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Deadlift Dave's training log


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Posted by: DLDave

9/9 Lower

Zercher harness good mornings
225 x 5
275 x 5
315 x 5
365 x 5
405 x 1

45 degree back raises w/ 25 lb-ish bag of salt
3 sets of 10

Single leg reverse hypers
180 for 3 sets of 10

Kettlebell swings
3 sets of 5

Decline Abs w/ kettlebell over face
3 sets of 10

Shrug machine
315 for 3 sets of 10

Plate tree grip work
4 plates for 3 sets of 5 reps, squeeze for 5 seconds

Gym was a full house by the end of this as the recent imports showed up. It wasn't too long ago when there might be 4 people in there on a Tuesday evening. I wanted to keep the work somewhat light as I'm taking a heavy squat this weekend, but that didn't work out so well as my lower back was fried. I did cut the Zercher GM short with a heavy single at the end. One of our group was laying outside by the end of this trying to puke.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

are those zercher harness gm's better than the chain suspended gm's? I haven't tried those yet.


Posted by: DLDave

I wouldn't say they're better, but they're different. They hit your lower back very hard, but don't beat the rest of your body to hell like the chain suspended ones do. You also can't go quite as low with the harness.


Posted by: DLDave

9/11 DE Bench

Speed bench
185 for 8 sets of 3

Reverse Pec Deck
130 x 10
150 x 10
170 x 10

Wide-grip pulldowns
120 x 10
140 x 10
160 x 10

Side raises
20 x 10
25 x 10
30 x 10

Panora pressdowns
100 for 3 sets of 15

H-rolls on chest-assisted row
20 x 10
25 x 10
30 x 10

Bar speed on the speed bench was really good today. I was focusing on wrist and elbow positioning, and realized I wasn't cranking my wrist wraps nearly enough, so I had them cranked so hard today that my hands were purple. Usually when I do this my thumbs cramp, so I did a few more sets than usual to adjust to it. There's no way I could cock my wrists back with this setup today, hopefully it carries over to the heavier weight this weekend. The H-rolls on the chest assisted row bench was much easier for me to get into position, as a normal adjustable bench is too damn low. Kept most everything moderate as I have a heavy squat coming this weekend.


Posted by: DLDave

9/13 Squat

Free squat
225 x 5
Add briefs
315 x 2
405 x 1
495 x 1
Add suit, straps down
535 x 1
585 x 1
Straps up
635 x 1
Add knee wraps
705 x 1 (cut it slightly high)

Deadlifts from floor, sumo stance
315 x 3
405 x 1
495 x 1
585 x 1
635 x 1
675 x 1

Reverse Hypers
210 for 3 sets of 10

Only 2nd time I've squatted with briefs under the suit, which I did not do last meet. I couldn't get the legs on the suit pulled up high enough, which I didn't realize until Chuck pointed out this was preventing me from pushing knees out in the hole. I then discovered the the suit legs were a good 2" lower than the briefs, so I rolled the ends up, which really helped. I think I'm finally getting the hang of my gear, as the 705 was easier than the 635, which was easier than the 585, as more gear was added. I could barely breath with it all on though, my belt may need adjusted slightly to account for the weight gain. The 675 pull was very slow, probably a combination of adjusting my form and the fact that I was out of gas after the heavy squats. I have a suspicion that my conventional might be stronger now, but don't know how to test it this close to the meet.

Right now I'm thinking I'll open in the neighborhood of 675 squat and 650 pull, maybe slightly increase both openers depending on the the circa max goes. Full house at the gym today, we now have a group of 4 1000 lb squatters and a 5th who is pretty close.


Posted by: DLDave

9/14 ME Bench

225 x 5
275 x 3
315 x 1
Add shirt
365 x 3 (no touch)
405 x 3 (no touch)
405 x 2 (no touch)

Seated plate-load row
4 plates + some band for 4 sets of 5

Rope tricep pushdowns
3 sets of 10

Had no plans to touch anything today, mainly wanted to do some light weight in the shirt to see if the sleeve modification helped. I had taken an inch off before today, which helped, but going to take a little more off as I still had to roll it up a bit. The sleeves now don't feel like they're going to snap my bicep in half when the weight is at the bottom, probably because I left the sleeve end flat and not cuffed. I still need to work on speed on the descent and starting the bar lower, but with the sleeves fixed that should remove 1 variable. I'm beat to hell after yesterday's squatting and pulling, so wouldn't have been able to go any heavier today had I wanted to.


Posted by: DLDave

9/16 Lower

Close stance belt squats off low box
4 plates for 3 sets of 10

GHR
3 sets of 10

Single-leg reverse hypers
140 for 4 sets of 10

Hammer curls
25 x 12
35 x 12
45 x 12

Shrug machine
3 plates per side for 3 sets of 12

Plate tree grip work
4 plates for 3 sets of 5 reps, squeeze each for 5 seconds

Skipped the good mornings today as I'm still not fully recovered from the heavy squat/pulls this weekend. Everything else was pretty basic, not terribly hard, trying to get back to normal before starting this circa max this weekend.


Posted by: DLDave

9/18 DE Bench

Speed bench
185 for 2 sets of 3
225 for 3 sets of 3

Wide-grip pulldowns
140 x 5
160 x 5
180 x 5

Chest-assisted row
1 plate x 10
2 plates x 10
3 plates x 10
4 plates x 10
4 plates and quarter x 8
5 plates x 3

Reverse pec deck
130 x 10
150 x 10
170 x 10


Posted by: DLDave

9/20 Squat

Foam box squat w/ short chains, below parallel
225 + 160 chains for 5 sets of 2
455 straight weight for 1 set of 2

Ultrawide sumo pulls, standing on plates (work up to 50% of max)
225 x 3
275 x 3
315 x 3
365 x 3

Reverse Hypers
210 for 3 sets of 10

Kneeling pulldown abs
3 sets of 10

45 degree back raise
3 sets of 10

Today's squat session combined the 2 things I like the least, the shortened chains and squatting into the foam which was set below parallel. I finally felt stable on the last set by really pushing feet out. The pulls today really forced you to get down into position at the start, I still need to work on my timing with dropping hips but not losing momentum at the start in the sumo stance. I'm assuming next week we squat against the bands and some sort of heavy pulls.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

I'm putting the kabash on the bands. I felt like I was in a glorified smith machine yesterday


Posted by: DLDave

9/21 ME Bench

Flat bench
225 x 3
275 x 4
315 x 1
Add Rage X
365 x 3 (no touch)
405 x 0 (partially dumped forward at bottom)
405 x 2 (no touch)
455 x 2 (no touch)
475 x 1 (no touch)

Floor pin press against doubled minis (100+ lb tension)
225 x 5
315 x 3
365 x 3
405 x 3
455 x 3

My shirted bench is a complete mess right now, trying too many different things trying to figure this shirt out and for some reason trying to touch stuff i shouldn't be bothering with. I'm handcuffing myself on just about everything as I have my wrists misaligned with elbows and can't get my elbows tucked. I tweaked my bicep on the partial dump, which then led to me fighting the bar again on the next few descents as I had a lot of pain when the shirt caught halfway down. Skipped any back work to avoid aggravating the bicep. I'm out of town next weekend, so I'll pick up a moderately heavy raw day next Monday, then have 2 training weeks left to get a shirt figured out before the meet.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Are you squatting on Friday then and do you know what you're supposed to do?


Posted by: DLDave

I should be able to make the Saturday morning squat session and then leave afterwards for some family reunion BS up near Canton. A 2 hour car ride immediately after squatting should leave me good and cramped.


Posted by: DLDave

9/23 Lower

Cambered bar good mornings in monolift, lowered into foam blocks
225 x 5
275 x 5
315 x 5
365 x 5
405 x 5

Single leg reverse hypers
140 for 3 sets of 10

Kneeling Ab pulldowns
3 sets of 10

GHR
3 sets of 10

Plate tree grip work

Woke up this morning with a very tight lower back, so wisely did some heavy GM's to stretch it out. Lifted with SHW teenager and Lt. Pete Mitchell since his training partner ditched him, must not be as reliable as his old buddy. Goose.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Ian's real excited he gets to lift with the adults.


Posted by: DLDave

Ian did pretty well, got a couple of reps at 405. Wasn't pretty but he finished it.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

thread over at outlaws about touching in a rage x


Posted by: DLDave

Good info in the thread, unusual for that board. I forgot that this shirt has a reinforced neck, which doesn't help. I'm following the advice of DOH for this meet, or at least giving that a shot on my next heavy bench day. I need to do some reverse bands regularly after this meet.


Posted by: DLDave

9/25 DE Bench

Speed bench
185 for 2 sets of 3
225 for 3 sets of 3
275 for 1 set of 3
315 for 1 set of 3

Close grip bench (thumbs on smooth)
225 x 10
275 x 10
275 x 10

Wide-grip pulldowns
130 x 5
150 x 5
170 x 5
190 x 5

Reverse pec deck
110 x 10
130 x 10
150 x 4 (ouch my shoulder, stopped)

Chest-assisted row
1 plate for 10
2 plates for 10
3 plates for 10
4 plates for 10
5 plates for 5

Face pulls
100 x 10
120 x 10
140 x 15
160 x 15

Panora pressdowns
100 for 3 sets of 10

Went a little heavier on the bench today since I'm not benching this weekend and to work on descent speed with heavier weight since I have no problem with speed at 225 or under. Picked up a few things that might help, particularly relaxing shoulders. We'll see if it carries over to even heavier weights with the shirt. Softball is finally over, maybe now my shoulders and legs will actually recover during the week. I'm not designed to run bases anymore.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

I'm pretty confident we won't be asked to post our logs:

EliteFTS - Superior Products and Knowledge for Lifters, Athletes, Coaches, and Trainers


Posted by: DLDave

With the wording used in that description, I bet this isn't the log of anyone specific but probably the general gym workout that they come up with each day. We'll see how it turns out.


Posted by: DLDave

9/27 Squat

Box squat against green/purple bands (+225 at top, 130 at bottom)

235 + bands x 3
325 + bands x 2
415 + bands x 2
465 + bands x 2
505 + bands x 0 (mono started to flip while on box)
505 + bands x 1 (grinder)

Speed pulls against doubled mini-bands (sumo stance w/ briefs)
135 x 3
185 x 3
225 x 2
275 x 1
315 x 1
365 x 1
405 x 1

Reverse hypers
210 for 3 sets of 10

Decline Abs w/ 54 lb kettlebell
3 sets of 10

Hammer curls
25 x 15
35 x 15
45 x 15

The box squats were all fast and felt light, until the monolift about flipped on my 505 attempt. I had just hit the box and saw the monolift starting to go, and I lost all my air and tightness and had no chance to get back up. I didn't wait long enough to take my 2nd attempt at 505 as everyone else was done, and didn't have much left coming out of the hole.


Posted by: DLDave

9/20 Lower

Single leg reverse hypers
140 for 4 sets of 10

GHR
4 sets of 10

Single leg hamstring curls
50 for 3 sets of 10

Kneeling pulldown abs
4 sets of 10

It's apparently time to start reducing workload, as I was advised to skip the close stance squats today and only do accessory work. We'll be in full gear for our last heavy squat this weekend. I'll pick up my speed bench and bench accessory work tomorrow to give myself an extra day off before a heavy weekend.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Does anyone squat there on Tuesdays?


Posted by: DLDave

John occasionally squats on Tuesdays. JL and his buddy usually do too but don't start until 4:30 or so after 30 minutes of stretching. The rest of us are on the Chuck plan, but there are enough people there before 4 to help you out. I imagine I'll be repeating today's routine next Tuesday, so will have plenty of downtime as I was done by 4.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

I'm going to pull thur or fri then go to a squat opener next tuesday. I really don't want to do them both this Friday. I'd rather have a dedicated deadlift session so I can end up mind-fucking it. This worked for me last time, at least for my squat. I'll have 17 days rest after my last dead workout and 12 days rest after the last squat.


Posted by: DLDave

sounds like a good plan


Posted by: DLDave

10/1 DE Bench

Speed bench
185 for 2 sets of 3
185 + 1 mini-band looped under bench, for 2 sets of 3
185 + 2 mini-bands looped under bench, for 2 sets of 3
225 straight weight for 2 sets of 3

Wide grip pulldown
120 x 10
140 x 10
160 x 10

Chest assisted row
1 plate for 10
2 plates for 10
3 plates for 10
4 plates for 10
5 plates for 5

Reverse pec deck
100 x 10
120 x 10
140 x 10

Face pulls
120 x 10
140 x 10
160 x 10

H-rolls
20 for 3 sets of 10

Side raises
20 for 2 sets of 10

Kept the weight on assistance work somewhat moderate to start reducing workload and to get some rehab work in for my shoulder. The H-rolls and side raises at the end were done strictly to get a good stretch in the delts and rotators.


Posted by: DLDave

10/4 Squat

Box squat against greens and purples (add 225 at top, 130 at bottom)
235 x 5
285 x 3
Add briefs
325 x 2
375 x 1
Add suit, straps down
415 x 1
465 x 1
505 x 1
555 x 0 (lost tightness on box)

Reverse hypers
140 for 4 sets of 10

Speed pulls
315 for 4 singles
405 for 1 single

Last heavy squat day before the meet. It sucks to end this training cycle with a miss, but the good news is that the 505 was much faster than last week, which should put me about where I want to be once I add wraps and straps up. We were apparently supposed to have gone to a higher box for the last single, which would've been helpful had my group actually been told. Tomorrow is last heavy bench day, we'll see if I can get that mess sorted out.


Posted by: DLDave

10/5 ME Bench

Flat bench
225 x 5
275 x 3
315 x 1
Add loose Rage X
365 x 1 (touch)
405 x 1 (touch)
455 x 0 (abort half way)

Plate loaded rear delt row
1 plate per side + band for 4 sets of 10

Dumbbell rotator cuff work
3 sets of 10

Two meets in a row and my bench is a mess 2 weeks out. Since I hadn't touched in the tight Rage x in quite awhile, that shirt isn't going to work for this meet as the risk for bombing would be high. So I switched to a size larger shirt for today, which apparently isn't going to work either. My left shoulder has been bothering me for a few weeks, which hasn't been an issue in the tighter shirt, but this looser shirt provides absolutely no shoulder support. I aborted the 455 attempt about halfway down as my shoulder was giving out, so I pressed it back up rather than make things worse. I shut things down after that, did some very light shoulder work to try to get it stretched out. Right now it looks like my old denim will be the safest bet for the meet, so I'll throw that on next week for an opener, and maybe take a rep in the tight Rage X depending on how things feel. The biggest thing now is to get this shoulder rested and rehabbed and not let it mess with my head once I'm back under heavy weight.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Skipping tomorrow. Too backed up at work. I'll take my last one on Fri


Posted by: DLDave

10/7 Light Lower

Reverse Hypers
140 for 4 sets of 10

GHR
4 sets of 10

Kneeling pulldown Abs
4 sets of 10

Shoulder/rotator work

Uneventful day, mainly got some blood flowing to lower back and hamstrings. Added some band and light dumbbell shoulder work for some rehab. I believe we take a light free squat on Saturday, and then pretty much done with leg and back work.


Posted by: DLDave

10/8 DE Bench

Speed bench
185 for 3 sets of 3

Reverse pec deck
3 sets of 15, light weight

V-handle pulldowns
4 sets of 10, light weight

Face Pulls
100 for 3 sets of 15

Rope pushdowns
80 for 3 sets of 15

H-Rolls
15 for 3 sets of 10

Chest assisted row
2 plates for 2 sets of 10

Machine shrugs
worked up to 3 plates per side for 15

Kept most of the accessory work light today to reduce the workload and to get some additional shoulder rehab. The shoulder is still bothering me right at the top of the tricep with certain movements, but I've found some movements that are able to stretch it out and almost eliminate the pain for awhile.


Posted by: DLDave

10/11 Squat

Add briefs
235 x 3
325 x 2
415 x 1
Add suit, straps down
505 x 1
Straps up
555 x 1

Reverse hypers
140 x 1 set of 10

Standing hamstring curl
1 set of 10, each leg

Ab pulldowns w/ 2 monster-minis choked on top of rack
3 sets of 10

Last squat day before the meet, 8 days out. Chuck called my weight today, not exactly sure what percentage we were supposed to be hitting but it was lighter than we'd typically take in full gear. Our instructions were to not fight the weight in the hole and come up when it got tight. I think I was hitting depth though, or pretty close. My setup was a little off as I was in the meet monolift for the first time in awhile, but the weight flew up. The plan for now is to open 675 squat, 650 deadlift, bench TBD.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

tomorrow bring the shirt you used in your last meet, put it on early so you get used to the groove, go to a last warm-up or first attempt, and be done.


Posted by: DLDave

Yep, that's the plan


Posted by: DLDave

10/12 ME Bench

Flat bench
225 x 5
275 x 3
Add Inzer Double Denim
365 x 1 (1" from touching, up easy)
425 x 1 (touch, up easy)
465 x 1 (touch, up easy)
done

Back to the old double denim shirt, which I'll use in this meet. It fits a little better than previously as I've added a few pounds, but still a little loose. It has a much more forgiving groove, and much better shoulder support than the loose Rage X. Things still aren't perfect, shoulder isn't 100%, but today was a much better day and lets me head into the meet with some confidence. I'll open at 475, 2nd and 3rd attempts TBD based on how first bench goes and where my squat ends up. Not much planned this week, mostly rest and maybe some very light shoulder and back rehab work on Tues or Wed.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

223.5 right now, which puts me at 221 or so in the morning, and all I did was stop drinking diet coke with my lunch. I'll go in at around 218 on my scale in case the meet scale is heavy


Posted by: DLDave

Shouldn't be a problem then. Did Dan change the weigh-in times since he switched to single day, or is it still 6:30a-8a on Sat?


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Don't know


Posted by: DLDave

10/15 Misc stuff

10 min stationary bike

45 degree back raise
3 sets of 10

Hip abductor/adductor machines
4 sets of 25, light weight

Wide grip pulldown
120 for 3 sets of 10

Face pulls
100 for 3 sets of 10

Reverse pec deck
100 for 2 sets of 10

Hammer curls
30 for 3 sets of 10

Shrug machine
1 plate per side for 2 sets of 15

Last day of anything prior to the meet. Everything was kept light to get stretched and get the blood flowing. Everything feels healthy right now, which feels weird, no aches or pains, shoulder feels fine, no elbow issues for once. I'll do some stretching and foam rolling the rest of the week, then nothing but rest on Saturday.


Posted by: DLDave

10/19 Lexen Xtreme Fall Classic Results
308 Amateur class

Squat
1st attempt:675 (good)
2nd attempt:710 (miss,depth)
3rd attempt: 730 (good, ugly, 30 lb PR)

Bench:
1st attempt:480 (good)
2nd attempt: 530 (good)
3rd attempt: 550 (good, 20 lb PR)

Deadlift
1st attempt: 650 (miss, brain fart, didn't wait for down command)
2nd attempt: 680 (good)
3rd attempt: 720 (good, 40 lb PR, IPA 308 amateur record)

Total: 2000 on the nose, IPA Elite total

Two goals heading into this meet, an IPA Elite total at a minimum and wanted to hit a 2000 total. My usual problems on the squat put me in the hole from the start as I wanted to be up around 750, couldn't get a good feel in full gear and wasn't sitting back, which caused depth issues on the 2nd attempt, and had to take a smaller jump for my 3rd. By the time the deadlift rolled around, a good 9 hours after the meet started, I was cramping pretty bad in the quads and calves at lockout. This caused an issue with my opener, as both calves cramped and I stopped paying attention to the head judge and didn't wait for the down command. At this point I was worried about bombing out on the deadlift, but would've considered this meet a failure anyways had I not hit the elite total, which required a 680 deadlift, and 720 for the 2000 lb total. The 680 went pretty easy, I waited a good 3 seconds after the down command to be sure. Barely got the 720 locked-out, was holding on by my fingertips, both calves and a shoulder cramped up at lockout. We got video of the 720, I'll post tomorrow, as I'm dead tired. There was professional video shot at the meet, hopefully I'll have that to post soon.

Three of us from Lexen hit Elite totals today, including PeteTheGreek at 220.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Chuck just lost his 275 squat record and the all time total was obliterated by that Ukrainian.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Question for you. I went through your logs since the June meet. On the Saturdays when you pulled after your squats, were they max effort lifts or did you leave some gas in the tank because you were also doing some heavy lower back shit on Tuesdays? I also didn't see any speed pulls until right up to the meet.

It appears my problem is lower back strength at the start of the pull. I'm real fast off the floor and throughout the whole lift, even up to 550, but once I get close to 600 I can't get the bar off the floor. I thought the chain suspended gm's would have helped my start but it didn't work out this way. I think I need to start training conventional or hit some deficit pulls to increase the range of motion.


Posted by: DLDave

Here's what I have from my logs and as best I can remember the effort level. It looks like a fair mix of max/near max and lighter work. Except for the 8/16 session at Lifetime and I think 9/27 when Spazz, Chewy and the pros pulled from pins to failure with the big chains after I was already done, these are all from the Chuck program. My Tuesdays since the beginning of Sept were all from the Chuck program too, and those were usually pretty heavy days regardless of what we had done on Saturday. Deficit pulls should help, as will switching between conventional and sumo. The ultrawides seemed that they would be effective in helping with floor speed, but as my stance is already so wide it's of limited benefit to me.

7/5 Rack pulls, singles to 705 (near max effort)

7/22 heavy GMs, speed pulls on Tuesday (not max)

7/26 pulls with plates on pads, singles to 635 (not max)

8/2 pulls against minis, singles to 545 (miss) (max effort)

8/16 pin pulls to 725 (miss 775) at Lifetime (max effort)

8/30 deficit pulls, triples to 585 (near max effort)

9/6 pin pulls for singles, to 690 (near max effort)

9/13 singles from floor, to 675 (max effort)

9/20 ultrawide pulls for triples, 50% of single max (not max)

9/27 speed pulls against doubled minis for singles, to 405 (not max)

10/4 speed pulls to 405 (not max)


Posted by: fufu

congrats on the successful meet.


Posted by: DLDave

Thanks


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

You Are World Famous Now!!!


Posted by: DLDave

Guess I'm officially big time when Tim Bruner rips my lift!

No clue where that came from, I didn't even post that video in any of my logs yet. And really, a 2000 lb total at 308 is what, #250 in PLUSA? Barely worth a mention. Must've been the expert camera work.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

How did PL Watch find it? I didn't know the video was posted.


Posted by: DLDave

I have no idea. I just uploaded it yesterday afternoon, and didn't link to it in any logs or tell anyone about it since I had problems uploading it. All I can guess is he monitors for keywords on Youtube, but that doesn't explain how he knows my history. Guy has a lot of time on his hands if he's searching Youtube for new lifts and then connecting those with previous meet results.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Impossible for him to know your history, and wasn't this your third meet? Someone from Lexen must have emailed him your history, but they would have had to know about the video? I showed Spazz his lift then gave the camera back to you.


Posted by: DLDave

Well PL Watch does have previous meet results, as my 630 DL was #50 overall (until I just knocked it off). I just can't imagine he goes back through that history after 6 months for insignificant lifters though. I haven't been to Lexen this week, so nobody knows about that video. And if they submitted the news, I'm sure they would've mentioned that I'm a Lexen lifter, and probably would've also submitted Spazz's and Chewy's results (Chewy may have hit a pro total as he dropped to 275).

And yes, this was my 3rd meet, although results were never posted anywhere for the in-house and my DL didn't count as a record, so I'm not sure that it was completely official.


Posted by: DLDave

Deadlift video and post at Powerlifting Watch, for those wondering wtf we're talking about:

YouTube - Dave Schwab 720 lb Deadlift
Dave Schwab Totals 2,000 in 2nd Meet | Powerlifting Watch


Posted by: Stewart20

Dave, you are tremendous, I never realized just how big you are. Makes me feel very small

question for you, if I wanted to compete sometime early next year, what weight class do you think I should shoot for if I currently weight around 213ish? Keep in mind, I want to do this raw, and my current lifts are OK, but aren't exactly noteworthy for someone of my size. Should I try to lose some weight to compete in a lower class?


Posted by: DLDave

Thanks Stewart. I was at 294 for this meet, the heaviest I've ever been. I gained a good 10 pounds over the past few months, and ate so much the last couple of weeks that I can barely even look at food this week.

Honestly, for you first meet or two, I wouldn't worry about any particular weight class. Just get yourself strong and compete at whatever weight you end up at. At 213, you'd be a somewhat light 220, but would have to drop 15 pounds to get to 198. And there really isn't a whole lot of difference between those two weight classes in terms of competition. Where manipulating your weight comes into play is when you're close to hitting an elite total, pro total, winning money, etc, things that a beginner doesn't need to worry about right away, but where it can be beneficial down the road to drop 10 pounds in order to not have to lift another 80 pounds for an elite total in the heavier class. And competing raw wouldn't be a big deal, there were a few raw lifters in this past meet that I did, despite most lifters competing in gear.


Posted by: Stewart20

thats good advice, thank you.

How did the raw guys do in comparison to the gear guys? Did they get smoked? I figure if I do stay raw and want a chance to place I'd have to go into a raw only competition right? (common sense huh?) I haven't really looked into it, but I imagine it's a lot harder to find a raw competition locally than it is a "regular" one right?


Posted by: DLDave

Well the guys that competed raw are entered into a raw division, so in the overall standings within their weight class, age bracket, etc. they're "competing" only against other raw lifters. Many federations that allow gear also have raw divisions for their open meets, not all do but many do. The IPA does, I believe the APF does as well, USAPL and NASA probably do. Pete might be able to chime in with his experiences in those other feds, I've only lifted IPA. Your best bet is to take a look at Powerlifting by State & Province | Powerlifting Watch and see what federations are holding competitions in your state and area. I don't recall where you're at, I'm thinking NY/NJ area for some reason, but I don't think that's right.

But most importantly, don't think of this as competing against other people, especially your first couple of meets. Set yourself some goals and compete against those. I honestly couldn't have cared less where I finished in my weight class this time, I had particular numbers I wanted to hit that would've determined whether I felt this was a successful meet or not, it didn't matter to me if I was the top 308 or the 5th best 308.


Posted by: Stewart20

wow, that's cool to know, I didn't know they had raw divisions within the entire meet. I am so going to do this next year, I am just not happy with my lifts yet, or I would do it now. Gear lifting is out of the question for me right now, since I don't have time to train at a gym, and I am doing this by myself in my basement, so really, any respectable numbers in the competition would be a win for me, I mean how many competing powerlifters train by themselves at home no less?

and yes, you were right, I live on long island, I have to check out that link you sent to see where the closest comps would be. I think realistically for my first time, I would love to hit at least a 550 deadlift, 425 squat and 405 bench. I can see myself getting the deadlift and the bench, the squat is going to be my undoing, although I must say that I am getting better at it by the day. doing squats every workout might be paying off for me in terms of getting the form down and finding a good groove for them.

thanks for the tips, hope I'm not bothering you with all the questions. by the way, do you have a video of your squat and/or bench from this past meet?


Posted by: DLDave

No bother at all. Those are certainly respectable lifts raw. Heck, I know guys benching 600+ in a shirt that can't bench 405 raw. And many people in your weight range that can't pull 550. And worst case, you'll have some good spotters for you to test yourself in the squat and bench.

No videos of the squat or bench yet. We didn't shoot any with my camera, but the meet director is going to have a video available of all lifts soon.


Posted by: Stewart20

a 600+ bencher that can't bench 405 raw? Really? Wow, the shirt makes that much of a difference?

Right now, I just benched 337.5 for 2 singles the other day with 2 second pauses on each one. I have no doubt I can hit 365+ right now on a good day. I deadlifted 475 earlier this year, and I know I can get back to that with proper training easily. The squatting is my achilles heel, but I'm working on it.

Are elbow sleeves allowed in the raw divisions? I always wear them when I bench heavy to protect my elbows. And for squatting do they allow knee wraps, or just a belt? What do the raw lifters usually wear, just sweats and shorts, or can you wear like the power briefs or is that considered gear?


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

The problem with powerlifting today is that there are too many federations with too many divisions within federations, so you're not going to find any competition. If you're the strongest of the strong, the only big meets that mean anything are the USAPL Nationals/IPF Worlds and the IPA August and January Pro-Ams. The Arnold was a big meet before the WPO/APF went to shit.

Back when I started, there was one federation, the USPF, with one set of rules and gear standards. There were records for only 3 divisions: teenage, open and masters (over 40). Most meets only had an open division. My weight class was always stacked with 8 or 9 lifters so there were always some good battles. Because of gear improvements, drugs and egos, the sport went to shit. Instead of adapting, lifters went and formed their own federations and it just snowballed from there.

Nowadays there are probably over 20 federations with multiple divisions within each federation. A record doesn't mean anything unless it's an all-time record or an IPF record. Pretty much every federation has a raw division. If you're not competing because you're worried about getting your ass handed to you, it likely won't happen because you'll find that you will lift uncontested, so the goal is to try to get a personal best each time you go out.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Powerlifting is so divided that there are even disputes over what type of equipment is allowed in raw divisions. Some federations allow knee wraps, some don't. SOme allow only knee sleeves, etc. You have single ply federations and double ply federations. SOme federations allow briefs, but they have to be the underwear kind. SOme federations allow multi-ply shirts but they have to be closed back.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stewart20 View Post
a 600+ bencher that can't bench 405 raw? Really? Wow, the shirt makes that much of a difference?

Right now, I just benched 337.5 for 2 singles the other day with 2 second pauses on each one. I have no doubt I can hit 365+ right now on a good day. I deadlifted 475 earlier this year, and I know I can get back to that with proper training easily. The squatting is my achilles heel, but I'm working on it.

Are elbow sleeves allowed in the raw divisions? I always wear them when I bench heavy to protect my elbows. And for squatting do they allow knee wraps, or just a belt? What do the raw lifters usually wear, just sweats and shorts, or can you wear like the power briefs or is that considered gear?

The average carryover is about 100 lbs. If you're good at shirt benching, 200 lbs. If you're really good at shirt benching, 300 lbs. However, you can't just put a shirt on and magically put 100 lbs on your bench. It's a whole different movement and you have to train your lock-out. For some, it takes years to learn a shirt. Go to a multi-ply bench meet and you'll see that probably more than half the lifters will bomb-out.


Posted by: Stewart20

I don't think that my lifts are that bad right now, I just personally want to get them a little better before doing the competition. From what you guys have said, it seems like a real grueling day, so I want to be prepared as best I can for when I do it. Besides, I've only really set my sights on doing this maybe only a month or so ago, so I need some time anyway to adjust my training to get it done.

Pete, can you recommend any federations to look into for the best raw divisions?


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

I wouldn't wait till you get "better" or you'll never compete. The only time I get better is when I have a meet to train for. Go to Powerliftingwatch.com and click on the link on the left hand side of the main page for "powerlifting meets". Click on your home state and it will pull up all meets coming up in your area. Personally, I would stay away from the USAPL. They are extremely strict with their rules and the handful of meets I lifted there were boring. The AAU I think is a raw federation. The SSA fed is out of New York and those meets I hear are pretty fun. I don't know if they have a raw division but you can still lift raw in a geared meet.


Posted by: DLDave

The rules on what is considered to be gear is going to vary by federation. For the most part, elbow sleeves aren't allowed at all even in gear divisions. Most powerlifters train with elbow sleeves, and it's not an issue to take only a few competitive reps on the platform without. You can use them in the warm-up room. In most cases, power pants and knee wraps aren't allowed in raw federations/divisions, knee sleeves might me. Truly raw is a belt and singlet, and nothing else. I'd suggest finding a meet in your area, or at least one of the more popular federations, and review their rules. It doesn't look like there is much scheduled very far into 2009 at this point for NY and NJ.

And yes, you'll find that a good shirt with good technique (trust me, that's as important as anything) will get you 200-300 lbs over your raw bench for an experienced lifter. I have no idea where my raw bench is right now, but it's definitely not 550, so I'm getting a good 100-120 out of my loose fitting shirt with shitty technique.


Posted by: DLDave

10/24 Bench

Flat bench
225 for 3 sets of 10

Chest-assisted row
1 plate for 10
2 plates for 10
3 plates for 10

Reverse pec deck
100 for 3 sets of 12

Tricep pushdowns
80 for 3 sets of 12

Hammer Curls
35's for 3 sets of 10

Hex dumbbell static holds
20 for 3 sets of 30 seconds

Some light-ish rehab work today, first day of any lifting since the meet on Sunday. Haven't felt too bad this week, no real aches or pains, but didn't have much gas today, a combination of still being worn down and not eating much this week. I'll squat tomorrow and then off until Tuesday, when I'll start ramping up to normal workouts.


Posted by: DLDave

10/25 Squat

Box squat
325 x 5 sets of triples

Standing hamstring curl
3 sets of 10

45 degree back raise
3 sets of 10

Kneeling ab pulldowns
4 sets of 10

Uneventful day of more rehab work. Hips were very tight, and the light weight wasn't feeling so light. We were done in under a half hour, spent the rest of the time loading and spotting for the main squat group, who took heavy singles in full gear, some testing new suits from the EFS sponsorship. There will probably be video posted of those.


Posted by: DLDave

10/27 Bench

Speed bench, against mini-band looped under bench
225 + band for 4 sets of 3

Close-grip bench (thumbs on smooth)
225 for 3 sets of 5

Wide grip pulldown
worked up to 160 for 8 reps

Dumbbell side raises
worked up to 30 for 10 reps

Band pull aparts
4 sets of 12

Schedule is a bit off this week, and felt like getting some moderate bench work in today. Feeling fully recovered from last week's meet, so I'll start ramping things up this week, as the January meet is 12 weeks out, which I'll start training for and decide whether or not to do later based on where my lifts are at.


Posted by: DLDave

10/28 Lower

Chain-suspended good mornings w/ cambered bar
135 x 10
225 x 5
275 x 5
315 x 5
365 x 5
405 x 5

Single-leg reverse hypers
140 for 3 sets of 10, each leg

GHR's
4 sets of 10

Kneeling Ab Pulldowns
3 sets of 10

Went a little heavier on the GM's than planned, but felt OK and left a little in the tank. Back got fairly tight after the rev hypers, but nothing too bad.


Posted by: DLDave

10/30 DE Bench

Chaos bench
135 bar weight + 45 suspended on each side
3 sets of 5

Speed bench
225 for 3 sets of 3

Chest-assisted rows
1 plate for 10
2 plates for 10
3 plates for 10
4 plates for 10
5 plates for 5

Reverse pec deck
140 for 10
170 for 10
190 for 10

Face pulls
120 for 12
140 for 12
160 for 12

Dumbbell 2-hand overhead tricep extension
55 x 10
65 x 10
75 x 10
85 x 10

The chaos bench was brutal today, really hammered the stabilizers and nearly dumped forward a couple of times when those suspended plates were really moving at the top. It's amazing how much easier the 225 straight weight was immediately after. Pretty standard stuff other than that, hadn't done the overhead tricep thing in awhile and couldn't remember how heavy I usually go on that. Looks like I was 10-15 lbs short on the final set.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Back is still fucked up. Can't put any weight on my right leg. I'm taking a few weeks off to let shit heal and I'll be back at it probably after Thanksgiving, maybe sooner depending how I feel. Haven't had any substantial time off since 2001. Lynn is starting to freak out. I told him I can come in and help anytime you guys need me.


Posted by: DLDave

Probably a good idea, you don't want to be dicking around with your back, as I'm sure you know by now. What is Lynn freaking out about? It should be easy enough for him to do his heavy stuff on Thursdays if he needs to, as that's what the rest of Lexen is doing that night when he's in there.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

He's worried about his squats, he doesn't get there till 4:30 on Fridays when everyone else is finishing up. Told him I'd be there to run the hooks. Worst case scenario we can drape the chains over the top of the monolift if he's forced to dump weight, or we can get some tow straps.


Posted by: DLDave

I'm sure he'll figure it out. It's only a few weeks, probably wouldn't be the end of the world to take some moderate doubles and triples.


Posted by: DLDave

11/ 1 Squat

Box squat against blues and greens (~340 at top, 205 at bottom)
235 + bands x 3
285 + bands x 2
325 + bands for 5 sets of doubles

Full range deadlifts against monster minis
225 x 2
315 x 2
365 x 1
405 x 1

Reverse hypers
140 for 4 sets of 8

Kneeling ab pulldowns
4 sets of 10

Standing hamstring curls
3 sets of 10

This was the most tension I've squatted against, never used blues before, last couple of sets were fairly slow. Wenning worked with me on form, picked up a couple things to get into a good position from the start.


Posted by: DLDave

11/2 ME Bench

Raw bench
225 x 10
275 x 10
315 x 8
365 x 3
Add 4-board
365 x 4
405 x 2

Floor pin presses against quadded minis
225 + bands x 5
315 + bands x 3
405 + bands x 3

Seated plate-loaded row
4 plates for 4 sets of 5

Had no real plan for today other than work up for some raw reps. Ran myself out of gas with the 315 reps, didn't have much left for the rest as pecs really tightened up. No idea when I last used this heavy of weight for more than 3-5 reps. The bands on pin presses added a lot of tension, I would guess 200+ lbs.


Posted by: DLDave

11/4 Lower Assistance

Belt squat machine, to parallel box
2 plates + green band for 5 reps
2 plates + green + purple for 5 reps
2 plates + green + purple + monster mini for 5 reps
2 plates + green + purple + 2 monster minis for 5 reps
4 plates + green + purple + 2 monster minis for 5 reps

Speed pulls
225 for 3 sets of 5, conventional
225 for 2 sets of 5, sumo

Single leg extension
50 lbs for 3 sets of 10

Standing leg curls
3 sets of 10

45 degree back raise holding 20 lb-ish bag at chest
3 sets of 10

Shrug machine
4 plates for 3 sets of 30

Leg extension, hamstring curl, and back raises were supersetted. The leg extensions were supposed to be against a green and doubled mini, but I snapped the green band on my 3rd rep, as the morning crew had a setup where a dumbbell was basically sawing at the band. So we improvised and added some 25's.


Posted by: DLDave

11/5 Extra workout

15 min treadmill

Hip abductor/adductor machines
Worked up to full stack for 10 reps

Hammer Curls
35 x 10
45 x 10
55 x 10

Static barbell holds
225 for 30 seconds
315 for 30 seconds
365 for 30 seconds

Standing ab pulldowns
worked up to 140 x 10 reps

EZ bar curls
75 for 3 sets of 15

Had some extra time today so got caught up on a few things I missed yesterday or haven't done in awhile.


Posted by: DLDave

11/6 DE Bench

Speed bench, against 2 mini-bands looped under bench
225 + bands for 8 sets of 3

Wide grip pulldowns
worked up to 180 x 10

Reverse pec deck
130 x 10
170 x 10
190 x 10

Dumbbell tricep extensions
45 x 10
60 x 10

Rope tricep pushdowns
80 x 10
100 x 10
120 x 10

Chest-assisted row
1 plate for 10
2 plates for 10
3 plates for 10
4 plates for 10

Lots of band tension today at the top, made it difficult to keep the speed up on the last couple of sets. Stopped after 2 sets on the tricep extensions, elbows weren't hurting but movement didn't feel right.


Posted by: DLDave

11/8 Squat/Deadlift

Box squat w/ reverse monster mini-bands
325 x 3
415 x 2
Add briefs
505 x 2
595 x 2
645 x 2

Deadlift from floor against doubled minis
225 x 3
275 x 3
315 x 3
365 x 3
415 x 3

Reverse hypers (rollers)
140 x 10
210 x 10
210 x 10
210 x 10

Decline abs
bw x 10
small kettlebell x 10
large kettlebell x 10

I think this was the first time I've squatted with reverse bands. The monster minis probably took around 100 lbs off at the bottom and not much if anything for my height at the top. I had easily another 100+ in me on those squats and a good amount left in the deadlifts as I was feeling very strong on both, but I kept it moderate to really work on form. Feedback was that my squat form was much improved. I've spent a few days this past week doing broomstick squats at home and filming them, so that I can match a visual of what sitting back enough to what it feels like. The adjustment that Wenning recommended last week when unracking has really clicked for me, hopefully I can maintain it with heavier weight and full gear.


Posted by: DLDave

11/9 ME Bench

Flat bench
225 x 5
275 x 3
315 x 3
Add Rage X
365 x 3 (3-board)
405 x 3 (2-board)
455 x 3 (2-board)

Floor pin press against quadded mini-band
135 + bands x 5
225 + bands x 5
315 + bands x 3
405 + bands x 3
495 + bands x 3

Plate loaded horizontal row against light band
2 plates for 10
4 plates for 10
4 plates for 10

Rope pushdowns
60 for 3 sets of 12

Kept the weight moderate with the shirt to work on descent speed and since this was first day since meet in a shirt.


Posted by: DLDave

11/12 Squat/DL assistance

Good mornings, straight bar from pins at parallel
135 x 10
185 x 5
225 x 5
315 x 5
365 x 5

Pull-thrus
100 x 10
120 x 10
140 x 10
160 x 10

Seated hamstring curl
3 sets of 10

Standing ab pulldown
100 x 10
120 x 10
120 x 10

Missed the gym yesterday thanks to having to fire someone at work. Should've lifted anyways as I was plenty pissed, but it wouldn't have been productive. Regardless, good mornings from pins suck, but only option at the commercial place. Didn't go too overboard as I'm thinking of taking a heavy-ish bench tomorrow at Lexen, which tends to be difficult with a fried lower back.

On another note, boy does this place suck lately, where'd all the lifters go?


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Quote:
Originally Posted by DLDave View Post
On another note, boy does this place suck lately, where'd all the lifters go?
Just you, me and maybe Pud every 5-6 weeks.

Ran into Palmo at the Y and got a bench workout in with him. He's doing the Jan meet.


Posted by: DLDave

Quote:
Originally Posted by PeteTheGreek View Post
Just you, me and maybe Pud every 5-6 weeks.

Ran into Palmo at the Y and got a bench workout in with him. He's doing the Jan meet.
Well we've got Stewart hanging in there too.

Dan says that Lynn is doing the Jan meet?


Posted by: DLDave

11/13 ME Bench

Floor press
135 x 10
185 x 10
225 x 6
275 x 5
315 x 3
365 x 3
405 x 3
425 x 1

Skull crushers w/ easy bar and against monster mini + mini looped under bench
20 + bands for 10
30 + bands for 10
40 + bands for 10

V-bar tricep pushdown superset with overhead tricep cable extension
60 x 20, 60 x 20

Chest-assisted row
70 x 10
105 x 10
140 x 10
165 x 10

DB side raises
25 for 4 sets of 10

Pec deck rear delts
4 sets of 20

Worked with the Thursday AM group at Lexen today as my schedule is going to be off for the next few weeks, and I have work vacation days to burn. Had more in the tank on the floor presses but shut it down at 425 as I lost my tightness and it seemed like a good place to stop since I just did ME bench work on Sunday. The rest of the work was a little off since I usually do this work at a different gym on speed days and the equipment is different. The Pro group was doing shirted bench work into the foam blocks with some big weight to overload, hopefully Wenning posts it at Elite.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Quote:
Originally Posted by DLDave View Post
Dan says that Lynn is doing the Jan meet?
Yes, it will be a treat getting him ready. Are you coming in on Sundays? I'm missing this Sunday because I have to leave town for a wedding so looks like Lynn will be there by himself. I have no idea what's happened to Tim.


Posted by: Stewart20

Hey Dave. I think I'm going to do a local meet in December. It is sanctioned by the SSA if you've ever heard of that federation. Anyway, I was wondering if you could give me a quick heads up as to what to expect that day. The entry form say lifting starts at 10AM with weigh ins prior to that.

1. Should I plan to be there for the entire day? How long do meets usually take? What do you do about eating during the day?

2. I know you generally do 3 attempts for each lift. So 9 max effort type lifts in a day. How do you handle this without killing yourself in the process? I know when I used to train westside style, I was wasted after performing just one max effort deadlift, now you need to do it 3 times, plus squat 3 times at max and bench? DAMN is all I have to say about that.

3. Are the lifts in succession? IE, you start with deads and do your 3 attempts in a row, or do you do an attempt, then others go, then you come back and do your second lift, etc. How do you warm up for the lifts? Can you warm up in the back and then work right up to your contest lifts without time wasting?

I am sure I will have more questions for you as the day approaches. I know it's kind of short notice, but this is the only meet scheduled so far that is even within an hour of my home, so I figure, why not?


Posted by: DLDave

Quote:
Originally Posted by PeteTheGreek View Post
Yes, it will be a treat getting him ready. Are you coming in on Sundays? I'm missing this Sunday because I have to leave town for a wedding so looks like Lynn will be there by himself. I have no idea what's happened to Tim.
Yep, I'll still be there on Sundays, I won't be going down there on Thursdays permanently, and when I do I'll still need to do speed and lockout work on Sundays. Lynn probably needs a deload, think we'll do suspended kettlebells or something light this Sunday. I think I'm missing next Sunday (the 22nd), have to check with the wife if that's the day we'll be out of town.


Posted by: DLDave

(Snipping Stewart's original post, as this reply is turning into a book)

I've heard of the SSA, a couple of the moderators over at Fortified Iron run some SSA meets in upstate NY. From what I know it's a pretty well run fed, not sure how big it is though. But the size and popularity shouldn't really matter to you at this point.

1) This is going to depend on how many lifters and flights there are. The meets I have done have been 50-60 lifters per day, split into 2 or 3 flights of 15-20 lifters per flight. These will take pretty much all day, starting at 9am and usually ending 5pm or later. In these cases, there is a LOT of downtime between flights. See below for a description of what a flight is and how that works.

As far as eating, you'll want to eat foods that are easily digestible and that are familiar to you. You don't want to be dealing with digestion issues on meet day. Ideally, you'll go with mostly complex carbs to supply consistent energy without risking insulin spikes (i.e. sugar crashes) that you get from sugary foods. However, a good Gatorade after an event will help with recovery. What I typically pack is recovery drink to have immediately after squat and bench events, and then eat a sandwich (turkey, PBJ, etc), prepackaged apple sauce, prepackaged baby food sweet potatoes, and usually a banana after squat and bench. The baby food may sound funny, but I eat a lot of oatmeal and sweet potatoes as my primary carb sources but those are not easily portable to meets. So the baby food sweet potatoes come close and are easily digestible. Energy drinks might also be helpful, but I went overboard on these with the last meet and I'm pretty sure they contributed to my cramping by the end of the meet. Pack a candy bar or two to have right before the deadlift starts, when the quick sugar spike will be helpful and you won't have to worry about a sugar crash as you'll be done by the time that happens. And by all means, keep the water intake high all day. I don't worry too much about protein intake on meet day as the protein probably isn't going to get through your system quickly enough to matter much, but I'm probably going to start adding a protein shake somewhere in the middle of the day. You'll see some guys eat pretty sloppy on meet day, pizza is pretty popular, but I tend to eat somewhat cleanly normally anyways.

2) Yes, you'll get pretty run down on meet day, which is why the food and water intake will be important. Also, the benefit of a larger meet is that you get a ton of rest time between events. And realistically, you first attempt for each lift shouldn't be a max attempt. A general rule of thumb is that the first attempt should be a weight that you can triple, 2nd attempt should be a 5 lb PR, and 3rd attempt is all out. However, for your first meet, I'd suggest being even more conservative, maybe save the PR for your 3rd attempt so you can build some confidence.

3) As I mentioned earlier, the meet will most likely be broken into flights. Flights for bigger meets are typically arranged by weight class, amateur or pro, teen, female, etc. A typical breakdown might be flight 1 containing teens, females, and weight classes under 198, flight 2 containing 198-242, and flight 3 275 and over. This is going to vary depending on how many of each category are entered. For large 2 day meets, the teens, females, and lightweigh males on day 1, with the heavyweights and sometimes the pros all on day 2. Each individual flight is going to be arranged by weight of the opening attempt, with the lighter openers being first, and the heaviest opener going last in the flight. The flight will take 1 rotation, where each lifter takes one attempt, and then order resets for 2nd attempts, in order from lightest to heaviest. And repeat for 3rd attempts. So let's say you are in flight #2 of 3 and there are 12 lifters in your flight, and you're going to open with a 500 lb squat. First, flight 1 will go through all 3 of their attempt. You can figure a good hour for each flight, assuming at least 12 lifters per flight. While the flight before you is lifting, you'll be going through your warm-up lifts (assuming there is a separate warm-up area and equipment). Once your flight starts, everyone opening with less than 500 lbs will squat their opening attempt first, then you, then everyone with an opener over 500. Figure 1-2 minutes per lifter multiplied by the number of lifters in your flight, and that will be a rough estimate of how much time you'll have between each of your attempts. A good estimate would be 15 minutes between each of your attempts. Now for your 2nd attempt, you'll attempt 550, so the order for 2nd attempts resets. Normally you'll stay in pretty much the same order, but some people will repeat a missed attempt while others will take bigger jumps. Just be sure to pay attention to the names that are called, they'll usually call the next 4-5 lifters in order. This repeats for 3rd attempts. Once your flight is over, find someplace to relax and start eating. Ideally you'll get away from the meet area for awhile to chill out. If there are 3 flights, you'll have a good hour or so until you even need to start warming up, and probably 2 hours until your bench flight hits the platform. Two flights leaves a little less time, but you still have a good chance to eat and rest before you need to start warming up.

Posting this now, not sure if I've answered everything as this has turned into a long and rambling post.


Posted by: DLDave

As far as your warm-ups, just do whatever you do when you work up to a max single, keeping in mind that you're not trying to set a record in the warm-up room, and take reasonable jumps between warm-up sets. For example, if you're going to open with a 350 bench, don't do sets at 185, 205, 225, 245 as you're just wasting energy. As you get closer to the meet, work through your warm-ups to get a feel for # of reps at each weight and what reasonable jumps are for you.

Lastly, I would highly recommend finding someone that has some meet experience to help you with this meet. A handler is invaluable during a meet, particularly your first one, when you're already nervous and probably have no idea what's going on. Worst case, take along a friend or family member to help out so they can keep track of what flight is up, where you're at in the order, when you should warm-up, etc.

Also, all of the above info is based on my own experiences with pretty well run meets. Some meets aren't so well run. Maybe Pete will chime in with some info as well, as he's done a ton more meets in various feds over the past 40 years or however long he's been at it.


Posted by: Stewart20

thanks so much Dave, this is awesome info


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Quote:
Originally Posted by DLDave View Post
Also, all of the above info is based on my own experiences with pretty well run meets. Some meets aren't so well run. Maybe Pete will chime in with some info as well, as he's done a ton more meets in various feds over the past 40 years or however long he's been at it.
Back when I started there was one federation. Meets were few and far between so everyone showed up at the same meets. 100-200 lifters per meet, sometimes with dual platforms. At the Canton open in 1985 there were 220 lifters, dual platforms. I squatted around 11:00 am, benched at 5:00 pm, pulled at around 9:00 pm, collected my trophy at 1:00 am and went home.

We don't want to throw too much information at you at once but the most common mistake I see at meets is people starting their warm-ups too early and then trying to max out in the warm-up room before they even go out on the platform. Prior to the meet, you should time yourself and determine how long it takes you to warm-up to an opener. Usually it only takes me about 35 minutes for the squat and 25 for the bench. If you are in the first squat flight, you want to start warming up about 30 minutes before your flight starts. If you are in the second or third flight, a good time to start warming up is at the start of the prior flight. A squat flight of 10 lifters usually takes around 30-40 minutes to complete. You want your last warm-up to be when there are 10 or so lifters in front of you. I'm usually one of the last lifters in my flight so I normally take my last warm-up at the start of my flight. At your meet they will post the flights with the names of all lifters and their opening attempts so you'll know where you're at in the order.

Your last warm-up should be about 90% of your opening weight. In addition, you don't want to open with something real heavy because if you miss the attempt, you cannot pick a lower weight for your second attempt. Once you tell them your openers at the weigh in, you cannot lower the weight after your first attempt. Dave mentioned to open with something you can do for a triple but this may not be a good guage if you don't train doing triples. For the squat and bench, I follow the 50 lb rule. If I did a 725 squat training for the meet, I'll open with 675. For the deadlift I usually open with 70 lbs less because I'm usually pretty tired at this point.

Leading up to the meet, you don't want to take any 100% squat or bench weight less than two weeks out. You need your rest at this point. It's ok to go up to maybe an opener or a last warm-up when you're one week out. I wouldn't pull less than three weeks out.

Try to stick to your normal daily routine leading up to the meet. Don't alter your work schedule and go about your normal business. The night before the meet you'll probably be nervous and won't be able to sleep. This is normal. I've been fighting pre-meet nerves for 27 years and I've finally resigned to the fact that this is normal and I don't fight it any more. Usually the nerves go away once I start my squat warm-ups.

During the meet eat and drink well and don't eat any foods you're not used to eating. Finally, as Dave said, find someone to handle you at the meet. Usually there will be plenty of guys more than willing to help you. Again, the biggest mistakes I see are people starting their warm-ups too early and doing a full max effort work-out in the warm-up room before the meet even starts. Good luck.


Posted by: DLDave

11/15 Squat

Box squat w/ short chains for stability work
225 + 110 in chains for 3
225 + 230 in chains for 3
285 + 230 in chains for 2
325 + 230 in chains for 2
375 + 230 in chains for 2

GHR + Reverse Hyper superset
3 sets of 10

Standing leg curls + kneeling ab pulldown superset
3 sets of 10

The short chains made this a pretty difficult day, quite a few guys were missing lifts due to the chains throwing them around. You have to descend somewhat slowly and under control, or the chains knock you back on the box, and you can't shoot out of the hole or they'll throw you forward at the top. I should've taken one more set as I had a good amount left in the tank, but we had a few guys taking their last squats before a meet and were anxious to get going. Eight training weeks to go until the Jan meet.


Posted by: DLDave

Kungfu Panda is hallucinating today.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

I forgot to tell you that some guy stopped in yesterday asking Dan if he could join. He looked to be about 40 yrs old. Told Dan that he pulled 865 twenty five years ago and wants to start training again. That's almost as believable as 3 blues, a green and a purple.


Posted by: DLDave

Must be Chuck Fought from the future. I think Dan had one of these guys try to join not too long ago, that supposedly had a monster pull years ago.

Funny that Joe is bitching about these imaginary bands today, when he very easily could've bitched about the real monster chains that were kicking his ass.


Posted by: DLDave

11/16 DE Bench

Speed bench
225 for 6 sets of 3

Close grip pin press (thumbs on smooth)
315 x 5
335 x 5
345 x 5
365 x 5
405 x 5

Plate-loaded horizontal row
2 plates + band for 10
4 plates + band for 10
4 plates + 2 quarters + band for 8
4 plates + 2 quarters + band for 8

V-grip pulldown
90 x 10
135 x 10
180 x 10
180 x 10

Seated kettlebell shrugs
57 lb kettlebell in each hand for 3 sets of 15

Mini-band pull aparts
4 sets of 12

Just two of us today, the other guy was doing pin presses so I just did close grips after my speed bench to hit the triceps. Shoulders and upper back were pretty sore from the bench work on Thurs and yesterday's squat session, so didn't do anything too crazy today.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Did he go heavy? I told him not to do anything stupid today


Posted by: DLDave

No, he did a few pin press triples on the bench of 315, then 335, 345 and stopped. He was doing dumbbell presses when I did my back work, not sure what weight he was doing but it didn't appear to be too heavy.

Wenning and JL moving a good amount of raw weight at Elite today:
EliteFTS - Superior Products and Knowledge for Lifters, Athletes, Coaches, and Trainers


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Was that cro-magnum head with the hot girlfriend at the start of that video? What a cool head band.

Thought for sure JL would get 600 after smoking 545. Wenning was at Lexen doing some nickel and dime shit when I was there this afternoon. He made no mention of the bench contest. Of course he doesn't talk to me to begin with.


Posted by: DLDave

Yep, that was cro-magnum with the sweet headband. He's got a pretty good shirted bench from a couple of vids I've seen, he's apparently testing that new Ace shirt out there. He shows up a little later shirted-up with ~600 lb with the blue padded board thing. JL stalled hard just short of lock-out on that last rep. You should suggest to him to do more 3 and 4 boards to fix that. I think that was Travis Bell in the red Westside shirt.


Posted by: DLDave

11/18 Squat/DL Assistance

Chain suspended cambered bar good mornings against double-choked minis
240 + bands x 5
290 + bands x 5
330 + bands x 5 (3 sets)

Seated leg extensions
3 sets of 10

Single-leg reverse hypers
210 for 3 sets of 10

45 degree back raise
3 sets of 12

Purple band standing ab pulldowns
4 sets of 10

Machine shrugs
3 plates per side for 4 sets of 15

Hex dumbbell static holds
25 lb for 30 seconds
25 lb for 30 seconds
25 lb for 60 seconds

Lower back is fried, and shoulders were already beat up coming into today, GM's didn't help.


Posted by: DLDave

11/20 DE Bench

Reverse Band Bench (purple bands)
225 x 8
275 x 5
315 x 5
365 x 3
405 x 3
425 x 3
315 x 3
315 x 3
315 x 3

Reverse band bench pulldowns (double-choked purples)
4 sets of 20

Cable low row
150 x 10
170 x 10
190 x 10
210 x 10

Reverse pec deck
130 for 3 sets of 10

Double purple band face pulls (choked at top of Smith rack)
4 sets of 15

Double purple band tricep pushdowns (choked at top of Smith rack)
4 sets of 25

Got called into work this morning and missed ME day at Lexen, so hauled my purple bands into the commercial gym to play around with some new stuff. Purples felt like they took 50-60 lbs off at the chest and not much if anything at lockout. The 425 wasn't particularly difficult, but stopped there as I'll probably take something heavy-ish this weekend. The pulldowns were done with the same band setup in the rack except I double-choked at the top to add a little more resistance, and setup the same on the bench, same bar path, etc. This would be pretty effective with more resistance, but it still did hit the lats pretty well at the bottom with the purples. The double band face pulls and pushdowns lit my delts and tris pretty well.


Posted by: DLDave

11/22 Squat/Deadlift

Foam box squat w/ reverse mini-bands
235 x 5
325 x 5
415 x 3
Add briefs
465 x 2
505 x 2
555 x 2
595 x 2
645 x 2
685 x 2

Rack pulls against quadded-minis, bottom pin
225 x 3
315 x 3
405 x 2
455 x 1
495 x 1

Reverse hypers (roller)
210 for 4 sets of 10

Kneeling Ab pulldowns
4 sets of 10

Standing hamstring curl
3 sets of 10

Kettlebell swing through
24 kg for 3 sets of 10

Lower back is good and blown up, again. Using the minis for reverse bands on squat was about useless with the weight we were using, probably took less than 50 off at the bottom, and the foam didn't allow for any rebound with the bands. This is the heaviest I've gone since adjusting form, and form didn't breakdown with the heavy weight. Left something in the tank on the pulls, will probably take something to failure next week as it's been awhile.


Posted by: DLDave

11/23 ME Bench

Bench
225 x 6
275 x 3
315 x 2
Add Rage X
365 x 3 (no touch)
405 x 3 (no touch)
455 x 1 (2nd rep rolled forward)
475 x 2 (no touch, 2nd almost touched)
Add 4 board for lockout work
495 x 5

Chest assisted row
1 plate for 10
2 plates for 10
3 plates for 10
4 plates for 10

Hammer Curls
25 for 3 sets of 12

Rope pushdowns
3 sets of 15

Tweaked left bicep on one of the shirted reps, most likely the 475 when my wrists cocked way back trying to touch. I really need to work on keeping wrists straight when trying to touch, when I don't I start having arm issues. This isn't an issue when benching raw, but adding the shirt throws my technique off. Bar path was off today too, shirt felt tighter in the arms than it did a few weeks ago. I will probably limit the pressing for the next week as shoulders, elbow, and now bicep aren't feeling 100%, and with the holiday schedule a deload would fit well.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Bar path on your first few raw warm-ups look fine. As the weight gets heavier you start to bring the bar down higher. Your starting position needs to be over your belly with your elbows in a straight, vertical line with your wrists. If you bring the bar down low and your wrists roll forward, you're not tucking your elbows in hard enough to get them in a vertical line with your wrists. If your wrists cock back, you're bringing the bar down too high and the bar will end up on your face. Today I tried to push the bar over your belly at the start and you kept pushing it back. If you're gonna bring the bar down high from the start, you can't tuck your elbows or else you'll handcuff yourself. I had to completely change the way I bench when I got my first Karins shirt and it took about 8 straight sessions in the shirt to get it right.

I would suggest skipping this meet and instead work on your shirted form. This way you can concentrate on perfecting your form instead of trying to get ready for a meet. You've already done what, like 3 meets in the last 2 months? If you really feel like competing in January, do a single lift. Maybe go for a 750 deadlift. If I can stay healthy, I may do the bench only and go for 550 plus.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Here's an old video courtesy of Pud. See how Lynn guides the bar out and my starting position is over the belly. Forearms are vertical during the decent and elbows are in a vertical line underneath the wrists. If my starting position was too high and I tried to tuck, the bar would end up on my face in a tricep extension position, not to mention I'm losing like 3-4 inches range of motion.

YouTube - Pete's 455lbs x 1 bench


Posted by: DLDave

Well I haven't committed to this meet, as I said from the start that I'd train for it and do it if my lifts were progressing enough to my next set of goals. Right now my squat is, my bench isn't, and who knows about my deadlift. From now on, any bench rep under 500 is going to boards. I'm not taking another rep under 500 in competition anyways, so I shouldn't give a damn if I can touch 455. I'm taking unnecessary wear and tear fighting for that last inch to touch with that light weight, and it's impacting my ability to put a heavier weight in my hands.

Besides, I need to stay within 1000 pounds of Donnie Thompson to still have a shot at him.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Problem is you're misgrooving the bar from the start, whether there's a board there or not. You don't want to work on form using heavy weight or you'll get hurt. When I was learning the shirt, if there was a form issue during a session, I always repeated the weight before going up. I still do that in the squat and bench. Even if I make the weight, if there's a major form issue I'll repeat the weight. Just make sure you get enough practice touching. Too many benchers out there train exclusively with boards and wonder why they can't touch anything in a meet. here's a louie article you've probably seen about this:

http://www.westside-barbell.com/Arti...OUT_aug_08.pdf

Dan went 800-540-660. He missed an 840 squat and 685 dead. Burke went 695-535-555. Only made his squat opener.


Posted by: DLDave

The problem with the weight I've been using is that I end up trying to touch. I start off trying to descend faster and end up fighting for those last inches. I think I can still work on form and hitting the groove with moderate weight by using boards, might just have to alter the position of the board so I have a target that I can see. On those weeks, I would still want to end with a weight that I can try to touch, so that I'm not working solely with boards. Something like boards for 365, 405, 455, etc., and then no boards for 500, 515, etc.

That's right around where I figured Dan would end up. I didn't think he'd end up pulling as high as he was talking about. Did Burke miss on depth?


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

That will work. In the Mondo shirt I don't try to touch anything less than 455. As soon as the bar stops I start pushing back up. Once you figure out how much weight it takes to touch you don't have to try to touch the lighter warm-ups.

Dan tried to unrack an 840 third attempt but it was misloaded on one side. They let him repeat at the end of the flight but he missed. He said he locked out a 685 deadlift but judges turned it down for not having his shoulders back.

Burke missed a 740 second because he was hovering too long in the hole and the spotters grabbed the bar. He then got crushed with a 770 third.


Posted by: DLDave

11/25 SQ/DL Assistance

Good mornings, chain-suspended with cambered bar against green bands
150 + bands x 10
200 + bands x 5
240 + bands x 5
290 + bands x 5
330 + bands x 5
380 + bands x 5

Seated leg extension against 2 purples
3 sets of 10

Reverse hypers (roller)
210 for 4 sets of 10

Kneeling ab pulldowns
4 sets of 10

The cambered bar was loaded up in the rack with the greens from the morning crew when I got to the gym, and I laughed at first about doing them, but did them anyways. Tension wasn't much fun, but it felt like a good workout. Cut the rest of the back work short as I'll do plenty of tomorrow since I'll move bench assistance up a day.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Are you lifting SUnday or are you out of town?


Posted by: DLDave

I'm out of town Saturday and Sunday, squatting Friday morning with Lynn.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

I'm out of town tomorrow through Monday. I told Lynn to Lynn to hit some reverse band triples, then put the shirt on, load up the weight and do more triples to overload his lock-out but I don't think anyone will be there Sunday to help him.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

How was the tension with the greens? Were they doubled? 380 with the doubled minis was about my limit.


Posted by: DLDave

It was a lot of tension with the greens. I didn't really check to see how they were hooked, the bottom was around both pegs to form a triangle. I wasn't going to bother with them since I was by myself and it looked like it was going to be brutal, but Dan was already running his mouth about tying my total, I figured I wouldn't hear the end if I took the bands off.


Posted by: DLDave

11/26 Bench Assistance

Flat bench
135 x 10
185 x 10
185 x 10

Wide-grip pulldowns
3 sets of 10

Reverse pec deck
3 sets of 10

Seated low cable row
3 sets of 10

Face Pulls
100 x 10
120 x 10
140 x 10

Panora pressdowns
80 for 3 sets of 15

Dumbbell side raises
20 x 10
25 x 10
30 x 10
40 x 10

I watched a good amount of bench seminar video the past couple of days and couldn't resist putting on some light weight to work on bar path. Most of the pulling movements were kept moderate to avoid aggravating any of these nagging injuries.


Posted by: DLDave

11/28 Squat/Deadlift

Box squat with much-hated SSB
belt-only, no briefs
225 x 5
315 x 3
365 x 3 for 5 sets

Rack pulls, pin 5 (just below knees)
(some various warm-up weights that I don't remember)
445 x 2
535 x 2
645 x 2
755 x 1
805 x 0 (barely moved, bar too far in front)
805 x 0 (miss at lockout)

Reverse hypers/GHR superset
Hypers: 140 for 3 sets of 10
GHR: 3 sets of 10

Green band standing ab pulldowns
4 sets of 15

Took a bit of a deload on the squat today to give my shoulders a break from holding the straight bar. I'm not a big fan of the SSB since it's difficult to sit back with it, but it gives the shoulders a break. Wanted to take some rack pulls to failure since it's been awhile since I've a good strain when pulling, and the 2nd 805 definitely accomplished that, as I couldn't get my shoulders pulled back. It's been awhile since I've pulled from pins at this height, and I'm not sure I got my hips dropped much at all.


Posted by: Stewart20

dave, well, you know how I feel about gear, but I was actually wondering is there anything you can get that would serve as protection without forcing you to relearn your entire movement or give you a 100 pound edge? On the Inzer site, they have the blast shirt and the z-suit and both are relatively inexpensive, so I would assume these are far from the real deal bench shirts and squat suits, would something like that if you were to get a bigger size say provide you with hip and shoulder protection without a huge numbers advantage?


Posted by: Stewart20

Quote:
Originally Posted by DLDave View Post
11/28 Squat/Deadlift

Box squat with much-hated SSB
belt-only, no briefs
225 x 5
315 x 3
365 x 3 for 5 sets

Rack pulls, pin 5 (just below knees)
(some various warm-up weights that I don't remember)
445 x 2
535 x 2
645 x 2
755 x 1
805 x 0 (barely moved, bar too far in front)
805 x 0 (miss at lockout)

Reverse hypers/GHR superset
Hypers: 140 for 3 sets of 10
GHR: 3 sets of 10

Green band standing ab pulldowns
4 sets of 15

Took a bit of a deload on the squat today to give my shoulders a break from holding the straight bar. I'm not a big fan of the SSB since it's difficult to sit back with it, but it gives the shoulders a break. Wanted to take some rack pulls to failure since it's been awhile since I've a good strain when pulling, and the 2nd 805 definitely accomplished that, as I couldn't get my shoulders pulled back. It's been awhile since I've pulled from pins at this height, and I'm not sure I got my hips dropped much at all.
is this your normal max effort day? do you usually do heavy squats and deads in the same session?


Posted by: Seanp156

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stewart20 View Post
dave, well, you know how I feel about gear, but I was actually wondering is there anything you can get that would serve as protection without forcing you to relearn your entire movement or give you a 100 pound edge? On the Inzer site, they have the blast shirt and the z-suit and both are relatively inexpensive, so I would assume these are far from the real deal bench shirts and squat suits, would something like that if you were to get a bigger size say provide you with hip and shoulder protection without a huge numbers advantage?
I have a ~20 year old Inzer Z-Suit that's sized for a 220lber. When it was given to me, I weighed ~192ish and it still gave me a decent advantage over my raw squat. Nothing incredible, but probably ~40-50lbs. As I've gotten a little more used to it, gained weight (~208lbs now) and used my briefs with it, I get ~80lbs more over raw.


Posted by: DLDave

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stewart20 View Post
is this your normal max effort day? do you usually do heavy squats and deads in the same session?
Yes, we typically do some sort of deadlift on squat day. It's not always a full max effort deadlift, but it's usually somewhere above speed pulls, and pretty heavy every 2-3 weeks. If you look through my log over the past few months, we've gotten away from the traditional Westside template as we have only 1 day per week where we do both squat and deadlift, and the other lower day is lower back and hamstring work through other movements, instead of speed squats and speed pulls.

On your other question, see Sean's reply on the Z-suit. I have no experience with the Blast shirt, but I do know some people who use the Blast shirt a size big to get the shoulder support. Even a properly fitted Blast shirt won't give you much carryover from your raw bench, and I've heard they're very uncomfortable when fitted properly.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Chuck F's going after the all time shw record? He'll need to go 1200-800-910.


Posted by: DLDave

Quote:
Originally Posted by PeteTheGreek View Post
Chuck F's going after the all time shw record? He'll need to go 1200-800-910.
I suppose it's doable. He didn't get crushed by the 1150 or whatever it was he attempted at the last Pro-Am, and he should be good for a 900 pull soon. That would be a big jump on the bench though. It would be nice to see the WR set with legit lifts, and Chuck definitely squats to depth.


Posted by: Stewart20

ok posting this here, but really dave, sean, or pete can answer. What exactly does it feel like to squat in a suit? I mean, what should I expect to feel the first time I try the z-suit and squat? The suit lets you squat more. OK, so lets say I can squat 405 with just my belt. So with the suit, maybe you figure add 50 pounds to that to get 455. Now, obviously there is no way I get that raw, so how exactly does it help you squat the weight? If the weight is more than I can handle without the suit, how do I not get crushed by the weight? what is the work in period to get up to that advantage? Like, I just can't see loading up the bar with 50 more pounds and squatting it, do you just proceed like you normally would, but you are able to just keep going up in effect, where without the suit you would be stuck?

i hope i am being clear.


Posted by: DLDave

12/1 Bench

Flat bench
225 x 5
275 x 5
315 x 3
315 x 3
315 x 3
225 x 8
135 x 8

Chest-assisted row
1 plate for 10
2 plates for 10
3 plates for 10
4 plates for 10
5 plates for 5

Reverse pec deck
150 for 3 sets of 10

Face pulls
100 x 15
120 x 15
140 x 15

Panora pressdowns (hold lockout for 3 seconds each rep)
80 for 3 sets of 10

Was out of town this weekend and missed bench day yesterday, so picked up some moderate raw weight today. Mainly working on faster descent and maintaining a slide type of bar path, got a good feel for it raw but it's a different ballgame with the shirt on. Threw some down sets in at the end to get a few more reps in.

Key clips from the Metal Militia seminar DVD I've been using to work on technique and bar path:
YouTube Video

YouTube Video

YouTube Video

YouTube Video



Posted by: DLDave

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stewart20 View Post
ok posting this here, but really dave, sean, or pete can answer. What exactly does it feel like to squat in a suit? I mean, what should I expect to feel the first time I try the z-suit and squat? The suit lets you squat more. OK, so lets say I can squat 405 with just my belt. So with the suit, maybe you figure add 50 pounds to that to get 455. Now, obviously there is no way I get that raw, so how exactly does it help you squat the weight? If the weight is more than I can handle without the suit, how do I not get crushed by the weight? what is the work in period to get up to that advantage? Like, I just can't see loading up the bar with 50 more pounds and squatting it, do you just proceed like you normally would, but you are able to just keep going up in effect, where without the suit you would be stuck?

i hope i am being clear.
I follow what you're asking. I don't know if Sean follows this log much, but he could best answer specifics about the Z-suit. I can tell you some general info based on my experience with a couple different 2-ply briefs and suits, which will be somewhat relevant for you. A suit or briefs provides support in the hips and legs, and a suit will add support up your back as well. At the bottom of the squat, with proper form, the suit will act as a harness and catch you. A good suit will also provide some rebound to help reverse your direction. That doesn't mean that you can load 300 lbs over your raw max on the bar on Day 1 and the suit will keep you from getting crushed. Your body is still very much involved. The suit keeps your body tight so that you hips, groin, etc don't explode. Once you're ready to use your Z-suit, I'd suggest just going through your normal squat workout a few times to adjust to it. Once you're comfortable, then start going to your raw max and slightly above to see how it goes.


Posted by: Stewart20

Quote:
Originally Posted by DLDave View Post

Was out of town this weekend and missed bench day yesterday, so picked up some moderate raw weight today. Mainly working on faster descent and maintaining a slide type of bar path, got a good feel for it raw but it's a different ballgame with the shirt on. Threw some down sets in at the end to get a few more reps in.
I like what they were saying about sliding the bar, seems to make sense, I might have to try it with some light weight before saturday to see if it is something that I can use right away, or if I am going to have to spend time perfecting it. I am sure I will know by 225 whether or not it's going to work for me in time for the meet.


Posted by: Stewart20

Quote:
Originally Posted by DLDave View Post
I follow what you're asking. I don't know if Sean follows this log much, but he could best answer specifics about the Z-suit. I can tell you some general info based on my experience with a couple different 2-ply briefs and suits, which will be somewhat relevant for you. A suit or briefs provides support in the hips and legs, and a suit will add support up your back as well. At the bottom of the squat, with proper form, the suit will act as a harness and catch you. A good suit will also provide some rebound to help reverse your direction. That doesn't mean that you can load 300 lbs over your raw max on the bar on Day 1 and the suit will keep you from getting crushed. Your body is still very much involved. The suit keeps your body tight so that you hips, groin, etc don't explode. Once you're ready to use your Z-suit, I'd suggest just going through your normal squat workout a few times to adjust to it. Once you're comfortable, then start going to your raw max and slightly above to see how it goes.
so when you say the suit should "catch" you, if you are using proper form should you then be literally "dive bombing" into the squat and not really focus on your muscles doing the lowering? Right now, I descend pretty quick, but completely under control, it's like a controlled negative, and then go back up, but with the suit, and correct me if I am wrong here, you can just drop with the confidence that the suit will catch you?


Posted by: DLDave

You'll still want to descend under control, and I doubt that the Z-suit will fully stop you, but you get the idea. A tight 2-ply suit with tight 2-ply briefs will require a good amount of weight to get proper depth, but the Z-suit won't give you quite that much support.


Posted by: Stewart20

Quote:
Originally Posted by DLDave View Post
You'll still want to descend under control, and I doubt that the Z-suit will fully stop you, but you get the idea. A tight 2-ply suit with tight 2-ply briefs will require a good amount of weight to get proper depth, but the Z-suit won't give you quite that much support.
right, i kind of figured that, I was just looking for some support because I am creeping up into 400 pound territory and really don't want to injure myself if I don't have to, lol. i won't even look at a 2 ply suit until I am able to join a gym full time and train with guys that use them all the time


Posted by: DLDave

Honestly, getting some reps in the suit will give you the best answers to your questions. It's difficult to understand lifting with gear until you give it a try.


Posted by: DLDave

12/2 Squat/Deadlift Assistance

Good mornings with chain-suspended cambered bar
135 x 10
225 x 5
315 x 5
365 x 3, 4 sets

Standing hamstring curl
4 sets of 10

Seated leg extension
75 for 3 sets of 10

Kettlebell swing thrus
small kettlebell for 1 set of 10
52 lb kettlebell for 3 sets of 10

Kneeling ab pulldowns
3 sets of 10

Machine shrugs
315 for 1 sets of 30
315 for 2 sets of 20

45 degree back raise
52 lb kettlebell on chest for 2 sets of 10
BW for 1 set of 10

Would've had 405 on the GM, but the bar was misloaded. Lower back is good and fried, kb swingthrus did a number on my hamstrings too. Finally got my altered Predators back from Inzer, had them make some major adjustments so tried them on in the gym as I needed something to hook onto to pull them on. These are good and tight, I might finally have some briefs that require some weight to get to parallel.


Posted by: DLDave

12/4 DE Bench

Speed bench
225 for 6 sets of 3

Barbell rows
135 x 10
185 x 10
225 x 10

Seated low cable rows
150 x 10
170 x 10
190 x 10

Overhead tricep cable extensions
80 for 3 sets of 10

Face pulls
100 x 12
120 x 12
140 x 12
160 x 12

Panora pressdowns
80 for 3 sets of 10

Reverse wrist curls
50 for 3 sets of 10

Speed bench wasn't so speedy, as I was working on technique again, pretty much resetting between each rep. I learned during the barbell rows that we're taking a heavy squat this weekend to start circa max, and everyone else deloaded on Tues (I didn't), so I figured I should stop the barbell rows as this stresses my lower back, which is still fairly tight from the GM's on Tues. So Sat should be fun.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

This guy lifts at the Y, not a bad touch and go bench for an old man. Says he's benching at the Pro-Am:

YouTube - Jeff Chrissis Hits a Personal Best Bench Press of 425 lbs.!

Here's Palmo, he's doing the full meet at the Pro-Am:

YouTube - Palmo Aracri bench-presses a massive 605 pounds


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Please be advised that Dan took the purple bands off the base of the varsity rack so the girls could do reverse bands squats in the JV rack. Dan did not put them back when they were done. In case Chuck has a meltdown, we had nothing to do with it.


Posted by: DLDave

No meltdowns today, Chuck and crew took a road trip to EFS


Posted by: DLDave

12/6 Squat/Deadlift

Free squat
(various warm-up doubles in Predators and belt)
505 x 1
545 x 1
595 x 1
635 x 1
add suit, straps down, no wraps
685 x 1
straps up
725 x 1 (smoked)
775 x 0 (lost air halfway up)

Deadlifts against doubled minibands
135 x 3
225 x 3
Add suit with straps up
315 x 1
365 x 1
405 x 1
455 x 1
495 x 1

Kneeling ab pulldowns, superset with standing leg curls
3 sets of 10

Other than the bar crushing my traps somewhere in the 500's and leading to some very painful singles the rest of the way, the squats felt very strong. Everything was flying up, even the 775 was coming up fast until I took a breath halfway up (wtf?). Feedback was that form was dialed in today, if I can keep it that way through circa max I should have a shot at something close to 800 in January. The Predators were very tight, which was good in the hole with the heavier weight. After having those on for nearly 2 hours, wearing the suit only on the deadlifts felt very loose. Shutdown the deadlifts a few sets early as I was out of gas and traps were killing me at lockout.


Posted by: PeteTheGreek

Did you use that squat bar from hell? I can barely get my hands around it


Posted by: DLDave

No, they took it to Elite. I guess I'm going to have to wait the 3 hours it will take to squat in the varsity mono if I want to use it before the meet.


Posted by: DLDave

12/7 Bench

Flat bench
225 x 5
275 x 3
315 x 1
Add Rage X
405 x 3 (2-board)
405 x 3 (2-board)
455 x 3 (2-board)
Add reverse green bands for lockout work
495 x 3 (no touch)
545 x 3 (no touch)

Chest assisted row
1 plate for 10
2 plates for 10
3 plates for 10
4 plates for 10

Rope pushdowns
3 sets of 10

Bench felt much better with new groove, and most of the weight came up pretty fast. I wanted to stick with moderate weight to work on groove and also since my shoulders are a wreck after the heavy squats yesterday. Threw in some reverse band lockout work at the end since it was setup, probably shouldn't have tried to touch those weights but didn't fight it too much at the bottom.


Posted by: DLDave

12/9 Squat/Deadlift assistance

Zercher GM's
225 for 5 sets of 5

Chuck V lower back harness, worn backwards
2 plates for 3 trips of ~30 yards

Reverse Hypers (strap)
245 for 3 sets of 10

Kettlebell swing thrus
26 kg for 3 sets of 10

Standing hamstring curl
3 sets of 10

Kneeling ab pulldowns
3 sets of 12

Hammer curls
35 for 3 sets of 12

Kettlebell shrugs
16 kg for 4 sets of 15

Hex dumbbell hold
16 kg for 30 seconds
26 kg for 30 seconds, 2 sets
26 kg for 60 seconds

Took it somewhat easy today as shoulders are still in bad shape from the weekend. The Chuck V harness is some contraption that Chuck had welded together, looks sorta like the Zercher harness but slightly different. When worn correctly, it blows up your posterior chain. We were instructed to wear it backwards today, which made it more difficult to stay balanced.


Posted by: DLDave

12/11 DE Bench

Speed bench
185 for 4 sets of 3 (reps as fast as possible)
225 for 4 sets of 3 (fast single rep, reset between)

Strip the rack press
315 x 5
405 x 5
455 x 5
495 x 5

Cable rows
140 x 10
160 x 10
180 x 10
200 x 10

Side raises
20 x 10
25 x 10
30 x 10
35 x 10

Rope pushdown
60 for 4 sets of 20

Face pulls
100 x 10
120 x 10
140 x 10
160 x 10

Abs
3 sets of 10

Basic stuff, bar was moving fast on the 185 sets and took some heavier reps to work on technique.


Posted by: DLDave

12/13 Squat/Deadlift

Reverse band free squat, with green bands
(warm-ups of various weights)
Add Predators
405 x 2
495 x 2
555 x 2
595 x 2
645 x 2
Add parallel box
685 x 2
735 x 2
775 x 2 (smoked)
825 x 1 (smoked)

Speed pulls against doubled minis
325 for 5 sets of singles

45 degree back raise w/ 16 kg kettlebell
3 sets of 10

Abs on decline bench w/ 16 kg kettlebell
3 sets of 10

So much for the deload day that I was expecting. The 825 felt good, I could've doubled it and had another good 50+ lbs in me. It's amazing how much easier it is to squat when you put your body in the right position to handle the weight. The greens feel like they take off maybe 100 in the hole. All of the free squats were called below parallel per Chuck, as he's expecting tight judging in this meet. Worked on technique on the speed pulls, including locking my knees hard at lockout, as I've been getting into a bad habit of locking them and then letting them slightly unlock as I pull my shoulders back. This is probably going to take some verbal cues, as it's an easy fix if I can remember to do it.


Posted by: DLDave

Where the hell did PeteTheGreek's journal go? It's vanished


Posted by: DLDave

8 hours later, I remember that the bands we used today were purple.


Posted by: Seanp156

Quote:
Originally Posted by DLDave View Post
Where the hell did PeteTheGreek's journal go? It's vanished
He had the mod's delete it.


Posted by: Stewart20

why,? what happened?


Posted by: DLDave

PeteTheGreek has decided to give mixed martial arts a try, look for him on the old guys circuit


Posted by: DLDave

12/14 Bench

Bench
225 x 8
275 x 3
315 x 1
Add Rage X
405 x 3 (2-board)
455 x 3 (2-board)
505 x 1 (no touch)
525 x 1 (no touch)
525 x 1 (no touch)

Skipped reverse bands as arm wasn't feeling great

Wide-grip pulldowns
3 plates for 3 sets of 10

Rope pushdowns
3 sets of 10

Mini-band pull aparts
4 sets of 15

Mini-band face pulls
4 sets of 12

Wanted to try to touch an opener today, which didn't work out as planned, as I took the handoff too far over face on the 505 and tweaked my bicep, which resulted in being too cautious and slow on the 2 525's. Considering dropping the Rage X again and going with the denim for this meet. I know I can hit 600 in the Rage X if I can get the bar path dialed-in consistently, not so sure that the denim can get there.


Posted by: Stewart20

Quote:
Originally Posted by DLDave View Post
PeteTheGreek has decided to give mixed martial arts a try, look for him on the old guys circuit
for real?


Posted by: DLDave

12/16 Squat/Deadlift assistance

Chain-suspended good mornings w/reverse blue band
135 x 10
225 x 5
275 x 5
315 x 5
365 x 5
405 x 5

Speed pulls
315 for 6 sets of singles

Back extension holding plates at chest
2 25's for 10
2 35's for 10
2 45's for 10

Reverse hypers
210 for 3 sets of 10 (strap)

Abs against blue band on GHR
3 sets of 15

Static plate holds
2 25's for 30 seconds for 3 sets (single handed)
2 45's for 30 seconds for 2 sets (two handed)

Reverse band on the GM's didn't do much, starting position wasn't low enough to take much off at the bottom, and the bar came out of the bands before the halfway point. Lower back was good and tight by the end of the back extensions though.



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