Thread: Homeland Security streetlights include surveillance cameras and loud speakers

it's not just getting more oil out of the US also have to factor in production and any added costs via commodities trading, etc. and then we need to attack the consumption problem. since the US gov shields consumers from having to pay the full price for gas we are wasteful. americans are way to fat to fit into small fuel efficient cars so we need to make cost effective mid-sized cars with much better fuel economy. urban spraw causes people to drive further than average and gas consumption accounts for 70% of US crude consumption.

since germany bit the bullet and shutdown their nukes they have already started to work on this green energy thing, they will certainly make some good advances in this to lead it off.

Nuclear power is green energy. The problem tree huggers have with it is that it is real. They're idealist and want an idealistic solution. Right now nothing compares to nuclear in being both cheap and clean.

All this talk about "security"? That's just what uncle sammy wants. He wants us all to overlook the real reason for this, advertising and propaganda. The loud speakers are for our safety during natural disasters and attacks, ya right. I saw the line "for emergency broadcast alerts and advertising" oh my. Of course it is bad enough that it invades our rights but it is no less invasive to allow corporations to force adds on us like this.

We have become the "Corporatized" States of America with congress solely owned and operated by huge corporations.

Originally Posted by hypno

We have become the "Corporatized" States of America with congress solely owned and operated by huge corporations.

If you sell your soul, you have only yourself to blame. So if the above is true, I still believe congress is to blame.

Originally Posted by troubador

Nuclear power is green energy. The problem tree huggers have with it is that it is real. They're idealist and want an idealistic solution. Right now nothing compares to nuclear in being both cheap and clean.

It's clean and produces a lot of power. It's what solar and wind power wish they were.

Originally Posted by DOMS

It's clean and produces a lot of power. It's what solar and wind power wish they were.

Solar is a joke. The amount of energy used to produce polycrystalline silicon is outrageous. I bet the amount of electricity used to produce any unit of just the polysilicon is way more electricity than that unit will ever produce during its life as a solar cell; forget the rest of the energy that goes into producing a solar panel.

Originally Posted by troubador

Right now nothing compares to nuclear in being both cheap and clean.

Cheap for who? when I lived in PA there were 3 nuke plants within an hour from my house, TMI, Peach-bottom and Limerick and we paid some of the highest rates in the country.

no such thing as cheap energy to the consumer, utilities by nature are a monopoly as there are no options to choose from.

Originally Posted by LAM

Cheap for who?

Production cost. What power companies charge in various locations is a different matter.

Originally Posted by troubador

Solar is a joke. The amount of energy used to produce polycrystalline silicon is outrageous. I bet the amount of electricity used to produce any unit of just the polysilicon is way more electricity than that unit will ever produce during its life as a solar cell; forget the rest of the energy that goes into producing a solar panel.

Our current solar farm frenzy along with electric/battery hybrid cars is going to being the standing joke in 5-10 years. Just wait and see.


Now, if and when, they can make solar panels out of cheap flexible plastics, we might be on to something with a good long term ROI. Private equity firms are trying to make this happen now.

Originally Posted by troubador

Solar is a joke. The amount of energy used to produce polycrystalline silicon is outrageous. I bet the amount of electricity used to produce any unit of just the polysilicon is way more electricity than that unit will ever produce during its life as a solar cell; forget the rest of the energy that goes into producing a solar panel.

best used for remote locations off the grid until the production problem you cited is reduced.

Originally Posted by troubador

Nuclear power is green energy. The problem tree huggers have with it is that it is real. They're idealist and want an idealistic solution. Right now nothing compares to nuclear in being both cheap and clean.

So I guess the nuclear waste they bury in the ground and under mountains is clean too?

Originally Posted by Gissurjon

So I guess the nuclear waste they bury in the ground and under mountains is clean too?

You think the chemicals used in making solar cells and windmills is clean too?

Modern reactors produce a small fraction of what the old ones did. The old boxcar of drums has been replaced with soup can sized container.

Originally Posted by DOMS

You think the chemicals used in making solar cells and windmills is clean too?

Modern reactors produce a small fraction of what the old ones did. The old boxcar of drums has been replaced with soup can sized container.

Funny I was talking about this exact thing last night. Not to mention all the chemicals, or the vast majority, are petroleum distillates. So no oil, no solar cells. Green energy needs to show the total carbon footprint to produce, if they did it would be staggering how NOT GREEN they are. Not to mention inefficient.

Originally Posted by oufinny

Funny I was talking about this exact thing last night. Not to mention all the chemicals, or the vast majority, are petroleum distillates. So no oil, no solar cells. Green energy needs to show the total carbon footprint to produce, if they did it would be staggering how NOT GREEN they are. Not to mention inefficient.

Imagine what the carbon footprint of that several hundred pound battery in the back of the Prius looks like.

Originally Posted by oufinny

Funny I was talking about this exact thing last night. Not to mention all the chemicals, or the vast majority, are petroleum distillates. So no oil, no solar cells. Green energy needs to show the total carbon footprint to produce, if they did it would be staggering how NOT GREEN they are. Not to mention inefficient.

Not to mention the side effects of some "green" technologies...

Originally Posted by LAM

it's not just getting more oil out of the US also have to factor in production and any added costs via commodities trading, etc. and then we need to attack the consumption problem. since the US gov shields consumers from having to pay the full price for gas we are wasteful. americans are way to fat to fit into small fuel efficient cars so we need to make cost effective mid-sized cars with much better fuel economy. urban spraw causes people to drive further than average and gas consumption accounts for 70% of US crude consumption.

since germany bit the bullet and shutdown their nukes they have already started to work on this green energy thing, they will certainly make some good advances in this to lead it off.

The insane regulations on the production on new, efficient refineries that are also safer is a big issue. The capacity of most is near maximum so drilling here more aggressively will require a massive spike in refinery capacity of accidents will pile up. The US has to drill, drill safely and with smarter regulations that are not ridiculous, and it has to happen soon. The amount of jobs that will create in such a short time is crazy; that is in part why there was low unemployment during the second term of the GWB presidency, the SE was employing tons for the oil industry.

Originally Posted by Gissurjon

So I guess the nuclear waste they bury in the ground and under mountains is clean too?

Compared to other forms of energy production, absolutely. Burying nuclear waste under mountains is pretty close to no waste. There's more radiation exposure living near a coal plant than a nuclear plant or waste disposal site. Where do you think the massive amounts of electricity used to make polysilicon comes from? It sure as hell isn't solar panels.

Originally Posted by oufinny

The US has to drill, drill safely and with smarter regulations that are not ridiculous, and it has to happen soon. The amount of jobs that will create in such a short time is crazy;

Oil boom brings high-paying jobs to North Dakota - Sep. 28, 2011

Originally Posted by troubador

Oil boom brings high-paying jobs to North Dakota - Sep. 28, 2011

This is exactly what happened in Alberta, Canada too and is still the case. Granted, with rapid growth comes some problems but I bet people in the town barely cracking minimum wage before making double or triple that now could care less. This is a perfect example of what WILL HAPPEN if we start to tap the US oil and gas resources both on and offshore.

Originally Posted by troubador

Oil boom brings high-paying jobs to North Dakota - Sep. 28, 2011

I've been reading a lot about this lately. Guys making $100K-$150K/yr living in campers in the Walmart parking lots because there are no homes to rent or buy and shit hole hotel rooms are renting for $6K/mo. Even college professors are quitting school to go work for the oil companies.

Originally Posted by Big Pimpin

I've been reading a lot about this lately. Guys making $100K-$150K/yr living in campers in the Walmart parking lots because there are no homes to rent or buy and shit hole hotel rooms are renting for $6K/mo. Even college professors are quitting school to go work for the oil companies.

Dude, around here, they are charging 6k/mo for 2 bd room apartments.

About 12 dudes will hull up in these.

Originally Posted by DOMS

You think the chemicals used in making solar cells and windmills is clean too?

Modern reactors produce a small fraction of what the old ones did. The old boxcar of drums has been replaced with soup can sized container.

WTF, why do people do this? Did I say anything about solar cells or windmills? No I didn't did I? Just to make sure, scroll back and read my post again.
Get out the sandbox with the "but he did too" mentality. Same bullshit mentality that is going on with politicians, nobody can discuss a fu**ing issue without someone saying "but look at him".

This might possibly be what is wrong with this country, this type of finger pointing mentality, sir.

My car has shitty wheels and doesn't break anymore but it's ok because Johnny's car doesn't have a muffler and is missing a window....

Originally Posted by Big Pimpin

Imagine what the carbon footprint of that several hundred pound battery in the back of the Prius looks like.

Originally Posted by Gissurjon

WTF, why do people do this? Did I say anything about solar cells or windmills? No I didn't did I? Just to make sure, scroll back and read my post again.
Get out the sandbox with the "but he did too" mentality. Same bullshit mentality that is going on with politicians, nobody can discuss a fu**ing issue without someone saying "but look at him".

This might possibly be what is wrong with this country, this type of finger pointing mentality, sir.

It's your posting record, Mr. Orator juriconsult

Originally Posted by Dark Geared God

It's your posting record, Mr. Orator juriconsult

What?

Originally Posted by oufinny

The US has to drill, drill safely and with smarter regulations that are not ridiculous, and it has to happen soon. The amount of jobs that will create in such a short time is crazy; that is in part why there was low unemployment during the second term of the GWB presidency, the SE was employing tons for the oil industry.

that is part of the problem "drilling safely" when gov allows industry's self-regulate bad things happen like Deepwater Horizon and banking collapses.

employment in that industry is always highly overstated by those in it and those that support more local extraction of oil and gas. it has never employed a major share of the US workforce. Not one mention of it in the report below and the raw data I attached in a PDF from the BLS.

Employment loss and the 2007–09 recession: an overview
http://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2011/04/art1full.pdf

With this link you can go back to the 80's and see when employment in that industry was at it's peak in the US.

Bureau of Labor Statistics Data

Originally Posted by Gissurjon

What?

Nuke power has come a long way from 3 mile island