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Glutamine


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Posted by: the_menace

What brands do you guys use and did it work for you?


Posted by: nikegurl

I use AST. As for it "working"....glutamine isn't the sort of supplement most people see dramatic results from. (you won't gain size or strength like some people do with creatine)

You may notice you need less time to recover from hard workouts. I've found that I still get sore but it doesn't last nearly as long. I've also found that I'm healthier overall since I started taking it. It helps with digestion as well.

I think it's a really good supplement. i'll post some more info for you when i find it!


Posted by: nikegurl

K....I found this info I had saved:


Some facts about glutamine and athletes.....
There has been very substantial research supporting the use of glutamine for increased muscle function and for anticatabolic properties over the years. Unfortunately there is a lot of this data that shows stronger immune system support than that of actual increase of protein synthesis (in healthy individuals) - however there was substantial increase in protein synthesis in "unhealthy" individuals. This lends itself to the need of glutamine when on calorie restricted diets and hard training to insure that the muscle protein will not be broken down to supply the body its need for glutamine. So the real benefit to glutamine supplementation is the preservation of muscle from catabolic breakdown - this is especially true when cutting up (usually because of the higher cardio and lower calories). Also it should be noted that glutamine research indicates that free form L-glutamine elevates blood glutamine levels far better (higher) than peptide (protein bonded or bound) bonded glutamine. Further, it should be noted that glutamine (free form) taken with hydrolyzed whey protein - gives better results than that of glutamine and glucose. Glutamine taken in conjunction with specific ratios of BCAA's actual haven shown protein synthesis.

Glutamine (free form) is more readily absorbed and utilized as it enters the system quicker and is cataloged in the liver faster then dispersed to the skeletal muscle amino pool in a more efficient manner than a protein bound (peptide bonded) glutamine. The reality is that glutamine is stored relative well in the muscle tissue over periods of time and is used or depleted upon exercise or muscle stress - this is the time you want to insure it is available in reserve - so as to guard against actual muscle protein being broken down (to supply glutamine to the system). This is the "anti-catabolic" function of glutamine. Glutamine taken pre - post and pm - insures an ample reserve within the muscle amino pool - that protects against catabolic breakdown, oxidative stress, and helps support muscle function and recovery. Glutamine in all fact can be taken any time of day - 10-20 grams daily - depending on lean body mass and exercise intensity.

First you have to understand the importance of increased immune system strength and especially stomach (which really should be GUT) health. Let me explain the GUT health first.....most everything you eat migrates (digests and is utilized) in (or in relation to passing through) the GUT - this has to be a "healthy place" or you will NOT get the optimum benefits from the foods and supplements you take......beside the fact you will be likely to have "problems" or complications with sickness and disease (age doesn't matter here - there are 10 year old kids that die from stomach cancer every year) - so to "think" age is the precursor to sickness is wrong. Next - if you apply the same "train of thought" to the immune system - it is all about internal health of your organs and support systems - people with low immune systems - can not and do not build muscle...period.

Now let's talk about "gains" from glutamine....glutamine is not like ephedra - where you can actually "feel it working" - glutamine is like a "ninja supplement" ( I just thought that up....pretty cool) where it is doing it's work in "silence"....kind of sneaks up and does its job. The importance of glutamine is what it does when you use it - and the negative of glutamine is what happens in your body and to your muscles when you DON'T use it....you (at your age) may never really feel the benefits of your glutamine use - the way I do at my age - I "feel" glutamine - because when my muscles are sore from an intensive session (after the fact) - glutamine supports the muscle recovery and I don't have the pain....so I know it works when I am using it - because of what I DON'T feel - where if I didn't use it - I WOULD feel (the pain)....Glutamine fulfills many functions and the most important is protecting from muscle protein breakdown....guess what - you DON'T feel that either. You will never feel your muscles giving up muscle protein for energy - you will never feel your body in a catabolic state - but your body is losing (wasting) valuable hard earned muscle. So the importance of glutamine lies in the "silent" support it gives our muscles and bodies for growth and preservation.....not in giving us huge gains and impressive pumps.....it is more about what would happen without it...then "feeling it".

The glutamine that naturally occurs in foods and in protein powders (unless it is added free form L-glutamine) do not synthesis in the same manner as orally ingested free form glutamine - so in essence you only get a small amount of the glutamine that is in foods - so supplementing is a great idea for athletes.

Bottom line - food alone CAN NOT supply adequate amounts of Glutamine to support serious training.....glutamine is so scavenged by the intestinal walls that as food is broken down and digested - by the time the stomach is done - there is little to no Glutamine left to support human performance or the additional support needed by the muscles of a trained (or training) athlete.

As with all raw materials used in making sports supplements and pharmaceuticals - there are different grades and specifications as it relates to source of origin, purity, particle size, etc. Cheaper is not always the best way to go when buying supplements - because in most cases you will get what you pay for.


Posted by: Prince

I am using EAS right now.


Posted by: the_menace

Good read NikeGurl...thanks for the info.


Posted by: Sauron

Ultimate Nutrition. Check out DPSNutrition for good prices.


Posted by: dvlmn666

AST here, seem to be alot more healthy every since I started using it.


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

People really over-exagerate how readily the body releases glutamine into the blood stream...

Nikegurl, where did you get that article from? And what else were they trying to sell you?


Posted by: nikegurl

Terry Giles - he's got some pretty solid credentials.

I do know from my own experience that it helps with recovery and overall health.

The rest....just cut and paste.


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

Terry Giles who posts on mm.com?


Posted by: nikegurl

yep. if the info is crap - sorry. he seems to be pretty well respected and I had saved the article.

i know for me if i kill my legs in the gym they'll be sore for 36 hours now instead of 4 days. i also know that i used to catch every cold/flu that went around the office and that's also stopped since i started the glutamine.


Posted by: Lightman009

I just started using Glutamine from GNC, I think it's too early to tell if it's really working.


Posted by: Tank316

TCD. i am curious, have ya ever tried it. maybe you have and you didnt have any results. but...........


Posted by: sawheet

I agree with nikegurl all the way on that one


Posted by: nikegurl

about 2 weeks after i started taking glutamine i hit my legs HARD in the gym (they need it!) late the next day they were killing me. (you know the kind of hurt where you can't even put your hand on your lap 'cause it hurts).

so i'm cussing out glutamine and everyone who told me it aids recovery and soreness b/c i'm plenty sore. but - the next night they were at least 75% better. still sore but no big deal. that was the kind of pain that would have lasted 4 days easily before i started taking glutamine.

so - i wasn't sold right away but i am now


Posted by: sawheet

Well you cannot stop pain from micro tearing of muscle but you can heal faster!1 thats why growth hormones are so good


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

Tank, yes i have mate.

I agree it IS good for the immune system since it boosts gluthione (sp?) levels, and it IS good for the villi of the gut, but i don't see any reason to take the stuff when bulking.

It takes a lot to release glutamine into the bloodstream. and since BBers tend to eat protein with every meal, the chances of them being in negative nitrogen balance is slim.

It may prove to be of benefit when you're in pre-contest strategy or you're cutting - i'm even debating whether to get some myself, since i'm cutting now and gonna use this time to work on my cardiovascular fitness - but when people push glutamine as one of the top three "necessary" supps it kinda annoys me, cause they're spending money on an over-priced product when they should be buying steaks and chicken and eggs etc...

I really do think most supps are over-rated, vits and minerals aside.

It's up to you whether you wanna keep buying it, but for the most part it's money i'd rather save for something else.


Posted by: gopro

Chicken...glutamine is the most abundant amino acid in muscle tissue and the gut is a total glutamine hog! It takes ALOT of supplemental glutamine to have an ergogenic effect in muscle, but when you get that amount the benefits are worth it. Putting aside that I have had fantastic results with gluatmine and so have all of my clients, you love to read research. Glutamine is one of the most researched supps out there, right up there with creatine, and there are so many studies proving gluatmines efficacy. You just seem to have a problem with it...EVEN AFTER people tell you that they have had great results with it. Damn, its just like incline presses with you, lol.

Anyway, please ignore TCDs glutamine comments...best glutamine products I have ever used...GP2 by Sports One and
G Force Peptides bt Osmo.


Posted by: Vale Tudo

I have been using it for a while, and I have noticed a little bit of change but not as much as i expected. I am using the GNC pro preformance brand and I take it after my workout and before bed. Are these good times to be taking it? When does everyone else take theirs?


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

Gopro, the studies done are using burn victims. Do you realise how stressful that situation actually is? Of course glutamine is gonna be good for them. Sure, a balls-to-the-wall workout is stressful, but not compared to burns situations. And the athletes used in studies are marathon runners - again, much more stressful situation than a 40-60 minute weight training workout.

If you have studies showing how it benefits BODYBUILDERS then please do show me them if there's so many studies. People who eat every 3 hours or so have no requirement for additional glutamine, unless, like i've always stated, they are cutting and even then it's debatable. And this is even going on the assumption that taking one amino acid alone will be digested and utilised how you want it to be. One amino on it's own is like taking in an incomplete protein source.


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

Oh, and if you're actually wondering why i argue about this, it's cause it annoys me seeing people push "ground-breaking" supplements to people who have no reason to waste their money on over-priced products.

Gopro is huge and now cause he says he's gotten good benefits from it someone less knowledgable may read his post and think, "Ah well, gopro's huge and he uses glutamine - looks like that's gonna get me huge too! Let's just forget about the basics and rely on this stuff to get me there..."


Posted by: Prince

I believe in using Glutamine, but I only take aorund 5 grams per day in supplement form. On work-out days I sometimes take 10 grams.


Posted by: tidalwaverus

TAG and everyone got sick with a cold 2 weeks ago (wife and 3yr old son) but me LOL

some good sh*t and last week I was doing max failure IT HELPS

RECOVER for sure


Posted by: Tank316

taking supps is a choice.some people have good results some dont.it can get be a spendy lifestyle, but speaking for myself, i have no other hobbies, so i do try alot of supps.i wish i had the knowledge of these supps 23 years ago, but as time passes on, the research has doubled. its a hobby that doest possess alot risk factors like car racing or what have you. supps are made for some and some not.


Posted by: gopro

Quote:
Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy
Oh, and if you're actually wondering why i argue about this, it's cause it annoys me seeing people push "ground-breaking" supplements to people who have no reason to waste their money on over-priced products.

Gopro is huge and now cause he says he's gotten good benefits from it someone less knowledgable may read his post and think, "Ah well, gopro's huge and he uses glutamine - looks like that's gonna get me huge too! Let's just forget about the basics and rely on this stuff to get me there..."

Two things...

1- all studies on glutamine are NOT on burn patients and marathon runners...jeez, do a search

2- my recommendations on glutamine have come about BECAUSE glutamine has aided me in GETTING to the size I am, AND because I am lucky to have a large pool of clients that take it and have shown wonderful results

Oh, just one more thing....you see guys, Chicken really does mean well, but he just likes to argue just to hear himself argue...he has a problem and we all need to be sensitive to it..ok?


Posted by: Big_Andy

I've read in T-mag that the oral glutamine makes your gut, not your muscles, protruding (hypertrophied), because of much more receptors there. Intravenous glutamine is of course different, and seems to be effective for muscle sparing and growth. (I guess Biotest has not invested heavily in Glutamine :-)
My own thoughts are that weightlifters tax their immune systems heavily, and anything and everything that can help immune system ultimately helps recovery. If Glutamine is good for gut health, then it is even better, because poor digestion negates all your well-thought meals and your calories are ultimately way below your calculations....


Posted by: Lightman009

Really, I am getting sick of reading Chicken Daddy's posts.


Posted by: the_menace

Quote:
Originally posted by Lightman009
Really, I am getting sick of reading Chicken Daddy's posts.
I well agree on his last posts about not relying on supplements. I myself do that but because of low budget, I have to step up and do the tasks myself without overloading myself with a lot of supplements. I depend more on training harder rather than relying on supplements.


Posted by: Lightman009

I would hope everyone would rely more on training hard rather then supplements. However, it just seems like this guy always finds a way to say something negative.


Posted by: gopro

Quote:
Originally posted by Lightman009
I would hope everyone would rely more on training hard rather then supplements. However, it just seems like this guy always finds a way to say something negative.
Hehehehe...I told you he just has a need to be argumentative. Some people are like that. Anyway, I agree that supps are exactly what the word implies...supplemental to training, nutrition, and rest. If those things are in order, however, than some good quality supps can help in our pursuit of physical excellence. And glutamine is one of those supps!


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

Quote:
Originally posted by Lightman009
Really, I am getting sick of reading Chicken Daddy's posts.

Good for you. Is anyone asking you to read them?

GP: out of EVERY search i have ever tried on pubmed for glutamine research i've come up with research on rats, burns victims or marathon runners. Please, if you have studies on "normal" people or on non-marathon running athletes then do share.


Posted by: gopro

Quote:
Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy



Good for you. Is anyone asking you to read them?

GP: out of EVERY search i have ever tried on pubmed for glutamine research i've come up with research on rats, burns victims or marathon runners. Please, if you have studies on "normal" people or on non-marathon running athletes then do share.
Ok.


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

Actually i lie. I HAVE seen studies done on normal people, but none that i have seen have shown positive effects as far as muscle tissue is concerned. Only positive aspects for immune system strength, villi in the gut and some ones that shown glutamine didn't actually do anything to muscle when taken on it's own.


Posted by: Snake_Eyes

I'm inclined to agree with Chicken here.

After reviewing the literature, the vast majority of the work was done with athletes involved in heavy, long-term endurance training, be it marathons, triathlons, rugby, etc., or in post-traumatic patients.

However, with respect to heavy resistance training, I did find the following, which do not support glutamine's use for young, healthy resistance trainers:

Eur J Appl Physiol 2001 Dec;86(2):142-9

Effect of glutamine supplementation combined with resistance training in young adults.

Candow DG, Chilibeck PD, Burke DG, Davison KS, Smith-Palmer T.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...&dopt=Abstract

Metabolism 2000 Dec;49(12):1555-60

Intravenous glutamine does not stimulate mixed muscle protein synthesis in healthy young men and women.

Zachwieja JJ, Witt TL, Yarasheski KE.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...&dopt=Abstract


Posted by: gopro

Snake and Chicken...you guys can go on agreeing with eachother and not taking glutamine. I have seen AND measured the results firsthand on myself and others. I strongly recommend the use of glutamine and will continue to do so. I have seen much better gains in the gym since I started using it in larger amounts and when I upped it this offseason, along with some changes in diet, I gained 17 lbs. I never had as much as a sniffle, always felt recovered, and felt very full even on low carbs.

We get the point...you don't believe glutamine is all it is cracked up to be...fine, don't use it...let the rest of us reap the benefits though.


Posted by: Prince

Quote:
Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy
Actually i lie. I HAVE seen studies done on normal people, but none that i have seen have shown positive effects as far as muscle tissue is concerned. Only positive aspects for immune system strength, villi in the gut and some ones that shown glutamine didn't actually do anything to muscle when taken on it's own.
Even if that's all it did was strengthen the immune system wouldn't that make it worthwhile? Or do you like being sick?


Posted by: Snake_Eyes

Hey, if you believe in it and want to use it more power to you.

I'm just pointing out that it doesn't really have any measurable effect in controlled tests.


Posted by: Lightman009

Its hard not to read when everyother post is by you. And also, because everyone else is responding to your argumentative statements, which they shouldnt, but it still gets my attention everytime.


Posted by: LAM

Glutamine is an expensive supp and needs to be taken in high dosages. I didn't really "feel" it working until I started taking 30 grams a day.


Posted by: KataMaStEr

Quote:
Originally posted by gopro
Snake and Chicken...you guys can go on agreeing with eachother and not taking glutamine. I have seen AND measured the results firsthand on myself and others. I strongly recommend the use of glutamine and will continue to do so. I have seen much better gains in the gym since I started using it in larger amounts and when I upped it this offseason, along with some changes in diet, I gained 17 lbs. I never had as much as a sniffle, always felt recovered, and felt very full even on low carbs.

We get the point...you don't believe glutamine is all it is cracked up to be...fine, don't use it...let the rest of us reap the benefits though.


I will have to agree with gopro on this one. Sense I started taking 20g of glutamine every day a few weeks ago I have felt much better, my recovery time is much faster than what it used to be. I just feel strong, different than the way I used to feel for good. I would definitely take this supplement over creatine with my eyes close. But you have to take it in high dosages, I used to take 5g a day which was what the bottle instructions said and I was starting to doubt this glutamine stuff b/c I did not feel any changes. Now I definitely believe on this stuff. You don’t like it then don’t take it.


Posted by: Snake_Eyes

Look guys, read above.

If you think its that big a deal, then keep using it. I'm just pointing out that, from a scientific stanpoint, its not that big a deal. If you think its a major contributor to your success, then keep using it.

No reason to be getting upitty.


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

Quote:
Originally posted by Prince


Even if that's all it did was strengthen the immune system wouldn't that make it worthwhile? Or do you like being sick?

Vitamin C can be just as effective and is much, much cheaper.


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

Quote:
Originally posted by gopro
Snake and Chicken...you guys can go on agreeing with eachother and not taking glutamine. I have seen AND measured the results firsthand on myself and others. I strongly recommend the use of glutamine and will continue to do so. I have seen much better gains in the gym since I started using it in larger amounts and when I upped it this offseason, along with some changes in diet, I gained 17 lbs. I never had as much as a sniffle, always felt recovered, and felt very full even on low carbs.

We get the point...you don't believe glutamine is all it is cracked up to be...fine, don't use it...let the rest of us reap the benefits though.
Is this so you don't have to look for all those studies?


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

Quote:
Originally posted by Lightman009
Its hard not to read when everyother post is by you. And also, because everyone else is responding to your argumentative statements, which they shouldnt, but it still gets my attention everytime.

If i didn't post here, then traffic on this site would probably half.

It was even better before ActionMatt was banned.

I have a distinctive avatar. whenever you see it, ignore the post. And then stop making quite worthless posts moaning about people (me).


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

Quote:
Originally posted by Snake_Eyes
Look guys, read above.

If you think its that big a deal, then keep using it. I'm just pointing out that, from a scientific stanpoint, its not that big a deal. If you think its a major contributor to your success, then keep using it.

No reason to be getting upitty.

I agree, i've always told people if they're happy paying for the stuff then go ahead, but it really isn't necessary.

It just seems like people want to hear a response telling them to buy something that will make them grow and get leaner. They seems almost disappointed to hear that 98% of supps available don't actually work.

(P.S. I still wanna see them studies.)


Posted by: dg806

Quote:
Originally posted by LAM
Glutamine is an expensive supp and needs to be taken in high dosages. I didn't really "feel" it working until I started taking 30 grams a day.
LAM.......I'm not knocking you or anyone else on this board....but as with anything you do in life, it takes a sacrafice! How much dedication is someone willing to put into bodybuilding??? This includes taking the plunge money wise to invest in supps, even if it only helps a little! If your not willing to do that then I think the commitment is not really there are you have priorities elsewhere! If your younger than 30, maybe you can get by without glutamine....but as for myself, being 38, I notice a remarkable increase in recovery and I haven't been sick in the last year and 1/2!(the time I have been lifting and taking glutamine). I think that says something........


Posted by: gopro

Quote:
Originally posted by Snake_Eyes
Look guys, read above.

If you think its that big a deal, then keep using it. I'm just pointing out that, from a scientific stanpoint, its not that big a deal. If you think its a major contributor to your success, then keep using it.

No reason to be getting upitty.
Nobody is getting uppitty. But when you actually agree with TCD I have to raise an eyebrow. I guess I have read different studies than you. I also find it curious that most experts in the field of fitness...even those with NO financial interest in selling glutamine...cite it as a must use supplement. Anyway, since I KNOW it is a major contributor to my success, I will keep using it 7 days per week, 365 days per year.

Peace...


Posted by: gopro

Quote:
Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy



I agree, i've always told people if they're happy paying for the stuff then go ahead, but it really isn't necessary.

It just seems like people want to hear a response telling them to buy something that will make them grow and get leaner. They seems almost disappointed to hear that 98% of supps available don't actually work.

(P.S. I still wanna see them studies.)
People are happy paying for stuff when the stuff produces results for them. Going by your assumption, that they are happy paying for it even though its not necessary, is very insulting to their intelligence.

You'll see the studies if and when I feel like looking for them.


Posted by: gopro

[quote]Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy



If i didn't post here, then traffic on this site would probably half.


Now THAT is funny !!!!! Hey, lets try an experiment. Stop posting here for a year or so and we can compare the numbers...we can call it a "study."


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

Are you serious?

If you want me to, i will leave this site.

Say the word and i am gone.

Seriously.


Posted by: gopro

Awwwww...now I feel bad. I was expecting some smart ass retort and I get an upset Chicken. No, Chicken, please stay...who else will put down inclines and gluatmine without you?


Posted by: Lightman009

I wasn't moaning. Just stating a point.


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

I wasn't upset - i was testing you.

And you love me...you really love me...


Posted by: nikegurl

more importantly....you love us, CD

all of us. it's true. i know it.


Posted by: Tank316

Quote:
Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy
I wasn't upset - i was testing you.

And you love me...you really love me...
.................................................. ..........j/k. i also thought you wouldve came back with a smartass remark. do stay, you make things interesting.


Posted by: gopro

Quote:
Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy
I wasn't upset - i was testing you.

And you love me...you really love me...

There's a fine line between love and hate


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

...and i think your upper chest is slightly over it.

Bump for studies.


Posted by: gopro

Quote:
Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy
...and i think your upper chest is slightly over it.

Bump for studies.
You just HATE that I LOVE inclines because they are so damn good at building the upper chest...

...you have no clue how busy I am...looking for studies for you is very low on my list of priorities.


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

No problem.

I'll just keep this baby bumped everyday until then.


Posted by: Eggs

Theres a little too much bumping action going on in here...

Which reminds me... as to Glutamine and the immune system. This Winter I was taking glutamine religiously and didnt get sick once. There were some pretty bad bugs going around here, and while on glutamine I didnt get sick once. However, I stopped taking it, and 2 weeks later I got nailed by the flu bad.

So, real life story there for you.


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

Bummer.

I've never took glutamine in supplement form (other than indirectly through protein powder) for the past year and a half and i don't recall having the flu in that space of time.


Posted by: gopro

Well, TCD...you are super-human...you don't need glutamine, you don't need inclines...you have it all figured out, unlike the rest of us...oh, and keep bumping, but one of these times, I'll just CLOSE.


Posted by: Prince

Quote:
Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy
Bummer.

I've never took glutamine in supplement form (other than indirectly through protein powder) for the past year and a half and i don't recall having the flu in that space of time.

If you have never taken glutamine as a supplement how can you sit there and say it does not work? Because you read that it does not, or because you cannot find any proof that it works?

Sometimes you just have to do some experimentation and take something yourself to see if it helps you or not. If it does not then stop taking, it. Even so just because it does not work for you does not necessitate that it will not work for soemone else.

I think you like to argue things like this just for the sake of arguing and getting a rise out of people.


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

Quote:
Originally posted by Prince



If you have never taken glutamine as a supplement how can you sit there and say it does not work? Because you read that it does not, or because you cannot find any proof that it works?
Read again and you'll see that i said in the past year and a half.

I have used glutamine yes.

Sly bump


Posted by: Prince

Quote:
Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy
If i didn't post here, then traffic on this site would probably half.

It was even better before ActionMatt was banned.
LMAO! Are you serious? IM gets as much traffic as WBB bro.

We get around 600-700 unique visits per day just on these forums, and we have been averaging over 1,000 posts per day, so your contribution is quite small in comparison.

Oh, and ActionMatt was a prick! Same with Mystic Eric and Maki.


Posted by: The_Chicken_Daddy

ActionMatt was great.

He may have been a prick, but at least you learned something from him.

He wasn't here to totally cause trouble.

Another sly bump


Posted by: gopro

Action, Maki, and Mystic taught us nothing and were all pricks.

A SLY CLOSE!


Posted by: Prince

Quote:
Originally posted by The_Chicken_Daddy
ActionMatt was great.

He may have been a prick, but at least you learned something from him.

He wasn't here to totally cause trouble.

Another sly bump

ActionMatt was a prick and did nothing but attack people on this board, we're much better off without him.



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