Thread: Sandy Hook hoax is falling apart

I believe just what the article says, if we don't believe it's possible the government can do those things then we are fools. Not saying it happened or not but I am one of those who's been labeled a right wing but job cause I brought up the inconsistencies in the story and the anomalies. Oh well what do I know.

In order for these conspiracy theories to be true, one must first accept two basic principles:
1- the government is capable of keeping a secret
2- the government is competent

If either of these is untrue, a large conspiracy would fail or be revealed.

People like to believe in these theories because it brings order to a chaotic world. Fact is, society contains a level of order that is only as meaningful as those that follow it. Any individual can create havoc with a lone, selfish act.

Originally Posted by J. Daniels

In order for these conspiracy theories to be true, one must first accept two basic principles:
1- the government is capable of keeping a secret
2- the government is competent

If either of these is untrue, a large conspiracy would fail or be revealed.

People like to believe in these theories because it brings order to a chaotic world. Fact is, society contains a level of order that is only as meaningful as those that follow it. Any individual can create havoc with a lone, selfish act.

According to your thought processes the CIA has only done a half dozen or so operations, all of which have resulted in catastrophic failure over the last several decades. The FBI only shoots up and burns down fringe religious sects to the ground, including women and children, like in Waco, Texas.

The government has so much shit going on it would make you lose bowel control for the rest of your life if you had half a clue as to what they are doing and have their fingers into. The greatest successes of the US government? The ones you don't know about and the ones that get passed off as impossible because the government is 100% incompetent.

Originally Posted by J. Daniels

In order for these conspiracy theories to be true, one must first accept two basic principles:
1- the government is capable of keeping a secret
2- the government is competent

If either of these is untrue, a large conspiracy would fail or be revealed.

People like to believe in these theories because it brings order to a chaotic world. Fact is, society contains a level of order that is only as meaningful as those that follow it. Any individual can create havoc with a lone, selfish act.

the JFK assassination blows your "theory" completely out of the water.

Originally Posted by Zaphod

The ones you don't know about and the ones that get passed off as impossible because the government is 100% incompetent.

that's where your wrong, it's 100% competent, only acting like it's incompetent so people lose faith in the system. the concentration of wealth and power in the US and the oligarchy now in power is not that of accident but of planning. nothing the US government does or doesn't do is arbitrary.

look to nations and country's far older than the US and see how they differ. many of the problems we have here they do not, they are specific to this country alone. everybody forgets what a young nation the US is compared to the rest of the industrialized world in the EU, etc.

Originally Posted by Zaphod

According to your thought processes the CIA has only done a half dozen or so operations, all of which have resulted in catastrophic failure over the last several decades. The FBI only shoots up and burns down fringe religious sects to the ground, including women and children, like in Waco, Texas.

The government has so much shit going on it would make you lose bowel control for the rest of your life if you had half a clue as to what they are doing and have their fingers into. The greatest successes of the US government? The ones you don't know about and the ones that get passed off as impossible because the government is 100% incompetent.

Please rerelease my post. I said "large" conspiracy. Meaning game changing, history making events.

And are you seriously using the JFK assassination as an argument? Made a good story for Hollywood but I have yet to see or read anything that clearly shows the govt's role in kiiling JFK. Coincidences, speculation, and odd occurrences are not enough to declare a conspiracy.

Remember, the president couldn't even get a blowjob from a fat chick without the whole world finding out.

Btw- what the fuck would be the govt's motive to kill a class room of kids? J

Every time initial reports don't match the finl story people scream conspiracy. It's absolutely ridiculous. ANYONE was has ever managed a chaotic event will tell you shit is NEVER what it first appeared to be. Takes investigation and time to put all the pieces together.

Originally Posted by J. Daniels

And are you seriously using the JFK assassination as an argument? Made a good story for Hollywood but I have yet to see or read anything that clearly shows the govt's role in kiiling JFK.

really? you think the Secret Service broke all of their standard protection protocols on that day and it was "just a coincidence"? you're obviously not military or ex-military because that shit doesn't happen in reality. you don't practice known effective procedures just to totally disregard them come game day.

it's also documented military history that FDR moved the Pacific Fleet from the home base in CA out to Pearl against the will of the rear admiral in of the fleet who was subsequently revealed of duty for objecting. war games performed years early documented known weakness in Pearl from an air attack from the west. and all the carriers just so happened to be out at sea. all of that surely must just been "another coincidence" also. to get the US into another war, when it did not concern us and the Russian's were already kicking the shit out of the German's, etc.

and when GWB stated "what the US needed was another "Pearl Harbor" which not only got the Patriot Act passed in a day (when it couldn't make it out of committee for years). to start another fake war in the middle east which has made not a single person any safer but increased the wealth of all the capitalists. it's the same old song and dance. false flag event and another costly war, which never benefits the working class.

only a fool would believe there are just so many coincidences again and again. at what time do so many re-occurring events become a behavior pattern in your mind?

sandy hook and other events that just don't add up are all the same. the government using emotions to get what they want with the support of the American people. you can only manipulate people if they allow themselves to be manipulated.

^wow. Not to be mean but you're batshit crazy. The government is run by people. People make mistakes. Decisions happen all the time that turn out wrong. Doesn't mean he bad result was intended.

Security procedures do change on the fly. Unfortunately on that day in Dallas it turned out to be tragic. Easy to judge after the fact. 3 months earlier when they changed protocols in Miami everything went fine. Conspiracy?

Sorry bro but sometimes shit happens. That's life. The govt can get away with small stuff that won't be investigated. Once shit gets big and gets the people's attention, it all falls apart. Watergate, the pentagon papers, Iran contra, .....

Just Google Operation Northwoods if you trully feel this Govt isnt capable of harming its citizens for a bigger objective.

The list goes on with false flag operations. Operation Washtub and Gladio, for example.

Then look at Waco and Wounded Knee.

I wonder when they'll release a photoshopped photo of Lanza holding an AR.

The next thing you know, the government will form a conspiracy to require that all registered gun owners be a member of a well regulated militia.
That of course will be denounced by the tea party as a government conspiracy to violate the second amendment.

Originally Posted by LAM

that's where your wrong, it's 100% competent, only acting like it's incompetent so people lose faith in the system. the concentration of wealth and power in the US and the oligarchy now in power is not that of accident but of planning. nothing the US government does or doesn't do is arbitrary.

look to nations and country's far older than the US and see how they differ. many of the problems we have here they do not, they are specific to this country alone. everybody forgets what a young nation the US is compared to the rest of the industrialized world in the EU, etc.

Most developed countries in the west are socialist, have huge social problems and have learned that their economic models are non sustainable.
You are stating that they should be used as models by the United States?

Originally Posted by SFW

Just Google Operation Northwoods if you trully feel this Govt isnt capable of harming its citizens for a bigger objective.

The list goes on with false flag operations. Operation Washtub and Gladio, for example.

Then look at Waco and Wounded Knee.

^^^this. They are capable and willing.

Originally Posted by J. Daniels

^wow. Not to be mean but you're batshit crazy. The government is run by people. People make mistakes. Decisions happen all the time that turn out wrong. Doesn't mean he bad result was intended.

Run by people with conncections who are influence by special interest. Yeah, they make a lot of mistakes also.

Originally Posted by LAM

and when GWB stated "what the US needed was another "Pearl Harbor" which not only got the Patriot Act passed in a day (when it couldn't make it out of committee for years). to start another fake war in the middle east which has made not a single person any safer but increased the wealth of all the capitalists. it's the same old song and dance. false flag event and another costly war, which never benefits the working class.

The quote above in bold: Did GWB every state this?

It sounds like the PNAC mission statement written by a guy named Donnelly in 1999.

Not sure, just checking. I don't recall GWB ever making that statement.

Originally Posted by Big Smoothy

The quote above in bold: Did GWB every state this?

It sounds like the PNAC mission statement written by a guy named Donnelly in 1999.

Not sure, just checking. I don't recall GWB ever making that statement.

Exactly. Everything is based on falsehoods, innuendos, and assumptions. Fucking retarded nonsense.

These people need to shut off the computer and go live in the real world. Everything isn't as neat and orderly as it is in the movies. It's fucking chaotic and changes every minute.

The conspiracy nut jobs always exploit these events. Its a shame. Just because the first report was a man dressed in black then it turns out he was dressed in brown it must all be a government cover up.

Originally Posted by SFW

Just Google Operation Northwoods if you trully feel this Govt isnt capable of harming its citizens for a bigger objective.

The list goes on with false flag operations. Operation Washtub and Gladio, for example.

Then look at Waco and Wounded Knee.

Thanks for proving my point. Operation Washtub- "The press and the public were skeptical and the story did not get much press". Could it have been true? Maybe. Had the press and public given a damn they would have uncovered the truth. Hence, the inability of the govt being able to keep secrets of highly scrutinized events.

And, by the way, Operations Northwoods never passed the proposal stage. IT NEVER HAPPENED. It was merely discussed. I'm sure there are plenty of outrageous ideas floated about on a daily basis. They are quickly dismissed and the brainstorming evolves.

The fact that you're mentioning all these "operations" further proves my point that govt can't keep a secret. Not much of a secret if its posted on Wikipedia.

Unless you're part of the govt and are planting these ideas in our heads so can ultimately control our minds and lead us to slaughter???

Originally Posted by heavyiron

The conspiracy nut jobs always exploit these events. Its a shame. Just because the first report was a man dressed in black then it turns out he was dressed in brown it must all be a government cover up.

If my child had been murdered at Sandy Hook by a mentally insane person using a gun and I read that someone was using my child's death as a way of advancing a paranoid theory related to promoting a government conspiracy theory that the government murdered my child in-order to violate my second amendment rights as to gun control, I think that I would be tempted to invite them to a mutual exchange of our second amendment rights to try and remove a paranoid hemorrhoid off of the asshole of society.

Originally Posted by SFW

Just Google Operation Northwoods if you trully feel this Govt isnt capable of harming its citizens for a bigger objective.

The list goes on with false flag operations. Operation Washtub and Gladio, for example.

Then look at Waco and Wounded Knee.

The fact that I can Google up information means that the secrecy was blown. J. Daniels isn't saying that the government wouldn't do, he's saying that they couldn't keep it a secret. You just helped to make his argument.

Originally Posted by J. Daniels

Remember, the president couldn't even get a blowjob from a fat chick without the whole world finding out.

That wasn't a government operation, though, was it? It was Bill going rogue for a hummer.

Originally Posted by DOMS

The fact that I can Google up information means that the secrecy was blown. J. Daniels isn't saying that the government wouldn't do, he's saying that they couldn't keep it a secret. You just helped to make his argument.

Time will tell though. It just happened In december....you really think full confessions and evidence are going to present themselves in just over a month?


Its probably a fact that an ar15 was not used in the crime. Why no video footage or even a stillframe from a CC camera? Why the push to ban AR's when one wasnt even used?

Rest in Peace to those lost during the events at Sandy Hook.

Originally Posted by J. Daniels

Exactly. Everything is based on falsehoods, innuendos, and assumptions. Fucking retarded nonsense.

"Everything" is an absolute term and is false.

Whether you're serious or not, LAM is the most informed poster in Open Chat.

And I think you are a ol' hand here with more than "8 posts."

These people need to shut off the computer and go live in the real world. Everything isn't as neat and orderly as it is in the movies. It's fucking chaotic and changes every minute.

These people? Does that include, you?

I haven't heard any positive evidence that this is a government conspiracy. Like most conspiracy theories they look for seeming inconsistencies then fill in the gaps with god...er, I mean fill in the gaps with a conspiracy. Just like creationist don't have any actual evidence for creationism, they just attempt to nitpick evolution. Media initially reports two shooters, then retracts it, conspiracy theorist think this must be a cover up but why? What if there really were two shooters and the media didn't cover it up? How does the fact that there were two shooters entail it was carried out by the government? If you're thinking that it's just one piece of evidence and you have to look at all the inconsistencies, you're dumb and missed the point.

snopes.com: Sandy Hook Hoax Video

this does a pretty thorough job of ripping the hoax theory apart.... i still don't get some parents being able to smile n laugh so soon after though for any reason...

Originally Posted by Bowden

The next thing you know, the government will form a conspiracy to require that all registered gun owners be a member of a well regulated militia.
That of course will be denounced by the tea party as a government conspiracy to violate the second amendment.

There is no national gun registry. Also, the federal government doesn't have the power to force conscription into a militia. If it did then it wouldn't by definition be a militia.