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Interesting Article

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Posted by: LoadedBats

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=1470868


Charles Poliquin is the man. I'm posting this because I know a few people on here will disagree with a few of the statements. Mainly: that 1 arm DB cleans & snatches are poor exercise choices, and that 1 arm DB shrugs are a better choice than standerd shrugs. Curious to see responses.


Posted by: DOMS

In the article, Charles said that One-arm DB Snatches are dangerous; is there any truth to that? I ask because I'm doing them as part of my routine.


Posted by: Witchblade

I thought one-arm DB snatches were among the most safe exercises...


Posted by: LoadedBats

My understanding is the rotational torque a DB can impart to your hand wrist (the plates/weight are fixed to the handle vs. a BB having plates that rotate). A good Eleiko bar is expensive due to its exceptional rotation at the collars which disperses torque transference to the shoulder girdle. The lifter is left only to support the weight.

As for DB cleans - depending on the type of DB (solid metal, nut on the end securing the weight) - the DB can do alot of damage in the catch position. Again, the BB spreads that force out across a more even surface area dissipating the effect.


Posted by: P-funk

Polliquin used to be smart. Then something happened. I think he is losing his mind. I don't like DB cleans so much. I do love DB snatches.....I think they are a great exercise.


Posted by: DOMS

Quote:
Originally Posted by P-funk View Post
Polliquin used to be smart. Then something happened. I think he is losing his mind. I don't like DB cleans so much. I do love DB snatches.....I think they are a great exercise.
Yeah, I just didn't get it. I have a bum left shoulder and I feel no pain at all when I do DB Snatches. It didn't feel like it was unduly training anything.


Posted by: fufu

He says one-arm snatches are bad...but gives no reasons why. Lame. To me that just seems like muscle head advice as bad as it sounds. Giving advice with no scientific or even anecdotal evidence.


Posted by: P-funk

yea, he also says DB cleans are bad and shows a picture of Paul Chek. What a classy way to take a dig on a guy. What a fucking prick. every article polliquin writes makes me hate him more. He is a fucking idiot. I like when talks about how he can get a person to add 80lbs to their bench by adding more copper to their diet or some voodo bull shit like that. What a moron.


Posted by: WantItBad

Speaking of DB Snatches i tried them today and i have no idea how they should feel?


Posted by: WantItBad

http://www.uwlax.edu/strengthcenter/...s/dbsnatch.mpg

is the form there right?


Posted by: P-funk

Quote:
Originally Posted by WantItBad View Post
Speaking of DB Snatches i tried them today and i have no idea how they should feel?
that is when they are dangerous.

get someone to teach them to you.


Posted by: WantItBad

Know anyone around Madison, WI?


Posted by: P-funk

Quote:
Originally Posted by WantItBad View Post
Know anyone around Madison, WI?
can't say i do unfortunatly. Why, are you looking for someone to train with?


Posted by: DOMS

It's not as good as a trainer, but this article may help.


Posted by: Duncans Donuts

Olympic style lifting should require a coach for the first few months. People don't understand the levels of force involved with throwing hundreds of pounds of weight, and doing an exercise out of form can put you in a hospital.


Posted by: WantItBad

Quote:
Originally Posted by P-funk View Post
can't say i do unfortunatly. Why, are you looking for someone to train with?
yes, i am everyone that lifts here at school lifts like 6 days a week one body part per day no matter what people tell them


Posted by: Duncans Donuts

Quote:
Originally Posted by WantItBad View Post
yes, i am everyone that lifts here at school lifts like 6 days a week one body part per day no matter what people tell them
I'm lifting 5 times a week one body part a day now

My workouts last about 10 - 15 minutes. I like it, because it is the only routine I can use that fits my schedule.


Posted by: LoadedBats

Quote:
Originally Posted by P-funk View Post
yea, he also says DB cleans are bad and shows a picture of Paul Chek. What a classy way to take a dig on a guy. What a fucking prick. every article polliquin writes makes me hate him more. He is a fucking idiot. I like when talks about how he can get a person to add 80lbs to their bench by adding more copper to their diet or some voodo bull shit like that. What a moron.
Ok, I understand if you disagree with some things he says, but calling him a "fucking idiot" and "moron"? Get real. Look at the list of Olympic and Professional Athletes this guy has trained....he has been in this business a long time and has an extremely impressive resume when it comes to training:

Donovan Bailey, Olympic Gold Medalist 100 m sprint
David Boston, NFL Pro Bowl wide receiver
Al MacInnis, Retired NHL defenseman, Norris Trophy winner
Joe Nieuwendyk, Florida Panthers, Conn Smythe Trophy winner, Stanley Cup winner
Chris Pronger, Anaheim Ducks, winner of Norris and Hart Trophies
Canadian short-track speed-skating team
Dwight Phillips, Olympic Gold Medalist long jumper
Nanceen Perry, World Record Holder 4 x 200 m
Michelle Freeman, former number 1 ranked hurdler in the World
Chris Thorpe, Olympic Silver & Bronze Medalist, Double's Luge
Adam Nelson, World Champion & 2x Olympic Silver Medalist, Shot Put

Also, the photos put up for the articles on t-nation are 9 times out of 10 provided by the editors (this was stated in the forum for this article) NOT by the authors. I don't agree with everything Poliquin writes either, but in know way does that mean the guys a fuckin idiot.


Posted by: fUnc17

Quote:
Originally Posted by LoadedBats View Post
Ok, I understand if you disagree with some things he says, but calling him a "fucking idiot" and "moron"? Get real. Look at the list of Olympic and Professional Athletes this guy has trained....he has been in this business a long time and has an extremely impressive resume when it comes to training:

Donovan Bailey, Olympic Gold Medalist 100 m sprint
David Boston, NFL Pro Bowl wide receiver
Al MacInnis, Retired NHL defenseman, Norris Trophy winner
Joe Nieuwendyk, Florida Panthers, Conn Smythe Trophy winner, Stanley Cup winner
Chris Pronger, Anaheim Ducks, winner of Norris and Hart Trophies
Canadian short-track speed-skating team
Dwight Phillips, Olympic Gold Medalist long jumper
Nanceen Perry, World Record Holder 4 x 200 m
Michelle Freeman, former number 1 ranked hurdler in the World
Chris Thorpe, Olympic Silver & Bronze Medalist, Double's Luge
Adam Nelson, World Champion & 2x Olympic Silver Medalist, Shot Put

Also, the photos put up for the articles on t-nation are 9 times out of 10 provided by the editors (this was stated in the forum for this article) NOT by the authors. I don't agree with everything Poliquin writes either, but in know way does that mean the guys a fuckin idiot.
So your saying that because Poliquin has trained elite athletes, he can say whatever he wants and it's written in stone? I could bring up a bigger list, of even more elite athletes that use the db clean and db snatch, but that doesn't mean anything.

Silly premise. Poliquin is a great trainer, and has pioneered the strength and conditioning scene, BUT it doesn't mean everything he says is right, or even remotely true! If that were the case, there would be no other strength and conditioning coaches.

DB cleans and DB snatches are acceptable exercises in my opinion, I do them, friends and family do them and I have not heard one complaint about a shoulder problem. These movements HELP your shoulders, among many other things.

That doesn't mean you can't jack your shoulder up doing them, BUT it does mean if you do them with proper form, you have little to worry about.


Posted by: milod

Quote:
Originally Posted by fUnc17 View Post
So your saying that because Poliquin has trained elite athletes, he can say whatever he wants and it's written in stone?
Well, I'm just guessing here, but I'm pretty sure he's saying that because Poliquin has successfully trained many elite atheletes, it proves he's not, y'know, a moron. It doesn't mean everything he says is therefore right. It does strongly suggest that most of the stuff he says isn't completely wrong.

I'm also pretty sure that P-Funk realizes this, and is simply using terms like idiot and moron for effect. Although he probably does think that Poliquin is prick.

Today's lesson in reading comprehension has been brought to you by the letter "O" and the number "0".


Posted by: LoadedBats

Quote:
Originally Posted by fUnc17 View Post
So your saying that because Poliquin has trained elite athletes, he can say whatever he wants and it's written in stone? I could bring up a bigger list, of even more elite athletes that use the db clean and db snatch, but that doesn't mean anything.

Silly premise. Poliquin is a great trainer, and has pioneered the strength and conditioning scene, BUT it doesn't mean everything he says is right, or even remotely true! If that were the case, there would be no other strength and conditioning coaches.
Re-read my post. I said I don't agree with everything Poliquin writes either, BUT that doesn't mean he's an idiot. I never stated that because he's a great trainer that his word is gospel. I posted the article to see some other points of view from here because there are a lot of well educated people that post here.


Posted by: fUnc17

Quote:
Originally Posted by LoadedBats View Post
Re-read my post. I said I don't agree with everything Poliquin writes either, BUT that doesn't mean he's an idiot. I never stated that because he's a great trainer that his word is gospel. I posted the article to see some other points of view from here because there are a lot of well educated people that post here.
I never said he was an idiot, ever. Re-read my post, that was my point of view on the article, don't take it personally.


Posted by: milod

Quote:
Originally Posted by fUnc17 View Post
I never said he was an idiot, ever.
No, but P-func did, and that's what LoadedBats was responding to when he offered Poliquin's CV as evidence.


Posted by: BoneCrusher

Quote:
Originally Posted by milod View Post
Well, I'm just guessing here, but I'm pretty sure he's saying that because Poliquin has successfully trained many elite atheletes, it proves he's not, y'know, a moron. It doesn't mean everything he says is therefore right. It does strongly suggest that most of the stuff he says isn't completely wrong.

I'm also pretty sure that P-Funk realizes this, and is simply using terms like idiot and moron for effect. Although he probably does think that Poliquin is prick.

Today's lesson in reading comprehension has been brought to you by the letter "O" and the number "0".
...

I also feel the same way on snatches, and most db work really. I've tweaked my cuffs a bit so caution is required when weight transfer isolates the cuffs. It's just form and common sense. So is eating with a fork ***thinking of the movie Dirty Rotten Scoundrels***.


Posted by: fUnc17

Quote:
Originally Posted by milod View Post
No, but P-func did, and that's what LoadedBats was responding to when he offered Poliquin's CV as evidence.
I'm well aware, who made you commentator?


Posted by: LoadedBats

Quote:
Originally Posted by milod View Post
No, but P-func did, and that's what LoadedBats was responding to when he offered Poliquin's CV as evidence.
Thank you, saves me the effort in trying to explain.







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