Thread: Pope John Paul II RIP

Although I take some jokes at the catholic church, I liked him. RIP

oh well....

condolences to those of the catholic faith

he was a great man. hard act to follow, whoever they decide.

Originally Posted by crazy_enough

oh well....

cold!

Originally Posted by crazy_enough

oh well....

Wow..

Originally Posted by du510

Wow..

Oh well as in life goes on...A new pope is ready to take the spot, those of the faith will morn and be guided by a new leader, but all over the world, people keep dying EVERY second....Not being mean....I apologize if anyone felt offended, not my intention.

Its not like anyone here knew him personally ....

Kinsey comes to mind. One person who places more importance on protecting his interests than the hearts, minds and bodies of numerous children being used for the sexual gratification of adults is pretty much the same as the next in my book.

Originally Posted by busyLivin

he was a great man. hard act to follow, whoever they decide.

I am thinking with a JOhn Paul the 3rd, seems like a natural progression. Although, I nominate G-Dub, that would get him out of our hair for a while.

.

i just found out technically they could nominate any baptized roman catholic male, i thought that was kind of interesting. i thought only cardinals could be the next pope

Originally Posted by bio-chem

i just found out technically they could nominate any baptized roman catholic male, i thought that was kind of interesting. i thought only cardinals could be the next pope

I nominate ME.

Originally Posted by rockgazer69

Kinsey comes to mind. One person who places more importance on protecting his interests than the hearts, minds and bodies of numerous children being used for the sexual gratification of adults is pretty much the same as the next in my book.

Wow.

altho i am a raised "muslim" ( i do not fallow the religion but i still consider myself a muslim and follow the holidays) and my mom is christian religion.i have nothing to do with the catholics i still feel sorry for the guy RIP and much respect for him, probably was a good man!!!!

Originally Posted by rockgazer69

Kinsey comes to mind. One person who places more importance on protecting his interests than the hearts, minds and bodies of numerous children being used for the sexual gratification of adults is pretty much the same as the next in my book.

You're seriously off base in that. In many ways its like saying "President so and so is responsible because this child molester got a kid in my city". For one, he has alot going on, and he might not have know it was such a huge problem. Second, I dont know if when the main amount of this stuff was happening if he was cognitively capable of handling all of it.

I'm an athiest, and I dont believe the Pope has any more connection to anything than I do, but this Pope was always somebody who pushed for human rights, and even slapped the US around a little when he thought we werent protecting those.

What exactly would you have him do btw? I've heard of a few shady situations, but I dont necessarily recall them having him as part of it. Should he tell the priests not to molest boys? Umm, dont you think that might not help so much, being that what they are doing is illegal and against the faith? You might as well expect the president to turn robo cop and go around and personally protect all the kids in the US who are being molested.

Granted, I think he could have done more, or done something differently... but I think you are a bit too quick to try and condemn somebody that IMO truly had good intentions.

I think that it places him in an especially difficult position because of his need to have faith and to forgive. I'm not in the situation he's in, so I find it hard to judge his actions when there is so much else to consider.

He was a good man who will be greatlly missed by the world as a whole

Originally Posted by Eggs

You're seriously off base in that. In many ways its like saying "President so and so is responsible because this child molester got a kid in my city". For one, he has alot going on, and he might not have know it was such a huge problem. Second, I dont know if when the main amount of this stuff was happening if he was cognitively capable of handling all of it.

I'm an athiest, and I dont believe the Pope has any more connection to anything than I do, but this Pope was always somebody who pushed for human rights, and even slapped the US around a little when he thought we werent protecting those.

What exactly would you have him do btw? I've heard of a few shady situations, but I dont necessarily recall them having him as part of it. Should he tell the priests not to molest boys? Umm, dont you think that might not help so much, being that what they are doing is illegal and against the faith? You might as well expect the president to turn robo cop and go around and personally protect all the kids in the US who are being molested.

Granted, I think he could have done more, or done something differently... but I think you are a bit too quick to try and condemn somebody that IMO truly had good intentions.

I think that it places him in an especially difficult position because of his need to have faith and to forgive. I'm not in the situation he's in, so I find it hard to judge his actions when there is so much else to consider.

well said.. even for an atheist

Originally Posted by rantheman

He was a good man who will be greatlly missed by the world as a whole

finally a solid answer

Originally Posted by crazy_enough

Oh well as in life goes on...A new pope is ready to take the spot, those of the faith will morn and be guided by a new leader, but all over the world, people keep dying EVERY second....Not being mean....I apologize if anyone felt offended, not my intention.

Its not like anyone here knew him personally ....

off the topic i think this women has a desire of attraction to me

Originally Posted by crazy_enough

Oh well as in life goes on...A new pope is ready to take the spot, those of the faith will morn and be guided by a new leader, but all over the world, people keep dying EVERY second....Not being mean....I apologize if anyone felt offended, not my intention.

Its not like anyone here knew him personally ....

You're right. While we're at it, let's do away with MLK Day, Presidents Day, etc. They all died, life goes on.. & nobody knew them personally.

It's about celebrating a great man's life..

Originally Posted by Eggs

You're seriously off base in that. In many ways its like saying "President so and so is responsible because this child molester got a kid in my city". For one, he has alot going on, and he might not have know it was such a huge problem. Second, I dont know if when the main amount of this stuff was happening if he was cognitively capable of handling all of it.

I'm an athiest, and I dont believe the Pope has any more connection to anything than I do, but this Pope was always somebody who pushed for human rights, and even slapped the US around a little when he thought we werent protecting those.

What exactly would you have him do btw? I've heard of a few shady situations, but I dont necessarily recall them having him as part of it. Should he tell the priests not to molest boys? Umm, dont you think that might not help so much, being that what they are doing is illegal and against the faith? You might as well expect the president to turn robo cop and go around and personally protect all the kids in the US who are being molested.

Granted, I think he could have done more, or done something differently... but I think you are a bit too quick to try and condemn somebody that IMO truly had good intentions.

I think that it places him in an especially difficult position because of his need to have faith and to forgive. I'm not in the situation he's in, so I find it hard to judge his actions when there is so much else to consider.

hmmm repeatedly relocate priests who molest not one but dozens and dozens of boys. put the same families that come faithfully into the church to worship in jeopardy. that's just not the answer and when it was proved undeniably time and time again that these priests only found fresh victims once relocated relocating the offending priest was still standard procedure. what if your son was some priests fresh start in a new town? then you found out he was known to have molested close to 100 boys total in 3 different churches he was sent to? make no mistake good man or not, worthy of our pity or not, mentally sound at the end or not this man contributed to the continuing molestation and rape of many children. i understand his position making his ability to act difficult but put these men where they cannot continue to do harm. how many people here have ever listened to a small child tell you they were the victim of such a man? i have but i still cannot fathom what i would have felt like had it been my child and certainly not the fault of my church.

Of course, I do not want to see anybody die. But the Catholic church gives me the willies. I'm kind'a with RG on this one.

Originally Posted by Eggs

Second, I dont know if when the main amount of this stuff was happening if he was cognitively capable of handling all of it.

That upholds RGs statement, he should have stepped aside then. Not saying I agree with her, but it does help her point.

The victims of those crimes, their families and loved ones, are inclined to disagree. They hold church leaders responsible for every case in which child molestation by a priest was concealed from authorities, hushed up with empty promises of counseling and ardent admonitions to protect the good name of the church.

http://www.crimelibrary.com

All the political and religious things aside, we can all agree that PJP was important because he ushered in the age of the Pope-mobile.

Originally Posted by overthepond

All the political and religious things aside, we can all agree that PJP was important because he ushered in the age of the Pope-mobile.

and 'the wave'

Originally Posted by rockgazer69

The victims of those crimes, their families and loved ones, are inclined to disagree. They hold church leaders responsible for every case in which child molestation by a priest was concealed from authorities, hushed up with empty promises of counseling and ardent admonitions to protect the good name of the church.

http://www.crimelibrary.com

i don't think anyone gives the Catholic Church a pass for what happened.

A man that millions loved has died. If you don't like him, that is fine... but I sincerely hope that when we die people don't rush to point out all of our bad decisions, that they admittedly know little about.

i do understand you anger, though.

Originally Posted by Dale Mabry

That upholds RGs statement, he should have stepped aside then. Not saying I agree with her, but it does help her point.

It does and does not uphold it. I was putting out several possibilities, not saying that any specific one was true.

As to stepping down... Popes dont just step down, at least from what I've seen. I think with his physical ailments, he would have preferred to be chilling in the Bahamas sipping on a nice red wine.

Originally Posted by rockgazer69

The victims of those crimes, their families and loved ones, are inclined to disagree. They hold church leaders responsible for every case in which child molestation by a priest was concealed from authorities, hushed up with empty promises of counseling and ardent admonitions to protect the good name of the church.

http://www.crimelibrary.com

Good, and I hold them responsible for the fact that I'm not a millionaire right now. In some way, each and every one of them is responsible in my eyes. That, or we can all just agree that just because someone says someone else is responsible does not make it so.

Church leaders should be held responsible... but this is a local matter in many ways. What you are saying, is that the Pop should have led a witch hunt through the Catholic churches, and burned and destroyed Catholocism over this. Thats nice, but it just doesnt work like that. From what I've read on that little Crime Library thing is that the church is kicking out alot of priests and turning their names over to civil authorities. Yes, stuff did happen before and its truly sad that it did. Changes need to be made, but these changes need to largely take place at the local level. Accountability needs to be had, but this isnt something that the Pope can take care of all by himself. Church leaders definitely should be held accountable if they did wrong, but going out and burning the town down to find them is reminiscent of Nero, and not of something the church should be involved in.

You guys can call the Pope all the names you want, and you can say he is reponsible all you want. When it comes down to it, its about as stupid as saying that the President is responsible for things that happen on a local level.

Tell you what, give me the name of every person you've voted for, and I'll look into the laws they've voted for or against that ended up possibly having a negative effect, and I'll blame you for those, because you voted for that person. Does that sound fair?

Then I can say you're responsible for murder... or child molestation... or rape... or whatever I so feel. Now how does that sound?