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Help with Cutting (Female)
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Posted by: wildriver7
Hello, I've been cutting and getting closer to my goal of being lean and lightly ripped. I'm slowing down though and am considering increasing my refeeds from once a week to twice a week (on the 3rd and 7th day of each week).
My current refeeds are about 4 hours long, calories are maintenance + 50%, once a week.
Considering two 4 hour refeeds (spaced 3-4 days apart), calories at maintenance + 25%.
Looking for advice on whether this would be a good idea or not.
Here are my stats:
Height: 5' 1"
Weight: 105
BF: 18% (3-point caliper measurement)
Goal BF: 14%
Diet : CKD
Routine: Lift 2-3x a week (Circuit Training) 30 mins ea
Cardio/Walk/Hike 3x a week 60 mins ea
Calories: My current daily cals are U2.0 style about 50% of maintenance. Then my refeed is maintenance + 50% and I end up being in a weekly deficit of about 5000 cals (enough for 1.5 lb fat loss per week, theoretically). It has worked great thus far, over two months have consistently lost with no plateau.
At this body fat level now my body is catching on I think and won't let me go lower. Any recomendations? Twice weekly refeeds?
Thanks everyone, sorry for the length.
River
Posted by: Jodi
Hi River 
What are you eating on your refeeds?
Posted by: wildriver7
Sorry Jodi, I meant to include that. My refeeds are very consistent:
Fat: <60 grams
Carbs: 450-500 grams
Protein: 90-100 grams
It adds up to about 2900-3000 calories for the day. Most of the carbs of course are during the refeed. I eat fat free high-GI carbs primarly. The stuff I've been missing like FF cookies, FF icecream, LF pizza, etc. I don't do much low-GI. Too busy satisfying the cravings.. lol
I was considering reducing this refeed slightly (to about 2500 cals and parameters reduced accordingly) twice a week?
Thanks, looking forward to your thoughts,
River
Posted by: Jodi
Reduce it for sure. I would reduce it to 2200-2500 cals per refeed.
Make sure you are keeping sugar low and I would lower fat much more than that. Try to stay VERY VERY low on the fat. Protein looks good though. 
Check out the article at the top of the forum on Refeeds & Leptin
Posted by: wildriver7
Thanks Lori. When you say "keep sugar low" do you mean go lo-GI on the carbs?
My carbs more high-starchy than directly sugar. But starch gets converted to sugar in the body, so I wasn't sure if you mean reduce sugars overall or just direct sugar (like candy, ice cream, etc).
River
Posted by: Jodi
It's Jodi.
You got it right, I meant direct sugar, aka sucrose.
Posted by: wildriver7
Sorry about the name thing! I knew it was Jodi (have read many of your posts) but my brain and fingers must have been out of sync.
I'm working in Fitday on the fat issue. I've read all the article stickys above and still unsure what to set the fat at for the refeeds. I know it has to be low low low but what is "very very low" for me? Would it be a percentage, etc? I thought keeping it below 60 grams was low, but ready and willing to go lower as you suggest.
By tweaking I think I can get it down to about 35-40 grams. I could go lower but I'm taking 4 grams of CLA a day which I count in.
Could you give me a recommendation given my size and goals for actual percentages or grams to aim for on my refeeds?
Thanks,
River
Posted by: Jodi
When I refeed I stay under 30G of fat. I make sure everything I eat is really really low in fat such as cereals, bagels pancakes without the oil and butter etc. How much fat does the CLA that you are taking equal?
Posted by: wildriver7
The CLA is Tonalin, which is 1 gm of fat per 1gm capsule. So about 4 grams in CLA every day.
River
Posted by: Jodi
Oh, that's only 4G of fat. So where is all the other fat coming from?
Posted by: wildriver7
Well, lets see, there are trace fats in some of the things I eat, for example 5 gms in the LF pizza, but the most comes from the LF Rice Crisps (25 gms) that I like to carb up with. Is 35 grams of fat too much for a carb up day? If so I can try to find something else carby/starchy to replace those.
Let me know, and thanks for all your help thus far.
River
Posted by: Jodi
If you can stick to 35G of Fat then that is good. If progress slows though you have something else to tweak 
Posted by: wildriver7
Okay, I'll try that then. Twice weekly carb ups on the 3rd and 7th day of the week, about 2200-2400 cals each, keeping fats to 35 or below.
The rest of the days continue at standard CKD parameters for F/C/P ratios, with the added UD2.0 factor of keep cals at maintenance -50% (which is 1000 cals a day for me).
That gets me to about 9800 cals per week max which is a 4200 cal deficit per week - slow but steady. I estimate I have about 5 pounds of fat to get rid of. So at the end of 6 weeks who knows! I'll know after 2 weeks if this plan works.
Side question Jodi - what do you use or recommend for sups? Currently on my carb ups I take hefty doses of R-ALA. Seems to keep me from bloating up. For regular sups I'm taking ALCAR, CLA, 7-keto, Guggul . I recently started on T-Rex which I like quite a bit.
River
Posted by: Jodi
Looks good 
I've read some things about T-Rex but none of it good so far. If that doesn't work for you I'd stick with the standard EC or ECY. The R-ALA is excellent for your refeeds. The rest of your supps look decent. Sesathin is something I'd recommend too.
I assume you are taking multi vits and minerals, extra calcium, magnesium, Vit E and Vit D. Are you getting any EFA's like Fish oil?
Posted by: wildriver7
Yes, I'm taking a multi-vitamin/mineral drink in the mornings that has everything covered in that arena. I'm afraid I'm low in the EFA right now. I was doing a tablespoon of flax daily but changed what I eat and it didn't fit in. The only oils I have right now is about a tablespoon of CLA.
On the Thermorexin, I've just started this stuff (about 4 days ago) so if there is something you think I should know please tell me. It gives me quite a bit of energy and keeps me from getting hungry (I still eat what I need to, but I don't have that famished/craving feeling)
River
Posted by: Jodi
Please please please incorporate come Fish oil capsules in your plan. That is very important and seeing you are doing CKD style there are no excuses 
I read something on the TRex that it cause some pain in women's breasts. 
I haven't used it so I can't say for sure but as soon as they came off of it the pain went away.
Posted by: wildriver7
Alrighty, I'll add some Fish Oil and keep an eye on the pain thing. I'll keep you posted. I've enjoyed our chat today.
Thanks,
River
Posted by: Jodi
Anytime and BTW - Welcome to IM
Posted by: ulter
Jodi, I find it interesting that you're making assertions that Trex causes women's breasts to be painful.
Would you please explain where you got this information from? You say "they" said that, because when "they" came off it went right away. Who are "they"?
I'll tell you why I ask. I am the president of the company that distributes Thermorexin. We've sold thousand of bottles to women all over the world. If someone has a problem with Thermorexin we're the first to hear about it. In two years of having this product on the shelves on 5 continents yours is the first report of anything like this. I am sure you wouldn't post something like this on the internet unless it was substantiated so I am very interested in learning where this report originated.
Posted by: Jodi
I didn't make the assertions. Women from another board that I frequent are the ones that used it, no I.
Posted by: ulter
Not to argue but, "I read something on the TRex that it cause some pain in women's breasts." IS an assertion.
I am asking you where this originated. What board? What women? I would like to contact them and check to see where they purchased the Thermorexin and when and talk to them about their experience.
Thanks
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Help with Cutting (Female)
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