Thread: Anti-Kerry Film looks damaging

People have heard a lot of this kind of crap from the Swift Boat veterans and others. It's not going to make any difference. If you dig around on Dubya's past you'll see someone arrested for DUI, cocaine possession (charges dropped due to Daddy's influence), AWOL from the guard and insider trading at Harken Energy (SEC charges dropped becuase of Daddy'd influence).

The other point people seem to forget is that at least Kerry put his life on the line and went to Vietnam, which is more than can be said of certain Chickenhawks.

pay per view? then fuc that.

I dont think its ppv when its broadcasted next week. thats an option on the web if it's not in your area.

correct me if im wrong.

"I was outraged, and still am, that he (John Kerry) willingly said things that were untrue. "

A lying politician... I cant believe it. What has this world come to!?

Booo hooo for Kerry. He showed his true character the other night with his low blow comments that he used as a crutch to sell himself. All I know is "Democrats are whores for votes" and some things never change

This travesty is being broadcast as a "news" special - which is more an indictment about the journalistic credentials of it's creator and the owner of the broadcast company than the actual content. Sinclair Broadcasting Group have made heavy contributions to the Bush campaign, have ordered stations to refuse campaign ads critical of the President, and earlier this year ordered its few ABC affiliates to not air a programmed tribute to the soldiers who had died during the war.

Now if Sinclair had decided to show this film in conjunction with "F-9/11" then they could have at least diminished the number of complaints that this broadcast is nothing more than another contribution to the Bush campaign - but by attempting to disguise it as a "news" special, they are basically ruining their already tarnished credibility, opening themselves up to license complaints questioning misuse of the public airwaves,
and a growing boycott of their advertisers. At least one station that does business with them (though it isn't owned) has made several public statements that they will not air the program. There will likely be a large boycott of advertisers.

Amazing thing is people weren't being as critical on Moore's 9/11 POS. At least this one includes facts.

Can't have it both ways folks.

Anyone seen FahrenHYPE 9/11? That movie pretty much destroys alot of what Moore claimed in his film. Again, it does it using facts - not cut scenes, hyperbole, and outright bullshit.

This isn't having it both ways, Stick - this is using the public airwaves to promote one particular political campaign. The airwaves belong to the entire public - not to the broadcasting company, and with that comes some degree of responsibility, which includes at least attempting to present many sides to an issue. Sinclair not only has attempted to block information it doesn't want the public to know, but has blatantly promoted a political party, which is exactly what former Pres. Reagan hoped would NOT happen following repeal of the Fairness Doctrine.

Moreover, I'd be careful about the level of claims to "facts" in this edited "news" special, both because of the manner in which the broadcast company is "ordering" it to be shown and because of its unwillingness to provide anything but that opinion. Even though the company vice president claims this is about "the public's right to know", that's a curious notion given the company track record of censorship. It also indicates that conservative arguments about the biased "liberal" media are based on nothing more than the desire to control the media themselves with their own agenda, not encourage participation by all viewpoints. It was an irresponsible decision.

While one of the co-producers formerly had a fairly distinguished journalistic career, he has long been associated with Party operatives. Carlton Sherwood, in his book Inquisition , broadly defended the Rev. Sun Moon as grossly persecuted by both Christians and the government. Ironically, Sherwood once worked for the Washington Times, a newspaper owned by Rev. Moon.

In fact, the Christian Research Institute has a long review of his attitude in writing that work. And while Sherwood claims there is no political motivation to his work on "Stolen Honor," he not only has worked in both the Reagan and Bush Administrations, but has ties to former Pa. Governor Tom Ridge (who is now in charge of Homeland Security). It's been asserted that his production company's office spaces are provided by the RNC.

As for Sinclair Broadcasting, the company is quickly being recognized as a political empire that has ownership of media stations - an dangerous assertion if we expect to keep public ownership of the airwaves.

Originally Posted by shutupntra1n

Booo hooo for Kerry. He showed his true character the other night with his low blow comments that he used as a crutch to sell himself. All I know is "Democrats are whores for votes" and some things never change

u talking about cheney's daughter being a lesbian?? i didnt see any thing wrong with that comment...pple are too fuking sensitive...man the fuk up...and that just shows that the repubs are reaching for anything to take away from bush's shitty debates...

Seems to me the democrats are using Bush's poor debating as a crutch to hold up Kerry's lack of substance. So Bush isn't the best spoken president, or doesnt debate as well on national TV as Kerry. Same goes for Clinton, who is very charismatic in front of the camera. Honestly, how they debate shouldnt be nearly as important as what they are saying... and Kerry sure does talk a lot for a guy who never says anything.

Originally Posted by camarosuper6

Seems to me the republicans are using Bush's poor debating as a crutch to hold up Kerry's lack of substance. So Bush isn't the best spoken president, or doesnt debate as well on national TV as Kerry. Same goes for Clinton, who is very charismatic in front of the camera. Honestly, how they debate shouldnt be nearly as important as what they are saying... and Kerry sure does talk a lot for a guy who never says anything.

I'M NOT A DEMOCRAT!!!!!!

I'M NOT A DEMOCRAT!!!!!!

Congratulations???

I never said ya were

Originally Posted by Stickboy

Amazing thing is people weren't being as critical on Moore's 9/11 POS. At least this one includes facts.

Can't have it both ways folks.

Anyone seen FahrenHYPE 9/11? That movie pretty much destroys alot of what Moore claimed in his film. Again, it does it using facts - not cut scenes, hyperbole, and outright bullshit.

Stick you are getting to involved in Bush and the Republican and to far away from your country's needs. Moore didn't use actors. He did not use CGI. He did not "retouch" the images. He showed raw footage that Bush even denied in his last debate ... the part where he said he was not worried about terrorists. Did Moore over state his theories? Neither you nor I know. We both see the news, hear the Rush show, and cruise the net for info ... but we weren't there when Bush was hooked up with Ken Leh at Enron to see just how crooked it was. There is some truth to Moore's flick Stick. Move away from the party dedication, step away from Bush's people ... and get in tune with the needs of your country bro. You went from debating issues a month or 2 ago to flat out denouncing all things not Bush positive.

Originally Posted by camarosuper6

Seems to me the democrats are using Bush's poor debating as a crutch to hold up Kerry's lack of substance. So Bush isn't the best spoken president, or doesnt debate as well on national TV as Kerry. Same goes for Clinton, who is very charismatic in front of the camera. Honestly, how they debate shouldnt be nearly as important as what they are saying... and Kerry sure does talk a lot for a guy who never says anything.

If we're talking about people with no substance Bush wins hands down. Listen to him on the stump these days, due to his lack of achievements over the past 4 years all he does is pound Kerry. If he had a record to stand on he'd quit the negative campaigning. All Bush talks about is tax cuts, terror, No Child Left a Dime and God.

Originally Posted by redspy

If we're talking about people with no substance Bush wins hands down. Listen to him on the stump these days, due to his lack of achievements over the past 4 years all he does is pound Kerry. If he had a record to stand on he'd quit the negative campaigning.

Oh, you mean like Kerry.. who is always bringing up his liberal voting record

Originally Posted by busyLivin

Oh, you mean like Kerry.. who is always bringing up his liberal voting record

It's amazing how the right has made liberal a dirty little word. Nevermind that we have the most radical right-wing bunch ever to attain power in the US. To be on the far right-wing isn't an issue of course.

Originally Posted by redspy

It's amazing how the right has made liberal a dirty little word. Nevermind that we have the most radical right-wing bunch ever to attain power in the US. To be on the far right-wing isn't an issue of course.

I did find it funny how Bush kept calling Kerry a liberal all throughout the third debate as though it was just discovered.

Originally Posted by tomas101

u talking about cheney's daughter being a lesbian?? i didnt see any thing wrong with that comment...pple are too fuking sensitive...man the fuk up...and that just shows that the repubs are reaching for anything to take away from bush's shitty debates...

Oh this was real classy It has nothing to do with being "sensitive" or "manning the fuck up" there Einstein I was always on the top of all my public speaking classes as well as debates and it is very unprofessional and unfactual to ever, ever, ever use a third party phrase... ie, "so and so would say if you asked them". It holds no substance and is an awful way to prove a point. That is why even many Dems thought Kerry was way out of line. That would be like Bush commenting on Kerry and his two divorces and his claim to Catholosism. It has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with being for or against Kerry. You should never use hearsay in a debate. It looks like your statements are opinionated and not factual. Not to mention your oponent. He said, "If you ask her she would say..." Didn't matter so much about the lesbian part. (and furthermore couldn't say 2 postitive words about his wife)

"Then I come back to the world, and I see all those maggots at the airport, protestin' me, spittin', callin' me a baby killer and all kinds of vile crap! Who are they to protest me?! Huh?! Who are they?! Unless they been me and been there and know what the hell they yellin' about!"-John Rambo, First Blood 1982

I opened with that quote, because that wasnt just a line in a movie but it sadly was a reality for alot of Vietnam soldiers who came home from the war. Why did people treat them this way? Because of communist pigs like John "Fonda" Kerry protesting, and testifying in front of congress calling his fellow soldiers a bunch of war criminals. Claiming that soldiers over there committed all these attrocities, listening to his testimony it made me wanna vomit. So now the people who bought into Kerry's garbage testimony hated the men who fought in Vietnam and life was hell for them when they came home. Kerry is nothing but a commie vote whore, who panders to whatever crowd he is talking to. He is gonna say anything it takes to win this election, and the smart people in this country are gonna vote for Bush. Just look at his record in the senate, he is a damn communist and he wants to try and use conservative rhetoric to try and get elected. He is a liberal 100%. When Reagan was funding the freedom fighters in Nicaruaga back in the 80's , the SOB Kerry went down there and met with and buddied up to the communist leaders. Its all fact people. And that low blow he delivered in the debates bringing up Cheney's daughters private life, in an attempt at a cheap political ploy, phewww! If I was Dick Cheney I would slam my fist right into the middle of Kerry's orange botoxed face!
If you vote for this man you are a communist/solicialist and you are voting against everything our founding fathers stood for and that is my opinion! This guy if elected is gonna be worse than Carter ever was, and if America isnt destroyed by the terrorists it will be destroyed by socialism that Kerry will inflict on our country!
I will leave you with a few facts for all of you commie President George W bashers!

When some claim President Bush shouldn't have started this war, state the following. . .

FDR. . .
led us into World War II. Germany never attacked us: Japan did. From 1941-1945, 450,000 lives were lost, an average of 112,000 per year.

Truman. . .
finished that war and started one in Korea, North Korea never attacked us. From 1950-1953, 55,000 lives were lost, an average of 18,334 per year.

John F. Kennedy. . .
started the Vietnam conflict in 1962. Vietnam never attacked us.

Johnson. . .
turned Vietnam into a quagmire. From 1965-1975, 58,000 lives were lost, an average of 5,800 per year.

Clinton. . .
went to war in Bosnia without UN or French consent, Bosnia never attacked us. He was offered Osama bin Laden's head on a platter three times by Sudan and did nothing. Osama attacked us on multiple occasions.

In the two years since terrorists attacked us President Bush has liberated two countries, crushed the Taliban, crippled Al-qaida, put nuclear inspectors in Libya, Iran and North Korea without firing a shot, and captured a terrorist who slaughtered 300,000 of his own people.

The Democrats are complaining about how long the war is taking, but. . .It took less time to take Iraq than it took Janet
Reno to take the Branch Davidian compound. That was a 51-day operation. We've been looking for evidence of chemical weapons in Iraq for less time than it took Hillary Clinton to find the Rose Law Firm billing records. It took less time for the 3rd Infantry division and the Marines to destroy the Medina Republican Guard than it took Ted Kennedy to call the police after his Oldsmoblie sank at Chappaquiddick. It took less time to take Iraq than it took to count the votes in Florida ! ! !

Keep America strong vote Bush 2004!

So you deny there were war crimes commited by US troops in Vietnam? Of course you do because you watch all the horseshit patriotic cheerleading media and think American is blameless for everything.

Vietnam was over 30 years ago. It was also the wrong war ran by the wrong people. Who the hell cares what some kid who just came back from Vietnam said. I'm sure he saw a lot of bad stuff and was expressing it how he saw fit. I've worked with Vets who told me some pretty wicked stories about what went on over there. Duty and honor only go so far.

At least he went and knows what it feels like to be shot at. All Bush ever did was dodge beer tops on weekends!!

Originally Posted by KingofdaForest

"Then I come back to the world, and I see all those maggots at the airport, protestin' me, spittin', callin' me a baby killer and all kinds of vile crap! Who are they to protest me?! Huh?! Who are they?! Unless they been me and been there and know what the hell they yellin' about!"-John Rambo, First Blood 1982

I just bought the ppv. That's pretty much what all the veterans say. Instead of coming home a hero, they came home as the enemy. They said the stories Kerry was telling were outright lies; Kerry made it sound like every soldier was doing that. There was an isolated incident, but the commander was held accountable. Also, the video goes on about how much hatred the Vietnamese had for the US after all the stories came out from Kerry.. and how they feel that caused their lengthened time as a prison & cost many their lives.

This is just what the video states...don't yell at me I wonder if it will affect voters.

And no, redspy.. the US is not flawless... but when the troops come home, the least they should get for putting their lives on the line is a warm welcome, not spit in their face for something a few people did.

Originally Posted by redspy

It's amazing how the right has made liberal a dirty little word. Nevermind that we have the most radical right-wing bunch ever to attain power in the US. To be on the far right-wing isn't an issue of course.

Funny how liberals interpret the label "liberal" it as negative when it comes from a moderate or a conservative. Perhaps he was trying to give the jackass a compliment...

Hey man - your liberal.

OD

whats weird is my uncle who was in vietnam and killed many people, kids, ladies, who ever threatened his life, but feels that this bullshit about vietnam being brought up is just sad...he cant stand these swift boat vets either...they talk nothing but rubbish..and he agrees with what kerry did 100%...he said he wished he could have done what kerry did...and he was also saying that you dont just get medals for nothing...they dont just give medals out to anybody....i'll take my uncle's advice who was one of just a couple pple from his platoon to actually survive, than these swift vote fukers...he's still fuked up in the head from the war too...you wouldnt believe the stories that he has told...

Originally Posted by redspy

If we're talking about people with no substance Bush wins hands down. Listen to him on the stump these days, due to his lack of achievements over the past 4 years all he does is pound Kerry. If he had a record to stand on he'd quit the negative campaigning. All Bush talks about is tax cuts, terror, No Child Left a Dime and God.

You got to be kidding? We watch the same debates. Virtually every response of Kerry's was personally condescending of Bush. Bush showed incredible resolve to ignore him and not walk over and spit in his face for the underhanded crap he pulled on those debates? Mr. "I got a plan" Kerry is a complete phony. He has no track record and is a utter failure in the senate. He would be absolutely ineffective in the white house. He is clueless how to fund anything he proposes and is just playing typical democratic demagoguery. But it don't work any more - the blue collar workers are a lot more educated since when he first started in politics and he is out of touch with the fact that everyone sees him for what he is - vapor.

OD

Originally Posted by tomas101

whats weird is my uncle who was in vietnam and killed many people, kids, ladies, who ever threatened his life, but feels that this bullshit about vietnam being brought up is just sad...he cant stand these swift boat vets either...they talk nothing but rubbish..and he agrees with what kerry did 100%...he said he wished he could have done what kerry did...and he was also saying that you dont just get medals for nothing...they dont just give medals out to anybody....i'll take my uncle's advice who was one of just a couple pple from his platoon to actually survive, than these swift vote fukers...he's still fuked up in the head from the war too...you wouldnt believe the stories that he has told...

I expect to find no credibility of a man as clearly "fucked in the head" as is your uncle. I'd say he is demented.

OD

Originally Posted by OceanDude

I expect to find no credibility of a man as clearly "fucked in the head" as is your uncle. I'd say he is demented.

OD

ok maybe the wrong words to use...he just has flash backs etc...but i trust him over these pple...he's still works and lives a regualr life, but just sometimes has BAD days....i can understand why..i guess u couldnt

Originally Posted by redspy

So you deny there were war crimes commited by US troops in Vietnam? Of course you do because you watch all the horseshit patriotic cheerleading media and think American is blameless for everything.

Patriotic media??? What country are you living in?? Certainly not the USA! Or if you are living here, you really are in la la land like all liberals are and completely out of touch with reality. I guess its true, that liberals are so open minded their brains have fallen out! The mainstream media here for the most part is liberal as you can get, with the exception of Fox news that is. Why do you think that ass clown Peter Jennings stopped Toby Keith from performing his song on that ABC special. I am just sick of people like you tearing down our country every chance you get. Thats whats wrong with you damn liberals, you wanna assign the blame to our country instead of to anyone else who deserves it.
Yes, there were some Americans that commited war crimes. So what? Its war! Sh*t happens. And even if some did that gives no reason for Kerry to make it sound like everybody in Nam was a war criminal! Hell we need to start getting cut throat, especially in these times but its impossible because liberal crybabies whine and protest. Once we capture terroists they need to be lined up and shot! The only way we win, is by killing more and more of them and I am all for it! Survival of the fittest! We are the strongest nation on the face of the earth and if you liberals are threatend by that well you can always get your asses out of here and go up to Canada or move on over to France.
For your information my dad was in Vietnam for two years, and people like Kerry who protested the war and spread lies were why people spit on them when they came home! Kerry was over there for 3 and 1/2 freakin months! And he has b*tched and whined about it for the past 30 years and wants all this recognition for being a great Vietnam war hero. He brings it up every time he talks,,,I got news for him, he aint the only one who was over there!
If you vote for Kerry you are an idiot, he has a crap record and this is the same man who wants us to get a permission slip from the UN before we defend ourselves and he wants to get rid of our nuclear weapons! Like I said he is a vote whore, who will change his issues and pander depending on what kind of people he is talking to. He is gonna say anything to win. He can run but he cannot hide, he has got a record people!
I am praying Bush will win, because if he isnt you are gonna see a return to Carterism, except it will be twice as bad! mark my words, if Kerry is elected we are in trouble.