Free Press 1, Obama 0

busyLivin · 10-23-2009, 09:57 AM

The Obama administration on Thursday failed in its attempt to manipulate other news networks into isolating and excluding Fox News, as Republicans on Capitol Hill stepped up their criticism of the hardball tactics employed by the White House.

The Obama administration on Thursday tried to make "pay czar" Kenneth Feinberg available for interviews to every member of the White House pool except Fox News. The pool is the five-network rotation that for decades has shared the costs and duties of daily coverage of the presidency.

But the Washington bureau chiefs of the five TV networks consulted and decided that none of their reporters would interview Feinberg unless Fox News was included.

The administration relented, making Feinberg available for all five pool members and Bloomberg TV.

The pushback came after White House senior adviser David Axelrod told ABC News' "This Week" on Sunday that Fox News is not a real news organization and other news networks "ought not to treat them that way."

Media analysts cheered the decision to boycott the Feinberg interview unless Fox News was included, saying the administration's gambit was taking its feud with Fox News too far. President Obama has already declined to go on "Fox News Sunday," even while appearing on the other Sunday shows.

"I'm really cheered by the other members saying "No, if Fox can't be part of it, we won't be part of it,'" said Baltimore Sun TV critic David Zurawik, calling the move to limit Feinberg's availability "outrageous."

"What it's really about to me is the Executive Branch of the government trying to tell the press how it should behave. I mean, this democracy -- we know this -- only works with a free and unfettered press to provide information," he said.

Fox News legal analyst Peter Johnson Jr. said the administration was potentially in violation of the Constitution with its attempt to restrict access to the "eyes and ears" of the country.

"What was averted was a very serious constitutional violation by the White House," Johnson said. "There cannot be selective and arbitrary access to the White House based on some subjective determination."

Several top White House advisers have appeared on other news channels to criticize Fox News' coverage of the administration, dismiss the network as the mouthpiece of the Republican Party and urge other news organizations not to treat Fox News as a legitimate news network.

On Wednesday, Obama, speaking publicly for the first time about his administration's portrayal of Fox News as illegitimate, said he's not "losing sleep" over the controversy.

"I think that what our advisers simply said is, is that we are going to take media as it comes," Obama said when asked about his advisers targeting the network openly. "And if media is operating, basically, as a talk radio format, then that's one thing. And if it's operating as a news outlet, then that's another. But it's not something I'm losing a lot of sleep over."

Obama's comments also came after he met Monday with political commentators Keith Olbermann and Rachel Maddow of MSNBC; Eugene Robinson and E.J. Dionne of the Washington Post; Ron Brownstein of the National Journal; John Dickerson of Slate; Frank Rich, Maureen Dowd and Bob Herbert of the New York Times; Jerry Seib of the Wall Street Journal, Gloria Borger of CNN and U.S. News and World Report, and Gwen Ifill of PBS.

House Republican leaders rushed to the defense of conservative commentators Thursday after the president's comments.

Rep. Mike Pence, chairman of the House Republican Conference, said conservative commentators speak more for Americans than the national media outlets that have targeted them for criticism.

"Goaded on by a White House increasingly intolerant of criticism, lately the national media has taken aim at conservative commentators in radio and television," the Indiana Republican said on the House floor. "Suggesting that they only speak for a small group of activists and even suggesting in one report today that Republicans in Washington are 'worried about their electoral effect.' Well, that's hogwash."

busyLivin · 10-23-2009, 09:59 AM

This is absolutely pathetic. I can't wait to hear the "free speech" liberals defend this bullshit.

**Dale Mabry** · 10-23-2009, 10:55 AM

Not so much change as politics as usual

bio-chem · 10-23-2009, 11:19 AM

politics as usual, but still a black mark on obama. this guy is letting his administration publicly fight with a news organization. thats childish and pathetic. say what you want about the media as a whole. I think that all news organizations and directors are pushing an agenda, but when you single out one news organization because it doesn't share your views then as a political figure you should be above that.

**Dale Mabry** · 10-23-2009, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bio-chem

politics as usual, but still a black mark on obama. this guy is letting his administration publicly fight with a news organization. thats childish and pathetic. say what you want about the media as a whole. I think that all news organizations and directors are pushing an agenda, but when you single out one news organization because it doesn't share your views then as a political figure you should be above that.

Public being the operative word. I am sure this has gone in the other direction one or 2 times over the previous 8 years, it's just Obama seems to play everything out in the media. I think this is a major mistake, if you need any evidence of this, look no further than the rest of the media backing Fox News. As was the case over the last 2 terms, I would just prefer the president to do his job, and not have to see him or one of his lackies every day on the news. I really think it's time we abandon the 2 party system, the parties are black and white, while 95% of us are shades of grey. If this weren't the case, Obama wouldn't be blackballing Fox. A liberal president trying to muzzle a news organization, who'da thunk it?

bio-chem · 10-23-2009, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dale Mabry

Public being the operative word. I am sure this has gone in the other direction one or 2 times over the previous 8 years, it's just Obama seems to play everything out in the media. I think this is a major mistake, if you need any evidence of this, look no further than the rest of the media backing Fox News. As was the case over the last 2 terms, I would just prefer the president to do his job, and not have to see him or one of his lackies every day on the news. I really think it's time we abandon the 2 party system, the parties are black and white, while 95% of us are shades of grey. If this weren't the case, Obama wouldn't be blackballing Fox. A liberal president trying to muzzle a news organization, who'da thunk it?

i agree. the problem is it's public. I have no problem with a guy behind the scenes not liking those who disagree with him. I actually expect that. Of course the other news organizations have to fight this. what if they are next. best way to make enemies friends is give them a common enemy. behind the scenes is fine. i don't care, but out in public is just stupid on obama's part.

maniclion · 10-23-2009, 05:08 PM

That god damn liberal media......

bio-chem · 10-23-2009, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maniclion

That god damn liberal media......

lol

lnvanry · 10-23-2009, 08:07 PM

I agree its a dum dum move politically...but its business as usual. How often did Bush go on MSNBC?

In reality I could care less though...they (TV news outlets) are all media whores and hardly ever report objectively, except PBS.

I get most of my news from ThomsonReuters and BBC

suprfast · 10-23-2009, 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lnvanry

I agree its a dum dum move politically...but its business as usual. How often did Bush go on MSNBC?

In reality I could care less though...they (TV news outlets) are all media whores and hardly ever report objectively, except PBS.

I get most of my news from ThomsonReuters and BBC

maniclion · 10-23-2009, 09:48 PM

I get my news from The Daily Show and The Colbert Report that's the only way to go brotha'

suprfast · 10-23-2009, 10:13 PM

Daily show is the best. Its also sad when REAL news shows get rated lower than a comedy show, ABOUT REPORTING NEWS.

Colbert and stewart FTW

danzik17 · 10-23-2009, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maniclion

I get my news from The Daily Show and The Colbert Report that's the only way to go brotha'

+1

Big Smoothy · 10-24-2009, 11:04 AM

The problem with FOX news is not Fox's political positions.

It's how these positions are expressed.

Too much fallacial reasoning during the night-time Op-Ed shows.

Fox only gets 3.0 to 3.1 million viewers. Number #1 in the ratings? Yes.

Do they affect the national publich policy? No.

It's not the message - it's how the message is presented.

bio-chem · 10-24-2009, 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Smoothy

The problem with FOX news is not Fox's political positions.

It's how these positions are expressed.

Too much fallacial reasoning during the night-time Op-Ed shows.

Fox only gets 3.0 to 3.1 million viewers. Number #1 in the ratings? Yes.

Do they affect the national publich policy? No.

It's not the message - it's how the message is presented.

that exact same problem is leveled at all news outlets now a days. every single one is out to push their particular agenda. it just so happens that fox is the one agenda that goes against the current president at the moment.

the current problem is made worse when the white house decides to have an open feud with this news outlet. when your job is to run the country you can't waste energy picking a fight with a news organization that disagrees with you.

obama needs to spend less time with his head in public opinion polls and more time leading. you can't tell the wind where and when to blow, and you can't lead this country by doing the same thing

Big Smoothy · 10-24-2009, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bio-chem

that exact same problem is leveled at all news outlets now a days. every single one is out to push their particular agenda. it just so happens that fox is the one agenda that goes against the current president at the moment.

But regardless of one's partisan views, FOX is definitely the worst.

FOX does not qualify as journalism.

Too many false reports. How did the false reports get past the editors and producers?

Madrassa, Andy Martin, etc.

As I stated, yes FOX gets high TV ratings. Ratings are a big part of the problem.

And with these ratings, FOX is a niche market. A small, narrow niche market.

suprfast · 10-24-2009, 09:06 PM

Fox has House MD. Does this count for anything?
kris

10fcp · 10-24-2009, 10:35 PM

Glen Beck is da man

bio-chem · 10-24-2009, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Smoothy

But regardless of one's partisan views, FOX is definitely the worst.

FOX does not qualify as journalism.

Too many false reports. How did the false reports get past the editors and producers?

Madrassa, Andy Martin, etc.

As I stated, yes FOX gets high TV ratings. Ratings are a big part of the problem.

And with these ratings, FOX is a niche market. A small, narrow niche market.

yea, I don't believe this at all. Your bias is showing here. the fact you are making the same argument as the president shows this. They are all shit, and they all have false reports. Fox is the worst? Fox does not qualify as journalism? did your special I LOVE obama decoder ring tell you to say this? while a free press has always been necessary to ensure that the people stay free of a tyrannical government the press has always been inherently biased. the reason why it works is because competition balances each other out.

Big Smoothy · 10-24-2009, 11:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bio-chem

yea, I don't believe this at all. Your bias is showing here. the fact you are making the same argument as the president shows this.

Yes, I have my biases. I am biased against FOX news.

I also think CNN is very bad, but not as bad as FOX.

I do not follow the US President, what he says, nor any specific news reports about him. I don't know what he has said or written about FOX, or what the Administration/White House has stated.

They are all shit, and they all have false reports. Fox is the worst? Fox does not qualify as journalism?[/quote]

Daytime, FOX: there is some journalistic reporting. Nightime is Op-Ed with O'reilly and Hannity, etc.

Quote:

did your special I LOVE obama decoder ring tell you to say this?

I am very critical of Obama. He's a major disappointment.

This said, I did not vote for him.

Quote:

while a free press has always been necessary to ensure that the people stay free of a tyrannical government the press has always been inherently biased. the reason why it works is because competition balances each other out.

I agree, the press has biases, we humans (including me have biases).

I am just looking for objectivity. Hard to find. Sometimes it can be found.

But it's not on TV, radio, or in the newspapers.

bio-chem · 10-25-2009, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Smoothy

Yes, I have my biases. I am biased against FOX news.

I also think CNN is very bad, but not as bad as FOX.

I do not follow the US President, what he says, nor any specific news reports about him. I don't know what he has said or written about FOX, or what the Administration/White House has stated.

I am very critical of Obama. He's a major disappointment.

This said, I did not vote for him.

I agree, the press has biases, we humans (including me have biases).

I am just looking for objectivity. Hard to find. Sometimes it can be found.

But it's not on TV, radio, or in the newspapers.

your post is a complete contradiction of itself.

You don't follow what the president does or says, but you are disappointed and critical of him?

and your statements about Fox mirror his administrations almost word for word

you are biased against FOX, but don't feel any objectivity can be found amongst it's competitors either either on tv, radio, or newspaper?

**Dale Mabry** · 10-25-2009, 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bio-chem

your post is a complete contradiction of itself.

You don't follow what the president does or says, but you are disappointed and critical of him?

and your statements about Fox mirror his administrations almost word for word

you are biased against FOX, but don't feel any objectivity can be found amongst it's competitors either either on tv, radio, or newspaper?

I get what he is saying, and essentially agree with him. Fox news will typically just pull something out of thin air based off little real evidence. Rush, who uses similar tactics to Fox News, just had some situation where he pulled off a fake thesis from the internet that said Obama was anti-constitution. It was fake and after realizing it quiter a while after presenting it his response was essentially, "Well it felt real." This is their problem, for every 2 good things they do, they are literally riddled with 10 things like this. That said, they typically bring up points that really should be looked at and attended to, and you need to sift through bullshit no matter what news organization you watch. Didn't Dan Rather get shitcanned for a similar deal with GWB?

vinnie799 · 10-25-2009, 08:37 AM

The Mullie's got to go

vinnie799 · 10-25-2009, 08:43 AM

Have ya'll forgotten what those guys' jobs are?

They throw 'stuff' out there to piss us off and get us talking to each other just like we are right now.

I believe what they say doesn't have to be true. There job is to evoke reactions. It's just that simple.

When more people realize it they'll go to more educated folks for conversations. Me included.

Big Smoothy · 10-25-2009, 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bio-chem

your post is a complete contradiction of itself.

You don't follow what the president does or says, but you are disappointed and critical of him?

I stopped following Obama's speeches and soundbites, but I do read the news reports - so yes, I actually am following his policies, from a 3rd party reporting perspectives.

I erred.

I stopped following directly a few months ago. But I still read about policies coming out of Washington and Congress.

I mispoke.

Quote:

and your statements about Fox mirror his administrations almost word for word

If my words mimic the current adminstration's position it is entirely coincidence - serious. I have not followed the Obama/admin position on FOX.

I have soured on FOX for at least 4 years.

Quote:

you are biased against FOX, but don't feel any objectivity can be found amongst it's competitors either either on tv, radio, or newspaper?

Yes, I'm biased against FOX.

I read international newspapers almost exclusively. They are not competitors with FOX.

mcguin · 10-26-2009, 07:40 AM

It's quite simple, you dont like fox news or what they have to say, dont turn them on, that's why you have the choice of Fx news, CNN, or msnbc. As for the white house, if they want to go after fox, then the social thing to do would be cancel all news networks and start the Obama Network...hmmm, sure this is already in the works actually!

p.s.- my last statement is a simple joke, please dont yell!

lnvanry · 10-26-2009, 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcguin

It's quite simple, you dont like fox news or what they have to say, dont turn them on, that's why you have the choice of Fx news, CNN, or msnbc. As for the white house, if they want to go after fox, then the social thing to do would be cancel all news networks and start the Obama Network...hmmm, sure this is already in the works actually!

p.s.- my last statement is a simple joke, please dont yell!

Thats the issue...all those networks suck. The simply are skewed to the other side and done so in a similar degree.

Its like saying your option for dinner is fastfood burger with tofu ...the two extremes don't really balance the meal.

suprfast · 10-27-2009, 01:16 AM

So not true, you can marinate the tofu

mcguin · 10-27-2009, 07:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lnvanry

Thats the issue...all those networks suck. The simply are skewed to the other side and done so in a similar degree.

Its like saying your option for dinner is fastfood burger with tofu ...the two extremes don't really balance the meal.

yes i understand what you're saying but for the most part, the majority of people here in 'Merica dont see it that way, they either watch cnn or one of the others...there aren't too many among the population who tune to the BBC for their news...

10-23-2009, 10:55 AM	#3
Dale Mabry Moderator Moderator Join Date: May 2003 Location: Elsewhere Posts: 14,335 Photos: 10	Not so much change as politics as usual If sense were common, everyone would have it. 4/2007-Current 75th Ranked most popular image 1 spot behind Prince's bulge...

10-23-2009, 05:08 PM	#7
maniclion Cartographer of the Mind Elite Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Mens Incognita Posts: 20,435 Photos: 10	That god damn liberal media...... "We are like tenant farmers chopping down the fence around our house for fuel when we should be using Natures inexhaustible sources of energy — sun, wind and tide. ... I'd put my money on the sun and solar energy. What a source of power! I hope we don't have to wait until oil and coal run out before we tackle that." Thomas Edison: In conversation with Henry Ford and Harvey Firestone

10-23-2009, 09:48 PM	#11
maniclion Cartographer of the Mind Elite Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Mens Incognita Posts: 20,435 Photos: 10	I get my news from The Daily Show and The Colbert Report that's the only way to go brotha' "We are like tenant farmers chopping down the fence around our house for fuel when we should be using Natures inexhaustible sources of energy — sun, wind and tide. ... I'd put my money on the sun and solar energy. What a source of power! I hope we don't have to wait until oil and coal run out before we tackle that." Thomas Edison: In conversation with Henry Ford and Harvey Firestone

10-23-2009, 10:13 PM	#12
suprfast Registered User Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Merced, ca Posts: 387	Daily show is the best. Its also sad when REAL news shows get rated lower than a comedy show, ABOUT REPORTING NEWS. Colbert and stewart FTW 5'8" 207 lbs 225lbs(6.8.09)/207lbs(10.22.09) looking for 200lbs in 25 weeks(a pound a week) Exercise Examples

10-24-2009, 11:04 AM	#14
Big Smoothy Windy City Elite Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Chicago Posts: 3,266	The problem with FOX news is not Fox's political positions. It's how these positions are expressed. Too much fallacial reasoning during the night-time Op-Ed shows. Fox only gets 3.0 to 3.1 million viewers. Number #1 in the ratings? Yes. Do they affect the national publich policy? No. It's not the message - it's how the message is presented. Military men are dumb, stupid animals, to be used as pawns for foreign policy – Henry Kissinger (January-February 2003 edition of Eagle Newsletter)

10-23-2009, 09:57 AM	#1
busyLivin Senior Member Elite Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Chicago Posts: 4,339	Free Press 1, Obama 0 The Obama administration on Thursday failed in its attempt to manipulate other news networks into isolating and excluding Fox News, as Republicans on Capitol Hill stepped up their criticism of the hardball tactics employed by the White House. The Obama administration on Thursday tried to make "pay czar" Kenneth Feinberg available for interviews to every member of the White House pool except Fox News. The pool is the five-network rotation that for decades has shared the costs and duties of daily coverage of the presidency. But the Washington bureau chiefs of the five TV networks consulted and decided that none of their reporters would interview Feinberg unless Fox News was included. The administration relented, making Feinberg available for all five pool members and Bloomberg TV. The pushback came after White House senior adviser David Axelrod told ABC News' "This Week" on Sunday that Fox News is not a real news organization and other news networks "ought not to treat them that way." Media analysts cheered the decision to boycott the Feinberg interview unless Fox News was included, saying the administration's gambit was taking its feud with Fox News too far. President Obama has already declined to go on "Fox News Sunday," even while appearing on the other Sunday shows. "I'm really cheered by the other members saying "No, if Fox can't be part of it, we won't be part of it,'" said Baltimore Sun TV critic David Zurawik, calling the move to limit Feinberg's availability "outrageous." "What it's really about to me is the Executive Branch of the government trying to tell the press how it should behave. I mean, this democracy -- we know this -- only works with a free and unfettered press to provide information," he said. Fox News legal analyst Peter Johnson Jr. said the administration was potentially in violation of the Constitution with its attempt to restrict access to the "eyes and ears" of the country. "What was averted was a very serious constitutional violation by the White House," Johnson said. "There cannot be selective and arbitrary access to the White House based on some subjective determination." Several top White House advisers have appeared on other news channels to criticize Fox News' coverage of the administration, dismiss the network as the mouthpiece of the Republican Party and urge other news organizations not to treat Fox News as a legitimate news network. On Wednesday, Obama, speaking publicly for the first time about his administration's portrayal of Fox News as illegitimate, said he's not "losing sleep" over the controversy. "I think that what our advisers simply said is, is that we are going to take media as it comes," Obama said when asked about his advisers targeting the network openly. "And if media is operating, basically, as a talk radio format, then that's one thing. And if it's operating as a news outlet, then that's another. But it's not something I'm losing a lot of sleep over." Obama's comments also came after he met Monday with political commentators Keith Olbermann and Rachel Maddow of MSNBC; Eugene Robinson and E.J. Dionne of the Washington Post; Ron Brownstein of the National Journal; John Dickerson of Slate; Frank Rich, Maureen Dowd and Bob Herbert of the New York Times; Jerry Seib of the Wall Street Journal, Gloria Borger of CNN and U.S. News and World Report, and Gwen Ifill of PBS. House Republican leaders rushed to the defense of conservative commentators Thursday after the president's comments. Rep. Mike Pence, chairman of the House Republican Conference, said conservative commentators speak more for Americans than the national media outlets that have targeted them for criticism. "Goaded on by a White House increasingly intolerant of criticism, lately the national media has taken aim at conservative commentators in radio and television," the Indiana Republican said on the House floor. "Suggesting that they only speak for a small group of activists and even suggesting in one report today that Republicans in Washington are 'worried about their electoral effect.' Well, that's hogwash."

10-23-2009, 09:59 AM	#2
busyLivin Senior Member Elite Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Chicago Posts: 4,339	This is absolutely pathetic. I can't wait to hear the "free speech" liberals defend this bullshit.

10-23-2009, 08:07 PM	#9
lnvanry primeau Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Tucson Posts: 3,437 Photos: 16	I agree its a dum dum move politically...but its business as usual. How often did Bush go on MSNBC? In reality I could care less though...they (TV news outlets) are all media whores and hardly ever report objectively, except PBS. I get most of my news from ThomsonReuters and BBC

10-24-2009, 09:06 PM	#17
suprfast Registered User Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Merced, ca Posts: 387	Fox has House MD. Does this count for anything? kris 5'8" 207 lbs 225lbs(6.8.09)/207lbs(10.22.09) looking for 200lbs in 25 weeks(a pound a week) Exercise Examples

10-24-2009, 10:35 PM	#18
10fcp Registered User Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: CA Posts: 1	Glen Beck is da man

10-25-2009, 08:37 AM	#23
vinnie799 Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 3	Outta here The Mullie's got to go Sir Knight A.J. Suvie

10-25-2009, 08:43 AM	#24
vinnie799 Registered User Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 3	Ya goin' blonde? Have ya'll forgotten what those guys' jobs are? They throw 'stuff' out there to piss us off and get us talking to each other just like we are right now. I believe what they say doesn't have to be true. There job is to evoke reactions. It's just that simple. When more people realize it they'll go to more educated folks for conversations. Me included. Sir Knight A.J. Suvie

10-26-2009, 07:40 AM	#26
mcguin "It's not a tooma!" Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: US Posts: 358	It's quite simple, you dont like fox news or what they have to say, dont turn them on, that's why you have the choice of Fx news, CNN, or msnbc. As for the white house, if they want to go after fox, then the social thing to do would be cancel all news networks and start the Obama Network...hmmm, sure this is already in the works actually! p.s.- my last statement is a simple joke, please dont yell!

10-27-2009, 01:16 AM	#28
suprfast Registered User Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Merced, ca Posts: 387	So not true, you can marinate the tofu 5'8" 207 lbs 225lbs(6.8.09)/207lbs(10.22.09) looking for 200lbs in 25 weeks(a pound a week) Exercise Examples

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