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Well this is my take on it. If you are doing that much volume, you are probably baby-ing yourself so to speak. Lowering the volume and upping the intesnity would be a good idea IMO.
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Volume isn't determined by the time you spend workouting it, it is derived from your sets and reps, I believe.
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be efficient. less is more.
if you give 100% to exercises 1-4 and then exercises 5-8 end up suffering what is the point of doing those exercises? |
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I'm inclined to think that more exercises in the same period of time => higher intensity => more muscle growth. Wrong? |
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I've thought about that, but I doubt it. I try to go to failure, but I usually end up 1 rep till failure. I usually can't get to the full 10 reps on the second or third set of each exercise either. The day after each workout, I have severely sore muscles. After a workout, I usually feel like collapsing.
This could lead you to overtraining and a stop or decline of muscle growth Aye, but I've heard it's bad to train for more than 1 hour. If you look at the set/rep volume, it's still very high. It depends what you are doing, you could be doing very taxing movements that require alot of time to recover, you might have fairly low volume though. I believe something detrimental can occur biologically when you you lift weights for too long, I don't know what factors determine that occurance though. Thanks for the input. |
| I'm still a bit confused though. True, the later exercises suffer, but they still stress the body right? So eventhough they're not 100% optimal, they're still stressing the body and promoting muscle growth I'd say. Could you elaborate your answer please? |
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This could lead you to overtraining and a stop or decline of muscle growth
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also, stress doesn't promote muscle growth. You want to have the optimal amount of tension, give your 100% on a few lifts and get out and rest. Rest outside of the gym, not in it.
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http://www.ironmagazine.com/article118.html
That's the link I was talking about. What do you think about it? Fortunately, I don't suffer from any of those signs, except poor sleep. But that's because I suffer (and have suffered from all my life) from a light form of insomnia. |
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http://www.ironmagazine.com/article118.html
That's the link I was talking about. What do you think about it? Fortunately, I don't suffer from any of those signs, except poor sleep. But that's because I suffer (and have suffered from all my life) from a light form of insomnia. |
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http://www.ironmagazine.com/article118.html
That's the link I was talking about. What do you think about it? Fortunately, I don't suffer from any of those signs, except poor sleep. But that's because I suffer (and have suffered from all my life) from a light form of insomnia. |
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Period os higher volume can be used, as I have stated before, as accumulation phases of training, in which you accumulate high amounts of both fitness and fatigue. Alternate that with phases where you unload (or under reach) to allow the fatigue to disipate and then follow it up with an intensificatin phase to allow the new fitness level to manifest itself. . |
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Hehe, P-Funk, I do my best not to sound too confident, but I'm just really stubborn and I like to think things through over and over before I actually start doing something. I am taking your advice into consideration very seriously.
In fact, I've looked at some other routines and tips and I've decided that you and fufu are right, I should lower the volume. My new proposal: Lower to amount of sets from 3 to 2 on - reverse crunches - crunches - reverse curls - wrist curls - dumbell curls Would that be sufficient? |
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This is why I usually skip over the "routine critique" threads. |
smiley seems a bit ambiguous in this case.
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Do you mean it's still suicide because the volume is too high? Or do you think it's stupid to lower the volume that much? The smiley seems a bit ambiguous in this case. |
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With a lot of these threads....not all of them....you either teach someone how to write a program or write it for them. I have no interest in either.
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| While only doing 2 sets per exercise does lower the volume, it's not exactly what we were thinking. |
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Well, I know Switchblades ... [snip] ...
If you aren't the bearer of this unique avatar that I know so well from another forum, please ignore this post. |
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Is this a preferred method of training in your opinion?? You've mentioned it more than once. (accumulation/intensification.)
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Hehe, P-Funk, I do my best not to sound too confident, but I'm just really stubborn and I like to think things through over and over before I actually start doing something. I am taking your advice into consideration very seriously.
In fact, I've looked at some other routines and tips and I've decided that you and fufu are right, I should lower the volume. My new proposal: Lower to amount of sets from 3 to 2 on - reverse crunches - crunches - reverse curls - wrist curls - dumbell curls Would that be sufficient? |
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OK, so what's the issue? Just look at this workout:
Front pulldowns 3x10 Bentover barbell row 3x10 Lat rows 3x10 Cable rows 3x10 Reverse curls 3x10 Dumbell curls 3x10 Wrist curls 3x10 Weighted reverse crunch 3x20 Weighted crunch 3x20 |
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I'm going to agree that you should beware of shoulder issues. That's a lot of pressing. In my opinion, most people should be doing more pulling than pressing.
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| Looks like a lot of useless crap on pull day. Wrist curls are ghey. They probably won't do much for you. Do some farmer's walks instead of the last two exercises if you want to train your grip, improve core strength, and engage your upper back all at the same time. |
| I think crunches are generally lame. I kind of like hanging leg raises, but do you need the ab work? |
| Your leg day looks fucking killer. I'm all about pounding your lower body, but using 4 bilateral compound exercises that allow for the implemntation of very heavy loads is going to be brutal. Alternating load patterns, or concurrently implementing different patterns, would help so that you don't accumulate too much of one form of fatigue. |
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Would it help to use machines for the military and shoulder presses to prevent shoulder injuries? I could also do the dips on a machine, though I'd be doing sets of 10+ reps then because the machine doesn't go higher than 65KG.
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| I don't know much about farmer walks. Is it just walking around with heavy weights? How long should I do them; in sets? They work the entire forearms right? I think I'm going to scrap the wrist curls and the reverse curls and replace them with farmer walks, as several people suggested. Should I just do them in the training, doesn't it take long? |
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Well, I need something to work the upper abs. But you're right that I don't really need ab improvement, but I do want maintenance. Like you advise your clients, I do ab exercises in the rest intervals of the other exercises. I could probably lower the volume though, say 2 sets per exercise? |
Aye, when you see me limping you know I've done leg day yesterday. I could try to do some leg presses etc. instead of 1 or 2 of the 4 compound lifts, but at my gym all the leg machines are usually taken. Almost nobody does squats or deadlifts or bentover rows except on machines. All afraid to look dorky I suppose. Thanks again for all the help. |
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Day 1, Pull:
- Front pulldown 3x10 - Bentover barbell row 3x10 - Cable row 3x10 - Dumbell curls 2x10 - Barbell curls 2x10 In rest intervals I do: - Weighted crunches 2x20 - Hanging leg raise 2x20 Day 3, Push: - Bench press 3x10 - Weighted Dips 3x10 - Incline bench press 3x10 - Military press 2x10 - Dumbell shoulder press 3x10 - Kickbacks 3x10 - Fly's 3x10 Day 5, Legs: - Squats 3x10 - Deadlift 3x10 - Front squat 2x10 - Deadlift (sumostyle) 2x10 - Standing calf raise 3x10 In rest intervals I do: - Farmer walks 3x Day 7, Repeat day 1. |
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I'm planning on periodization. So after a month I'm going to do a few weeks of 5-6 reps, then 8-12 (like now, 10 is the goal) and then 12-15. I'm not sure how long I should do those though, I'm thinking of 2 weeks. Would that work?
Unilateral work, is that really necessary? If so, I'll add in bulgarian squats somewhere. Deadlifts, squats, bulgarian squats, stiff legged deadlifts and standing calf raises: would that be a proper leg workout? About altering the exercises. I already do it a bit, different types of dumbell curls each week and a slightly different grip on exercises like the bench press. Instead of incorporating 2 variants of the deadlift and the squat, I could just alter the position a bit each week in the above mentioned leg program. Would that be better? |
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I'm planning on periodization. So after a month I'm going to do a few weeks of 5-6 reps, then 8-12 (like now, 10 is the goal) and then 12-15. I'm not sure how long I should do those though, I'm thinking of 2 weeks. Would that work?
Unilateral work, is that really necessary? If so, I'll add in bulgarian squats somewhere. Deadlifts, squats, bulgarian squats, stiff legged deadlifts and standing calf raises: would that be a proper leg workout? About altering the exercises. I already do it a bit, different types of dumbell curls each week and a slightly different grip on exercises like the bench press. Instead of incorporating 2 variants of the deadlift and the squat, I could just alter the position a bit each week in the above mentioned leg program. Would that be better? |
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screw linear periodization. to much is lost.
go with some form of undulating model: day1- 5-6 reps day2- 12-15 day3- 8-10 |

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I'm gonna go with P-Funk on alternating rep ranges. Looks like more fun.
Still too much pressing, hm... Scrap the military presses? My front delts are way more developed than my rear ones anyway. Or add in the lat rows again? Add 1 set of variant grip pulldowns? Heh, making a good workout is harder than I thought. |