Dips [Forum Archive]

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Dips

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Posted by: kiko

How low should I go when doing dips on parallel bars? Until my arms are at a 90 degree angle?

Posted by: Ben dur

i like to go just past 90

feels good to stretch out my chest after DB bench press and inclined DB press

careful not to strain the deltoids

Posted by: danzik17

I would go to 90 degrees. Any past that and you are putting the shoulders in an extremely mechanically disadvantaged position.

If you want the small stretch like Ben dur does, I would do it with bodyweight ONLY, and only after you are able to do full sets. Don't start off doing that. IMO there are better ways to stretch the chest though (DB flys for example).

Posted by: kiko

Should the upper body be straight or leaning forward a little bit?

Posted by: Ben dur

leaning forward puts less strain on the shoulders, but some may call this "bad form" i lean forward slightly

Posted by: Gazhole

Go down as far as is comfortable. This isnt to say that it shouldnt require EFFORT, dips are a tough movement, but some people i know find it actually painful in the shoulders/sternum before getting to 90 degrees.

Holy bad flexibility batman.

But yeah. 90 degrees or thereabouts, i have a slight lean forward also but that happens naturally when i do the movement.

Posted by: KelJu

It really depends on the weight for me. If I am doing body weight I can go lower than 90 degrees. If I am doing weighted Dips with an extra 100lbs, I will wreck my shoulder if I go below 90 degrees.

Posted by: ReproMan

I thought leaning forward made them more difficult and gets your chest involved more? Is that just a myth?

Posted by: Witchblade

I don't do dips.

Posted by: danzik17

Quote:

Originally Posted by ReproMan

I thought leaning forward made them more difficult and gets your chest involved more? Is that just a myth?

No, that's true. The question is really just how far can you lean forward? If you could get horizontal, then you would basically be doing suspended pushups.

Posted by: ReproMan

Quote:

Originally Posted by danzik17

No, that's true. The question is really just how far can you lean forward? If you could get horizontal, then you would basically be doing suspended pushups.

Except your feet aren't there for support like they are for suspended push-ups. Plus aren't suspended push ups usually performed with bands or chains to train stability?

Posted by: danzik17

Quote:

Originally Posted by ReproMan

Except your feet aren't there for support like they are for suspended push-ups. Plus aren't suspended push ups usually performed with bands or chains to train stability?

I didn't even know there was such a thing as suspended pushups

The comparison was just intended to show that you are essentially in a pushup position at that point, so yes it would work your chest.

Posted by: P-funk

Quote:

Originally Posted by Witchblade

I don't do dips.

me either

Posted by: largepkg

Quote:

Originally Posted by P-funk

me either

OK, I have to know why? Aren't they a great upper body compound movement?

Posted by: min0 lee

Quote:

Originally Posted by largepkg

OK, I have to know why?

Me too, I love them but with my busted shoulder I am limited to the amount of weight I can add.

Posted by: Ben dur

im sure most people who do avoid them, do so because of discomfort in their shoulders, or because of a previous shoulder injury

Posted by: rahaas

1 x a week in my current routine for me with body as vertical as possible.

Posted by: Robert D.

Quote:

Originally Posted by P-funk

me either

why?

I love dips!

Posted by: Witchblade

Quote:

Originally Posted by largepkg

OK, I have to know why? Aren't they a great upper body compound movement?

Unnecessary stress on the shoulder and sternum. Plus the movement is not functional and not natural.

Posted by: biggfly

Quote:

Originally Posted by Witchblade

Unnecessary stress on the shoulder and sternum. Plus the movement is not functional and not natural.

I disagree...very effective exercise IMO. Why isnt it natural or functional as compared to many other lifting movements??...no one in everyday life walks around just lunging, benching, doing pull ups, power cleans etc...it seems as natural as most other lifts, just pushing up your body weight vertically.

Posted by: KelJu

Quote:

Originally Posted by Witchblade

Unnecessary stress on the shoulder and sternum. Plus the movement is not functional and not natural.

I disagree. I credit dips for my super human ability to climb to the top of trees in seconds.

Think about it. To climb a branch you have to be able to do a pull-up, then have the shoulder power to flip your elbows around, then you have to perform a dip to get your feet on the branch.

I have yet to meet my equal at climbing trees.

Posted by: Ben dur

i would disagree to the "no one walks around etc."

pull ups are a very natural motion
many practical applications require the use of the very motions and muscles

lunges and squats as well

bench press
dead lifts
etc

all that being said...
i do agree that it(the dip) is a practical movement

how does one exit a pool?
the dip motion

climbing a wall?
pullups + dip

push something away from oneself
bench press

push something along a path (like pushing a car)
lunges

pick up heavy shit
dead lifts and squats

these motions are all natural and practical

Posted by: Ben dur

watch yourself...
im a marine

i can climb some ridiculous shit

Posted by: biggfly

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben dur

i would disagree to the "no one walks around etc."

pull ups are a very natural motion
many practical applications require the use of the very motions and muscles

lunges and squats as well

bench press
dead lifts
etc

all that being said...
i do agree that it(the dip) is a practical movement

how does one exit a pool?
the dip motion

climbing a wall?
pullups + dip

push something away from oneself
bench press

push something along a path (like pushing a car)
lunges

pick up heavy shit
dead lifts and squats

these motions are all natural and practical

That was my point exactly, if dips arent natural or practical, then neither are any of the others...point is they are natural and functional.

Posted by: Ben dur

then agreed

Posted by: biggfly

I realize we walk around doing the same motions as bench press etc. what I was getting across is we don't just walk around mimicking the exact movements of these exercises, as it was in response to the dips arent practical or natural, we don't just walk around doing dips everyday, but pushing your body weight vertically is practical and utilized in very much in your daily life.

Posted by: Ben dur

i see what your saying

the exact motion of a lunge for instance isnt exactly normal
itsnt abnormal though

and all muscles are utilized in many movements

i can see your point

this is why we try to keep the motions different
mix different motions into your workout to keep all major muscles, and stabilizing muscles equally developed

Posted by: KelJu

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben dur

watch yourself...
im a marine

i can climb some ridiculous shit

But I am half Mountain Gorilla.

Posted by: Ben dur

true...

Posted by: P-funk

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prince

why?

I love dips!

To much strain on my AC joint and I feel lots of pain in the anterior capsule of my shoulder and over the biciptal groove whenever I do them.

Posted by: Witchblade

Quote:

Originally Posted by biggfly

I disagree...very effective exercise IMO.

Sure it will build muscle and strength, but there are variants that do the same without trying to tear your shoulder out of its socket.

Quote:

Why isnt it natural or functional as compared to many other lifting movements??...no one in everyday life walks around just lunging, benching, doing pull ups, power cleans etc...it seems as natural as most other lifts, just pushing up your body weight vertically.

Lunging is one of the most functional and natural gym movements. In sports and everyday life it is very common to take a big step or brace yourself with one leg infront of you. Pushing a heavy object, playing hockey, car-pulling, catching something when you can't dive, etc.

The bench press is not a natural or functional movement, agreed. I don't bench either.

Pull-ups are man's primary way of climbing when there is no foot support.

Power cleans are a power exercise. Developing power in the hips and being able to perform triple extension properly are extremely valuable feats in everyday life and sports.

With dips, your feet are suspended in the air and you are pushing your body upwards with your arms. How often does that happen outside of the gym? As for muscle-ups, see below.

Quote:

Originally Posted by KelJu

You are describing an exercise called 'muscle-up'. It's a power exercise, not a strength exercise. The power comes from your hips primarily, the pull secondary and the push lastly. Also, the grip is different.

Posted by: JailHouse

I stopped doing dips also because of shoulder pain. It would get so bad some times it would be hard to sleep because id have to constantly adjust my shoulder all night.
I want to start doing them heavy again but not go below 90, maybe even slightly above. I do think they are highly effective.

Posted by: KelJu

Fuck all of ya'll then. Maybe I like doing Dips because I am the only person in my gym that can do them with 150lbs strapped to me.

Posted by: JailHouse

Quote:

Originally Posted by KelJu

Fuck all of ya'll then. Maybe I like doing Dips because I am the only person in my gym that can do them with 150lbs strapped to me.

Your shoulder must be a bone/iron hybrid lol.

Posted by: KelJu

Quote:

Originally Posted by JailHouse

Your shoulder must be a bone/iron hybrid lol.

The truth is, I have never broke or fractured a bone in my life. Neither has my dad or my brother. On the other hand, my connective tissues suck donkey balls.

Posted by: min0 lee

Quote:

Originally Posted by Witchblade

Unnecessary stress on the shoulder and sternum. Plus the movement is not functional and not natural.

I disagree also, done right your chest will grow like a weed.

Posted by: biggfly

Quote:

Originally Posted by Witchblade

Sure it will build muscle and strength, but there are variants that do the same without trying to tear your shoulder out of its socket.

Lunging is one of the most functional and natural gym movements. In sports and everyday life it is very common to take a big step or brace yourself with one leg infront of you. Pushing a heavy object, playing hockey, car-pulling, catching something when you can't dive, etc.

The bench press is not a natural or functional movement, agreed. I don't bench either.

Pull-ups are man's primary way of climbing when there is no foot support.

Power cleans are a power exercise. Developing power in the hips and being able to perform triple extension properly are extremely valuable feats in everyday life and sports.

With dips, your feet are suspended in the air and you are pushing your body upwards with your arms. How often does that happen outside of the gym? As for muscle-ups, see below.

You are describing an exercise called 'muscle-up'. It's a power exercise, not a strength exercise. The power comes from your hips primarily, the pull secondary and the push lastly. Also, the grip is different.

Just because YOUR shoulders are unable to sustain the movement doesnt deem it unnatural or impractical...that simply is your issue, not the actual exercise. My shoulders handle it just fine, as do many many others, so to some degree the exercise isn't all that useless or unnatural. Its to each his own, but your issues with it doesn't deem it a waste.

Posted by: KelJu

Dips never hurt my shoulder. Bench press is always what destroys mine, and bench press is a more natural or excepted movement.

Posted by: ReproMan

Dips are actually the only "push" movement I do that doesn't hurt my shoulders. I love them.

Posted by: Witchblade

@ all above: I said dips are effective at building mass and strength, but they are still unnatural and not functional.

You can do dips without pain, sure. I don't feel pain when I do them either. The point is that pain and stress are not the same. You could deadlift with a round back for years without pain until you herniate a disc. You could do behind the neck military presses for years without pain until you dislocate your shoulder. More general, you can run a high risk or bad program for a long time before you start seeing the negative consequences.

But hey, it all depends on what's more important to you. Health is a higher priority than mass for me, so I avoid risky exercises. Others might find mass more important and use steroids. It's your own body, go for it.

Posted by: GOtriSports

I also love dips. I think the main reason I enjoy doing them so much though is because I used to be too fat to do them (and pull ups). Since I have lost weight I can do them both and add weight to myself while I do them. I have never once had any pain in my shoulder when I do dips.

However I do sometimes have a small pain in my left hand/wrist when I do dips BUT I attribute that to the fact that the dip machine has crappy handles and about 4 years ago I broke my left wrists had some surgery on it and it still has some pain when I put too much pressure on it. You can see how this could cause problems for push-ups bench press, ect, but the pain is not so bad that I cannot keep working out so I just ignore it because the only option is live with the pain or quite half of the most important exercises in my work-out.

Posted by: Ben dur

i do bench dip movement when getting up off a deep chair...

is sitting in a chair unnatural?

Posted by: ReproMan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Witchblade

But hey, it all depends on what's more important to you. Health is a higher priority than mass for me, so I avoid risky exercises. Others might find mass more important and use steroids. It's your own body, go for it.

So that's your excuse for being scrawny?