Thread: How to rescue the housing market: Foreclosures!

Originally Posted by DOMS

True capitalism is the best form of fiscal environment. It follows a basic premise of survival of the fittest. You either win or lose by your own merits. And there will be losers. Or, to paraphrase Tosh, "Damn, capitalism, you scary!"

but in the real world it only exists at the local level and has many naturally occurring flaws. it's only an economic system and not a hard science. it is also completely separate from monetary systems which effects the basic functions of capitalism.

Originally Posted by LAM

but in the real world it only exists at the local level and has many naturally occurring flaws. it's only an economic system and not a hard science.

No doubt. There needs to be laws to rein in abuses, such as anti-monopoly laws and a minimum wage.

However, it's still the best fiscal system there is.

Four years into the housing crisis, the real estate market is still teetering on the edge. The Obama administration has tried one program after another to stem the tide of foreclosures with limited success. And it is continuing to look for ways "to ease the burden on struggling homeowners," though no new initiative is imminent, the White House said this week.

Like the band-aid stimui that have been done 3 or 4 times, (twice before Obama came into office).

Putting good money after bad. It's just a postponement and delay.

Originally Posted by Big Smoothy

Like the band-aid stimui that have been done 3 or 4 times, (twice before Obama came into office).

Putting good money after bad. It's just a postponement and delay.

the supply-side tax cuts in the 2000's had the exact opposite effect of stimulus, top down grants only make the economy worst, they account for almost 50% of the 14T deficit.

the baby-boomers and older have no desire to feel the financial burden of the cluster fuck of a democracy and market economy that THEY developed in the US these past 3 decades. and this bullshit is not going to last much longer.

below is a pie chart of how wealth is distributed in the US by the 5 different income quintiles..

I borrowed it from the PBS website

Originally Posted by Zaphod

Banks aren't willing to work with homeowners...... But banks aren't willing to work with the customer.

Do you work for a bank? specifically in the REO world? just curious... b/c I do. Banks are willing to work with people. They have huge divisions with in the company I work for dedicated to working out loan mods, short sales, and other programs to keep from foreclosing on people. They employ thousands of people in these divisions.

It's not that banks aren't willing to, if anything there's simply too much work right now. Mortgage servicers can't keep up with the amount of work there is. A lot of stuff falls through the cracks that shouldn't but it's not intentional on the banks part.

Even if for the sake of argument they wanted to they're so heavily scrutinized by the media and especially the government now because of the fallout from the mortgage crisis they're pretty much forced to try to work things out with borrowers before a last result of foreclosure.

Originally Posted by awhites1

Banks are willing to work with people.

not really in any measurable amount or with regularity across the country. home ownership has taken a record decline and with about 25% of US owners upside that rate will continue to fall driving down prices as occupancy rates decrease. banks are trying to clear off their balance sheets right now and increase capital reserves.

the large US banks are lending overseas but smaller banks are not lending especially to small businesses because of the lack of home equity for collateral. lots of info on this at the SBA website.

the OECD and World Bank wanted most country's to increase interest rates 2 years ago but the central bank in the US could not comply. that would send many homeowners into payment ranges they can not afford further increasing foreclosure rates, etc.

most banks have increased APR's on credit cards which can also a sign of increasing inflation. the avg APR in the US right about 15% +/- but rates to depositors on savings accounts are still mainly less than 1%...talk about some bullshit right there

Originally Posted by LAM

not really in any measurable amount or with regularity across the country. home ownership has taken a record decline and with about 25% of US owners upside that rate will continue to fall driving down prices as occupancy rates decrease. banks are trying to clear off their balance sheets right now and increase capital reserves.

the large US banks are lending overseas but smaller banks are not lending especially to small businesses because of the lack of home equity for collateral. lots of info on this at the SBA website.

the OECD and World Bank wanted most country's to increase interest rates 2 years ago but the central bank in the US could not comply. that would send many homeowners into payment ranges they can not afford further increasing foreclosure rates, etc.

most banks have increased APR's on credit cards which can also a sign of increasing inflation. the avg APR in the US right about 15% +/- but rates to depositors on savings accounts are still mainly less than 1%...talk about some bullshit right there

Yes, even though you don't work in the industry anymore and someone who does clearly states to the contrary, you must be right.

Originally Posted by oufinny

Yes, even though you don't work in the industry anymore and someone who does clearly states to the contrary, you must be right.

just because I'm not doing mortgages for a profit doesn't mean i'm not working in the field. i'm sure you have no clue what a person can do once they are given limited power of attorney.

never mind...

Originally Posted by awhites1

never mind...

you are in Texas there were no bubble cities in your state, it was not effected near as much as many other cities. here in Vegas it can take 6-12 months to get a loan modification if/when they do it is usually just a small reduction of the rate and nothing off the principle. short sales her can take from 2 months to over a year, depending on the lender and what zip code you are in. it's the same thing in most parts of AZ, CA and some places on the east coast.

Originally Posted by LAM

just because I'm not doing mortgages for a profit doesn't mean i'm not working in the field. i'm sure you have no clue what a person can do once they are given limited power of attorney.

No I just don't pretend to know everything like you do.

Originally Posted by oufinny

No I just don't pretend to know everything like you do.

I do everything balls to the wall or not at all...if i'm going to do something, I become an expert at it or I don't bother. I've also been in/out of the mortgage business for the past 17 years. the more you know about the system the easier it is to beat it. unfortunately being an engineer i'm also anal-retentive then add in bored, I barely work or sleep so I read about 10 hours a day.

Originally Posted by LAM

I do everything... and...anal

Cool

Nothing you've you've said so far proves or even lends to your point that banks don't care and they're all just trying to foreclose on everyone with out trying to help them out first. A short sale takes along time. A loan mod takes a long time just like getting a mortgage in the first place can take a long time. Doesn't prove they don't care. Have you thought maybe it's not that they don't care, there's just a flood of work to do and not enough people. I had typed up this long post yesterday citing some numbers from my my company but said never mind bc I realize your not really interested in hearing someone else's opinion. Sounds like you've got your mind made up already

The banks don't much give a shit. If they did they would hire the people they need to get the work done. There would be a decline in the rate of foreclosures. There would be no robo-signing of documents. They would have all their shit together, paperwork, etc.

Prove me wrong.

Originally Posted by awhites1

A loan mod takes a long time just like getting a mortgage in the first place can take a long time.

there is no reason for a loan mod to take a long time unless the person has jacked up credit, job instability or a problem with the title, etc. even if you have to beg the underwriters to make an acception or change, that only takes days and/or weeks max not months.

home purchases and refi's with out w/o cash for those that are well qualified shouldn't take any more than 2-3 weeks max before going to docs.

and of course the banks don't care, they are the ones that came up with the securitization process of bundling debt products together and selling them off. along with lobbying for the changes made in TRA97 which increased turnover which further increased home prices far above real income growth and the cost of capital. they get their profits and eliminated much of their exposure to bad debts and somebody else ends up holding those notes (central bank).

homes in extreme bubble cities like Vegas and Phoenix were appreciating at 20-30% a year with real wage growth at less than 2%, fucking ridiculous and a total setup from the beginning...a homeowner w/o much debt can handle payments on a home with a selling price that ranges from 2-3x the household income to keep payments at less than 30% of disposable.

Originally Posted by Zaphod

Prove me wrong.

What did you prove? Do you know how many mortgages are behind currently in the entire country vs how many banks there are and how many ppl they employ to service them and how much it would cost to employ enough people to get it done right. I didn't say it was fair, I just said its not intentional. Believe it or not banks don't make money on foreclosures so ... It's not profitable to foreclose. They lose money on those.

THEY DO NOT MAKE MONEY/PROFIT ON FORECLOSURES
Therefore there is no incentive to foreclose. It's just they made tooany bad loans and now they're paying the price.

i know how to prevented this.Stop lending to blacks and mexicans

Originally Posted by awhites1

THEY DO NOT MAKE MONEY/PROFIT ON FORECLOSURES
Therefore there is no incentive to foreclose. It's just they made tooany bad loans and now they're paying the price.

the banks actually have to spend money on upkeep and maintenance once they take possession.

and it's not just about the loans that were originated during the bubble many people that were not having fiscal problems previously are now due to job losses, depreciating home values, etc. lots of large US based firms reduced workforces to save on payroll far above what was needed. not many have much in the way of non-retirement savings available to carry them through a job loss and unemployment at $400/wk is just enough to keep most from offing themselves.

Originally Posted by awhites1

What did you prove? Do you know how many mortgages are behind currently in the entire country vs how many banks there are and how many ppl they employ to service them and how much it would cost to employ enough people to get it done right. I didn't say it was fair, I just said its not intentional. Believe it or not banks don't make money on foreclosures so ... It's not profitable to foreclose. They lose money on those.

THEY DO NOT MAKE MONEY/PROFIT ON FORECLOSURES
Therefore there is no incentive to foreclose. It's just they made tooany bad loans and now they're paying the price.

You claim there is a shortage of people in banking to do the work to get loan modifications done. You claim there is a backlog of paperwork to do those modifications. You also claim that banks ARE working with people to keep their homes.

I'm going by the rate of foreclosures, the number of empty homes on the market, the dropping market in housing and my own personal experience and the experience of others that I personally know.

So to your claims that banks really don't want to foreclose I say bullshit. You claim to have facts and numbers we aren't privy to that will prove us wrong. So prove us wrong.

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