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deadlifts vs squats

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Posted by: rangers97

if you had to choose either deadlifts or squats to put into your routine, which would you choose and why....and don't say "I would do them both!" cause thats not the question

they appear to overlap certain muscles, obviously deads hit the lower back more and the squats hit the legs more. I just dont have the room in my current routine for both, so I am trying to decide which to use. One idea I had was to put deadlifts on my leg day, and do deads, leg presses, and calfs on that day, so I can concentrate on other back exercises on my back day.


Posted by: Flex

they're only the 2 most important exercises in BB.

Hmmmm
i have an idea do both


Posted by: KarlW

If I could do rows for back then I'd choose Squats.


Posted by: P-funk

If you don't have time to do both the cycle them. 4-5 weeks of squats then switch to deadlifts.


Posted by: Flex

Quote:
Originally Posted by P-funk
If you don't have time to do both the cycle them.
that's where i'm having the hard time.

why wouldn't you have time?

Deads on back day, squats on leg day


Posted by: GIZmo_Timme

haha you are funny Flex


Posted by: sabre81

if i had to pick i would pick deadlifts. but since i dont have to pick one, i choose both on their respective days.


Posted by: madden player

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flex
they're only the 2 most important exercises in BB.

Hmmmm
i have an idea do both
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flex
Deads on back day, squats on leg day
...Professor Flex is in the house.

Really though, why not do both; I always have.


Posted by: rangers97

the question is if you had to pick one, which one do you think is better, and the answer to that should not be, "well why not do both" which is exactly what I figured everyone would write, which doesn't really help me in finding the answer I am looking for. So, no offense, but don't reply if you're going to say, do both......


Posted by: P-funk

Quote:
Originally Posted by rangers97
the question is if you had to pick one, which one do you think is better, and the answer to that should not be, "well why not do both" which is exactly what I figured everyone would write, which doesn't really help me in finding the answer I am looking for. So, no offense, but don't reply if you're going to say, do both......

there is no better or worse in this case. It is a foolish question. they are two different exercises which, although the have some overlaping muscles, work different aspects of the body. It is like saying what is better a push up or a bench press. Both are great.....both are pushes in the trasverse plane. Both recruit your anterior delts, pectoralis major and triceps. Both use the lats (to internally rotate) and biceps (to stabalize). Is one better than the other....no neccessarily. they both have their place. train your deadlift and your squat on leg day since primarily (I look at them at least) they are hip extension. Choose one to focus on for a few weeks and then switch to the other. Or train both at different intensities for a few weeks (ie.....squat for strength at a high intensity and deadlift for power/explosiveness at a lopw intensity (65-70% of 1RM) and then after 4 or 5 weeks swap the exercises). Your body will thank you for the change of pace.


Posted by: musclepump

Because of the overlaping muscles, I do both on leg day. I separate leg day from back day by a few so I'm good to go.


Posted by: SugarDaddy

Being able to choose only one, I would pick squats. It is definitely more of a core strenth workout, and has more muscle groups involved than the deads. Do the squats properly! Don't let your ego get in the way! Lighten the weight and get the full motion rather than going heavy and cheating yourself. I sometimes load up and do partials to overload the muscle, but the regular part of the exercise is in full.

I don't quite understand how you are comparing one to the other, though. The squat will target your quads and glutes, with all kinds of stabilizers coming into play. The deadlift targets your lower back and hamstrings. I don't really see how you consider to put only one or the other in. Anyhow, that's not my decision.

If you decide not to do deadlifts, do something a little different...won't have the same results, but at least will work your back. I assume you do sets of situps for your abs. In between ab sets, do 'supermans'. Like I said, it won't make your lower back huge or anything, but it'll at least strengthen it. Remember, your body is a set of balances. If you work your chest too much without working your upper back, you get hunched shoulders. If you work your abs without working your back, things get unbalanced there too.


Posted by: TCD

If i had to drop one it'd be deadlifts, because i heavily rate squats for quad development, and i can make up for the loss of deadlifts with other exercises on back day.

However, i currently do squats on leg day on a Tuesday and rack pulls on back day on a Thursday.


Posted by: Dale Mabry

Rack deads are sweet.

I would choose squat also, but if it were only due to time I would cycle them as P-fizzle mentioned.


Posted by: Duncans Donuts

Quote:
Being able to choose only one, I would pick squats. It is definitely more of a core strenth workout, and has more muscle groups involved than the deads.
I don't know about that.

They are the two most important exercises in any good fitness program imo (athletics especially). Deadlifts are probably the most taxing exercise I do, with Squats a close second.

The question itself is ridiculous; how could you only have time for one? The only explanation is laziness...


Posted by: Archangel

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duncans Donuts
I don't know about that.

They are the two most important exercises in any good fitness program imo (athletics especially). Deadlifts are probably the most taxing exercise I do, with Squats a close second.

The question itself is ridiculous; how could you only have time for one? The only explanation is laziness...
I would have to agree!!! Why do you need to pick just one. They BOTH are just as important as the other!!! PLEASE, for your sake, fit them both into your routine!!!


Posted by: Flex

Quote:
Originally Posted by Archangel
I would have to agree!!! Why do you need to pick just one. They BOTH are just as important as the other!!! PLEASE, for your sake, fit them both into your routine!!!
Please only respond if you choose ONE


Posted by: Flex

Quote:
Originally Posted by GIZmo_Timme
haha you are funny Flex
What, the way i talk? Funny how? I mean, funny like I'm a clown? I amuse you? I make you laugh? I'm here to fuckin' amuse you? How da' fuck am I funny? What da' FUCK is so funny about me? Tell me, tell me what's funny."


Posted by: LAM

I would do squats hands down....


Posted by: Du

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flex
What, the way i talk? Funny how? I mean, funny like I'm a clown? I amuse you? I make you laugh? I'm here to fuckin' amuse you? How da' fuck am I funny? What da' FUCK is so funny about me? Tell me, tell me what's funny."


Da Pesci


Posted by: wtfzor

you'd be crazy if you don't do squat.

I do both, but if I MUST choose one, It would be squat.
I can spend all day listing the advantages of squat.


Posted by: BoneCrusher

I am 44 and need to be very carefull about back injuries. Dead's keep me well while still getting legs done. JMHO.


Posted by: SquatBenchDead

You can easily squat and deadlift on the same day. The first half of my training cycle I squat and deadlift in the same workout twice a week(And I train for strength).


Posted by: CowPimp

Although I recommend doing both, I would choose squats if I had to pick just one. The main reason being that you have to stabilize the weight.


Posted by: Flex

if i absolutely HAD to choose one with a gun to my head , i would say deadlift.

Squats obviously work your quads, hams, glutes, and to some extent your lower back. But you can get nearly the same results from hack squats, leg presses etc.

On the other hand, deads give you a thickness in your back like no other exercise can, as well as also improving your traps and forearms greatly, and to some little extent your legs.

just my .02

FLEX


Posted by: Flex

^but then again, i STILL don't see the problem with not being able to do both.

So do both.


Posted by: Luke9583

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flex
that's where i'm having the hard time.

why wouldn't you have time?

Deads on back day, squats on leg day
That's what my puny ass does


Posted by: lnvanry

I have never done a deadlift in my entire life. I was never taught how to, and since I know you can easliy injure yourself w/ out proper instruction, I aviod them. I don't want start to blindly pick a barbell off the ground. Sometimes I wish the guys in my gym would get past the macho thing and pass some knowledge down to us younger guys.


Posted by: Gazhole

i do both, but i lean slightly towards the squat. deadlifts are also really good though, just keeping form can sometimes be tricky, i get a better feeling from squats.


Posted by: Archangel

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flex
^but then again, i STILL don't see the problem with not being able to do both.

So do both.
Hey, only pick one!!!


Posted by: chris mason

Squats.


The reason is that squats train the largest muscles in the body with greater intensity than deadlifts (upper legs and glutes).

The above assumes you are able to train your upper body.


Posted by: JerseyDevil

Like everyone else said ... do both. I do think a strong deadlift is a superior indicator of overall strength over the squat, so in the poll I voted deadlift.


Posted by: Du

Squats my friend, squats.


Posted by: CowPimp

Quote:
Originally Posted by chris mason
The reason is that squats train the largest muscles in the body with greater intensity than deadlifts (upper legs and glutes).
I'm not disagreeing necessarily, but it seems to me like this would largely be a function of personal biomechanics. Where did you get your information, if you remember?


Posted by: CowPimp

Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyDevil
I do think a strong deadlift is a superior indicator of overall strength over the squat, so in the poll I voted deadlift.
Why is that?

I don't mean to be a thorn in your sides here, but it seems to me like some of these comments are unfounded as to why one exercise is superior to the other, and the driving force behind the statements is merely one's personal preference.


Posted by: Duncans Donuts

Deadlifts activate more muscle and muscle groups overall than the squat. Unless I'm mistaken?


Posted by: JerseyDevil

Quote:
Originally Posted by CowPimp
Why is that?

I don't mean to be a thorn in your sides here, but it seems to me like some of these comments are unfounded as to why one exercise is superior to the other, and the driving force behind the statements is merely one's personal preference.
Simply because the deadlifts involves 13 muscle groups, while the squat 9. Although they both involve many of the same muscle groups, most people can deadlift more then they squat, correct? That has always been the basis of why one should focus on compound movements for strength. More muscles involved, and the most amount of weight handled. There is a reason why in powerlifting there is a saying that contests are won or lost in the deadlift.

That said, I don't claim to be an expert in kinesiology... and yes some of my statement was based on my own experience and beliefs, and I indicated that by saying "I do think". So what? I would rather do what works for me rather then listen to the self proclaimed internet guru's.

One thing I will say, is that I've been doing squats for a long, long time. Never really focused on big weight, but I never got past about 265 with a deep squat. I tried deadlifting when I first started working out, and the very first wo I strained my lower back by using too much weight. That scared me away from deads until earlier this year when I started a steady diet of rack pulls, SLDL's, and conventional deads. Guess what? My squat has gone up over 100 lbs since I started deadlifting. I'll never know if I reverse that story (doing only deads, then introducing squats) if my deads would have gone up as dramatically, but I seriously doubt it would have worked the same way. Anecdotal evidence to be sure, but I'm now a believer in the deadlift.


Posted by: X-Cop

I guess I would say I like deadlifts better than squats, but I do both. I've seen the most gains with deadlifts. This time last year I could deadlift about 200lbs. Last Monday I did 425, which I'm sure is still way under what most people here can do.


Posted by: 19-chief

you need a third choice: BOTH.
that's what i would choose... deadlift start a back work out right! 3 days later, squats.


Posted by: CowPimp

Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyDevil
Simply because the deadlifts involves 13 muscle groups, while the squat 9. Although they both involve many of the same muscle groups, most people can deadlift more then they squat, correct? That has always been the basis of why one should focus on compound movements for strength. More muscles involved, and the most amount of weight handled. There is a reason why in powerlifting there is a saying that contests are won or lost in the deadlift.

That said, I don't claim to be an expert in kinesiology... and yes some of my statement was based on my own experience and beliefs, and I indicated that by saying "I do think". So what? I would rather do what works for me rather then listen to the self proclaimed internet guru's.

One thing I will say, is that I've been doing squats for a long, long time. Never really focused on big weight, but I never got past about 265 with a deep squat. I tried deadlifting when I first started working out, and the very first wo I strained my lower back by using too much weight. That scared me away from deads until earlier this year when I started a steady diet of rack pulls, SLDL's, and conventional deads. Guess what? My squat has gone up over 100 lbs since I started deadlifting. I'll never know if I reverse that story (doing only deads, then introducing squats) if my deads would have gone up as dramatically, but I seriously doubt it would have worked the same way. Anecdotal evidence to be sure, but I'm now a believer in the deadlift.
Actually, top powerlifters pretty much all squat more than they deadlift. Although, I believe that has to do with biomechanics; your body makes for a better lever when the bar rests on your shoulders. Either way, I didn't realize that many more muscle groups were involved with the deadlift. Interesting stuff.


Posted by: SquatBenchDead

They squat more than they deadlift because of all the equipment they wear! The equipment just doesn't help as much in the deadlift. I have nothing against equipment(squat suits, deadlift suits, briefs, knee wraps, bench shirts, erector shirts, etc......), that's just the facts. 99% of the lifts out there who train both the squat and deadlift equally ( barring any physical limitations ) will deadlift more than they squat.

I used to squat more than I deadlifted when I used to compete. Now the only piece of lifting equipment I use is a belt. What do you know?.....Now I deadlift more than I squat.


Posted by: Evil ANT

I always do squats but sometimes it can be taxing for me to find time to do deadlifts. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love deadlifts, but they kick the crap out of me and completely exhaust me. Therefore, if I did deadlifts on chest and back day I'd be too spent to do any other back exercises. Also, if I do deadlifts after my chest workout I can't go as heavy because it strains my chest. If I do them before my chest workout I can't get a good chest workout in because I'm too damn tired. I can definitely see how it can be a pain to find a place in your routine to do deadlifts. What I do, since deadlifts kick the crap out of me so bad, is I devote one day a week to training deadlift and a few other light exercises. This seems to work well for me.


Posted by: CowPimp

Quote:
Originally Posted by SquatBenchDead
They squat more than they deadlift because of all the equipment they wear! The equipment just doesn't help as much in the deadlift. I have nothing against equipment(squat suits, deadlift suits, briefs, knee wraps, bench shirts, erector shirts, etc......), that's just the facts. 99% of the lifts out there who train both the squat and deadlift equally ( barring any physical limitations ) will deadlift more than they squat.

I used to squat more than I deadlifted when I used to compete. Now the only piece of lifting equipment I use is a belt. What do you know?.....Now I deadlift more than I squat.
Interesting stuff. I have never worn any sort of lifting aid, so I was not aware at the difference these items make. I'm all about raw lifting.


Posted by: Evil ANT

Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Cop
Last Monday I did 425, which I'm sure is still way under what most people here can do.
Don't sell yourself short! 425 is a great deadlift and is more than I can do for sure. I max out at a mere 410. Next month I plan on really stepping up my deadlift training, though. I know I can get to 500 with enough hard work.


Posted by: P-funk

Quote:
Originally Posted by CowPimp
Interesting stuff. I have never worn any sort of lifting aid, so I was not aware at the difference these items make. I'm all about raw lifting.

it is all about going raw!!


Posted by: CowPimp

Quote:
Originally Posted by P-funk
it is all about going raw!!
This doesn't just apply to lifting either...


Posted by: P-funk

Quote:
Originally Posted by CowPimp
This doesn't just apply to lifting either...


yup....

eggs and women too!!


Posted by: CowPimp

Quote:
Originally Posted by P-funk
yup....

eggs and women too!!
I didn't even think of eggs. You're more creative than I am. I'm just a dirtbag.


Posted by: chris mason

Quote:
Originally Posted by CowPimp
I'm not disagreeing necessarily, but it seems to me like this would largely be a function of personal biomechanics. Where did you get your information, if you remember?
Nope.

First, squats will work the legs and hips through a much greater ROM assuming you do them to parallel or lower.

Next, the legs tend to be most heavily recruited in deadlifts only in the beginning of the movement. After that it the lower back becomes much more involved and you are "levering" the weight up with your spinal erectors. Many deadlifters will actually have straightened (or mostly straightened) their legs well before they have completed the movement. The same cannot be said of the squat.

The legs and hips are the prime movers in the squat while the lower back is used to keep the torso in position and possibly to improve one's leverage (when one ends up performing a bit of a good morning when the ass rises too quickly). In the deadlift the lower back is a prime mover for a good portion of the movement.

In summary, the legs and hips are stressed to a much greater degree in the squat than the deadlift.


Posted by: CowPimp

Quote:
Originally Posted by chris mason
Nope.

First, squats will work the legs and hips through a much greater ROM assuming you do them to parallel or lower.

Next, the legs tend to be most heavily recruited in deadlifts only in the beginning of the movement. After that it the lower back becomes much more involved and you are "levering" the weight up with your spinal erectors. Many deadlifters will actually have straightened (or mostly straightened) their legs well before they have completed the movement. The same cannot be said of the squat.

The legs and hips are the prime movers in the squat while the lower back is used to keep the torso in position and possibly to improve one's leverage (when one ends up performing a bit of a good morning when the ass rises too quickly). In the deadlift the lower back is a prime mover for a good portion of the movement.

In summary, the legs and hips are stressed to a much greater degree in the squat than the deadlift.
How about some platform deadlifts? That would require you to go to parallel or below, and the ROM for your hips and upper legs would certainly be increased. I know that wasn't he question asked, but it is just some food for thought.


Posted by: chris mason

Leverage.

Yes, a platform deadlift will take the legs through a greater ROM than a traditional deadlift but the load is still being held (by the hands mind you) in front of the body. Due to the leverage factor this creates you cannot push with the same degree of force with the legs as you can when resting a load on your back.

Thus, reduced intensity for the muscles of the legs and hips.


Posted by: CowPimp

Quote:
Originally Posted by chris mason
Leverage.

Yes, a platform deadlift will take the legs through a greater ROM than a traditional deadlift but the load is still being held (by the hands mind you) in front of the body. Due to the leverage factor this creates you cannot push with the same degree of force with the legs as you can when resting a load on your back.

Thus, reduced intensity for the muscles of the legs and hips.
Fair enough. I guess that's why a lot of people do deadlifts on back day and squats on leg day. Either way, both exercises are awesome and deserve some of everyone's lifting time.


Posted by: LAM

Quote:
Originally Posted by CowPimp
I guess that's why a lot of people do deadlifts on back day and squats on leg day.
IMO...that is the only logical method. DL's are far from a quad dominant exercise..


Posted by: TCD

Like i said earlier, rack pulls for back days.


Posted by: CowPimp

Quote:
Originally Posted by LAM
IMO...that is the only logical method. DL's are far from a quad dominant exercise..
The hamstrings and gluts are recruited plenty though...


Posted by: Mudge

Quote:
Originally Posted by SugarDaddy
I don't quite understand how you are comparing one to the other, though. The squat will target your quads and glutes, with all kinds of stabilizers coming into play. The deadlift targets your lower back and hamstrings. I don't really see how you consider to put only one or the other in. Anyhow, that's not my decision.
The only difference is where the weight is, on your back or in front of you, as well as emphasis - other than that the movements mirror each other. A deadlift also hits the legs, to avoid this, do them in a power rack with the pins around knee height. Its virtually the same movement.

If you are a powerlifter, you may not even do these until the day of the meet. If you are a bodybuilder, do what you feel works best for you. Lots of people do both, but never in the same week. It all depends what you feel is best for you.

Of the two, if I could really only do one I would go with deadlifts.


Posted by: Leatherface

Try and find a Trap-Bar and do Trap-Bar deadlifts. That will recruit more quads and give you many benefits of the deadlift.

If memory serves I think Stuart McRobert is a big fan of trap-bar deads.


Posted by: WilliamB

Quote:
Originally Posted by lnvanry
I have never done a deadlift in my entire life. I was never taught how to, and since I know you can easliy injure yourself w/ out proper instruction, I aviod them. I don't want start to blindly pick a barbell off the ground. Sometimes I wish the guys in my gym would get past the macho thing and pass some knowledge down to us younger guys.
Just dont try to be rediculous with the weight and the form pretty much follows. People have talked up how easy it is to hurt your self doing deadlifts far more than they should have. Everyone who hasnt tried them I am sure pictures someone bending over, grabbing the bar, and giving a quick tug and instant back problems.


Posted by: Uzi9

Squats are better overall


Posted by: Newt

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duncans Donuts
Deadlifts activate more muscle and muscle groups overall than the squat. Unless I'm mistaken?
Even if you were wrong you could probably find some quote from a physics book to make you look right couldn't you!?! I'm just screwing with you. I thought I'd bring our other argument into this thread.


Posted by: Squaggleboggin

I'd choose deadlifts.


Posted by: P-funk

i prefer to squat.


Posted by: Dale Mabry

I would pick the squat as well, based on feel.


Posted by: ALBOB

Quote:
Originally Posted by P-funk
i prefer to squat.
There has GOT to be a short joke in there somewhere.







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