Barbell or dumbbell [Forum Archive]

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Barbell or dumbbell

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Posted by: Josh

Hi all,

From various opinions that I read in my threads in this forum, I gather that some people prefer exercises using dumbbells better than using barbell, while some seem to be okay with barbell exercises.

So I wanna ask, what is the benefit of using dumbbell against using barbell in an exercise (for instance, bench press, shoulder press, etc)? Also vice versa, the benefit of using barbell instead of dumbbell?

How would using dumbbell affect the muscles being worked on which differ from using barbell, and vice versa?

-- Josh

Posted by: Prince

the main benefit of using dumbbells is they incorporate more synergistic (balancing) muscles.

Posted by: Josh

If so, then actually using db does not improve the effectivity on the major muscles being worked on themselves, instead it helps the other supporting muscles. In other words, using db contributes mainly to the overall body workout, but does not necessarily work more effectively on the main muscles themselves. Is this understanding correct? -- Josh

Posted by: cornfed

Yes and no. The balance required by db's actually can, depending on the muscle being focussed on and the depth of your press, form and contraction.
I've found that db's, particularly in presses and flyes, are better for mass gains, as you have more freedom to squeeze. But For isolation, I'm gonna plug for hammer strength.

I don't use bars except for BB curls and military (only 1 of the 6exercises I base my shoulder routine on).

But how people do DB rows, I'll never get

Posted by: lean_n_76er

Yes, what Prince and CF said. I couldn't add anything to that!

Posted by: irnmnps

I broke my clavicle which caused me to have different distance between my shoulder and center of chest - so dumbells allowed me to work heavier and deeper that olympic bar.

Posted by: Scotty the Body

I think a combo of all three, db, BB, and machines is important for total muscle development.
Sometimes when your progress is slowed or stoped a simple switch from DB to BB or Machine is all that is needed to start progress going again.

Posted by: ragingbull

I have worked with DB for several years and enjoy the results that I have seen but, using a BB enables me to shock the muscles when needed while maintaining perfect form. I incorporate both in my routine. As far as machines go, I stopped using them after I injured myself with the smithmachine, it cause severe shoulder problems that I am still recovering from 3 years later.

Posted by: jagleaso

DBs are the only way to go. The whole one arm bent over row thing I kinda dont get though...

Posted by: Scotty the Body

Originally posted by jagleaso
DBs are the only way to go. The whole one arm bent over row thing I kinda dont get though...

Welcome to IM Jagleaso, what don't you get about bent over one arm rows? I find them better than seated rows as your less likly to use momentom to move the weight.

Posted by: Robboe

I tend to use more BB for lower body and more DB for upper body.

Not exclusively though, of course.

Posted by: Lightman009

As in everything, a good combination will give the best results.

Posted by: LittLe FraNk

Originally posted by Lightman009
As in everything, a good combination will give the best results.

i agree simply

Posted by: maxxlina

I prefer dumbbel

Posted by: KryptoAllez

I use anything and everything!

Keeps the boredom away and the muscles growing!

Posted by: Yanks20

in my experience most PL's use BB for shear power and mass and DB more for cutting.

me personally i prefer using BB any time i can!

Posted by: Snake_Eyes

Dumbells for cutting? Explain.

Posted by: Yanks20

BB is shear power and great for overall growth. DB require a lot more concentration and stabalization of the muscles being used, from personal experiences i have noticed when switching routines up i get much more cut/ripped using DB then when using BB.

Posted by: Snake_Eyes

Wouldn't that be more a function of diet?

Posted by: Yanks20

not in my case, i switch the routines and exercises around whether i'm bulking or cutting

Posted by: Robboe

Ah, so DB's get you cut.

riiight...

Posted by: LittLe FraNk

Originally posted by Prince
the main benefit of using dumbbells is they incorporate more synergistic (balancing) muscles.

this is what its bout....
the wise man has spoken...

Posted by: CJMAJOR

I have to disagree. The stablizer muscles are used more when using dbs versus a barbell. I don't see how using a db instead of a barbell or machine would make a person cut. I am a firm believer that cutting is all about diet.

Posted by: Neil

Originally posted by Snake_Eyes
Wouldn't that be more a function of diet?

Yes.
I don't see the difference between a DB or a BB having any effect on cutting.

Posted by: LittLe FraNk

hi rep training i belive is for cutting if you use low rep training hi weight it more frequently for hypertrophy right...

Posted by: LAM

Increased definition is the result of lowered body fat. db's are not for "cutting" nor is a high-rep routine. The only truth in performing higher reps (8-12) is that rep ranges will produce a greater increase in GH levels than low reps <6 .

GH is the strongest hormone when it comes to fat loss as it enables brown fats to be released for use as energy by the mitochondria.

Posted by: ians

In my current chest routine i firstly use DB's - both flat and inclined - as my main mass builders. Then i move to BB's - again both flat and inclined - but use higher reps in order to flush the muscles with blood and increase the microtearing in the muscles ! Then i do flat bench DB flys to finish off !

I think the best thing is try both DB's and BB's and see which work best for you ! Everybody's different - what works for one person may not work for another !

Posted by: Robboe

Litte frank, that ain't true man.

Keep your training no different from bulking when cutting. A routine that builds muscle while bulking will help retain it when cutting.

All you may wanna consider doing is lowering volume a bit. But even that isn't madatory.

Posted by: gopro

Both barbell and dumbell training have their benefits. They should both be incorporated into a complete training regimen.

What I do like about dumbells is...

-the need to use more stabilizing muscles to perform the movements

-the ability of dumbells to increase ROM on some exercises

-the fact that a "stronger message to contract" is given by the nervous system to a muscle being trained unilaterally

-the fact that with dumbells you can slightly alter hand/wrist position, and/or plane of movement to make an exercise more comfortable and effective

Posted by: Xeldrine

I like to train heavy so if they make a 300 lb. dumbell than I'll switch until then f**k it!

Posted by: nikegurl

Originally posted by gopro

-the fact that with dumbells you can slightly alter hand/wrist position, and/or plane of movement to make an exercise more comfortable and effective

This is a big factor for me with DBs. I can find the right "groove" easier and make adjustments in a way that's easier then bb or machines for most exercises.

I like to mix it up between BB DB and machine but this is a big reason I personally like DBs best for most upper body exercises.

Posted by: TJohn

Use both !! You need the benefits of both. DB's give you a better range of motion and BB's let you pure on the power.

TJohn

Posted by: gopro

Originally posted by Xeldrine
I like to train heavy so if they make a 300 lb. dumbell than I'll switch until then f**k it!

And for which exercise will you be using a 300 lb dumbell???

Posted by: Mule

Hell they would have to have a seperate rack for that dumbell.

Posted by: J.T. HALL

Dumbells offer greater range of motion, but barbells offer use of heavier weights.

TRAIN HARD

J.T. HALL
news

Posted by: Xeldrine

[QUOTE]Originally posted by J.T. HALL
barbells offer use of heavier weights.

Main I rather use barbells..

Posted by: Pressalot

I know I'm a little late to this, but I thought you would find this link interesting. You could see a video of Paul Anderson pressing a 300 lb dumbell twice. http://ffden-2.phys.uaf.edu/211_fall...rongestman.htm

(I don't lift weights, but I'm pretty)

Posted by: Mudge

Right now I live with the barbell, for almost everything.

Posted by: Pressalot

As I said, I don't lift weights, but I used to a bit, and I think someone whos doing it just to keep in shape should stick with dumbells. As people said, the stabilizer muscles get worked, and I figure that the more muscles you work per set, the more exaustion with be the reason for stopping rather than muscle fatigue, which is better cardiovascularly and probably reduces the chances of injury (just my theory). It's also safer, especially if you do bench presses.

Posted by: leg_press

I used to use a barbell when I trained at a gym ( before I moved to a college sports complex), and it seemed to add mass to my arms because I could do 21's which you can't really do with a dumbell or with the bicep machine.

Posted by: maniclion

I'm sorry, but you should never have to choose between one or the other. They are both vital for optimal growth, just like food and water.

Posted by: firestorm

I incorporate both in my routines. If I do DB flat benches and incline barbell this week the following week I may do barbell flats and incline DBs. I think for a well rounded physic both are required

Posted by: Tha Don

Originally posted by leg_press
I used to use a barbell when I trained at a gym ( before I moved to a college sports complex), and it seemed to add mass to my arms because I could do 21's which you can't really do with a dumbell or with the bicep machine.

yeah you can

do you mean you can't do 21's with a barbell?

db's are a lot more versitle than bb's, you can do pretty much everything with them and a bench (apart from pulldowns for which you need a L.P.)

barbells, dumbells and cables all have their place and are all important in my book

peace

Posted by: leg_press

No I said that I couldn't do 21 with a DUMBELL

Posted by: prophet

i switch about every 3 months between db and bb.. so what i do with db switches to bb and what i do with bb switches to db.. flat and incline bench, shrugs, shoulder press

Posted by: Tha Don

Originally posted by leg_press
No I said that I couldn't do 21 with a DUMBELL

well personally i think 21's are better with dumbells

you can do them on 1 arm at a time, and really focus on that muscle (either left or right bicep) rather than having to focus on both at once

you can also use your free arm to help support and lock the elbow of the arm you are working in a fixed position just above your hip

try that, it might help you a bit

peace

Posted by: vanity

The more variety you incorporate into your routine the greater your gains will be. You seriously limit your potential if you use only one type of bar. Vary the bars, cable handles , machines and exercises to constatly keep your body guessing and adapting.

The greatest advantage that dumbells have over barbells is that they allow you to work on a single side of your body at one time.
This is important because it highlights where you may have a muscle imbalance. More importantly it allows you to correct the imbalance. Muscle imbalances are often the cause of injuries.

Examples of imbalances are when you could do more reps of db chest or shoulder presses with one arm than you can with the other. If when you do the BB bench press or BB military press for instance, and the bar seems to tilt to one side, then that is your weaker side.

Imbalances are very common and it's important to correct them as soon as possible.

Posted by: Tha Don

Originally posted by vanity
The more variety you incorporate into your routine the greater your gains will be. You seriously limit your potential if you use only one type of bar. Vary the bars, cable handles , machines and exercises to constatly keep your body guessing and adapting.

The greatest advantage that dumbells have over barbells is that they allow you to work on a single side of your body at one time.
This is important because it highlights where you may have a muscle imbalance. More importantly it allows you to correct the imbalance. Muscle imbalances are often the cause of injuries.

Examples of imbalances are when you could do more reps of db chest or shoulder presses with one arm than you can with the other. If when you do the BB bench press or BB military press for instance, and the bar seems to tilt to one side, then that is your weaker side.

Imbalances are very common and it's important to correct them as soon as possible.

thats a good point!

and another reason why 21's are better with d/b's

Posted by: Randy

I incorporate both into my workout. The main difference in using dumbell vs barbell is this. Dumbell allows you to get a more concentrated focus on your main bicep. Barbells allow you to utilize the full range grip. You can use a wider grip to build the other portions of your bicep muscle. For instance using medium grip verses wide grip builds a different portion. There are main, inner, and outer bicep muscles. Using both dumbells and barbells allows one to work the full range of your bicep muscles.

I use dumbells and single cable curls to get a more concentrated workout on my bicep. But in addition to that I also include barbell curls. For the barbells, I do inner, medium, and outer grip to work all parts of the bicep. The Dumbells tend to focus on the main peak portion of the bicep. Now this is just my experience.
In addition, I rotate my routine every 6 weeks. I create an entirely new program. I feel this is a very important factor in body building.

As for cuts, you get them by a number of factors. Hi reps, lean diet and cardio will definately bring out the cuts. In my opion, those are the 3 keys.

Posted by: JerseyDevil

To get big, you have to lift big. Barbells allow you to use more weight, so are better for building mass. I sort of agree with the guy who said that DBs are better for cutting, combined with diet of course. I focus mainly on compound barbell movements, then use DBs for 'finishing off'. For chest 3-4 sets BB flat bench, 3 sets BB incline, then 3 sets DB incline cover the bases, for me at least.

Posted by: Pressalot

Another theory from a guy who doesn't even work out...if you have muscle imbalance, a barbell is probably better than dumbells, if you make sure you keep the bar straight. With dumbells, it's harder to tell if you're using the the same arm movement for each arm.

I wonder if you could get the same benefit from dumbells as you do with alternating between wide and narrow grips with barbells if you use a variety of arm motions with the dumbells, such as keeping the dumbells farther from your body for some sets.

Posted by: vanity

Pressalot:

I find your remark ,"Another theory from a guy who doesn't even work out" , mildly amusing.

I'm guessing you recently celebrated your 14th birthday.
happy birthday.

Posted by: Pressalot

Actually, I began working out at about 14. Sad to hear that only 14 year olds theorize.

Hmmm.... incase you misunderstood, I'm the one who doesn't work out, as I said in a previous post to this thread.

Posted by: Randy

Pressalot,

It could be possible to get the same results using dumbells like you describe. I just think it is easier to use a barbell for this purpose. But heck, there is somebody stumbling across a new excercise method every day. I am always open to anthing that works. Keeping an open and scientific mind is always a good thing.

Originally posted by Pressalot
I wonder if you could get the same benefit from dumbells as you do with alternating between wide and narrow grips with barbells if you use a variety of arm motions with the dumbells, such as keeping the dumbells farther from your body for some sets.

Posted by: Tha Don

Originally posted by Pressalot
Another theory from a guy who doesn't even work out...if you have muscle imbalance, a barbell is probably better than dumbells, if you make sure you keep the bar straight. With dumbells, it's harder to tell if you're using the the same arm movement for each arm.

this is not true man

if you push a bar with both, you are using strength from both sides of the body

if your right side is much stronger than your left side, your right side will take over a lot of the push/pull itself, meaning the left side is not been worked at all!

you think both muscles will work out the same, but if one side struggles and the other side is stronger it will take over, and you will get imbalances

With dumbells your working just that side of your body! If you have good technique on both sides and are lifting the same on both sides muscle imbalances can and will not occur!

Peace

Posted by: vanity

YoungD:

cool, you get it man.
That's exactly what I'm talking about.

Posted by: Randy

I would have to agree with young there.

In addition, if you do have an imbalance you can componsate for that using dumbells. If your weaker on your left arm, you just do a few more reps on the left than the right, or visa versa. Eventually you will overcome the indifference, and achieve an equal balance. This is a common issue with many. Like if your right handed, your right hand is usually stronger. It's just a way of human nature I guess.

Originally posted by young d
this is not true man

if you push a bar with both, you are using strength from both sides of the body

if your right side is much stronger than your left side, your right side will take over a lot of the push/pull itself, meaning the left side is not been worked at all!

you think both muscles will work out the same, but if one side struggles and the other side is stronger it will take over, and you will get imbalances

With dumbells your working just that side of your body! If you have good technique on both sides and are lifting the same on both sides muscle imbalances can and will not occur!

Peace

Posted by: maniclion

If your weaker on your left arm, you just do a few more reps on the left than the right, or visa versa.

Not exactly, if you are working to failure, do as many reps as possible with the weaker arm first then do the same number with the stronger arm. Continue doing that until you feel both arms are equal.

Posted by: Randy

I didn't notice anyone reference that they were working to failure, maybe I missed it. But I would disagree with you on that. If I personally had a weaker arm and was working to failure. I would do exactly as you said, but I would wait about 15 to 30 seconds afterward and do a few more reps with the weaker arm. I would then proceed to the other arm and work to failure as normal. Whether your working to failure or not, if your doing the exact same reps on each arm, how is the weaker arm going to get any stonger and become equal with the stronger arm?

That's just my opinion. Maybe I'm missing some scientific theory here .

Originally posted by maniclion
Not exactly, if you are working to failure, do as many reps as possible with the weaker arm first then do the same number with the stronger arm. Continue doing that until you feel both arms are equal.

Posted by: Monolith

Originally posted by Randy
I didn't notice anyone reference that they were working to failure, maybe I missed it. But I would disagree with you on that. If I personally had a weaker arm and was working to failure. I would do exactly as you said, but I would wait about 15 to 30 seconds afterward and do a few more reps with the weaker arm. I would then proceed to the other arm and work to failure as normal. Whether your working to failure or not, if your doing the exact same reps on each arm, how is the weaker arm going to get any stonger and become equal with the stronger arm?

That's just my opinion. Maybe I'm missing some scientific theory here .

If your normal "failure" workout means its that easy to "do a few more reps with the weaker arm", then youve got some inherently flawed techniques to begin with imo.

And if youre doing the same number of reps on each arm using the proper intensity, your strength will even out. Doing 10 reps on the right arm with 50lbs may only take half as much intensity as 10 reps with 50lbs on the left arm. Youre still working the left arm harder to do the same work as the right arm.

It worked for me, anyway.

Posted by: Randy

I never implied that normal "failure" workout means that it is easy to do a few more reps with the weaker arm. The key is that after doing as many as you can, hence the name "until failure", you add a waiting period (such as 30 seconds) to get just a couple more reps in on that weak arm.

I clearly understand what your describing, but that never worked for me. I had to do a few more reps on my weaker arm in order for my strength to even out.

But I have seen a variety of methods that work for some, but not for others. This is why it is so beneficial to have the variety of options that exist. If one method doesn't work, try another that does

Originally posted by Monolith
If your normal "failure" workout means its that easy to "do a few more reps with the weaker arm", then youve got some inherently flawed techniques to begin with imo.

Posted by: Pressalot

The fastest way to even things out is to work out the weaker arm alone, but if you use a fairly wide barbell grip and fairly heavy weight, I wonder if one arm would really be able to signifigantly help the other.

Hey, someone should invent a stress indicator for barbells to show how much of the weight is being lifted by each hand. If the bar is bent more on one side, the indicator would let you know that you need to use your other arm more. That would address my concern about the difficulty in using the same arm movement with dumbells and it would prevent favoring one arm with a barbell. Maybe it could be built into a glove.

Posted by: Randy

Just leave the collars loose on the barbell. If the bar is bent more on one side, then the weight plates will fall off on your foot.

It won't take long for you to realize that you should keep the bar straight.

Now seriously speaking, they do have one device that I'm sure you've seen. Not sure what the proper name is, but it prevents you from cheating while doing curls. You place a strap around your neck. The strap holds a conformed piece of metal so that it hangs in front of you. When you grab the barbell, your triceps fit against the metal curvature. Your elbows just below the metal form. This Helps prevent you from coming down and going back to far with your arms;thereby using your back and body to lift.
I guess it may help keep your arm movement straight too. At least to a point. I guess you may call this an anti-cheat curl strap.

Now if your questioning whether one arm could significantly help the other, then in my opionion you shouldn't be using barbells. You should work the weak arm with a dumbell so you can even out the strength so both arms are equal. (such as you indicated in your first sentence).

Originally posted by Pressalot
The fastest way to even things out is to work out the weaker arm alone, but if you use a fairly wide barbell grip and fairly heavy weight, I wonder if one arm would really be able to signifigantly help the other.

Hey, someone should invent a stress indicator for barbells to show how much of the weight is being lifted by each hand. If the bar is bent more on one side, the indicator would let you know that you need to use your other arm more. That would address my concern about the difficulty in using the same arm movement with dumbells and it would prevent favoring one arm with a barbell. Maybe it could be built into a glove.

Posted by: Pressalot

We're talking about different kinds of straight. I think people here were saying that even though a barbell is straight ("not tilted" or "level" might be better terms), one arm could be lifting more. I figure the way to determine whether one arm is lifting more is to see if the bar is bent (as in curved) more by one hand than the other.

I think a better way to deal with this would be to build a dual dumbell machine (separate weights for each arm) with arms that could only move at the same time. Any such thing?

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Barbell or dumbbell

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