Squats: Full vs Parallel [Forum Archive]

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Squats: Full vs Parallel

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Posted by: furious

I'm 6'1 180 lbs, all leg it seems. I can parallel squat 315x4. Full squats make my knees hurt, but have read of the added benefits (better leg development, strength development through a larger range of motion) and have started to use full squats as a warmup for paras.
Which squat do you prefer, and why?
Doesn't the leg press machine perform exactly the same function with less strain on the lower back?

Posted by: seyone

I don't do ass to the ground squats because they my my knees hurt too. sounds like good enough reason not to do them.

Posted by: Tank316

the ole saying goes if it hurts dont do it. my old training partner was tall as well,keep it light,try leg presses to,always keep good form.put some leg ext,leg curls into your work out.in time you might grow out of the pain.

Posted by: Prince

We have had this debate here before, the verdict was there is no scientific evidence that proves going beyond parallel hurts your knees.

However, if it is causing you pain, then do not do them.

Posted by: Rob_NC

I read somewhere, it may have been on Fred Hatfield's site, that there is no added benefit to going past parallel. I routinely go full on front squats because my back is straighter and it's easier to go full, but I don't go heavy either. I use front squats for skin splitting burnout sets after I do back squats.

Posted by: Rick C

I used to hit parrallel and make legs didn't grow at all. Now I go ass to the ground and I'm showing tremendous gains. Pain is just the feeling of weakness leaving your body. Nobody said the weight lifting wouldn't hurt.

Posted by: w8lifter2

Dude,

Don't take this the wrong way, but I don't want to hear it. I am 6'7" and I squat every Friday...performing strict, full range of motion squats. Was it always something I enjoyed....did I mention I was 6'7".... Did it hurt my knees, lower back and every other part of my body...yes, at first but after a few warm-up sets I'm ready to go for it...

Bottom line, stop whinning about your height and your knees stick to the squats, do them properly, executing a full range of motion squat and before you know it, you will look forward to leg day ... I DO. If your knees still bother you, use wraps..that's what they are made for. Also, make sure you mix up your workouts. One week go heavy squats, followed by extensions and curls. The next do light squats, then leg press and curls. DON'T USE A SMITH MACHINE TO DO SQUATS....that's for sissy's or front squats..

Posted by: Rob_NC

w8lifter2, Are you saying front squats are for sissy's? If you don't do them, you missing a great movement that targets areas of the quad the back squat doesn't. I've seen some BIG pros front squatting over 400lbs.!!! They don't seem to think it's for sissy's.

Posted by: Prince

You should not use a Smith for squating, but not because it makes you a sissy, because it is too restrictive, and I think it can cause more harm than good.

I still say that if squating is causing you knee pain, do not do them.

Posted by: BigAL

Quote:

Originally posted by furious
I'm 6'1 180 lbs, all leg it seems. I can parallel squat 315x4. Full squats make my knees hurt, but have read of the added benefits (better leg development, strength development through a larger range of motion) and have started to use full squats as a warmup for paras.
Which squat do you prefer, and why?
Doesn't the leg press machine perform exactly the same function with less strain on the lower back?

The prefered execise in place of the squat for the legs is the tensioned lower knee extension.

The knee joint is unfortunately a poor genetic design for compression

, but good for range of motion.

Posted by: Gabriel

When Squating it's good to go down into almost your butt hits your calves.Going that far down will also work your Hamstrings more and also get the full pump when Squatting. If your knees hurt you when you go below parlalel, then get some Power Lifting Knee Wraps. You don't want to have to depend on them every set. So,just use them on your last couple of sets.

Posted by: ballast

my squat preferences of choice are front and overhead squats.I do full range of motion for both, as I'm able to keep a more upright posture.It just feels more natural to go really low on these, and my legs and hips are responding well to these exercises.no knee pain at all.

Posted by: w8lifter2

Quote:

Originally posted by Rob_NC
w8lifter2, Are you saying front squats are for sissy's? If you don't do them, you missing a great movement that targets areas of the quad the back squat doesn't. I've seen some BIG pros front squatting over 400lbs.!!! They don't seem to think it's for sissy's.

Isn't that the proper name for them? Please correct me if I'm wrong.

I'm in agreement with you, they are a great exercise for the quads, I simply stated that using the smith machine will allow you to use heavier weight, without tearing up your front delts.

Posted by: gopro

Doing squats past parallel will engage the hamstrings, hips and glutes more so than the parallel version. Which is better? It depends on why you are doing them. If you are squatting for explosiveness and strength for sport, I would recommend full squats, IF you can do them properly without injury...some people can't...they just aren't made for full squats. For quad development for bodybuilding, I recommend parallel squats.

I want to add that I DO NOT think squats are necessary for full leg development. They work great for some, but not for others. My best development has come from deep hack squats and leg presses. I still squat occassionally to mix things up, but not too often.

Posted by: arbntmare

hmm i don't think smith machine is for sissy's.. the reason i use it is i don't wanna break my back.. sorry guys but i think the smith machine keeps my back flat and if it doesn't hold enough weight i don't think i have reached the point where i need to put 400lbs on them ... till then i am sticking with it.. even tho they are little bit restrictive..

and from doing them i am still sore so its not that i don't get sore from working out

on another note.. what is front squats??

Posted by: Tank316

front squats are where the bar is placed across the top of your chest and the front part of your deltoids while placing your hands on top of bar to hold it in place. these should be done with proper form,and lighter weight to prevent serious injury.

Posted by: Tank316

Quote:

Originally posted by w8lifter2
Dude,

Don't take this the wrong way, but I don't want to hear it. I am 6'7" and I squat every Friday...performing strict, full range of motion squats. Was it always something I enjoyed....did I mention I was 6'7".... Did it hurt my knees, lower back and every other part of my body...yes, at first but after a few warm-up sets I'm ready to go for it...

Bottom line, stop whinning about your height and your knees stick to the squats, do them properly, executing a full range of motion squat and before you know it, you will look forward to leg day ... I DO. If your knees still bother you, use wraps..that's what they are made for. Also, make sure you mix up your workouts. One week go heavy squats, followed by extensions and curls. The next do light squats, then leg press and curls. DON'T USE A SMITH MACHINE TO DO SQUATS....that's for sissy's or front squats..

CHILL OUT A LITTLE BIT DUDE,

Posted by: gopro

Many of the worlds top bodybuilders do squats on a smith machine...Dorian did them this way, and he was one of the most intense BBs ever. Smith squats are excellent when done with feet foward and back straight...great isolation of the quads without too much ham and gluteal involvement. This is great for bodybuilders, however, if you are squatting for sports performance, I do recommend free bar squats.

Posted by: rmau803

I don't think Dorian Yates is a great example. Sure, he was friggin' enormous, but he also, if I remember correctly, was famous for one set, very high intensity training, and also famous, I believe, for tearing muscles and tendons due to his training. I think. I agree with gopro, anyone with any athletic intentions outside bb should use free squats. I also believe that smith machine squats are fine, for beginning squatters, to work on form and get the feel for the movement. I started out on smith before I could even squat 135 and moved to free squats after I got comfortable.

Posted by: Prince

Quote:

Originally posted by gopro
Many of the worlds top bodybuilders do squats on a smith machine...Dorian did them this way, and he was one of the most intense BBs ever. Smith squats are excellent when done with feet foward and back straight...great isolation of the quads without too much ham and gluteal involvement. This is great for bodybuilders, however, if you are squatting for sports performance, I do recommend free bar squats.

I think doing squats on a Smith is too restrictive.

However, I do like doing one legged lunges on the Smith.

Posted by: Scotty the Body

Grrrr, everyone always picking on my smith machine

I agree that it souldn't be the only thing used but i've found that its helped me to increase lifts like free Squats, and bench press work because you don't have to worry as much about proper form and therefore can do alot more weight.

I like to do both, free and smith and no, I'm not a begginner.

Posted by: gopro

I used Dorian as an example because most pros don't do smith squats and he did...yes he takes roids, and yes he tore muscles, but he heavily relied on and believed in smith squats.

Personally, I think the smith machine is a great piece of equipment, and I use it almost every workout for one thing or another. As for squats...I do not perform regular form on these on the smith...I use it specifically for the FEET FOWARD VERSION!

Posted by: arbntmare

feet forward version???

Posted by: Tank316

Quote:

Originally posted by arbntmare
feet forward version???

please dont take this the wrong way,maybe you should go by a book on lifting, this will help with those ??????????.

Posted by: gopro

Quote:

Originally posted by Tank316

please dont take this the wrong way,maybe you should go by a book on lifting, this will help with those ??????????.

That may be of great help...having exercises described to you is not as good as seeing them in pics or on video!

Posted by: arbntmare

hehe.. i think u guys miss understood me.. its the only way i do squats on the smith machine is with my feet in front.. and my back flat...

Posted by: w8lifter2

Quote:

Originally posted by Tank316

CHILL OUT A LITTLE BIT DUDE,

Thanks Man...I needed that

I've worked so hard at my height I just cannot stand anyone whining about training and being tall.

Aren't front squats, as you described above, also referred to as sissy squats?

Posted by: gopro

Quote:

Originally posted by w8lifter2

Thanks Man...I needed that

I've worked so hard at my height I just cannot stand anyone whining about training and being tall.

Aren't front squats, as you described above, also referred to as sissy squats?

Sissy squats are a different exercise than front squats. Sissies are performed while holding onto an object for stability and leaning back while squatting down, rising up on your toes, and stretching your quads over your knees. This puts an enormous stretch on your quads and is a very difficult and painful exercise.

Posted by: Rob_NC

Has anyone used Fred Hatfield's Safety Squat Bar? I had the chance to use one on Friday and that thing will KILL YOU! My legs ache so bad today that I can hardly walk. Too bad it costs so darn much.

Posted by: w8lifter2

Quote:

Originally posted by gopro

Sissy squats are a different exercise than front squats. Sissies are performed while holding onto an object for stability and leaning back while squatting down, rising up on your toes, and stretching your quads over your knees. This puts an enormous stretch on your quads and is a very difficult and painful exercise.

Thanks for the memory refresh, brotha, now I remember what they are....

Posted by: gopro

Quote:

Originally posted by w8lifter2

Thanks for the memory refresh, brotha, now I remember what they are....

No prob my friend!

* And Rob NC...yes, Hatfields squat bar is good stuff!

Posted by: ZECH

I think the main thing here is to remember to use the strictest form possible. This is where growth and size comes from. It doesn't matter how much you can squat, if you don't do it right you won't get the full benefit. That goes with all bodyparts. Forget trying to lift more than anyone else. Pick a weight that you can do 6-10 reps with good form. I promise you you see better results!

Posted by: ZECH

I agree that machines are also good to use some of the time. I think the barbell is best for overall size. But lots of huge guys use machines to cut and define!

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Squats: Full vs Parallel

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