The NHE and ONE - cut and bulk

kuso · 11-22-2002, 09:19 AM

I do most of my reading in the early hours of the morning with full brain fog lol

Anyway, I think your original plan was 2 on 2 off 2 on right? Why the change? Or was that posted already?? lol

I must say this quote from you ""Well, by the time he could send anything over here once he's made his descision i'd be off PS for about 4-5 weeks"" made me wonder. lol

Twin Peak · 11-22-2002, 09:22 AM

Rob, he's drunk.

kuso · 11-22-2002, 09:24 AM

Yep....just went through this again and noticed this...which I had read ""Today is the last day of application of this first two week cycle. I'm now gonna spend at least 2 weeks making sure i keep all my gains, via shorter training sessions, lower volume, shy of failure training, EC throughout the day, keeping protein and carbs up (i.e. no low carbs), nicotine gum and extra zinc.""

But can`t find where you decided to cut or not for the 4 weeks

Robboe · 11-22-2002, 09:25 AM

Nah, i never had a proper plan i was gonna implement. But 2 on, 2 off, 2 on, 4 off, 2 on, 8 off etc.. was a proposed potential plan. At the time it seemed like i was gonna go that route, but i'm in no hurry and other commitments have come up (as expected). And with christmas coming up (during which time i plan on taking a much required week off), i don't see the point.

Yeah, by the time Mike's chosen the testers and shipped out and given instructors, it would be about 4-5 weeks off PS for moi.

Robboe · 11-22-2002, 09:27 AM

Kuso, i decided, just on wednesday i think, not to bother with the 4 week cut just now cause of University commitments. I'm just doing the sub-concious calorie cycling thing for now.

I may squeeze a short cut in the new year and maybe start a proper cut again sometime afterwards. Maybe around easter time.

kuso · 11-22-2002, 09:31 AM

I can see that, if your school year is the same as Oz this is the most stressful time for you as it is.

Are you thinking to stake the ONE with anything next time round, or just stick with the 1-T?

Robboe · 11-22-2002, 09:37 AM

Like what?

4-AD and shit like that?

Nah, i'm not that into all this PS/PH stuff.

1-T was just something i've seen people rave about and wanted to see what all the fuss was about.

At the end of the day, i'm not really big on supplements. This was just an experience i wanted to have.

kuso · 11-22-2002, 09:41 AM

4-AD was what I was thinking.

It is good to see what the fuss is about though, self experimentation and all.

Robboe · 11-22-2002, 09:47 AM

Yeah, i'm like that.

If i offer advice to anyone about something i haven't done or tried, i let them know that i have no personal experience with it before telling them my opinion. It's why i don't try and give gear advice. Not to mention the fact that i know very little about gear.

kuso · 11-22-2002, 10:00 AM

Good to hear! Always good to get advice from someone experienced with the topic, rather than someone who has simply read about it.

lol....not knowing much about it is another good reason not to advise, not that that doesn`t stop some.

Twin Peak · 11-22-2002, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by kuso
lol....not knowing much about it is another good reason not to advise, not that that doesn`t stop some.

Shit I better stop advising....

kuso · 11-22-2002, 10:10 AM

Lack of smiles again there TP

Twin Peak · 11-22-2002, 10:33 AM

I wasn't kidding.

kuso · 11-22-2002, 10:45 AM

If we are talking PH/PS here ( which I wasn`t really refering to ), seems to me you have about 2 weeks on TCD there.

Twin Peak · 11-22-2002, 10:54 AM

Experience does not necessarily mean knowledge. OOOHHH, we can have a thread on that!

kuso · 11-22-2002, 10:57 AM

LOL....haven`t we been there?

Yanick · 11-22-2002, 12:11 PM

Damn, I thought someone deleted this thread, for a second.

Twin Peak · 01-06-2003, 01:53 PM

Hey, how did this go back to 11/22? I know there have been posts since....what's going on?

Anyway, Rob, I just reread the beginning since I am trying to plan my cut, both type and timing. Any updates here? Back to lifting yet?

Robboe · 01-06-2003, 04:54 PM

Started back yesterday.

Three weeks off and the soreness i'm feeling is unreal.

Dropped 8lbs in one week with a stomach bug. All gone now though, thank Christ.

Twin Peak · 01-07-2003, 07:01 AM

That's been going around here to. Glad to hear you are back. So what are the short term goals, other than just getting back into it? Plan on updating this thing?

Robboe · 01-07-2003, 10:19 AM

Not in the immediate future. Too much on, and i'm rarely online at the moment.

Just continue what i'm doing until start of february when i'll focus on trimming down i suspect. Nothing planned or set in stone just yet.

AgainstAllOdds · 08-13-2003, 11:53 AM

So this diet calls for under 20g carbs everyday except for 2 days?

Can you have the carb up days whenever you want--Wouldn't it be best to have it the day of an intense training session and have training days after--just not around off days? Those days have minimal fat and protein right?

But how do you know how much protein and fat to eat on low carb days? How many calories do you shoot for?

And it works for gaining LBM?

I looked at the site, what foods does he say Increase T levels?

And

"How most Americans are systematically, but unknowingly, suppressing growth hormone, the "fountain of youth" hormone! (Considering how profoundly important this hormone is, this piece of information alone makes the Natural Hormonal Enhancement guidebook worth its
weight in gold!).……......................."

*

Why cashews, almonds, peanut butter, and especially walnuts, can be great allies in the fight against bodyfat. (Of course, most Americans are avoiding these foods like the plague due to the hare-brained, low-fat dietary concept that has been foisted on them by the "experts.").....................................se e p. 191

What are those 2 about? I assume the last one is about good fats.

AgainstAllOdds · 08-13-2003, 11:57 AM

You said you have cottage cheese preworkout, then after that meal you have tuna and oil? So that's protein and fat?

I've heard of that before for postworkout..but why don't you have whey?

Robboe · 08-13-2003, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by AgainstAllOdds
So this diet calls for under 20g carbs everyday except for 2 days?

The standard is 9 days of <20g carbs/day for the first 9 days. Then 3 days of 20-60g with a carb load in the last one or two meals of the third day followed by 4 days of 20-60g carbs followed by a carb load on the 4th day. And then repeating the 3 day/4 day cycle. So it might look like this:

sun - 20-60g C
mon - 20-60g C
tues - 20-60g C and carb load in evening.
wed - 20-60g C
thur - 20-60g C
fri - 20-60g C
sat - 20-60g C and carb load in evening.

Quote:

Can you have the carb up days whenever you want--Wouldn't it be best to have it the day of an intense training session and have training days after--just not around off days?

If you do the diet, try both and see which you prefer. Some prefer carb loads the night before a training session whereas others prefer on the night of the workout.

Quote:

Those days have minimal fat and protein right?

The meals during the days are all the same, only you keep fat minimal during the carb loads themselves. And eat some protein but keep it moderate or else you'll stink and probably feel a bit ill to your gut.

Quote:

But how do you know how much protein and fat to eat on low carb days? How many calories do you shoot for?

Gonna be different for everyone. I personally start with about 12kcals/lb of bodyweight and then assess how it effects me via energy levels and weekly weight loss. And the mirror of course.

Quote:

And it works for gaining LBM?

Control calories so that you gain muscle but not too much fat pretty much, yeah. May not be totally 100% lean, but calorie control is the important aspect.

Quote:

I looked at the site, what foods does he say Increase T levels?

Red meat probably.

Quote:

And

"How most Americans are systematically, but unknowingly, suppressing growth hormone, the "fountain of youth" hormone! (Considering how profoundly important this hormone is, this piece of information alone makes the Natural Hormonal Enhancement guidebook worth its
weight in gold!).……......................."

*

Why cashews, almonds, peanut butter, and especially walnuts, can be great allies in the fight against bodyfat. (Of course, most Americans are avoiding these foods like the plague due to the hare-brained, low-fat dietary concept that has been foisted on them by the "experts.").....................................se e p. 191

What are those 2 about? I assume the last one is about good fats.

Firstly, he overemphasises hGH.

Secondly, not huge amounts of w-3's in those nuts, but the monounsaturates they yield are good for various stuff.

Robboe · 08-13-2003, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by AgainstAllOdds
You said you have cottage cheese preworkout, then after that meal you have tuna and oil? So that's protein and fat?

I've heard of that before for postworkout..but why don't you have whey?

I used to drink whey with a tablespoon of whipping cream (the pretty much nil sugar type of cream) in it straight after training.

DaMayor · 08-13-2003, 01:41 PM

What's this I see? The infamous TCD firing up the old journal again? Sharing his vast dietetic knowledge with a layman?

You should. It'd be cool.

Robboe · 08-13-2003, 02:06 PM

I would but i rarely get online these days due to work-related long days. But if anyone has any questions i can help with or give insight into any personal experience then i'm more than happy to.

DaMayor · 08-13-2003, 06:28 PM

Yeah, you've mentioned your busy schedule a few times lately.
Hey, do it when you can, this board could use the insight. No offense to present mods, of course.

11-22-2002, 09:22 AM	#542
Twin Peak Peak Physiques™ Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: NY Posts: 7,967	Rob, he's drunk.
	www.DesignerSupps.com INTELLIGENT DESIGN™...lands on 1/1/2007 www.intelligentdesignmag.com

11-22-2002, 09:25 AM	#544
Robboe Designer Supplements Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Newcastle Posts: 5,151	Nah, i never had a proper plan i was gonna implement. But 2 on, 2 off, 2 on, 4 off, 2 on, 8 off etc.. was a proposed potential plan. At the time it seemed like i was gonna go that route, but i'm in no hurry and other commitments have come up (as expected). And with christmas coming up (during which time i plan on taking a much required week off), i don't see the point. Yeah, by the time Mike's chosen the testers and shipped out and given instructors, it would be about 4-5 weeks off PS for moi.
	Being held down by The Man

11-22-2002, 09:27 AM	#545
Robboe Designer Supplements Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Newcastle Posts: 5,151	Kuso, i decided, just on wednesday i think, not to bother with the 4 week cut just now cause of University commitments. I'm just doing the sub-concious calorie cycling thing for now. I may squeeze a short cut in the new year and maybe start a proper cut again sometime afterwards. Maybe around easter time.
	Being held down by The Man

11-22-2002, 09:37 AM	#547
Robboe Designer Supplements Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Newcastle Posts: 5,151	Like what? 4-AD and shit like that? Nah, i'm not that into all this PS/PH stuff. 1-T was just something i've seen people rave about and wanted to see what all the fuss was about. At the end of the day, i'm not really big on supplements. This was just an experience i wanted to have.
	Being held down by The Man

11-22-2002, 09:47 AM	#549
Robboe Designer Supplements Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Newcastle Posts: 5,151	Yeah, i'm like that. If i offer advice to anyone about something i haven't done or tried, i let them know that i have no personal experience with it before telling them my opinion. It's why i don't try and give gear advice. Not to mention the fact that i know very little about gear.
	Being held down by The Man

11-22-2002, 09:19 AM	#541
kuso Um......get rooted! Elite Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: aka ( o Y o ) Posts: 15,033 Photos: 15	I do most of my reading in the early hours of the morning with full brain fog lol Anyway, I think your original plan was 2 on 2 off 2 on right? Why the change? Or was that posted already?? lol I must say this quote from you ""Well, by the time he could send anything over here once he's made his descision i'd be off PS for about 4-5 weeks"" made me wonder. lol

11-22-2002, 09:24 AM	#543
kuso Um......get rooted! Elite Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: aka ( o Y o ) Posts: 15,033 Photos: 15	Yep....just went through this again and noticed this...which I had read ""Today is the last day of application of this first two week cycle. I'm now gonna spend at least 2 weeks making sure i keep all my gains, via shorter training sessions, lower volume, shy of failure training, EC throughout the day, keeping protein and carbs up (i.e. no low carbs), nicotine gum and extra zinc."" But can`t find where you decided to cut or not for the 4 weeks

11-22-2002, 09:31 AM	#546
kuso Um......get rooted! Elite Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: aka ( o Y o ) Posts: 15,033 Photos: 15	I can see that, if your school year is the same as Oz this is the most stressful time for you as it is. Are you thinking to stake the ONE with anything next time round, or just stick with the 1-T?

11-22-2002, 09:41 AM	#548
kuso Um......get rooted! Elite Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: aka ( o Y o ) Posts: 15,033 Photos: 15	4-AD was what I was thinking. It is good to see what the fuss is about though, self experimentation and all.

11-22-2002, 10:00 AM	#550
kuso Um......get rooted! Elite Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: aka ( o Y o ) Posts: 15,033 Photos: 15	Good to hear! Always good to get advice from someone experienced with the topic, rather than someone who has simply read about it. lol....not knowing much about it is another good reason not to advise, not that that doesn`t stop some.

11-22-2002, 10:10 AM	#552
kuso Um......get rooted! Elite Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: aka ( o Y o ) Posts: 15,033 Photos: 15	Lack of smiles again there TP

11-22-2002, 10:33 AM	#553
Twin Peak Peak Physiques™ Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: NY Posts: 7,967	I wasn't kidding.
	www.DesignerSupps.com INTELLIGENT DESIGN™...lands on 1/1/2007 www.intelligentdesignmag.com

11-22-2002, 10:45 AM	#554
kuso Um......get rooted! Elite Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: aka ( o Y o ) Posts: 15,033 Photos: 15	If we are talking PH/PS here ( which I wasn`t really refering to ), seems to me you have about 2 weeks on TCD there.

11-22-2002, 10:54 AM	#555
Twin Peak Peak Physiques™ Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: NY Posts: 7,967	Experience does not necessarily mean knowledge. OOOHHH, we can have a thread on that!
	www.DesignerSupps.com INTELLIGENT DESIGN™...lands on 1/1/2007 www.intelligentdesignmag.com

11-22-2002, 10:57 AM	#556
kuso Um......get rooted! Elite Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: aka ( o Y o ) Posts: 15,033 Photos: 15	LOL....haven`t we been there?

11-22-2002, 12:11 PM	#557
Yanick Amor Fati Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 3,798	Damn, I thought someone deleted this thread, for a second.
Yanick Amor Fati Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 3,798	"...we have to remember that training is a complicated dance of stimuli and response. Our goal is to understand how to manipulate the stimuli in order to evoke the responses we desire." -Nathan J. Polenchek

01-06-2003, 01:53 PM	#558
Twin Peak Peak Physiques™ Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: NY Posts: 7,967	Hey, how did this go back to 11/22? I know there have been posts since....what's going on? Anyway, Rob, I just reread the beginning since I am trying to plan my cut, both type and timing. Any updates here? Back to lifting yet?
	www.DesignerSupps.com INTELLIGENT DESIGN™...lands on 1/1/2007 www.intelligentdesignmag.com

01-06-2003, 04:54 PM	#559
Robboe Designer Supplements Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Newcastle Posts: 5,151	Started back yesterday. Three weeks off and the soreness i'm feeling is unreal. Dropped 8lbs in one week with a stomach bug. All gone now though, thank Christ.
	Being held down by The Man

01-07-2003, 07:01 AM	#560
Twin Peak Peak Physiques™ Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: NY Posts: 7,967	That's been going around here to. Glad to hear you are back. So what are the short term goals, other than just getting back into it? Plan on updating this thing?
	www.DesignerSupps.com INTELLIGENT DESIGN™...lands on 1/1/2007 www.intelligentdesignmag.com

01-07-2003, 10:19 AM	#561
Robboe Designer Supplements Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Newcastle Posts: 5,151	Not in the immediate future. Too much on, and i'm rarely online at the moment. Just continue what i'm doing until start of february when i'll focus on trimming down i suspect. Nothing planned or set in stone just yet.
	Being held down by The Man

08-13-2003, 11:53 AM	#562
AgainstAllOdds Registered User Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 31	So this diet calls for under 20g carbs everyday except for 2 days? Can you have the carb up days whenever you want--Wouldn't it be best to have it the day of an intense training session and have training days after--just not around off days? Those days have minimal fat and protein right? But how do you know how much protein and fat to eat on low carb days? How many calories do you shoot for? And it works for gaining LBM? I looked at the site, what foods does he say Increase T levels? And "How most Americans are systematically, but unknowingly, suppressing growth hormone, the "fountain of youth" hormone! (Considering how profoundly important this hormone is, this piece of information alone makes the Natural Hormonal Enhancement guidebook worth its weight in gold!).……......................." * Why cashews, almonds, peanut butter, and especially walnuts, can be great allies in the fight against bodyfat. (Of course, most Americans are avoiding these foods like the plague due to the hare-brained, low-fat dietary concept that has been foisted on them by the "experts.").....................................se e p. 191 What are those 2 about? I assume the last one is about good fats.

08-13-2003, 11:57 AM	#563
AgainstAllOdds Registered User Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 31	You said you have cottage cheese preworkout, then after that meal you have tuna and oil? So that's protein and fat? I've heard of that before for postworkout..but why don't you have whey?

08-13-2003, 01:41 PM	#566
DaMayor On a Perpetual Bulk Elite Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Here. Posts: 5,976	What's this I see? The infamous TCD firing up the old journal again? Sharing his vast dietetic knowledge with a layman? You should. It'd be cool.

08-13-2003, 02:06 PM	#567
Robboe Designer Supplements Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Newcastle Posts: 5,151	I would but i rarely get online these days due to work-related long days. But if anyone has any questions i can help with or give insight into any personal experience then i'm more than happy to.
	Being held down by The Man

08-13-2003, 06:28 PM	#568
DaMayor On a Perpetual Bulk Elite Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Here. Posts: 5,976	Yeah, you've mentioned your busy schedule a few times lately. Hey, do it when you can, this board could use the insight. No offense to present mods, of course.