About that time II (training)

Stewart20 · 01-31-2007, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Double D

No if that were the case I would say I want to get stronger also. Now thats have our cake and eat it to......

But ya know whats the point of having cake if you cant eat it?

Ahhh words to live by, can be applied to a great many things in life....you might have a future in philosophy if the whole weight lifting thing doesn't work out for you

Malley · 01-31-2007, 01:48 PM

Took many philosophy classes. I am very good at it and sense I am pretty sure theres no future in weight lifting other than a hobby I may have to look into it.

Stewart20 · 01-31-2007, 01:54 PM

i think you and i need to keep to a set routine and stop with this changing things up crap, it is getting a bit rediculous, if you ask me. I don't know what it is, I just can't stick with a plan, and apparently neither can you. I know we talked about doing the same routine before, but maybe that's what we need to do. same plan, same days, everything, just so we can keep on each other.

i have something in mind. i think it might work well for you since you are cutting and all.

Malley · 01-31-2007, 01:57 PM

Lets hear it. I want to do something that does focus on flexibility though. Talk I am listening.

Stewart20 · 01-31-2007, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Double D

Lets hear it. I want to do something that does focus on flexibility though. Talk I am listening.

if you want flexibility, then stretch dammit! I'm not quite sure how you would incorporate it into a program other than adding stretching at the end. in fact, just stretch in random places, you would be surprised how well it works. for example, every morning when I get out of the shower, I take my towel and hold it behind my back to stretch out my chest and shoulders. I gotta tell you, I've been doing it a couple of months now, and I have had 0 shoulder issues since (knock on wood). just stretch in your daily life. I am sure you are sitting at a desk typing this stuff, just put your feet up and stretch your hammies out on the desk a couple times a day. stuff like that.

now for a routine. i kept the rep range at 6 for most exercises just to force you to lift heavy to keep strength levels up. the shoulder stuff at the end is what I want to call "preventative maintenance work" for the shoulder capsule. plus you will probably get some good hypertrophy out of that anyway.

day 1 Lower 1
Squats 3x6
Good Mornings 3x6
Glute Ham Raise 2x8
Hypers 2x10
Decline Crunches 2x8

day 3 Upper 1
Incline bench 2x6
Barbell rows (overhand grip) 2x6
Close Grip Bench 2x6
Chest Supported rows (underhand grip) 2x6
Pullups 2x6
Upright rows 2x110x max reps
Db shoulder press 2x50x max reps
Rear flies 2x40x max reps

day 5 Lower 2
Deadlifts 3x6
Lunges 2x8
Glute Ham raise 2x8
Hypers 2x10
Decline crunches 2x8

day 7 Upper 2
Decline bench 2x6
Barbell Rows (underhand grip) 2x6
Dips 2x6
Chest Suported Rows (Overhand grip) 2x6
Chinups 2x6
DB Upright Rows 2x50x max reps
Seated Overhead Press 2x135x max reps
Rear flies (alt grip) 2x40x max reps

Lift close to, but do not go to failure PLEASE! Stop a rep or 2 short on everything! Lift heavy! If you are cutting, I would rather see you do 300 x 4 on bench as opposed to 225 x 12, I just don't see the point. You can condition yourself by doing GPP on off days if you like. I never use my weight training for cardio purposes. weight training is to build muscle, run around the block on your off day if you want to get "fit". YM does some amazing workouts, and can probably run circles around my ass, but I think you are like me in that you like being as strong as you can be, and his workouts just don't work well with that goal. Do some sprint work on off days if you want to, 15 minutes or so, and when the spring and summer comes, just do more stuff outside and be more active in general, that will help with BF levels a bit

Malley · 01-31-2007, 02:19 PM

Whats with the max reps at the end of the 2 upper days?

Also instead of glute ham raises I need to do something else I dont have a machine for that.

Stewart20 · 01-31-2007, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Double D

Whats with the max reps at the end of the 2 upper days?

Also instead of glute ham raises I need to do something else I dont have a machine for that.

Well, those weights are numbers that are for me, I forgot to edit that, I just picked weights that were light, yet still challenging for me, and you just rep them out for as many reps as you can on each set. There are no goals there, no goal to add reps or weight, just do whatever you can on any given day. it is there to build up the shoulder joint to help with the other heavier exercises.

Can you do leg curls? If not, and your lower back can handle it, do SLDLs. I know I can't handle SLDLs twice a week plus regular deads, so I took it out. OR, do DB RDLs with one leg at a time....that way you can still get a similar workout to glute ham raises without frying your back

Malley · 01-31-2007, 02:28 PM

I want to incorporate some of those core lifts, but I dont think they are enough to get any strength out of like T-pushups, I think I could do them at the end of the workout.

Stewart20 · 01-31-2007, 02:33 PM

you can do whatever you like, but I just have a feeling that all that "core" stuff is like the flavor of the week for you, and you will just go back to something else, most probably Westside by next week. I can spot someone like me from a mile away. You read about someone else's ideas or program and it sounds cool and you try it maybe once or twice or even a week, then just go and do something else.

that is why i suggested doing something together that way we *might* potentially have a chance to stick with it., but then again, probably not, so who knows.

Tom_B · 01-31-2007, 03:25 PM

Phew I'm far behind in this journal!

I love Saxon side bends as well .. been a while since I've done any though. Did you ever try those Landmines after you found out what they were?

Also about the Glute Ham Raise .. do you have a Pulldown machine? You can use that or even a seated calf machine, that's what I do. Just face the opposite way and seat the seat to lock your ankles/calves in place..

fufu · 01-31-2007, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stewart20

. I never use my weight training for cardio purposes. weight training is to build muscle, run around the block on your off day if you want to get "fit".

I think using weights for circuits is a fun and effective way to train conditioning.

fufu · 01-31-2007, 03:36 PM

Double D, you got a new job I saw in CP's journal?

yellowmoomba · 01-31-2007, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stewart20

YM...all other things kept equal, have you found doing this type of routine on a consistent basis to do anything to "alter" your body composition in any ways? I know this would be great for "conditioning", but I would hope that since you are doing this pretty much at the expense of strength, that you would get some other benefits. Are your muscles fuller/harder after following this type of scheme than say, the heavy weight low rep route, or do you just get the advantage of conditioning?

For me body composition has more to do with my diet than my training. Honestly my body hasn't changed much from an appearance standpoint but at 36 I never thought I would be able to do a chinup with 125lbs on my waist or deadlift 400lbs for 10 reps and still outrun 21 year olds on the football field and knock over 220 lbs guys on the basketball court (that's legal in streetball..haha). My training is geared more for competitive sports. To me - there is no sense being able to bench 400 lbs if I can't run for a mile or lift myself and my family to safety in the event of an emergency. I train for "functional strength". As long as my waist stays under 35", my arms stay over 16", I have a 10" drop in my sport coat and have some meat on my legs - I'm happy. Plus I don't get bored with benching every Monday, Back and Bis on Tuesday, Legs on Thursday and Shoulders on Friday. Just my 2 cents on why I train the way I do.

yellowmoomba · 01-31-2007, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stewart20

if you want flexibility, then stretch dammit! I'm not quite sure how you would incorporate it into a program other than adding stretching at the end. in fact, just stretch in random places, you would be surprised how well it works. for example, every morning when I get out of the shower, I take my towel and hold it behind my back to stretch out my chest and shoulders. I gotta tell you, I've been doing it a couple of months now, and I have had 0 shoulder issues since (knock on wood). just stretch in your daily life. I am sure you are sitting at a desk typing this stuff, just put your feet up and stretch your hammies out on the desk a couple times a day. stuff like that.

now for a routine. i kept the rep range at 6 for most exercises just to force you to lift heavy to keep strength levels up. the shoulder stuff at the end is what I want to call "preventative maintenance work" for the shoulder capsule. plus you will probably get some good hypertrophy out of that anyway.

day 1 Lower 1
Squats 3x6
Good Mornings 3x6
Glute Ham Raise 2x8
Hypers 2x10
Decline Crunches 2x8

day 3 Upper 1
Incline bench 2x6
Barbell rows (overhand grip) 2x6
Close Grip Bench 2x6
Chest Supported rows (underhand grip) 2x6
Pullups 2x6
Upright rows 2x110x max reps
Db shoulder press 2x50x max reps
Rear flies 2x40x max reps

day 5 Lower 2
Deadlifts 3x6
Lunges 2x8
Glute Ham raise 2x8
Hypers 2x10
Decline crunches 2x8

day 7 Upper 2
Decline bench 2x6
Barbell Rows (underhand grip) 2x6
Dips 2x6
Chest Suported Rows (Overhand grip) 2x6
Chinups 2x6
DB Upright Rows 2x50x max reps
Seated Overhead Press 2x135x max reps
Rear flies (alt grip) 2x40x max reps

Lift close to, but do not go to failure PLEASE! Stop a rep or 2 short on everything! Lift heavy! If you are cutting, I would rather see you do 300 x 4 on bench as opposed to 225 x 12, I just don't see the point. You can condition yourself by doing GPP on off days if you like. I never use my weight training for cardio purposes. weight training is to build muscle, run around the block on your off day if you want to get "fit". YM does some amazing workouts, and can probably run circles around my ass, but I think you are like me in that you like being as strong as you can be, and his workouts just don't work well with that goal. Do some sprint work on off days if you want to, 15 minutes or so, and when the spring and summer comes, just do more stuff outside and be more active in general, that will help with BF levels a bit

I like your new program. I would just throw in some supersetting workout or a fullbody circuit program once every five workouts to keep things interesting and maintain some level of "fitness".

Stewart20 · 01-31-2007, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yellowmoomba

I like your new program. I would just throw in some supersetting workout or a fullbody circuit program once every five workouts to keep things interesting and maintain some level of "fitness".

well, I gotta tell you, I went with short (er) rest periods today and I was huffing and puffing big time tonight. Nothing quite in your league yet, but then again, you don't incline bench 275 yet either

yellowmoomba · 01-31-2007, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stewart20

well, I gotta tell you, I went with short (er) rest periods today and I was huffing and puffing big time tonight. Nothing quite in your league yet, but then again, you don't incline bench 275 yet either

..........I'm glad you tried the "shorter" RIs - how long were they?

Stewart20 · 01-31-2007, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yellowmoomba

For me body composition has more to do with my diet than my training. Honestly my body hasn't changed much from an appearance standpoint but at 36 I never thought I would be able to do a chinup with 125lbs on my waist or deadlift 400lbs for 10 reps and still outrun 21 year olds on the football field and knock over 220 lbs guys on the basketball court (that's legal in streetball..haha). My training is geared more for competitive sports. To me - there is no sense being able to bench 400 lbs if I can't run for a mile or lift myself and my family to safety in the event of an emergency. I train for "functional strength". As long as my waist stays under 35", my arms stay over 16", I have a 10" drop in my sport coat and have some meat on my legs - I'm happy. Plus I don't get bored with benching every Monday, Back and Bis on Tuesday, Legs on Thursday and Shoulders on Friday. Just my 2 cents on why I train the way I do.

Interesting points there....but I think it's possible to be able to bench 400 and still be able to run a mile, obviously a lot harder to do. I, like you , adhere to that 10" rule and as long as the number is there, I don't care how big my waist is cause that goes with the territory. there is no way, or at least not naturally, for a 32 year old to have a 50 inch chest and a 34 inch waist, so while my waist now is 37", my chest is 48", so I am happy with that. I don't get the chance to play much sports, I played hockey up until 2 years ago, but hurt my groin and haven't played since. I wanna try to get back into it in the spring, we'll see. I am hoping once JR gets a little older, that I will be outside playing something with him every day, and that's gotta help a little bit.

And how does one distinguish functional strength anyway? you can say the bench press isn't functional, but then again, how is a power clean functional? when are you ever gonna pick something up off the floor and fling it up to your collar bones? Deadlift, yes, I see the functionality obviously, but really, any compound movement can be functional I think. I know that when I did play hockey, I was able to control the puck along the boards and with my free hand, take people and throw them down to the ice with one hand. I attribute that to my lifting...squats for the leg drive to skate and plant myself in the crease and not be moved, various benching for pushing strength, and so on.

the only thing I can see as the differing factor for whether something can be labeled functional or not would be unilateral exercises...that can be said to be more functional than its bilateral counterpart, but otherwise, I don't think you need to do power clean super snatches off of blocks to be labeled as a functional exercise.

edit----curls are NOT functional

Stewart20 · 01-31-2007, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yellowmoomba

..........I'm glad you tried the "shorter" RIs - how long were they?

I didn't really time them, but I know that on some sets I did do my usual 2 min between sets, and that felt like an eternity compared to some of my other sets, so it was probably around a minute or so. big difference when you are still huffing from the last set!

yellowmoomba · 01-31-2007, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stewart20

Interesting points there....but I think it's possible to be able to bench 400 and still be able to run a mile, obviously a lot harder to do. I, like you , adhere to that 10" rule and as long as the number is there, I don't care how big my waist is cause that goes with the territory. there is no way, or at least not naturally, for a 32 year old to have a 50 inch chest and a 34 inch waist, so while my waist now is 37", my chest is 48", so I am happy with that. I don't get the chance to play much sports, I played hockey up until 2 years ago, but hurt my groin and haven't played since. I wanna try to get back into it in the spring, we'll see. I am hoping once JR gets a little older, that I will be outside playing something with him every day, and that's gotta help a little bit.

And how does one distinguish functional strength anyway? you can say the bench press isn't functional, but then again, how is a power clean functional? when are you ever gonna pick something up off the floor and fling it up to your collar bones? Deadlift, yes, I see the functionality obviously, but really, any compound movement can be functional I think. I know that when I did play hockey, I was able to control the puck along the boards and with my free hand, take people and throw them down to the ice with one hand. I attribute that to my lifting...squats for the leg drive to skate and plant myself in the crease and not be moved, various benching for pushing strength, and so on.

the only thing I can see as the differing factor for whether something can be labeled functional or not would be unilateral exercises...that can be said to be more functional than its bilateral counterpart, but otherwise, I don't think you need to do power clean super snatches off of blocks to be labeled as a functional exercise.

edit----curls are NOT functional

By functional I mean to improve my strength is other areas of my life such as - sports, protecting my family, moving/fixing things around the house - you never know - I may need to clean and press some young punk that wants to go out with my daughter. THAT is functional....

yellowmoomba · 01-31-2007, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stewart20

I didn't really time them, but I know that on some sets I did do my usual 2 min between sets, and that felt like an eternity compared to some of my other sets, so it was probably around a minute or so. big difference when you are still huffing from the last set!

That's right.

Stewart20 · 01-31-2007, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yellowmoomba

By functional I mean to improve my strength is other areas of my life such as - sports, protecting my family, moving/fixing things around the house - you never know - I may need to clean and press some young punk that wants to go out with my daughter. THAT is functional....

That is badass

Triple Threat · 01-31-2007, 07:26 PM

We're going to need Cliff notes for this journal to be able to keep up with all the posts and also lead a normal life.

01-31-2007, 01:48 PM	#542
Malley Senior Member Elite Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Illinois Posts: 10,018	Took many philosophy classes. I am very good at it and sense I am pretty sure theres no future in weight lifting other than a hobby I may have to look into it.
	www.crossfit.com

01-31-2007, 01:54 PM	#543
Stewart20 My little pain in the ass Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: in my home gym Posts: 2,924 Photos: 2	i think you and i need to keep to a set routine and stop with this changing things up crap, it is getting a bit rediculous, if you ask me. I don't know what it is, I just can't stick with a plan, and apparently neither can you. I know we talked about doing the same routine before, but maybe that's what we need to do. same plan, same days, everything, just so we can keep on each other. i have something in mind. i think it might work well for you since you are cutting and all.
	http://futuretrainer.blogspot.com/ --My new blog!!

01-31-2007, 01:57 PM	#544
Malley Senior Member Elite Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Illinois Posts: 10,018	Lets hear it. I want to do something that does focus on flexibility though. Talk I am listening.
	www.crossfit.com

01-31-2007, 02:19 PM	#546
Malley Senior Member Elite Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Illinois Posts: 10,018	Whats with the max reps at the end of the 2 upper days? Also instead of glute ham raises I need to do something else I dont have a machine for that.
	www.crossfit.com

01-31-2007, 02:28 PM	#548
Malley Senior Member Elite Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Illinois Posts: 10,018	I want to incorporate some of those core lifts, but I dont think they are enough to get any strength out of like T-pushups, I think I could do them at the end of the workout.
	www.crossfit.com

01-31-2007, 02:33 PM	#549
Stewart20 My little pain in the ass Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: in my home gym Posts: 2,924 Photos: 2	you can do whatever you like, but I just have a feeling that all that "core" stuff is like the flavor of the week for you, and you will just go back to something else, most probably Westside by next week. I can spot someone like me from a mile away. You read about someone else's ideas or program and it sounds cool and you try it maybe once or twice or even a week, then just go and do something else. that is why i suggested doing something together that way we might potentially have a chance to stick with it., but then again, probably not, so who knows.
	http://futuretrainer.blogspot.com/ --My new blog!!

01-31-2007, 03:25 PM	#550
Tom_B Tom_B Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Amherst, Nova Scotia, Canada Posts: 3,589	Phew I'm far behind in this journal! I love Saxon side bends as well .. been a while since I've done any though. Did you ever try those Landmines after you found out what they were? Also about the Glute Ham Raise .. do you have a Pulldown machine? You can use that or even a seated calf machine, that's what I do. Just face the opposite way and seat the seat to lock your ankles/calves in place..

01-31-2007, 03:36 PM	#552
fufu fiendish thingy Elite Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 16,442 Photos: 7	Double D, you got a new job I saw in CP's journal?
	fufu's 1337 Journal Your diet will set you free.

01-31-2007, 07:26 PM	#562
Triple Threat ... Elite Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Lost Posts: 9,480 Photos: 6	We're going to need Cliff notes for this journal to be able to keep up with all the posts and also lead a normal life.