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Need help revamping my training routine


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Posted by: JuXtaposed

I've been lifting for about 6 months now, and I've decided to switch to a 3 day push/pull/legs routine. I'm having some difficulty coming up with a good training routine, so I thought I'd post here for advice. Here is what I have so far:

Push:
DB Shoulder Press
Arnold Press
Bench Press
Dips
Flys

Pull:
Bent Rows
One arm DB Rows
Chinups
Lat. Pull Down


Legs:
Back Squats
Hack Squats
Standing Calf Raises
Leg Curls

I'm looking to add 1 more exercise to my Pull and Leg days. Also, I'd like to replace the flys on my Push day with something else, and maybe get rid of Leg Curls for another exercise. I would appreciate any advice that you guys can give me.

Thanks in advance.


Posted by: mike456

for push day is there a reason you are doing the shoulder presses before benching (I always do the heavier lifts first), also were are the sets and reps, rest interval, goals??
on leg day add in a hip/ham dominant, such as RDLs.
add in reverse flys on pull day.
Latsly, drop the arnold press for incline press.


Posted by: JuXtaposed

Quote:
Originally Posted by mike456
for push day is there a reason you are doing the shoulder presses before benching (I always do the heavier lifts first), also were are the sets and reps, rest interval, goals??
on leg day add in a hip/ham dominant, such as RDLs.
add in reverse flys on pull day.
Latsly, drop the arnold press for incline press.
I always liked doing benches in the middle of my set. That way, I'm loosened up enough from doing a few exercises, but still not tired from working out. If there is a particular advantage to doing heavier lifts first (aside from doing them when you're less tired), then I will start doing bench presses ahead of shoulder presses.

I'll add in reverse flys on my pull day and switch the arnold press for the incline press, but I'd rather not do deadlifts (several people I know and respect have strongly urged me not to make them a part of my training routine). Could you perhaps recommend another hip/ham dominant exercise for my leg day?

Also, all exercises are being done for 3 sets of 10 reps, but I don't track my RI. My main goal is bulking up.


Posted by: mike456

for size stay in the 60-90 sec R.I., and 6-12 reps

Deadlifts are dangerous only if you don't do them correctly (just like any other exercise), but if you don't like them try hyperextensions.


Posted by: Bakerboy

Mike, I think you mean glute ham raises


Posted by: mike456

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bakerboy
Mike, I think you mean glute ham raises
What are you talking about


Posted by: Bakerboy

Quote:
Originally Posted by mike456
What are you talking about
http://www.shapefit.com/lower-back-e...xtensions.html
They are done a bit different.


Posted by: Bakerboy

http://www.infinityfitness.com/videos/exer.htm
http://www.shapefit.com/lower-back-e...xtensions.html

here


Posted by: CowPimp

I would throw in some extra scapular stabilizer/upper back work on pull day. I like reverse flys, scarecrows, and face pulls a lot. YTWLs are also great; I frequently use them as a warmup exercise though.

I would probably throw in some type of pulling movement on leg day too. Hyperextensions with a stiff back are a good place to start, but I would try to progress to something where you can implement greater loads, such as a deadlift variation.


Posted by: mike456

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bakerboy
I know what hyper-extensions are, they also hit the hamstrings, and are a good hip/ham dominant exercise, glute-ham raises is also a good exercise.


Posted by: Bakerboy

sorry, Mike, I thought you were getting the two mixed up.


Posted by: JuXtaposed

Thanks for all the advice guys. I think my final training routine will look like this:

Push:

Bench Press
Incline Bench Press
DB Shoulder Press
Flys
Dips

Pull:
Bent Rows
One arm DB Rows
Chinups
Lat. Pull Down
Reverse Flys

Legs:
Back Squats
Hack Squats
Standing Calf Raises
Leg Curls
Hyperextensions

Thanks again for all of your help.


Posted by: CowPimp

Looks okay, but again, I would try to progress to some pulling movements where you can move higher loads over the next couple of months in place of hyperextensions.


Posted by: blueboy75

Quote:
Originally Posted by JuXtaposed
Thanks for all the advice guys. I think my final training routine will look like this:

Push:

Bench Press
Incline Bench Press
DB Shoulder Press
Flys
Dips

Pull:
Bent Rows
One arm DB Rows
Chinups
Lat. Pull Down
Reverse Flys

Legs:
Back Squats
Hack Squats
Standing Calf Raises
Leg Curls
Hyperextensions

Thanks again for all of your help.
On your pull day I think you have some duplication in doing both chinups and Lat. Pull Down. I would replace the Lat Pulldown with preferably a deadlift as cowpimp mentioned or a seated cable row.


Posted by: Adamjs

Quote:
Originally Posted by blueboy75
On your pull day I think you have some duplication in doing both chinups and Lat. Pull Down. I would replace the Lat Pulldown with preferably a deadlift as cowpimp mentioned or a seated cable row.
Possibly true. If he changes the amount of sets, to say, 2 a piece, on the chinups/lat pulldowns both should be able to be included. It all depends how many chinups he can do, and whether he is doing them as weighted or bodyweight and how many reps he is doing on the lat pulldowns. The lat pulldowns could be helping him build up his chinup reps or vice-versa. Also, varying grip could change it up.

Definately would try and throw in a deadlift somewhere.


Posted by: CowPimp

By the way, what about sets, reps, tempo, rest intervals, etc?


Posted by: mike456

IMO you should put flys after dips, and standing calf raises at the end of the leg workout, also If you ever end up wanting to deadlifts (wich I really suggest you do) just put them in place of the hyperextensions.


Posted by: Adamjs

Quote:
Originally Posted by CowPimp
By the way, what about sets, reps, tempo, rest intervals, etc?
He says he's planning on doing them all for 3 sets of 10 reps with no tracking of his rest interval - which could do with some tweaking I think.

Which is what I was trying to get across on the chinup/lat pulldown thing. If he's doing the same intensity for both lat pulldown and chinups, then he could be very well overworking the movement like what blueboy75 suggested, but if he adjust rep ranges, sets, RI, etc and one is the primary move in that plane and the second is the accessory movement in that plane then I see no issue.


Posted by: CowPimp

I think 3x10 is just fine, though I would probably not rest excessively long. Just make sure to unload and change those parameters as needed.


Posted by: JuXtaposed

Since so many people reccommended deadlifts, I think I will incorporate those into my routine sometime in the near future. As it is, I think I'll stick with hyperextensions for a few months until I've built up strength in my back. Once I get back to school in late August, I'll be able to have a friend show me proper form for deadlifting.

Also, two quick questions for CowPimp (or anyone else):

1. When you say I should avoid resting excessively long, what type of RI are you talking about? Would 60s be about right, or should it be less than that?

2. What exactly is meant by "unloading?" I've heard the term before, and I remember reading about it on this forum, but I can't remember what it is or find a link at all.

Again, thanks for all the help guys. My first day of the new program was yesterday, and I thoroughly enjoyed it.


Posted by: Adamjs

^

1. Rest intervals should be somewhere between 60-120 seconds for your goals. You would rest up to 3 minutes if you are doing heavier loads and less reps.

2. In simple terms, unloading is really just doing a light session here and there or a rest week here and there.

In more precise terms, your muscle growth follows a growth and decay curve. At the top of the curve your CNS (central nervous system) will be overloaded and you will be at an overtraining phase. Your muscle growth will reduce unless you rest or reduce the stress on your CNS by using lighter weights/less intense sessions.

When you periodise your workouts you either need a full week of rest every so often or a week of lighter loads or something along those lines. You cannot work out at your heaviest all the time without going lighter or having total rest so your CNS can recover.

Try reading up on periodisation which, I think, is in the stickies. It all depends how seriously you want to workout your routine.


Posted by: CowPimp

Quote:
Originally Posted by JuXtaposed
1. When you say I should avoid resting excessively long, what type of RI are you talking about? Would 60s be about right, or should it be less than that?
For hypertrophy, a rest interval of 30-90 seconds is about right.


Quote:
2. What exactly is meant by "unloading?" I've heard the term before, and I remember reading about it on this forum, but I can't remember what it is or find a link at all.
Unloading is a period where you back off the level of effort and the workload used in your training sessions to allow systemic fatigue to dissipate. Usually a combination of decreased intensity and volume is implemented. Taking an entire week off from training is also a valid form of unloading.


Posted by: JuXtaposed

One last question (probably):

About how often should I be unloading. Every 4th week or so?


Posted by: CowPimp

Quote:
Originally Posted by JuXtaposed
One last question (probably):

About how often should I be unloading. Every 4th week or so?
I think every 4-6 weeks is about right. The absolute maximum I would go is 12 weeks. It does depend on how much you ramp up volume and intensity though. If you notice your performance start to decrease, it's usually a good idea to unload then, or shortly thereafter.



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