games he played in.

He was also known to start fights in the locker room & on the practice field with teammates.

LB Bill Romanowski is a perfect example of this type of defensive player. Especially what he did to that TE on his own team in practice after beating him & putting him out for the season.

Romanowski is an arrogant jerk who is someone who I've seen commit H to H hits more than once, but luckily no one was seriously hurt.

These are the types of players we don't need at any level.

This could've been the case with this incident, he could be that type of player.

As I've already said, out of the 7yrs I played, none of our defensive, or special teams players ever commited an H to H hit.

So they are avoidable, as a defensive player it's your responsibility to pay attention despite what's going on which I understand in the heat of the moment, but it's your responsibility to pay attention.

Look man people dying from helmet to helmet hits is so rare. It's one thing if you get your mask underneath another guys and drive him up, but you'd almost never get a chance to do that in a game. Trust me I've played every defensive position at one point or another in the last five years, mainly linebacker, and shit does happen. I wear one of those black cowboy collars to protect my neck, and it works like a charm. You don't usually try to helmet to helmet people, but if your already off balance from a lead blocker that hit you, you just kinda dive and try to make it, it's not like you get a chance to set up perfect form most of the time. I had one time I hit a back that was bigger than me h to h in a tackling drill so hard I saw a flash of white when are heads made contact. And besides, most experienceed players and veterans aren't going to change their tackling style because of a d.c. telling thme too. My DC happens to be a skinny dude that was a shutdown cover corner type, he never tackled as much as me so who is he to really teach me that, he just knows the schemes real good. I would definetly support high schools getting contracts with mcdavid and douglas for high quality neck restrictors and cowboy collars, cause those really help the neck a lot. I don't go out there hoping to paralyze someone, but I'd love to give someone something like broken ribs or a finger that takes them out of the game, or makes them think twice before they run at me. Fact is players are rewarded for making big hits, unfortanetly sometimes people get killed. If you can't handle that fact maybe you shouldn't play, it's part of the game.

Posted by: Johnnny

I guess I have to repeat myself, but the way our defensive players were taught to hit & tackle, they never, ever performed a H to H hit.

Being a tail back that I was at 225lbs, I would very often have to run into & over ppl, but I'd lower my shoulders & keep my head down to push my way forward.

I also wore the smaller neck collar not the full size one, b/c at times they'd even put me in as Full Back to block for the smaller & shorter (5ft7-5ft10) speedsters (180-210lbs) with a 4.2-4.4 yard dash for the 40 going outside. B/c I was bigger they usually used the bigger backs to go up the middel for 3-5 yards at a time.

So I know about having to run into ppl & hit ppl & even me, I was never in a position where I was going to do a H to H hit as I would always keep my head down & lower my shoulders.

Posted by: solid10

Damn Johnnny! Do you choreographed your games?
Accidents happen in the spur of the moment, I once busted my nose hitting my best friends shoulder once.Bled like a bitch.

Posted by: Johnnny

Yes accidents happen, but I still believe certain things are avoidable.

Like I said, no one on our team ever performed a H to H hit.

Most of the college games I see on tv, there aren't many if any H to H hits.

Posted by: ccr_bballer33

I'm not sure of your age, and when or how long ago you played, but i can tell you kids are stronger, and jus like many have said when your going in for the tackle you dont have anything on your mine except take his ass down. I know where I play the big hits, are the ones that light up the practice, and also Spearing and putting your head completely down is banned. Where I go (Central Catholic, back-to-back-to-back state champs) the fundmentals are stressed and gameplans, we dont particularly spend alot fo time on head up tackling. More form, and for DB's cut tackling. We lead with our shoulders and rub our ears off on the opponents chest. we pracitce form daily, and it shows..its all about repetition

Posted by: Johnnny

ccr_bballer33

Quote:

I'm not sure of your age, and when or how long ago you played, but i
can tell you kids are stronger, and jus like many have said when your
going in for the tackle you dont have anything on your mine except take
his ass down. I know where I play the big hits, are the ones that light
up the practice, and also Spearing and putting your head completely down
is banned. Where I go (Central Catholic, back-to-back-to-back state
champs) the fundmentals are stressed and gameplans, we dont particularly
spend alot fo time on head up tackling. More form, and for DB's cut
tackling. We lead with our shoulders and rub our ears off on the opponents
chest. we pracitce form daily, and it shows..its all about repetition

I played for about 7yrs starting at 16yrs old & was a bigger TB who was taught how to hit as I was usually sent right up the gut as we were a power team most of the time when it came to running the ball, but we had 2 other smaller guys at around 190-200lbs who would run outside.

But myself & the fullbacks had to go through proper hitting techniques compared to the 2 other backs we had as they didn't do much hitting.

Your techiniques are similar to ours. Our ears were never above the opponents chest no matter what else was going on, & our DB's used the same tackling, the cut tackling you mention.

We had plenty of reps over & over again, & never had problems with H to H hits.

But we were allowed to hit with our heads & shoulders lowered.

Posted by: solid10

Like I said mistakes happen, does anyone remember when Dennis Byrd and Jeff Lageman collided with each other with Byrd being paralyzed for some time?

Posted by: Johnnny

Yes mistakes occur, but I don't see H to H hits very often even in college games let alone NFL or CFL games.

This means that H to H hits are controlable unless you have an arrogant prick like Bill Romanowski the MLB.

Posted by: PreMier

Hey.. I like Romo.

Posted by: solid10

Quote:

Originally Posted by PreMier

Hey.. I like Romo.

Me too, he's a tough SOB.

Posted by: Johnnny

Premier

Quote:

Hey.. I like Romo.

So you support the fact that he almost beat his TE teammate to death & put him out of for the season b/c he started a fight in a practice?

What a fn' jerk.

Nobody needs a person with that attitude on the team, screw Bill Romanowski

Posted by: PreMier

I hope Romo reads this and comes and beats you TO death.

Posted by: gr81

^^ HA HA ah ha

jesus christs, johnnny doesn't ever have to worry about H to H hits, motha fucka is the most hard headed person I have ever seen in my life..lol

Posted by: Sean0621

Quote:

Originally Posted by PreMier

I hope Romo reads this and comes and beats you TO death.

Should makes this into a poll, who hopes Bill Romanowski should beat Johnnny to death.

Posted by: PreMier

Posted by: Johnnny

Sean0621

Quote:

Should makes this into a poll, who hopes Bill Romanowski should beat Johnnny to death.

So you're another one who supports Bill Romanowski & other arrogant pricks like this beating up their teammates half to death putting them out for the rest of the season.

I guess this shows that you & Premier are just like Bill Romanowski.

Posted by: Pepper

Johnnny, your REALLY need to work on getting sense of humor, man.

Posted by: Johnnny

gr81

Quote:

^^ HA HA ah ha

jesus christs, johnnny doesn't ever have to worry about H to H hits, motha fucka is the most hard headed person I have ever seen in my life..lol

Typical gr81 response.

Instead of replying to the thread & the death of this poor 15yr old kid who had his whole life cheated out b/c of some careless arrogant prick like Bill Romanowski

you come on to insult me.

Well they were right about you as this is what you do. You don't add anything intelligent to threads most of the time, but if someone is getting a hard time, for something you're convieniently there to "intervene".

& notice I quote the word intervene meaning your childish insults.

Posted by: Johnnny

Pepper

Quote:

Johnnny, your REALLY need to work on getting sense of humor, man.

Death is never a laughing matter especially when it involves someone so young who missed out on an entire life b/c of carelessness.

Posted by: Sean0621

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Pepper

Death is never a laughing matter especially when it involves someone so young who missed out on an entire life b/c of carelessness.

Of course it would seem that way to someone with no sense of humor, the rest of us like to lighten things up a little bit. What am I supposed to mourn for somebody I never even met for days, I got enough on my plate as it is already buddy, and as far as liking people like Romo, I thought he was a tough sob and made the game more entertaining, and yes I like people like that.

Posted by: Pepper

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Pepper

Death is never a laughing matter especially when it involves someone so young who missed out on an entire life b/c of carelessness.

That is not what I was referring to...they were talking about Romo (who is a prick, by the way.) I think you should shove some coal up your butt, in two weeks you;ll have a diamond.

Posted by: pmech

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

You don't add anything intelligent to threads most of the time,

Coming from the guy that is never wrong or even if he is, met someone, once upon a time, over the rainbow, that is right, and you agree with him.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Yes mistakes occur, but I don't see H to H hits very often even in college games let alone NFL or CFL games.

Pfft, you hold HS kids to the same level of control and abilities as college and NFL players?

http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/09/16/lig....ap/index.html

^^ Lets outlaw lightning because this could have been completely avoidable. In all the years I played football this never happened, our coaches taught us to get in out of the rain, and I have rarely if ever seen it occur in the NFL or College level play.

Posted by: PreMier

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pepper

That is not what I was referring to...they were talking about Romo (who is a prick, by the way.) I think you should shove some coal up your butt, in two weeks you;ll have a diamond.

Posted by: gr81

hey johnny, you stupid fucc, of course its sad and of course Romo is a prick, but can eiher of us prevent either of tose things, NO, so why argue about it? btw I have never contributed to a thread,.. ha, ok man. I will let my record speak for it self.. ya kow, you have a good attitude, but if you weren't so anal people wouldn't jump all over you and respect you more.. it is what it is dude

Posted by: Johnnny

Pepper

Quote:

That is not what I was referring to...they were talking about Romo (who is a prick, by the way.) I think you should shove some coal up your
butt, in two weeks you;ll have a diamond.

Like I said nobody needs dangerous pricks like Bill Romanowski who look to purposely hurt opposing players.

One of my friends is lucky to be still walking, let alone playing football again after some ahole blocked him by rolling on the ground taking his legs out but he did it in a way that had twisted one of his legs around so his foot was facing the other side.

That type of blocking is ilegal in highschool & college levels in Canada and The United States, this guy knew the rules, but he wanted to be a jerk anyways.

None of you would be complaining if it happened to you or your best friend or brother, you'd feel exactly the way I do.

gr81

Quote:

hey johnny, you stupid fucc, of course its sad and of course Romo is a prick, but can eiher of us prevent either of tose things, NO, so why argue about it? btw I have never contributed to a thread,.. ha, ok man. I will let my record speak for it self.. ya kow, you have a good attitude, but if you weren't so anal people wouldn't jump all over you and respect you more.. it is what it is dude

First I think you need to take an english class to help you with your spelling, then maybe I could understand what you're trying to say.

But from what I can see you still think that those types of hits aren't avoidable.

& 2nd I never said that you never contribute to threads. I said that much of the time you come on when there are debates going on & you turn it into a slug fest.

Sean0621

Quote:

Sorry Sean, I have a sense of humor, but you will never see me lauging at death & tragedy.

You wouldn't be lauging if it happened to you or someone close to you so why laugh at this poor kid?

pmech

Quote:

Pfft, you hold HS kids to the same level of control and abilities as college and NFL players?

Damn straight if they're taught properly how to hit & tackle by a defensive co-ordinator who knows what he's doing.

Like I said on our highschool & college/junior teams we never had problems like this b/c our guys never made hits or tackle's like that even being highschool kids.

Quote:

Coming from the guy that is never wrong or even if he is, met someone, once upon a time, over the rainbow, that is right, and you agree with him.

Yes I have met many ppl in many different areas, computers, movies/tv, sciences & medicine, & professional athletes so I've met a lot of different ppl & learned about the businesses & what goes on & the proper way of doing things.

Anyway there's no point arguing b/c you guys want to laugh at this poor kid who's been cheated out of his life & there's no way to avoid these things.

Posted by: Sean0621

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Pepper

Sean0621

Sorry Sean, I have a sense of humor, but you will never see me lauging at death & tragedy.

You wouldn't be lauging if it happened to you or someone close to you so why laugh at this poor kid?

.

For one thing no you actually have no sense of humor, I'm pretty sure that can be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. Second you give the same response for every stupid thing that happens in the world, "You wouldn't be laughing if it happened to someone close to you". Think of something else to say cuz I'm sick of hearing that. When did I say it would be funny to watch someone get hit like that anyways, what I did was made a funny comment about Romo beating your ass. Oh and third I don't believe you've actually ever sat down and talked to any NFL players in your life, nor do I care if you have, you have a tendancy of backing things up that you say, by telling us that you met some famous bodybuilder, or football player. First off you should be able to argue your case on your own like the rest of us second of all, it is a dead give away that you are full of shit. And finally you argue about things that are so obvious it's idiodic and you never have a real point or a real solution, it's just mindless

. For instance, it sucks that troops are dying in iraq, helmet to helmet hits are bad, Wreckless Drivers Suck, and so on... It's tiring

Posted by: Johnnny

Sean0621

Quote:

Sorry dude you don't know me for sh!t nor do I care if you want to know me or not.

But I have a great sense of humor.

I just don't see the humor in this 15yr old's death playing football.

& I don't care if you're sick of hearing "if it happened to you or someone you know, you wouldn't be laughing"

b/c it's damn true you sure as hell wouldn't be laughing if the tables were turned.

& I don't give a sh!t if you believe me or not that I've sat down & talked with the Pro football players I've named that I've met & spoken with b/c it's true.

& it's true that I've met bodybuilders & ppl of other professions with high ranking jobs & I would believe all of these experienced ppl over you.

I know they aren't lying as they've been through it all & have the experience to back it up.

Posted by: Sean0621

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Sean0621

Sorry dude you don't know me for sh!t nor do I care if you want to know me or not.

But I have a great sense of humor.

I just don't see the humor in this 15yr old's death playing football.

& I don't care if you're sick of hearing "if it happened to you or someone you know, you wouldn't be laughing"

b/c it's damn true you sure as hell wouldn't be laughing if the tables were turned.

& I don't give a sh!t if you believe me or not that I've sat down & talked with the Pro football players I've named that I've met & spoken with b/c it's true.

& it's true that I've met bodybuilders & ppl of other professions with high ranking jobs & I would believe all of these experienced ppl over you.

I know they aren't lying as they've been through it all & have the experience to back it up.

No I can pretty much tell when someone does not have a sense of humor and you definatley don't. That is almost proven fact, you don't have one and you don't even know what a sense of humor is, so it's stupid to even debate me on that. And if you talk to enough people like I do in the Marine Corps it's easy to spot a lyer or someone that makes up stories, we have one just like you in my unit, he knows three of the Detroit Lions, he made up shit about slepping with 30 girls last year, and we would have let it go because he's a fuck up, so I his fire team leader have to wake him up and dress this grown man like he's my kid every mornining and tie his boots and walk him out to formation so he's not late, you dude, you remind me of him so much it's uncanny. I love how you have an excuse for everything you do as well, like you can't eat right or work out right because you have a thyroid disorder, sorry but I don't believe one word that comes from your mouth, too many excuses and too much I know a guy that's an expert on this or that so I'm right and you're wrong, dude you have to argue things for yourself, right or wrong stand on your own principles and argue your case, don't tell me what Mercury Hayes thinks cuz honestly I don't care.

Posted by: Johnnny

Sean0621

Like I said you don't know me for sh!t nor do I care if you think you know me.

I don't laugh at death. I don't think it's funny.

Plain & simple, & yes these types of hits are avoidable, they are called mistakes & mistakes are avoidable.

Ppl just have to pay more attention & be sure they get proper instruction & these hits are avoidable.

That's why these helmet to helmet hits don't happen very often in the highschool, college or pro level.

& yes I've met many different types of ppl with different jobs including professional atheltes & had a descent conversation with these ppl.

Posted by: Sean0621

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Sean0621

Like I said you don't know me for sh!t nor do I care if you think you know me.

I don't laugh at death. I don't think it's funny.

Plain & simple, & yes these types of hits are avoidable, they are called mistakes & mistakes are avoidable.

Ppl just have to pay more attention & be sure they get proper instruction & these hits are avoidable.

That's why these helmet to helmet hits don't happen very often in the highschool, college or pro level.

& yes I've met many different types of ppl with different jobs including professional atheltes & had a descent conversation with these ppl.

And who said that they were laughing at somebody elses death, you have accused several people including me of laughing at somebodies death, and nobody said that, not one person in this entire forum, so you made that shit up in your head. And again you state something obvious, mistakes are avoidable, well guess what if we were able to avoid every mistake in the world there would be no such thing as a mistake, sometimes people slip up and sometimes people really pay for the mistakes of others, that's life. And no I still don't believe you've met any NFL players and satdown to talk to them, I don't know if anybody believes you, to me it sounds like obvious BS. If you want me to believe it then you are going to need somekind of proof, otherwise I think you're full of shit.

Posted by: Duncans Donuts

This is dumb. These kind of things aren't allowed. But they can easily occur unintentionally. Playing football itself is a risk; you want to scream and holler at someone who takes part it one? Engaging a helmet to helmet hit is dangerous in itself, and there are better ways to bring someone down without screwing yourself up in the process.

Football is dangerous itself, so let's ban it and play two hand touch. Two completions first down.

Posted by: Johnnny

Sean0621

I've been accused of having no sense of humor regarding this topic.

You say you don't think this is a laughing matter?

You're accusing me of having no sense of humor regarding this thread.

You say you don't think this is funny either?

Than you wouldn't be saying I need to lighten up & laugh about this sort of thing.

Sorry I don't think that death especially in sports at any level is at all funny or deserves a chuckle at all.

This is not funny.

That's how I feel plain & simple regarding this subject.

Posted by: Sean0621

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Sean0621

I've been accused of having no sense of humor regarding this topic.

You say you don't think this is a laughing matter?

You're accusing me of having no sense of humor regarding this thread.

You say you don't think this is funny either?

Than you wouldn't be saying I need to lighten up & laugh about this sort of thing.

Sorry I don't think that death especially in sports at any level is at all funny or deserves a chuckle at all.

This is not funny.

That's how I feel plain & simple regarding this subject.

Nobody made fun of the kid getting hit in the head, I made fun of your reaction to this and what other people said about you, the H to H hits are not the joke here, you are the joke. And I didn't accuse you of having no sense of humor for this subject, I accused you of not having any sense of humor at all, and that's just a fact so deal with it.

Posted by: Johnnny

Sean0621

Again my reaction is based on my experience that H to H hits are avoidable mistakes. Like I've said already none of our defensive or special teams players in the 7yrs I played, did any of our players ever perform these types of hits which means they all learned well & were very careful & payed close attention in what they were doing on every play to prevent those hits as that's what was taught.

& you don't see them happen all the time either & when they do happen, it's b/c of a prick trying to put someone else out of the game.

That's why they are called mistakes b/c they don't normally happen nor should they happen.

That's my reaction.

I don't see what's funny about the truth.

There's nothing funny about his thread at all except for your comments.

Posted by: Sean0621

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Sean0621

Again my reaction is based on my experience that H to H hits are avoidable mistakes. Like I've said already none of our defensive or special teams players in the 7yrs I played, did any of our players ever perform these types of hits which means they all learned well & were very careful & payed close attention in what they were doing on every play to prevent those hits as that's what was taught.

& you don't see them happen all the time either & when they do happen, it's b/c of a prick trying to put someone else out of the game.

That's why they are called mistakes b/c they don't normally happen nor should they happen.

That's my reaction.

I don't see what's funny about the truth.

There's nothing funny about his thread at all except for your comments.

What is funny is that you are an idiot, you have been arguing with me and several others over something that we agreed with you on in the first place, then we started making fun of you because you say the same shit over and over again, about everything. And yes my football coaches in HS taught us proper tackiling technique too, most coaches do, but what we are telling you is that sometimes accidents happen. Have you ever been in a car accident, those happen too, are you gonna bitch to the world about how all car accidents are avoidable as well, and quit telling me what is funny and what is not, it's like a tiger trying to show a deer how to hunt. I told you that you have no sense of humor, I don't expect you to know what is funny or what is not, you don't have to tell me you don't find something funny, I already know.

Posted by: Duncans Donuts

Yes, Johnny, you do repeat everything ad nauseaum. No, accidents are not completely unavoidable.

Helmet to helmet collisions happen because of the speed of the game, not typically because of the intent to do so. Believing otherwise is naive.

Posted by: aztecwolf

One of my buddies on the football team died in high school from a collision on the field, very somber and sad time. Guy had a cannon for an arm and was the ultimate good guy. RIP Adrian.

Posted by: Johnnny

aztecwolf

Quote:

One of my buddies on the football team died in high school from a collision on the field, very somber and sad time. Guy had a cannon for an arm and was the ultimate good guy. RIP Adrian.

Sorry to hear that. God Bless him.

This is why these incidences need to be avoided & proper defensive skills other than just basic tackling & hitting.

What needs to be taught are techniques that help players avoid helmet to helmet hits such as these in particular.

Like I've already said, our defensive/special team players never had problems the way they were taught out of 7yrs.

7yrs & not one helmet to helmet hit by our players b/c we were taught how to avoid helmet to helmet hits properly & how to pay attention in the heat of battle.

So again I see nothing funny regarding this topic at all.

Posted by: pmech

I truly believe he is Rainman... What time is Wapner on?

Posted by: Johnnny

What I will also say is this;

with all the local American, & Canadian highschool games, college games & pro games I've seen over the past couple of weeks, I have not seen one helmet to helmet hit, not one even with rough & aggressive defenses.

After watching the past 2 Notre Dame games, their defense was on fire & hitting hard & they had no helmet to helmet hits.

Here in Montreal we also pick up the local New York & Vermont Friday night highschool games as well as Montreal highschool games, & I've not seen one helmet to helmet with these highschool kids so obviously they were taught well & properly.

With the Sunday Night football game with Miami Vs. Cincinnati Bengals.
It was all defense with not much offensive plays, hard hitting defenses on both sides of the ball.

The Bengals would bring 3-6 defensive players at a time on every snap AJ Feeley took they were in his face the whole night & they were all over the RB's. Yes there were roughing the passer calls, but never a helmet to helmet hit.

I also saw Zack Thomas make a huge hit right down the middle on QB Carson Palmer & guess what? No helmet to helmet hit.

So the level of players & the league has nothing to do with it. It's a matter of teaching your players to pay attention to what they're doing at all times to avoid these things.

& if you happen to have a prick like Bill Romanowski on your team, you cut his ass as nobody needs jerks like that around.

Posted by: Johnnny

Pmech

Quote:

I truly believe he is Rainman... What time is Wapner on?

If you're referring to me, maybe you should go out & get a helmet to helmet hit & then complain.

Posted by: Sean0621

God you are dumb, you really think that only people like Bill Romanowski are the ones who are involved in helmet to helmet hits. What about Chris Speilman, he broke his neck in a H to H hit, and he was probably one of the more stand up guys in the NFL, and as far as tecnique goes, you could not find me a person with better hitting technique than Speilman, but yet he slipped up and made a mistake and now he's in broadcasting instead of still playing football. Everybody is capable of making mistakes, and sometimes people make bad mistakes, that's just life, deal with it.

Posted by: jack52

Man you must be a referee! There are H to H hits on nearly every play in nearly every game played. Maybe not on the tackle but watch the line play. Coaches have been teaching burying your shoulder in your opponents chest since forever and your helmet is coming along for the ride. So is the other guys! If they didn't hit there wouldn't be cages. They don't spear as much anymore but that's because they miss more often when they take their eyes off their target.

Posted by: Johnnny

Sean0621

Have you played football? Let me guess you are a 6ft3 280lb Defensive tackle who knows everything about hitting & tackling & that these things happen.

But don't put words in my mouth, I never said that I think everyone is a prick like Bill Romanowski. There are different degree's of pricks out there.

Bill is on the extreme prick side while Warren Sapp is more in the middle of the prick rating between extreme prick & just a regular arrogant prick.

As I've said that most of the few helmet to helmet hits are done by a regular prick or extreme prick or somewhere in the middle who's trying to purposely hurt the other teams star player to give their team the advantage.

But yes mistakes happen, but that's why they're called mistakes b/c they are avoidable if you pay proper attention at all times. Yes Spielman might've slipped up probably b/c he wasn't paying full attention on that particular play.

The way our players were taught was if you pay attention those helmet to helmet hits are avoidable.

jack52

Quote:

Man you must be a referee! There are H to H hits on nearly every play in nearly every game played. Maybe not on the tackle but watch the line play. Coaches have been teaching burying your shoulder in your opponents chest since forever and your helmet is coming along for the ride. So is the other guys! If they didn't hit there wouldn't be cages. They don't spear as much anymore but that's because they miss more often when they take their eyes off their target.

Sorry, I was no referee, I played tailback at 5ft10 225lbs & ran between a 4.5-4.6 for the 40 yard dash. I was an up the middle power runner who ran between the center & guards & the guards & tackles most of the time.

First our linemen never did helmet to helmet hits with the way they were taught. As for myself I'd run into & over & through defenders & I never did a helmet to helmet hit ever & I would hit ppl especially on short yardage rushing plays like 3 & 1 or 2 & 2 or whatever.

So I saw everything that went on & our offensive players or linemen never did helmet to helmet hits.

Posted by: Sean0621

Maybe you should draw an illustration of your prick meter cuz you've completely lost me, how does one qualify for this prick meter you speak of, and what is the difference between a middle prick and a low prick. Explain it to me Johnnny cuz you've lost me. And by the way I don't care that you were a tailback that ran a 4.5-4.6 in HS and College, what are you Al Bundy. Every kid on my block played football from 6th grade all through HS, I played Quick Guard and Defensive End in HS if you really want to know. Plus I have 22 years experience of watching football like most red blooded americans, you tell me you were a 4.5-4.6 40 tailback, that's great, but that doesn't mean you know the game any better than I do, so stop telling me that like it's supposed to mean something.

Posted by: Sean0621

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Sean0621
But yes mistakes happen, but that's why they're called mistakes b/c they are avoidable if you pay proper attention at all times. Yes Spielman might've slipped up probably b/c he wasn't paying full attention on that particular play.

The way our players were taught was if you pay attention those helmet to helmet hits are avoidable.

You still don't get it, if people avoided 100% of the mistakes all the time there'd be no such word as a mistake, there'd be no need for it since in a perfect world nobody would make any. You really do live in a strange world in that thick ass head of yours. There's reason a Helmet to Helmet hit should ever take place, People shouldn't be dying in war, I don't know what they should be doing but they shouldn't be dying, Nobody should ever drive over the speed limit because that would be wreckless. There's no room for anybody elses opinion but your own, unless of course you're a former NFL player named Mercury Hayes, or some famous Bodybuilder. Remind me never to fight you, hitting your head must be like punching lead, or maybe I'd just get a really hollow knock, one or the other, i just don't believe I'd find any brains in there.

Posted by: Johnnny

Sean0621

Okay let me try & illustrate the prick meter.

let's start with a 1-10 ratio, 1 being barely a prick maybe with just a bit of an attitude & attitude/showboat. Someone such as Larry Fitzgerald the rookie WR who asks for a $50million dollar contract or whatever he asked for b/c he thinks he's so good when he's never taken an NFL snap up until 2 weeks ago.

Let 5 be the midway point between someone with somewhat of an arrogant attitude but not overly dangerous or out to get other players. Such as Keyshawn Johnson WR of Dallas. Yes he complains about not getting the ball, but nothing even close to the degree of Terrell Owens. But Keyshawn had every right to complain as they stopped using him in critical situations which cost the Buc's many close games they should've won. He is a clutch player & many times came up with the big 1st down catch or TD when they needed it & they didn't use him last year the way he should be used.

Let 10 be a dangerous & arrogant jerk like Bill Romanowski or WR Terrell Owens who yelled at his QB, coach & offensive co-ordinator & made off the field on the record insulting comments towards his own QB Jeff Garcia.

As for your insulting comments about my intelligence, I just don't think that you can accept the fact that helmet to helmet hits are avoidable provided they are taught properly.

Like I said I haven't seen any so far this season in highschool (except for the one in Seattle where he died), none in College & none at the Pro level.

As for the opinions of professionals, yes I trust those opinions much more than anyone else's b/c whatever their profession, they've been through it all & experienced it all.

Posted by: Sean0621

It amazes me that you have created such a prick meter and have assigned people prick rankings. As for insults about your intelligence, I feel that they are warranted since in fact you are quite stupid, it only makes sense to call a rock a rock. And I was being sarcastic about saying you only listen to the opinions of NFL players, I already know you're making that shit up, so there's no need to discuss anything about choosing your own opinions, when you obviously are making up people and conversations in an attempt to validate your own arguments. Or maybe you are hearing voices in that vacant lot you call a head, anythings possible.

Posted by: Johnnny

Sean0621

Quote:

It amazes me that you have created such a prick meter and have assigned people prick rankings. As for insults about your intelligence, I feel that they are warranted since in fact you are quite stupid, it only makes sense to call a rock a rock. And I was being sarcastic about saying you only listen to the opinions of NFL players, I already know you're making that shit up, so there's no need to discuss anything about choosing your own opinions, when you obviously are making up people and conversations in an attempt to validate your own arguments. Or maybe you are hearing voices in that vacant lot you call a head, anythings possible

Sorry, but I do know those NFL players I named.

Not too hard to believe, Mercury Hayes played in Montreal after years in the NFL so I met him through a friend who works in a club he frequented, RB Troy Davis after years in the NFL plays for Hamilton, RB John Avery who was in the NFL with Miami, Dallas & other teams plays for Toronto & I've been to these games & got to meet them, then I had went on a few different NFL trips to see games & was able to meet WR Ricky Proehl, QB Doug Flutie & Steve Chrisite K both played for Toronto, & the others I mentioned.

So sorry that you've never had the pleasure of meeting any professional atheletes, but that doesn't mean no one else has.

Back to the point if you're careful when hitting & tackling, you can avoid helmet to helmet hits plain & simple.

Posted by: Sean0621

Ok Johnnny I have to admit I have just been messing with you, the only reason I posted my last ten or so posts was to just see what you'd say next, you are persistent and stick to your guns, as far as your point goes, it has been made, actually it was made in your first post and I think it was unanimous that almost everyone agreed that they H to H hits are a shame. Well if I was to say one thing about your posts Johnnny they are entertaining if anything. Take care man.

Posted by: PreMier

No.. dont give up sean!

Johnnny I wish Romo would H to H your mother.

Posted by: Johnnny

Sean0621

Quote:

Ok Johnnny I have to admit I have just been messing with you, the only
reason I posted my last ten or so posts was to just see what you'd say
next, you are persistent and stick to your guns, as far as your point
goes, it has been made, actually it was made in your first post and I
think it was unanimous that almost everyone agreed that they H to H hits
are a shame. Well if I was to say one thing about your posts Johnnny
they are entertaining if anything. Take care man.

Well my only point has been that helmet to helmet hits don't happen much which means that they are avoidable.

They occur when mistakes happen. Mistakes are avoidable as long as you pay attention to what you're doing.

Why do you have to pay attention?

B/c you could kill yourself or your opponent or seriously injure eachother for no reason.

Posted by: Johnnny

Premier

Quote:

No.. dont give up sean!

Johnnny I wish Romo would H to H your mother.

Typical Premier that ppl warned me about.

You always come around looking for a chance to insult ppl.

I'm not the only person on this forum who feels that.

Personally I think you're wasting your time with your immaturity.

Let's see you complain after going through a helmet to helmet hit.

Who knows, it might knock some sense & maturity into you but probably not.

Posted by: PreMier

I dont play, so I wont get one. I think that you have had too many H to H hits.. thats why your so weird..

Posted by: Sean0621

Quote:

Originally Posted by PreMier

No.. dont give up sean!

Johnnny I wish Romo would H to H your mother.

It's no use dude, he doesn't have emotions, it's like talking to a computer that is programmed to give a certain response, though I will say you seem to have the magic ability to get to him, so go for it man.

Posted by: Duncans Donuts

Johnny, you are the most repetitive fucking poster I've ever met. I try and read through this thread and I keep thinking I'm going back reading the same shit you posted the first time.

HELMET TO HELMETS DON'T JUST OCCUR ON TACKLES. This is a good point. Helmet to helmets are dangerous for both people involved, but mistakes happen. People have been injured on REGULAR collisions, should we ban football because of that? It is a risk to play period.

And this "I played and ran a 4.5 40 at 225" carries no weight at all. Just because you played (or claim you did) does not reflect that you know what you are talking about. God.

One more thread where everyone disagrees with Johnny, and he responds by repeating the exact same thing OVER AND OVER.

Posted by: Johnnny

Premier

Quote:

I dont play, so I wont get one. I think that you have had too many H to H hits.. thats why your so weird..

I guess you're affraid.

But maybe Bill Romanowski will still do you a favor & give you a helmet to helmet to knock some sense & maturity into you or it will probably make it worse.

Sean0621

Quote:

Actually I do have emotions, my emotions concerning this topic are very strong. My emotions have been clear this whole thread that helmet to helmet hits are avoidable if you pay attention to what you're doing on every snap.

Duncans Donuts

Quote:

Johnny, you are the most repetitive fucking poster I've ever met. I try and read through this thread and I keep thinking I'm going back reading the same shit you posted the first time.

You guys are being just as repetitive as myself. I'm repetitive b/c I stick to my point & opinions.

Quote:

And this "I played and ran a 4.5 40 at 225" carries no weight at all. Just because you played (or claim you did) does not reflect that you know what you are talking about. God.

You got your measurements wrong, that was 225lbs not inches & I was more like 227lbs close to 230lbs most of the time & yes I did play TB for 7yrs so I have hands on experience so I know what I'm talking about. Did you ever play football?

& you say 225-230lbs at 5ft10 is carrying no weight at all?

That's easy for you to say with your "extra help".

If you've never played football, than you shouldn't even be talking on this thread, watching it isn't the same as playing it.

Posted by: madden player

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

...you say 225-230lbs at 5ft10 is carrying no weight at all?

That's easy for you to say with your "extra help"...

I can't speak for Duncan but I think his point was not about pounds and inches...As far as I know Duncan in all natural..all natural and extremely strong (awesome Heavy Duty Journal

)...

This whole thread was VERY interesting, you all made valid points, the kids death was a tragedy but It was an accident. Like you have been saying all along, players that intentional H to H hit should be punished (no one in this thread argued against that)..kids should be taught respect for their opponent at a young age just like you said..but accidents are going to happen in all sports, accidents just happen sometimes and all the precautions and training in the world can't prevent them from happening.

Posted by: Johnnny

madden player

Quote:

This whole thread was VERY interesting, you all made valid points, the kids death was a tragedy but It was an accident. Like you have been
saying all along, players that intentional H to H hit should be punished

You said it, accidents happen, & you know what's funny about accidents?

They are avoidable if you pay attention.

Quote:

I can't speak for Duncan but I think his point was not about pounds and inches...As far as I know Duncan in all natural..all natural and extremely strong (awesome Heavy Duty Journal )...

So what does inches have to do with anything? I wasn't 227 inches. I was 227lbs. I was never able to get any heavier than this w/o getting fat & not muscle.

But IMO there's only a point that you can improve naturally b4 you need "help"

& a physique eventually begins looking a certain obvious way that the individual has had a lot of "help".

Posted by: Duncans Donuts

JESUS CHRIST, I DIDN'T USE THE TERM "CARRIES NO WEIGHT" LITERALLY. I MEANT THE ARGUMENT CARRIED NO WEIGHT FIGURATIVELY.

The " was what I hit instead of the enter key, or something. It was a mistake. Nobody is 225 inches, and clearly that was a mistake. How someone could overlook that is completely beyond me. As far as you questioning whether I played or didn't play, uh, if it weren't for a torn ligament in my ankle I would be playing now. Don't challenge people because you like to tout a 40 yard dash time and a playing weight that you feel validates your repetition. The fact that you claim to have played for 7 years doesn't make you some kind of champion of football ethics and protocol.

Thanks for the compliment, Madden, I appreciate it.

Posted by: camarosuper6

Johnny your a nice guy, but for crying out loud, these posts have got to stop. This is GETTING OLD!

Posted by: gr81

Quote:

You said it, accidents happen, & you know what's funny about accidents?

They are avoidable if you pay attention.

jesus this is still goin on.. there is a reason they call them accidents ya know. if they weren't accidental then they wouldn't be accidents and what your inplying is that kids are purtposely trying to kill others, which is nonsense. but since Johnny doesn't seem to understand what the fucc an accident is, I shall define it for him:

ac·ci·dent ( P )
n.

1. a. An unexpected and undesirable event, especially one resulting in damage or harm: car accidents on icy roads.
b. An unforeseen incident: A series of happy accidents led to his promotion.
c. An instance of involuntary urination or defecation in one's clothing.
2. Lack of intention; chance: ran into an old friend by accident.
3. Logic. A circumstance or attribute that is not essential to the nature of something.

there you stupid fucc, can you understand that. Car accidents are avoidable too in theory, but we still have accidents b/c thats life. btw they are much more fatal that football games, why not complain about these accidents too johnnny? why aren't you up in arms about all the accidents people have when they are bungy jumping as well huh, those are avoidable to, why do they happen? get a fuccin clue you god damm moron. no one can stand to listen to your bullshit anymore. you are teh most hardheaded dimwit I have ever come across. there can be 20 people telling you something and yet somehow in your mind they are ALL wrong and you are still right! get some therapy and shut the fucc up about it. have a nice day

Posted by: PreMier

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Premier

I guess you're affraid.

But maybe Bill Romanowski will still do you a favor & give you a helmet to helmet to knock some sense & maturity into you or it will probably make it worse.

Afraid? Afraid of what? Only thing I fear is going to jail after I run you over with my big suv bitch.

And you forget, im cool with Romo. Your the one who has to lookout, because you insulted him.

Posted by: Sean0621

You guys are still trying to argue with it, i already wrote a letter to the programmers that created Johnnny, I'm suing them for 3.5 million dollars for pain and suffering of having argued with it for an hour last night. If you want to get in on the class action I suggest you all email me immediatley.

Posted by: gr81

^^

Posted by: Johnnny

Duncans Donuts

Quote:

JESUS CHRIST, I DIDN'T USE THE TERM "CARRIES NO WEIGHT" LITERALLY. I
MEANT THE ARGUMENT CARRIED NO WEIGHT FIGURATIVELY.

The " was what I hit instead of the enter key, or something. It was a
mistake. Nobody is 225 inches, and clearly that was a mistake. How
someone could overlook that is completely beyond me. As far as you
questioning whether I played or didn't play, uh, if it weren't for a torn
ligament in my ankle I would be playing now. Don't challenge people
because you like to tout a 40 yard dash time and a playing weight that you
feel validates your repetition. The fact that you claim to have played
for 7 years doesn't make you some kind of champion of football ethics
and protocol.

My bad if it was a typo.

& I was only questioning you about playing football b/c some guys talk sh!t about football like they know everything & they never played.

Sorry to hear about your ankle, for real.

But I don't claim to have played RB for 7yrs, b/c I actually did. & I never said I was a champion or an NFL player, but I do have 7yrs hands on experience with the game & I was able to see what really happens deep within the trenches on the battlefield.

& you guys say they are accidents.

Well, what is an accident? It's an event that occurs when an individual is not paying full attention to what he/she is doing therefore causing unexpected errors which include injuries & in this case helmet to helmet hits.

If you pay proper attention to what you're doing despite of what's happening around you at all times these incidences can be avoided.

Posted by: PreMier

Not once have you ever admitted to being wrong. And here you are just that. Accidents cant always be avoided, no matter what the fuck you say.

So when you have a child.. and they piss their bed, will you yell at them and say "With you paying better attention, this could have been avoided"? I mean seriously you need to get a fucking grip!

Posted by: Sean0621

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

& I was only questioning you about playing football b/c some guys talk sh!t about football like they know everything & they never played.

Hmmm now that you said I think you may have opened pandora's box. Because I really wanted to say this to you in every football thread I've seen you post in. If you want to know the truth Johnnny, I don't believe you ever played football, lifted weights, or left home. I believe you are a computer geek sitting at home at his computer with nothing but all the time in the world to look up evry article in the news and post on it like you know something about it. You sound like someone reading directly out of a textbook, and nothing you tell me actually sounds like a real experience you've had, it sounds like something you concocted out of reading endless articles and statistics on the internet. Come on Johnnny you can tell us, this can be your intervention, we can help you, but you have to admit you have a problem first.

Posted by: madden player

I happen to think he is just a little too passionate about football and too stubborn...I have never suited up and played football so maybe my opinion doesn't count, but I am a football fan as you can see from my screen name and it is a contact sport and shit fucking happens you know..fuck as the athletes get bigger and faster it is going to happen more often IMO.

The only other sport I ever took part in besides bodybuilding was Judo and once a much older kid with more experience throw me and I landed on my head and I was knocked out in front of my mother and it was not intentional...it was an accident...stubbed my toe the other day and it was an accident too..IMO the only way accidents in life can be avoided TOTALLY would be to live in a bubble and never leave your house..this would definately mean no playing football.

Posted by: Sean0621

Quote:

Originally Posted by madden player

I happen to think he is just a little too passionate about football and too stubborn...I have never suited up and played football so maybe my opinion doesn't count, but I am a football fan as you can see from my screen name and it is a contact sport and shit fucking happens you know..fuck as the athletes get bigger and faster it is going to happen more often IMO.

The only other sport I ever took part in besides bodybuilding was Judo and once a much older kid with more experience throw me and I landed on my head and I was knocked out in front of my mother and it was not intentional...it was an accident...stubbed my toe the other day and it was an accident too..IMO the only way accidents in life can be avoided TOTALLY would be to live in a bubble and never leave your house..this would definately mean no playing football.

Johnnny5 "Accidents are Avoidable....Pay better Attention..error...proper...form...teach error...no humor... wouldn't laugh if accident happened to...syntax error...someone close....error to you....End Program...

Posted by: PreMier

Posted by: gr81

exactly, that risk is the price you pay for choosing to play dude, and if you think that you can stop accidents then you are niave. why do tailbacks fumble, its an accident of course, but if everything on the football field can be planned out rationally and executed to perfection with no line of error, then why do people fumble the ball, or throw interceptions for that matter. Johnnny, you say you played football for so long, well then you of all people should understand that most of the game is based on split second reactions to various scenarios. Unless you can slow time matrix style its impossible to avoid certain things. what about other injuries for that matter. I saw Steve Smith break his ankle in half teh other week for the Panthers when his tackler grabed his feet to take him down. Wasn't that an accident? the shit happens, its the way of the game man. How could you possibly see it differently??

Posted by: Johnnny

All I'm going to say is that accidents are avoidable that's why they are called accidents b/c the individual wasn't paying proper attention.

Sure I fumbled & had the other team recover it & score a TD or worse the defense takes it in for a TD.

But over time through all the drills & instruction, my fumbles almost never occured as I became more mature, gained experience & more "aware" of what was going on around me.

Same goes for defensive & other hitting/tackling players.

I don't see what the big deal is, players need to be more careful so this sort of incident doesn't happen.

Like I said it never happened with any of our defensive players for years.

Posted by: madden player

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean0621

LMFAO!!

Posted by: Sean0621

[QUOTE=Johnnny]All I'm going to say is that accidents are avoidable that's why they are called accidents b/c the individual wasn't paying proper attention.

QUOTE]
See what we need to do is shut off his endless loop function and we should have this probelem fixed boys.

Posted by: PreMier

Quote:

Originally Posted by PreMier

So when you have a child.. and they piss their bed, will you yell at them and say "With you paying better attention, this could have been avoided"? I mean seriously you need to get a fucking grip!

Answer this.

Posted by: Sean0621

What haven't you heard Premiere, all accidents are avoidable, that kid needs to be punished for making a mistake, give him a helmet to helmet hit, they gotta grow up sometime.

Posted by: Duncans Donuts

Johnny, to believe your argument, we would presume that everyone whos disagrees in this forum with you (and everyone else in this world besides Hippies probably disagrees with you) is wrong and you are right. Notice how not one person has rallied to your repetition?

This is not a good way to proove an argument, but unfortunately, helmet to helmet collisions happen. If you didn't see it once in 7 years, I can promise you it happened away from the ball and you missed it. If you don't want to believe that, what can I say? Maybe you were so busy running past everyone for touchdowns that one slipped by.

Posted by: Sean0621

Hey I'm pretty sure we're all wrong, and he's right. I mean it makes sense to me, how it can't to you is beyond me.

Posted by: Johnnny

Duncans Donuts

Quote:

This is not a good way to proove an argument, but unfortunately, helmet to helmet collisions happen. If you didn't see it once in 7 years, I can promise you it happened away from the ball and you missed it. If you don't want to believe that, what can I say? Maybe you were so busy running past everyone for touchdowns that one slipped by.

No sorry never missed them. Besides all our guys were buddies & if something like that ever happened, we'd all hear about it, & no one ever said they had a hit such as this.

As for compariing a broken ankle or torn knee, or seperated shoulder you can't compare it to a helmet to helmet hit b/c ankles, knees, & shoulders are more prone to injury & you never know when it might happen.

But helmet to helmet hits can be controlled/prevented if you pay attention

Posted by: Sean0621

Moron

Posted by: pmech

Quote:

Originally Posted by PreMier

So when you have a child.. and they piss their bed, will you yell at them and say "With you paying better attention, this could have been avoided"? I mean seriously you need to get a fucking grip!

I agree, answer this Johnny.

And to Sean, this could possibly be the climactic scene where Whopper learns it lesson from playing Tic tac 10^474

Posted by: Duncans Donuts

Yes, Johnnny, you are very very wrong.

Posted by: Johnnny

You certainly can't compare a child wetting the bed to a helmet to helmet hit just like you can't compare a hockey player getting slammed into the ice from behind by a clear prick.

Sean0621

You say I'm a moron?

Maybe you're the moron who can't take a hint that helmet to helmet hits are avoidable provide that each individual pays attention to what they're doing when hitting & tackling on every play.

& just for your information you can't compare ankle, knee & shoulder injures to a helmet to helmet hit as those injuries are far more common.

Like I said in all levels of football games that I've seen this year, I have yet to see a helmet to helmet.

I've seen dirty hits, but no helmet to helmet hits except for this one highschool incident.

Posted by: Sean0621

Idiot

Posted by: pmech

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

All I'm going to say is that accidents are avoidable that's why they are called accidents b/c the individual wasn't paying proper attention.

Your argument has been all along that accidents are avoidable, hence if they do occur, the person commiting said accident should be punished. So if that is the case then.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

If it was my brother I'd want revenge on the arrogant jerk who did the H to H hit.

This statement is a flip flip on your orignal argument that accidents are aviodable and should be punished for.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

You certainly can't compare a child wetting the bed to a helmet to helmet hit just like you can't compare a hockey player getting slammed into the ice from behind by a clear prick.

Some other inconsistencies in your armor of illogical statments

Your original post:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

I saw this on tv the other day & then I found it online.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...lldeath08.html

Helmet to helmet hits should be completely banned & result in the player responsible being tossed from the game & have a one or 2 game suspension.

This is a very dangerous thing as it's happened to me a couple of times while playing & other teammates of mine, but thank God no one got seriously hurt.

Later posts of yours

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Like I said on our highschool & college/junior teams we never had problems like this b/c our guys never made hits or tackle's like that even being highschool kids.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

First our linemen never did helmet to helmet hits with the way they were taught. As for myself I'd run into & over & through defenders & I never did a helmet to helmet hit ever & I would hit ppl especially on short yardage rushing plays like 3 & 1 or 2 & 2 or whatever.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Back to the point if you're careful when hitting & tackling, you can avoid helmet to helmet hits plain & simple.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Again my reaction is based on my experience that H to H hits are avoidable mistakes. Like I've said already none of our defensive or special teams players in the 7yrs I played, did any of our players ever perform these types of hits which means they all learned well & were very careful & payed close attention in what they were doing on every play to prevent those hits as that's what was taught.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

7yrs & not one helmet to helmet hit by our players b/c we were taught how to avoid helmet to helmet hits properly & how to pay attention in the heat of battle.

Ok so lets start with your orignal post, you start out by stating that you and your teammates had this happen to you more than once. Then you should have been able to AVOID it, you are just as much at fault as the other helmet in the collision. (Again this based upon your argument, not mine)

Lets move onto your later statements that contradict your first one by stating that you nor your team mates never or had this happen. HMMMMMM, and even if it did happen it should have been AVOIDABLE by you and your team mates.

You sir, are retarded

Posted by: madden player

I was waiting for ya to mention something "aboot" hockey Johnnny. You most know that there is the "unintentional" high sticking penalty..It doesn't go unpunished but they do consider it an accident...so maybe "accidental" h to h hits in football should be penalized also??...Do you think this would make the players more aware and the chances of "accidental" h to h less likely (by know you most believe accidents happen because no one in this thread agrees with you and your theories on accidents)..

You have never had an accident in your life??..IMO you would have to be delusional/maybe insane to believe that ALL accidents can be avoided...I don't think you are insane just too fucking stubborn to admit you are wrong.

Posted by: Sean0621

OH NO!!! He caught you in a lie Johnnny. You stupid moron, you talked your way into it, talk your way out of it you fucking retard.

Posted by: Johnnny

Very good Pmech you learned how to use the copy & paste tool, congratulations.

Yes I said it happened to me once b/c of the other team player who was trying to take me down, but I ran his ass down & that was the only way he could bring me down.

He was tossed from the game b/c he also tried to start a fight & he was the opposing teams star defensive player. So you can see the other player was a jerk.

I kept my head down & lowered to avoid this type of collision, but the guy went even lower to purposely perform a helmet to helmet hit on me.

So my teammates or myself weren't responsible. Nice try dude.

madden player

Quote:

I was waiting for ya to mention something "aboot" hockey Johnnny. You most know that there is the "unintentional" high sticking penalty..It doesn't go unpunished but they do consider it an accident...so maybe "accidental" h to h hits in football should be penalized also??...Do you think this would make the players more aware and the chances of "accidental" h to h less likely (by know you most believe accidents happen because no one in this thread agrees with you and your theories on accidents)..

You have never had an accident in your life??..IMO you would have to be delusional/maybe insane to believe that ALL accidents can be avoided...I don't think you are insane just too fucking stubborn to admit you are wrong.

Well to tell you the truth I haven't any serious accidents as I pay attention to what I'm doing.

Most accidents are avoidable if you pay attention especially road accidents but who wants to discuss road accidents here in a sports thread.

Posted by: Johnnny

Sorry Sean0621 no lie. He just didn't read properly.

I said that a helmet to helmet hit happened to me b4. I was a running back not doing the initial hitting so it was the defensive players fault not mine.

Posted by: pmech

I read it just how it was typed. Idiot.

Yes this happened to me,
No this didnt happen to me.

Thats a lie.

And even if it wasnt, which it is,
It is avoidable, because all accidents are avoidable
Hence you were still at fault

Posted by: Sean0621

Oh so only the defense is at fault, never the offense, makes sense, I have to belive you on this one that there is a general universal that the person on defense is always at fault. Hey Johnnny give me your address, I'll mail you my intro to logic book that I used in my philsophy class last semester, make sure you read the whole thing and do the questions at the end of each chapter, it just may change your life.

Posted by: madden player

Yes some accidents with a little common sense you can avoid, everyone in this thread should be able to understand that, and I think they do..But you don't understand Johnnny that to avoid all accidents would be immpossible IMO...You would have to live a home bound existence and take no risks..Even then getting up to go to the crapper you could trip and fall and have and accident..

You didn't see any connection to bed wetting and accidental h to h but you still didn't answer the question..would the bed wetting be intentional or accidental??

Posted by: pmech

let me answer this one for you Johnny,

"well based upon my 7 years as a bedwetter, and the 52,714 professional bed wetters that I have talked to, this is clearly a accidental sitaution that could be avoided with proper coaching, and if it were my bed, I would clearly go after the said pants pisser and give him a good whatfor"

Posted by: Duncans Donuts

Johnny has been destroyed in this thread. Annihalated. Despite his desperate attempts at argument, over and over again he has been exposed as having none, being completely contradictory, and most seriously: being a hippie.

I hate to rip off Eric Cartman but I fucking hate hippies. You're argument is literally in the area of completely banning football as is. FOOTBALL IS DANGEROUS. You can get injured or hit someone with your helmet strictly on accident. The only solution to this problem is to eliminate football. And cars. And 35 mph speed limits. What nonsense.

Posted by: madden player

Cartman rules...BEEFCAKE BEEFCAKE.....Everyone familiar with this episode of Southpark??

Johnnny is probably going to say football is as safe as a game of chess.

Posted by: Johnnny

Duncans Donuts

Quote:

Johnny has been destroyed in this thread. Annihalated. Despite his desperate attempts at argument, over and over again he has been exposed as having none, being completely contradictory, and most seriously: being a hippie.

No, no never.

I stand by MO.

Pmech

Quote:

I read it just how it was typed. Idiot.

Yes this happened to me,
No this didnt happen to me.

Thats a lie.

And even if it wasnt, which it is,
It is avoidable, because all accidents are avoidable
Hence you were still at fault

You don't get do you? Are you that dumb?

I just finished saying that I was purposely avoiding a helmet to helmet hit, but that jag off purposely went lower than me so he could hit me right in the face mask & then after I still ran over his ass, he had the nerve to try & start a fight with me.

He tried to cause a fight b/c he was pissed that he got beat by me running his ass over to the ground.

He is at fault for that helmet to helmet as I did everything in my power to avoid it but he just wanted to hit me in the face mask purposely b/c it was the only way he thought he could bring me down.

I went so low to make it almost impossible for anyone to hit my face mask. But he practically had to dive right into my face mask with his just to hit my face mask, that's how low to the ground I was lowered during the run up the middle.

So I was not at fault, the defensive player was.

& to those talking about bed wetting, I guess you've never played ball as you have nothing better to say.

But when it happens to you, you'll be PO'd to hell at the other guy especially if you did everything in your power to what should've avoided the helmet to helmet hit.

Sean0621, no the defense is not always at fault for these hits when they occur, but it happens to be more often on the rare occasions that it's the defense & not the offense.

How often do you see Keyshawn Johnson banging his head right into Ty Law or Deion Sanders or whoever, not very much.

As for TB's, RB's & FB's, they're taught to lower their heads & shoulders to run into the defender so the majority of the time it's the defense doing the hitting & tackling. But the offensive linemen also hit as well obviously but from my experience they do not usually hit helmet to helmet as they are too busy pushing the defender out of the way, but I'm sure it's happend by "accident" of course.

Posted by: Sean0621

So fellas, who here actually believes Johnnny played football for 7 years, or who here thinks he spent the last 7 years playing Madden Football in his parents basement, Let's get a count.

Posted by: Sean0621

I'm voting basement

Posted by: Johnnny

Sean0621

[quopte] So fellas, who here actually believes Johnnny played football for 7
years, or who here thinks he spent the last 7 years playing Madden
Football in his parents basement, Let's get a count. [/quote]

personally I think that you are the one who's been playing madden & never even picked up a football let alone played which is why you have to try & insult me.

Sorry dude, but I played Running Back for 7yrs partially in highschool, & the rest in college.

I'm not criticizing other teams at any level here, but all I can say is our team was taught very, very well on both sides of the ball, never had helmet to helmet hits on the fault of our players, we didn't have many offensive or defensive penalties in games, nor did we have many turnovers b/c we had great instruction.

Yes we had other injuries such as seperated shoulders, torn knees, & achillies tendon's, but not one helmet to helmet hit performed by any of our players.

If helmet to helmet hits happened during our games, it's b/c of the fault of opposing team players.

So just b/c you never played football, doesn't mean everyone else hasn't either nor does it mean you know everything just b/c you play madden in your parents basement.

Posted by: Sean0621

so guess that means you vote that you played, it's one to one, even so far, lets get them votes in.

Posted by: Duncans Donuts

I'm going to be a football coach one day, and all I'll teach is to helmet to helmet the other star player. Even if he doesn't have the ball.

I don't know if Johnny played fb or not, but he doesn't talk like one. Talks like a hippie.

Posted by: PreMier

fuckin hippes'

Posted by: camarosuper6

Agreed.

Posted by: pmech

My vote) Basement, he never touched Madden, and yes , he is a fuckin hippie.

Yes I do get it. You on the other hand have flip flopped your statements/argument once again. Good day.

Posted by: Johnnny

Sean0621

Quote:

so guess that means you vote that you played, it's one to one, even so far, lets get them votes in.

You really don't have a life do you?

Maybe you're so against me b/c the football team picked on you in highschool or something who knows.

But just to let you know I was friends with everybody & didn't take on the typical role of a jerk, b/c I was a fat slob who didn't have much of a social life until I started playing football & I still kept the friends who I had b4 & they eventually started playing & training b/c of me.

Instead of this childish vote, maybe you should get physical & try playing football.

Duncans Donuts

Quote:

First let's get one thing straight, I'm not a fn' hippie.

Just b/c I feel what I feel doesn't make me a hippie.

But you just proved to me that you haven't been paying attention or know nothing about football b/c you say

" I don't know if Johnny played FB or not, but he doesn't talk like one"

First I didn't play full back as that's what fb stands, I played running back which I clearly stated many times so I don't see football from FB's point of view but I still see everything on the field at all times as you have to know what's going on.

2nd just how is a FB (which I'm not) supposed to talk anyway?

If you want to talk to a fb you should talk to my good buddy who was my lead blocker for a few years.

Speaking of coaching, I was actually offered to be one of the teams running back coach's when I stopped playing, but b/c of work & school I didn't have the time.

Pmech

I personally think that it's you guys who are the one's playing madden in your parents basement.

I didn't have much time for video games while playing football & I lived alone in my own place by the way which I still do.

& being a hippie is something I'm not.

If you say I'm a hippie just b/c of an opinion, that's pretty narrow minded.

There have been plenty of examples in the past that I could've said some of you here were hippies, but that would just be childish & a waste of my time.

To each his or her own, from my personal experience & from what I've seen, helmet to helmet hits are avoidable if you're paying proper attention to what you're doing.

& so far this season in highschool (accept for this one time), college & NFL I haven't seen a helmet to helmet hit, other dirty hits & injuries yes, but helmet to helmet no.

But if you guys want to believe that helmet to helmet hits aren't avoidable & they can happen left, right & center that's fine. I respect that opinion.

But I stand behind my opinion.

Posted by: madden player

What exactly is wrong with playing Madden in your parents basements??

...Let's keep it civil..I don't want to see this thread get ugly now but video games in your parents basement is fine with me.

This gotta be the neverending thread??

Posted by: Johnnny

madden player

Quote:

What exactly is wrong with playing Madden in your parents basements??

...Let's keep it civil..I don't want to see this thread get ugly now
but video games in your parents basement is fine with me.

This gotta be the neverending thread??

I have nothing against video games sometimes a couple of times a week we get together & rent a bunch of games on a Friday night especially in the cold winter.

But I do have something against it if ppl are trying to use video games to convince ppl that I never played football which I did for 7yrs.

& I also have something against it when it's all an individual does 4 or more times a week & doesn't do anything else. That's a couch potatoe.

I play Madden myself but only a couple of times a week as that's all I have time for.

But when I was playing football, I had no time for such luxuries.

But I still stand by my opinions.

Posted by: Sean0621

Jesus Johnnny you're a fuckin hippy now too, I gotta tell ya I thought more of you than that.

Oh and madden dude, by the way I don't think there's anything wrong with livin at home with your parents or playin video games, just as long as you're not still doin it when you're 25 years old like Johnnny. Oh don't give me this crap about not playin video games Johnnny, I've been in open chat and saw you post in every video game thread on this site. You need to get out of the house and go do something with your time, and cut your hair you fuckin hippy

Posted by: madden player

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

...I play Madden myself but only a couple of times a week as that's all I have time for...

I hear ya man...I try and get in as many games online as I can in the run of a week..You play Madden online??

I wasn't trying to be serious when I said this thread was going to get ugly...IMO that happen along time ago.

Posted by: Duncans Donuts

Johnny, nobody cares that you claim you played football. Sorry I confused fullback with tailback (or whatever position you say you played), that's almost as bad as getting pissed because you weigh 225 and someone claimed your "argument doesn't carry weight."

I don't care that you claim you were offered a running backs coach. To me you've demonstrated true ignorance in relation to football. You're boisterous nonsense means nothing, and no many how many times you "confirm" in this thread that you played football for 7 years, it doesn't mean any of us care or believe it.

Posted by: gr81

Quote:

You're boisterous nonsense means nothing

^^ ha ha, BINGO!!!!! couldn't have said it better myself DD

Posted by: Johnnny

Duncans Donuts

Quote:

I don't care that you claim you were offered a running backs coach. To
me you've demonstrated true ignorance in relation to football. You're
boisterous nonsense means nothing, and no many how many times you
"confirm" in this thread that you played football for 7 years, it doesn't
mean any of us care or believe it.

Like I said I don't claim anything b/c it's all true.

You shouldn't even be talking here b/c you never even played football b/c of your ankle so you wouldn't have the hands on experience that I had.

Yes I feel bad that you hurt your ankle, but you never played so you should be the last person talking about football.

You don't even talk about the game here or techniques or anything which proves to me you know sh!t about the sport.

You're just here to give me a hard time & call me hippie & blah, blah, blah. You have yet to say something valid towards the actual sport.

I personally don't have anything against you or anyone here, but since you've never played, you haven't seen things from a footbally player's point of view so you can't possibly judge on what should happen & what shouldn't during a game.

Posted by: Sean0621

Dude you never played football either, so quit your talking, you fucking dumbass. Ok Johnnny, if you were running for the 2 gap, in between what two people would you normally run through. In an X block what player steps through first if the play is going through the 3 gap. What number is a tailback called in a playbook. And as far as you complaining about the defensive player hitting you while you were low, let me ask you was he supposed to stand up and hit you, is that what defensive coaches teach. Mine taught me to hit low so I can get under the player and drive him back, that would be proper technique, I don't recall anyone ever telling me to hit high. Let me ask you something was the guy supposed to just let you keep going, no he did his job and stopped you short, argue all you want but if you choose to run low like that, someone is going to make you pay for it eventually, of course almost anyone that has ever actually played would understand this as just being part of playing football, why do you think they do all those neck exercises during practice, so you don't break your fucking neck, of course you wouldn't know about that cuz again you never actually played. Oh and you are a fucking hippy!!!!!

Posted by: PreMier

No point in arguing with a fucking hippie.

Johnnny post a pic of yourself in football gear. You know.. when you were like 10yrs old playing gremlin ball. Thats the only ball I bet you played. Go smoke your weed, and use your pump hippie boy.

Posted by: Duncans Donuts

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Johnny you fucking faggit I didn't play this year but I'm 20. I'm in college you fuck nut with a torn ligament. You're a fucking soft ass weak piece of shit, 225-230 running a 4.5, I'd fucking wreck your ass you bitch. Go blast your arms by isolating your brachialis pussy, have you ever even done a compound press?

Fucking laughable joke ass piece of hippie trash. You don't know shit about football except protesting helmet to helmet shots, and you didn't even know that was already banned.

Get back on this board when you have something relevenat to bring you lying repetitious idiot.

Posted by: madden player

Glad I checked in on a Friday night..Duncan that sig is over the top

..ROFLMFAO.

Posted by: camarosuper6

Posted by: madden player

Run Johnnny run!!!

Posted by: PreMier

Posted by: camarosuper6

LOL.. that kid behind him looks like hes about to spank the other kids ass.

Posted by: PreMier

You didnt know? Johnnny like his ass spanked by other guys

Posted by: Sean0621

Damn Johnnny you a bitch

Posted by: Johnnny

Sean0621

Quote:

Dude you never played football either, so quit your talking, you
fucking dumbass. Ok Johnnny, if you were running for the 2 gap, in between
what two people would you normally run through. In an X block what player
steps through first if the play is going through the 3 gap. What number
is a tailback called in a playbook. And as far as you complaining about
the defensive player hitting you while you were low, let me ask you was
he supposed to stand up and hit you, is that what defensive coaches
teach. Mine taught me to hit low so I can get under the player and drive
him back, that would be proper technique, I don't recall anyone ever
telling me to hit high. Let me ask you something was the guy supposed to
just let you keep going, no he did his job and stopped you short, argue
all you want but if you choose to run low like that, someone is going
to make you pay for it eventually, of course almost anyone that has ever
actually played would understand this as just being part of playing
football, why do you think they do all those neck exercises during
practice, so you don't break your fucking neck, of course you wouldn't know
about that cuz again you never actually played. Oh and you are a fucking
hippy!!!!!

Sorry dude, wrong again, I did play as you know sh!t about me nor do I care if you care to know me or not.

Duncans Donuts

Quote:

I see I hit the button right on the knob.

Defensive aren't we. That can only mean that you it's the truth.

I really don't care what you say, but if you get on the team with your steroid enhanced body, congradulations.

I did it natural & when I was at my 227lbs with my 4.5 for the 40 I would've run over you.

Now there's no need to insult, that just shows me that you're insecure about my comments that hold truth.

If you think a 320lb bench press with a 260lb incline bench, with a 205lb standing military press in the front for reps for a 225lb man is weak, there's something wrong with you upstairs.

I guess your steroids are helping you bench 500lbs, 350lbs on incline bench press & probably 250lbs on standing military press.

Well if I took juice I would've been doing at least 400lb bench & I probably would've hit 250lbs within a couple of years.

& you don't have anything relevant to say either as you just insulted me, nothing relevant.

Get a few years of football experience & then we'll talk.

None of you have to believe that I played but I did, & just one thing Donuts, just b/c you're big of juice, doesn't mean that you automatically can play football.

I saw plenty of big, ripped & lean guys get cut from teams b/c they couldn't even run a 4.8 for the 40 nor did they have any athletism or flexibility & it hurt them as their ass got cut within the first couple of weeks.

& you say you're 20yrs old & never played?

Well my friend you'll have a lot to learn & I doubt you'll even start as most guys start playing football when they're kids or at least in highschool so you got a long way to go b4 you see playing time.

Posted by: nikegurl

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

First let's get one thing straight, I'm not a fn' hippie.

I smell patchouli. I hate that stuff.

Posted by: Sean0621

Now you're trying to defend you're argument by accusing duncan of juicing, hmmm this isn't the first thread where you've tried this approach is it. Oh and I love how you couldn't answer any of my questions on the technical terms used on football plays, anyone who ever played running back should be able to tell me immediately what I am talking about. I'll give ya time to look it up online you fucking dork.

Posted by: nikegurl

hipppies play hacky sak - not football

Posted by: Sean0621

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

& you say you're 20yrs old & never played?

Well my friend you'll have a lot to learn & I doubt you'll even start as most guys start playing football when they're kids or at least in highschool so you got a long way to go b4 you see playing time.

Oh and Johnboy let me set you straight on what Duncan said, he said if it wasn't for his injury he'd still be playing right now, now normal people would be led to believe that he played all the way up until his injury. Now what happened was he probably mispuncuated, which of course leaves you quite flustered much like bright lights and loud noises leave our friends in the animal kindom frightened and confused. You know what this means Johnnny, once again you've proven to the world just what kind of an idiot you are, the very special kind, it's a disease man, similar to the napolean complex which comes from being short, you have a complex from riding on a shorter bus than the rest of us, it happens, sorry I have to be the one to break it to ya, but you are retarded.

Posted by: PreMier

"Yeah I hate to say it, but I think that's impossible, I've never met somebody that thickheaded in real life, and I'm in the Marines, 9 out of 10 guys are rocks in the Marines, but this guy is a very special kind of rock."

Posted by: nikegurl

rocks? don't non-hippy/football people refer to the football as "the rock"

Posted by: Sean0621

No Nikegurl a football has way more personality than this rock

Posted by: camarosuper6

Duncan doesnt juice. Im his brother, and believe me , he is a strong as he says and hes natural.

Dont be a hater.

Posted by: Johnnny

Sean0621

Quote:

I've made my point, Duncan hasn't played or isn't playing b/c of an injury & I know a steroid physique when I see one.

I stand by my opinions regarding helmet to helmet hits. They are avoidable which is why none have yet to happen in the college & NFL & this is the only highschool helmet to helmet so far this season so most ppl are doing a good job by paying attention to what they're doing when playing.

Posted by: nikegurl

i'm was just playing. i adore football!

i've heard some guys call the actual ball "the rock"

plus i like picking on the hippie/patchouli/hacky sack stuff b/c I know it'll upset him

Posted by: PreMier

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

I've made my point, Duncan hasn't played or isn't playing b/c of an injury & I know a steroid physique when I see one.

Read Camaro's post you ignorant fuck.

Posted by: camarosuper6

Quote:

I've made my point, Duncan hasn't played or isn't playing b/c of an injury & I know a steroid physique when I see one.

Obviously you do NOT know a steroid physique when you see one, because, once again I state, he is 100 LEGALLY natural (with the aid of OTC supplements).

Posted by: nikegurl

Quote:

Originally Posted by camarosuper6

Dont be a hater.

I thought it needed repeating

Posted by: Sean0621

Johnnny you are a moron, you can tell Duncan is juicing from his pic in his avatar. Just because you don't train hard enough to get over your little walls like the rest of us doesn't mean that Duncan hasn't got to where he is at naturally. All this is telling me is that A you do not train hard enough and B you do not train smart enough and C you are a jealous motherfucker. If you can't do what he is capable of doing you feel like you have to tear him down, this is part of the reason why we are so merciless when making fun of your stupid ass.

Posted by: camarosuper6

Fo Shizzle NikeGurl

Posted by: Johnnny

Premier

Quote:

Read Camaro's post you ignorant fuck.

Have you ever heard of something called lying?

Which is something I never do.

Now you guys are getting very childish & immature.

I made my point, get some playing time & then we'll talk.

As for me I payed my due's for 7yrs.

But you guys are entitled to your opinions & that's fine with me nor have I insulted anyone b/c of their opinions, disagreed yes, insulted no.

& I stick to my opinion regarding this subject.

Posted by: nikegurl

don't be a hater

Posted by: Sean0621

You'd stick yourself to an atomic bomb if you thought you were right in doing so you fucking idiot.

Posted by: PreMier

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

Premier

Have you ever heard of something called lying?

Which is something I never do.

Now you guys are getting very childish & immature.

I made my point, get some playing time & then we'll talk.

As for me I payed my due's for 7yrs.

But you guys are entitled to your opinions & that's fine with me nor have I insulted anyone b/c of their opinions, disagreed yes, insulted no.

& I stick to my opinion regarding this subject.

You think that he is lying? So not only are you a retarded, ignorant, hater, hippie fuck, you are now dilusional.

Post a picture of your physique, DO IT. Or better yet, post a pic of you IN a football uniform. Whats that? You dont want to? Because you cant! Fucking troll

Posted by: camarosuper6

I haven't utterd an insult yet.

However, If You insist on starting to call me a liar, then I will proceed to pull out a can of certfied Camarosuper6 Verbal Whipass.

Posted by: Johnnny

camarosuper6

Quote:

Obviously you do NOT know a steroid physique when you see one, because,
once again I state, he is 100 LEGALLY natural (with the aid of OTC
supplements).

There's a thing called lying.

Your body can only grow & so strong to a certain point b4 you need steroids.
You'd be surprised how many ppl lie about steroids in every gym in the world.

One guy in my gym had competed at the IFBB leve at 265lbs ripped at a height of about 6ft tall & he claimed to be all natural. Well I his brother found steroid vials in his house along with syringes.

He was lying to everyone about his steroid & GH use while he was on it all along.

I don't care what anyone thinks about the ppl I know but all there are many examples of these lies in every gym like it or not, believe it or not.

Posted by: camarosuper6

Quote:

don't be a hater

Seems we just cant get the point across can we Nike?

Posted by: Johnnny

Sean0621

Quote:

You'd stick yourself to an atomic bomb if you thought you were right in doing so you fucking idiot.

Now you're just losing it & not making any sense. You've just completely steered away from football

Posted by: nikegurl

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

One guy in my gym had competed at the IFBB leve at 265lbs ripped at a height of about 6ft tall & he claimed to be all natural. Well I his brother found steroid vials in his house along with syringes.

What the hell does that have to do w/Duncan?

Seriously - an apology is in order. You have no right to say he's lying or that he is a steroid user because of your experience with YOUR genetic limits.

Posted by: Sean0621

Johnnny I'm beginning to doubt whether or not you've ever been in a gym period, do like Premiere said and post a pic.

Posted by: Johnnny

camarosuper6

Quote:

Seems we just cant get the point across can we Nike?

What point?

I have my opinions regarding helmet to helmet hits & I stand by them.

Posted by: camarosuper6

Look Johnny, your entitled to believe the moon is made out of cheese for all I care, but lying I am not. If you continue to believe these dellusions of gradeur you seem to create.. this so called "Johnny 6th sense" you have about everything, fine by me, but dont go throwing insults my way.

Hes natural. Hes strong . Yes it is possible.

Just because you dont feel like agreeing with the truth, doesnt make it any less true.

Posted by: nikegurl

Quote:

Originally Posted by camarosuper6

Seems we just cant get the point across can we Nike?

nope

but now we know that every guy here with a better physique than Johnny is a liar and a steroid user.

Posted by: camarosuper6

I guess.

I dont have a problem with Johnny's opinion on helmet hits, I could care less. The man has a right to his opinion.

But Johnny would try to convice Newton that gravity is an illusion, and actually believe himself. This is getting old, fast.

BTW Johnny, accusing someone of steroid use is a pretty serious issue. I suggest you give it up fast.

Posted by: Johnnny

nikegurl

Quote:

What the hell does that have to do w/Duncan?

Seriously - an apology is in order. You have no right to say he's
lying or that he is a steroid user because of your experience with YOUR
genetic limits.

You've got to be kidding.

He owe's me an apology, he comes on here talking sh!t to me & insulting me saying I never played football, when the dude at 20yrs old has never played one play of football in his life.

He just came here to get on my case, now I know why Randy was pissed at him on another thread.

As for lying I believe he is lying as there are too many steroid users lying out there.

Just like Arnold back in the day said he was all natural & he was pumping up with D-Bol & Primobolan & the dude claimed to be natural all those years.

What a crock.

Like I said I know a steroid physique when I see one, there's too much lying about steroid use going on that you wouldn't even know if your own brother, sister or best friend was using steroids.

Posted by: Johnnny

camarosuper6

Quote:

BTW Johnny, accusing someone of steroid use is a pretty serious issue. I suggest you give it up fast

Well I have my opinions on lying steroid users & I'm sticking to that opinion as well.

Posted by: camarosuper6

Quote:

As for lying I believe he is lying as there are too many steroid users lying out there.

There are a lot of people out there lying about their football experiences too, but I dont disbelieve you because of the mere percentages of liars....

I am TELLING you he is natural. I have no reason to lie, and neither does he. Telling me the Earth is flat does not make it any less round. Facts are Facts and you my friend, are wrong and starting to piss me off.

I try to stay unbiased in the discussions, being a Mod, but your blantently putting out untrue information, agasint the word of a reliable informant(me). There is a term for this, its called libel.

Posted by: Johnnny

One of my good friends who I played ball with lied to me for almost 8yrs about his steroid use until just recently even though I knew he was already on them.

It's just an example of what goes on in every gym.

But at least some of the guys on the team where honest about their steroid use & offered me cycles of this testosterone & that hormone & so on but I always turned them down

Posted by: camarosuper6

Your full of examples.

Your also full of shit.

Posted by: madden player

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

...Like I said I know a steroid physique when I see one, there's too much lying about steroid use going on that you wouldn't even know if your own brother, sister or best friend was using steroids.

Johnnny I hate this bullshit more than anyone. I have been natural for life (IMO I happen to think that even androstenedione is a steroid..it is certainly a male sex hormone and I have never even touched that crap or any OTC juice to enhance my physique) and I have been accused of juicing and being natural is something I take alot of pride in and so does everyother natural bodybuilder.

I have been fascinated/practicing bodybuilding for almost almost ten yrs..IMO steroid use is only obvious in the most extreme of cases..Please don't judge a book by it's cover, just because someone is bigger than you does not mean they use steroids. With that kind of attitude/belief you will amount to nothing when it comes to natural bodybuilding.

Posted by: Duncans Donuts

Johnny, you fucking weak, sorry faggit. For reference; yes, I played football. Injuries limited me in high school seriously; torn tricep, broken toe. The idea that my opinion doesn't matter because you say I didn't play, though, is fucking ridiculous. I used over the counter supplements and nothing else, dizzawg, but the fact of the matter is that the burden of proof lies on the accuser. Where's your proof?

Oh, I see, you SEE me and see my lifts (which, let's be honest Mr. Brachialis blaster, destroy yours - I'm modest, but I won't back down from this shit) and assume that I'm juicing. HOW IS THIS ANY DIFFERENT FROM US LOOKING AT YOU AND ASSUMING BASED ON HOW YOU TALK THAT YOU DON'T PLAY FOOTBALL?

OK, i'm a juicer since you say so, if you're a faggit hippie with no football experience who's a complete moron with no sense of argument who probably never broke 5 seconds in an agility run. You're a fucking douche. No good football player lifts like you. No football player who presses 205 pound military style (OFMG WOWWOW! Should I suck ur 12" cock now Mr. Delusional?) reverts to being an incoherent, blubbering little hippie.

Posted by: Johnnny

camarosuper6

Quote:

I was curious have you ever played football?

Naw, sorry dude football is the truth as I loved the game since I was a kid & then finally got into fairly good condition & eventually grew to a descent "natural" size to play football at a college level

But the liars of steroids is much more common.

How the hell do you know that he's natural? Do you live with him at his house?
If you do you should try wiping his behind as I'm sure you'll find needle punctures on both cheeks.

You will never know if someone is lying or not about steroids.

Like I said at least most of the guys I played football with where honest about their steroid use & offered many cycles, many times to me.

Quote:

Your full of examples.

Your also full of shit.

Wrong again, the truth, not sh!t.

Posted by: Duncans Donuts

Wow, you know better than my brother, who is a police officer, who lived with me for 20 years, who taught me basically everything I know about weight training which I developed from there.

For your reference I am now currently considering a cycle, but until that time, you fucking piece of shit, I'm still naturally better than you will ever dream of being. Oh, and my best 40 yard dash time was 4.473, based on a 3 run average. So I'm faster than you are, too. Hurts, don't it?

Posted by: camarosuper6

Damn it Johnny. I have gotten along with almost everyone on this forum for over a year now, and your gonna blow that for me.

I have lived with him, for the past 24 years of my life, until I recently moved. How the hell could you possibly be a good judge of how well I know my own brother? You have an exteme case of the "know it all's". You are on the verge of becoming Spam in this forum, and I will be the first to boot you out if necessary.

Yes I played football throughout highschool, and stopped as soon as college hit. I know plenty about the game, and how to play. Just because all your so called "friends" have lied to you about their so called steroid use, doesnt mean the same applies to me and my brother.

I am too curiuos, if you are all you claim to be, why you dont post a simple picture of yourself playing football, lifting weights, hell, Id be satisfied if you were over 13 by the way you speak and act.

It is not smart to speak libel (slander) about another person, especially on an illegal subject. Your opinions do not matter in this case, you are not a jury. You do NOT know it all, and need to get your foot out of your mouth.

Posted by: Johnnny

Duncans Donuts

Quote:

Johnny, you fucking weak, sorry faggit. For reference; yes, I played football. Injuries limited me in high school seriously; torn tricep, broken toe. The idea that my opinion doesn't matter because you say I didn't play, though, is fucking ridiculous. I used over the counter supplements and nothing else, dizzawg, but the fact of the matter is that the burden of proof lies on the accuser. Where's your proof?

Oh, I see, you SEE me and see my lifts (which, let's be honest Mr. Brachialis blaster, destroy yours - I'm modest, but I won't back down from this shit) and assume that I'm juicing. HOW IS THIS ANY DIFFERENT FROM US LOOKING AT YOU AND ASSUMING BASED ON HOW YOU TALK THAT YOU DON'T PLAY FOOTBALL?

OK, i'm a juicer since you say so, if you're a faggit hippie with no football experience who's a complete moron with no sense of argument who probably never broke 5 seconds in an agility run. You're a fucking douche. No good football player lifts like you. No football player who presses 205 pound military style (OFMG WOWWOW! Should I suck ur 12" cock now Mr. Delusional?) reverts to being an incoherent, blubbering little hippie.

You just proved it, you just said you have "limited football experience".

Obviously your body wasn't meant for the sport with all the injuries you sustained.

Not everybody is meant for every sport.

What position did you play for a "limited time"?

Sorry, wrong again 7yrs experience Vs. your what 1 month or 1 year experience?

& you just proved that you don't know much about football or football training b/c many of the players & football weight lifting routines include standing military press as well as the push press which is when you're going way too heavy on standing military press & you slightly squat down as you lower the weight & then slightly squat up at the same time exploding the barbell back up in the air.

So you don't know what you're talking about.

We did mostly 20 & 40 yard sprints along with plenty of plyometrics, wall climbing & hopping, pushing SUV's with 4 ppl in it up & down parking lots (a technique out of the FB Mike Alstott routine), tire & rope hopping, box jumping, long jumping, sprints with parachute's, running plays from the 5 yard line, then the 10 yard line, then the 20 & so on, weight lifting of course, watching game films, learning techniques for each players position, & many more training exercises & routines.

I think that's enough

Posted by: camarosuper6

BTW.. like my brother said Johnny... the burden of proof lies in the hands of the accuser.

You claim all these football accomplishments... with absolutely no proof.
You CLAIM you can tell my brother is un natural, against not only his word, but MINE, as well.

Where is you proof, Oh wise Yoda ?

Posted by: Duncans Donuts

OH MY FUCKING GOODNESS. WHERE DID I SAY I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT A STANDING MILITARY PRESS IS? OR A POWER PRESS? OR A BOX SNATCH?

I don't care if you think you know more about football than I. God, I'm faster than you, I'd bet dollars to donuts my pro agility run is better, and I'm naturally stronger than you could be if jesus gave you the powers of samson and you injected my muscle into your body. You want to go over fucking drills that coaches use now? How about a hip fip on the line, or a backpedal weave? The fact that I know this means what? It means nothing. When you make your argument it still makes no sense.

Posted by: camarosuper6

Posted by: Johnnny

camarosuper6

Quote:

Damn it Johnny. I have gotten along with almost everyone on this forum for over a year now, and your gonna blow that for me.

I have lived with him, for the past 24 years of my life, until I recently moved. How the hell could you possibly be a good judge of how well I know my own brother? You have an exteme case of the "know it all's". You are on the verge of becoming Spam in this forum, and I will be the first to boot you out if necessary.

Yes I played football throughout highschool, and stopped as soon as college hit. I know plenty about the game, and how to play. Just because all your so called "friends" have lied to you about their so called steroid use, doesnt mean the same applies to me and my brother.

I am too curiuos, if you are all you claim to be, why you dont post a simple picture of yourself playing football, lifting weights, hell, Id be satisfied if you were over 13 by the way you speak and act.

It is not smart to speak libel (slander) about another person, especially on an illegal subject. Your opinions do not matter in this case, you are not a jury. You do NOT know it all, and need to get your foot out of your mouth.

I have nothing against you, but you're the one who's blowing your friendly record here by coming at me just b/c I have my own opinions about certain issues & you don't like my opinions that's why you're here.

I'm sorry that you didn't play football in college (for real), you missed a good time, it was a lot of fun.

As for judging your brother, I didn't mean yours personally I mean in general as I've heard crazy things about steroids with ppl who you'd never think were on them, maybe one day they come out in the open or one day you're at their house & you stumble on some empty vials or syringes in the garbage.

That's what I'm talking about.

You say you've been here for a year correct? Than you'd know why I'm patiently waiting to post a pic of myself.

As you know I suffered a thyroid condition in 2001 losing almost 30lbs in a month from 227lbs to a burnt out 200lbs who was on his way to developing Graves disease which is an untreated hyper thyroid condition which takes longer to recover from than just a simple hyper thyroid.

That's why I had to stop playing football, that was the main reason & school.

Now after 4yrs of treatment I'm a descent 205lbs with my strength half way back to where it was at 227lbs, but it's taking a long time to get back there & I don't know if I'll be able to gain that mass back w/o steroids after my body suffered from that condition.

But my thyroid treatment was altered last August 2003 with Iodine to shut my thyroid production down & then 6 months later I was put on synthroid but during those 6 months of not having any thyroid production I suffered gain from a moderate amount an unwanted gut having my waist go from about 32-34 inches up to 36-38 inches uncontrolably despite training & diet.

My endocrinologist told me that once my thyroid returned to normal & I continued dieting & training, the fat would eventually burn away.

& it is, I'm back down to a 34 inch waist but not completely in the condition I feel comfortable with. It's mostly just a tiny bit of a stomach but the rest of the body is pretty lean & I'm starting to develop my lean set of abs again.

This is why I haven't posted a pic yet, good enough answer? If you went through this, you'd feel the same way, having your physique take a turn in the wrong direction despite your training, diet, & cardio is a tough thing to deal with.

But with regards to steroid users, I stick to my opinions as well as helmet to helmet hits.

Maybe I should've taken my teammates up on their steroid offers, I could've exploded up to 250lbs at 5ft10 & maybe played FB or MLB which is something I always wanted to play as well but I wasn't big enough so I settled for Running Back.

Posted by: Johnnny

Duncans Donuts

Quote:

OH MY FUCKING GOODNESS. WHERE DID I SAY I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT A STANDING MILITARY PRESS IS? OR A POWER PRESS? OR A BOX SNATCH?

I don't care if you think you know more about football than I. God, I'm faster than you, I'd bet dollars to donuts my pro agility run is better, and I'm naturally stronger than you could be if jesus gave you the powers of samson and you injected my muscle into your body. You want to go over fucking drills that coaches use now? How about a hip fip on the line, or a backpedal weave? The fact that I know this means what? It means nothing. When you make your argument it still makes no sense.

I never said you didn't know about Standing military press, I said you didn't know about football training routines.

As for your "NATURAL STRENGTH" I'm guessing you have a 420lb bench press for reps, a 315lb incline bench press for reps, & a 255lb standing military press w/o the push press for reps correct?

Posted by: Duncans Donuts

I dont' do regular bench presses nor incline bench presses nor standying military presses.

What you may fail to realize, dear sir, is that none of these are specific football training routine. They are strength training routines. Football training is on the field; strength training is in the weight room.

You can look at my journal if you want to see my routine.

Posted by: Johnnny

Duncans Donuts

Quote:

Wow, you know better than my brother, who is a police officer, who
lived with me for 20 years, who taught me basically everything I know about
weight training which I developed from there.

For your reference I am now currently considering a cycle, but until
that time, you fucking piece of shit, I'm still naturally better than you
will ever dream of being. Oh, and my best 40 yard dash time was 4.437,
based on a 3 run average. So I'm faster than you are, too. Hurts,
don't it?

The police? Give me a break. They are some of the worst crimminals & corrupted ppl around.

One cop I know offered me steroids at the gym. Many of the cops are affiliated with the organized crime ring in each city.

As for your 40 yard dash time at 4.437 seconds that doesn't bother me that much as it's not that much faster than mine at 4.5.

My 100 yard dash was around 13-15 seconds on a bad day.

But then again the 40 yard dash time isn't always important. There are NFL running backs with a 4.6-4.7 for the 40 around. Ron Dayne of the Giants runs about a 4.67 or something the last I heard last season.

You can say I'm a piece of shit, but I still don't have anything against you.

But one thing you have to admit is there are a lot of steroid users out there who don't tell the truth.

I'm just curious what you're current thoughts of a steroid cycle consist of & how many CC's & for how long?

Just so you know the NCAA has a strict policy on steroid use & sometimes "the way around it" isn't always effective.

Posted by: Johnnny

Duncans Donuts

Quote:

I dont' do regular bench presses nor incline bench presses nor
standying military presses.

What you may fail to realize, dear sir, is that none of these are
specific football training routine. They are strength training routines.
Football training is on the field; strength training is in the weight
room.

You can look at my journal if you want to see my routine.

Actually that's where you're wrong as they are all part of a football training routine.

Take a look at a pro level training program or even a highschool or NCAA routine.

Yes they are strenth training routines, & many football routines include strength training routines as well as on field routines.

If teams didn't have a strength training routine, than their players would lose some size, strength & power.

Posted by: Duncans Donuts

Johnnny, no, I am not wrong. Football training is skill specific; in regards to an open skilled training system, football itself is not improved in the weight room. Getting better at blocking has nothing to do with getting better at doing a military press (standing, sitting, whatever). Functional strength and skill specific training are SEPERATE ENTITIES that come together to improve an athlete. It isn't skill training, it is strength training. There are neuromuscular studies that support this, which upon request, I will pull up for you.

I by no means meant that strength training is unnecessary. I'm saying that strong athletes who can't block are useless, as are fast athletes who can't move diagonally.

nothing against me? I certainly have something against you, and you against me. You wouldn't have accused me of steroid use and then said this:

"Obviously your body wasn't meant for the sport with all the injuries you sustained.
Not everybody is meant for every sport."

Let's be real.

Posted by: Johnnny

Duncans Donuts

Quote:

Johnnny, no, I am not wrong. Football training is skill specific; in regards to an open skilled training system, football itself is not improved in the weight room. Getting better at blocking has nothing to do with getting better at doing a military press (standing, sitting, whatever). Functional strength and skill specific training are SEPERATE ENTITIES that come together to improve an athlete. It isn't skill training, it is strength training. There are neuromuscular studies that support this, which upon request, I will pull up for you.

I by no means meant that strength training is unnecessary. I'm saying that strong athletes who can't block are useless, as are fast athletes who can't move diagonally.

nothing against me? I certainly have something against you, and you against me. You wouldn't have accused me of steroid use and then said this:

"Obviously your body wasn't meant for the sport with all the injuries you sustained.
Not everybody is meant for every sport."

Let's be real.

Yes you're right as techniques & skills are extremely important but the weight room is also essential.

But I don't have anything against you, just ppl who lie about steroid use.

Let me ask you this, what good is a FB with all the skills in the world, but not enough strength or power to block the defensive tackle or linebacker? Then the running back gets nailed before he can get back to the line of scrimmage.

Posted by: Duncans Donuts

I did not disagree with you, Johnny. Clearly I believe that strength is important because I'm training for football now. If I thought the weight room was not ballast I wouldn't be considering anabolics now, a full year before I have to report for the next season. I just don't believe standing military presses are better than seated military presses; or power cleans better than squats for improving the strength function of football.

Posted by: Sean0621

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnny

He owe's me an apology, he comes on here talking sh!t to me & insulting me saying I never played football, when the dude at 20yrs old has never played one play of football in his life.

Johnnny your parents owe all of us an apology for giving birth to you.

Posted by: Johnnny

Here is one of Illinois's (of the Big 10) strength training routines:

Workout:
Suggested warm-up for 5 minutes. Biking or Jump Rope. Get a nice sweat going to warm up the muscles. Stretch as needed. Remember to breathe correctly, full range of motion, concentrate on the specific muscle that you are using.

Week 1: sets x 10
Weeks 2-5: sets x 8
Weeks 6-8: sets x 6

Monday: (Chest and Shoulders)
Bench (cycle). Usually a pyramid or ladder.
Incline Bench 3x
Shrugs 3x
Dips 3x
Flys 3x
DB Raises 3x
Decline Pushups 3x
Forearms
Abs
Cardio (20 min) High Intensity

Tuesday (Legs, Back and Bi's)
Squat (cycle)
Leg Extension 3x (two legs)
Leg Curls 3x (two legs)
Back (wide grip lats) 3x (heavy)
Back (choose) 2x
Biceps (straight bar) 3x (heavy)
Biceps (choose) * high rep burnout
Forearms
Abs
Cardio (same)

Wednesday (off)

Thurs (Chest, Tri-concentration, shoulders) Lighter day
Bench Cycle
DB Bench 2x
DB Military 2x
Upright Rows 3x
Torture 3x and 3x15 (Flat bench with EZ curl bar, tricep extension lying on bench, then pressout for 15). Rest for 1 to 2 minutes and repeat. Your triceps will grow!
Light DB raises 3x
Pushups 3x
Forearms
Abs
Cardio (same)

Friday (Legs, Back and Bi's)
One legged Squats 3x
Leg Press 3x
One legged leg extensions 3x
One legged legs curls 3x
Back (a-frame) 3x
Back (choose) 2x
Biceps (db curl) 3x (heavy)
Biceps (choose) * high rep burnout
Forearms
Abs
Cardio (same)

Remember, variation is the best. This is just a basic workout that I follow. I change it up periodically to shock my body. Each weight workout should take no longer then 1hr to 1:15 and the cardio is only 20 minutes

Posted by: Johnnny

Sean0621

Quote:

Johnnny your parents owe all of us an apology for giving birth to you.

Posted by: Johnnny

Duncans Donuts

Quote:

did not disagree with you, Johnny. Clearly I believe that strength is important because I'm training for football now. If I thought the weight room was not ballast I wouldn't be considering anabolics now, a full year before I have to report for the next season. I just don't believe standing military presses are better than seated military presses; or power cleans better than squats for improving the strength function of football.

I never said that seated military press weren't good or important, but standing military press is a tru test of over head power.

& power cleans or power clean & press don't replace squats they do something different.

But many strength coaches are encouraging their players to refrain from power cleans as you can easily rip something in your rotator cuffs.

But the push press & standing military press are parts of many strength training routines.

Posted by: Duncans Donuts

Johnny, dude seriously, I'm trying to be nice now. Why did you post up what a Big 10 school's program is? STANDING MILITARY PRESSES are not a better "test" of overhead power. In fact, speaking strictly on the deltoids, a seated military press might be better because you can't use the LEGS to propel the weight from a static position.

I think squats ARE BETTER FOR DEVELOPING strength itself, in place than power cleans. Just because they are parts of many strength training routines (AND DONT GET ME WRONG, THEY ARE FINE EXERCISES) they do NOT HAVE TO BE THE CRUX of a good one. I haven't done standing military presses in probably 2 years, nor power cleans either. I wouldn't consider my overall body strength suffering because of it; seated I workout with 225 on military press and i work out with well in the 400s for squat. Someone who does your suggested exercises are not necessarily better than my recommended exercises as far as football is concerned.

Posted by: Johnnny

Duncans Donuts

Quote:

Johnny, dude seriously, I'm trying to be nice now. Why did you post up what a Big 10 school's program is? STANDING MILITARY PRESSES are not a better "test" of overhead power. In fact, speaking strictly on the deltoids, a seated military press might be better because you can't use the LEGS to propel the weight from a static position.

I think squats ARE BETTER FOR DEVELOPING strength itself, in place than power cleans. Just because they are parts of many strength training routines (AND DONT GET ME WRONG, THEY ARE FINE EXERCISES) they do NOT HAVE TO BE THE CRUX of a good one. I haven't done standing military presses in probably 2 years, nor power cleans either. I wouldn't consider my overall body strength suffering because of it; seated I workout with 225 on military press and i work out with well in the 400s for squat. Someone who does your suggested exercises are not necessarily better than my recommended exercises as far as football is concerned.

I posted the routine to show that the weight room is just as important than the overall techniques of the game.

I never said power cleans were better than squats, I didn't even bring up power cleans, you did.

But back b4 my thyroid condition I was using 235lbs for 3-5 reps on seated military press in the front & about 210-215lbs on standing military press in the front for 3-5 but I do both now.

Here are some other routines:

Example: Body Building exercises sequence from large to small muscle groups.

Before Sequencing After Sequencing

Bench Press Half Squat
Barbell Curl Deadlift
Reverse Curl Leg Extension
Half Squat Leg Curl
Deadlift Bench Press
Shrug Shrug
Leg Extension Barbell Curl
Leg Curl Reverse Curl

Example: Weightlifting exercises sequence from fast to slow.

Before Sequencing After Sequencing

Clean and Jerk Drop Snatch
Power Clean Snatch
Snatch High Pull Snatch Pull
Snatch Push Press
Push Press Power Clean
Drop Snatch Clean & Jerk
Full Squat Full Squat

Posted by: tucker01

Let's see Johnnny played Canadian High School football

prolly the equivilant of playing with your budies in a park in the States. And Canadian College Football

Equivlant of a US High School Team.

So your 7 Years of experience in football really equate to 7 months.

(CLICK HERE here to view the original thread with full colors/images)

N E 1 hear of the 15yr old football player dying of a helmet to helmet hit?

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