Thread: Death Penalty and Abortion

Yes and yes, I think there are situations and circumstances that warrant both.

Now if we could abort the current legislators/court justices...

And give the death penalty to all the lawyers...

Double yes. In fact, abortion could have weeded out a good portion of the people now on death row.

Death penalty = yes.
Right to choose = yes (I'm personally against abortion, but women should have the right).

yes & yes

Abortion Statistics - U.S.

* Approximately 1,370,000 abortions occur annually in the U.S. according to the Alan Guttmacher Institute. Click here to see the approximate number of abortions in the U.S. per year from 1973-1996. In 2001, 1.31 million abortions took place.
* 88% of abortions occur during the first 6 to 12 weeks of pregnancy.
* 60% of abortions are performed on women who already have one or more children.
* 47% of abortions are performed on women who have already had one or more abortions.

http://womensissues.about.com/cs/abo...rtionstats.htm




Number of Executions in U.S. Increases


Texas led all states with 33 out of 71 executions
Thirteen states carried out 71 executions in 2002, five more than in 2001, according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS). Texas led all other states with 33 executions in 2002, followed by Oklahoma (7), Missouri (6), and Georgia and Virginia (4 each).

So far this year, preliminary data show that the states executed 60 prisoners from January 1 through November 7, 2003. Lethal injection was used in 59 of the executions, while one prisoner was electrocuted. During 2003, Texas has executed 21, followed by Oklahoma with 14 and North Carolina with 5.

While executions increased, 2002 marked the fourth straight year during which death row admissions dropped -- 304 death row inmates were admitted in 1998, 282 in 1999, 232 in 2000 and 163 in 2001. During 2002, 159 persons received a death sentence, the lowest number since 1973, when 44 persons were put on death row.

As of December 31, 2002, federal and state authorities held 3,557 inmates on death row, 20 fewer than at the end of 2001.

A total of 3,601 prisoners were on death row on December 31, 2000.

Among the 38 states with capital punishment laws as of December 2002, California held the most death row inmates (614), followed by Texas (450), Florida (366) and Pennsylvania (241). The Federal Bureau of Prisons held 24 inmates. Twelve states and the District of Columbia do not authorize capital punishment.

BJS also reported that:

# Of the 69 men and two women put to death last year, 53 were white and 18 black. Six were Hispanics, all of whom were white. They had been on death row an average of 10 years and 7 months, which was 15 months less than those executed in 2001. Seventy of these individuals were executed by lethal injection and one by electrocution.

# Among all inmates on death row as of December 31, 2002, the youngest was 18 years old and the oldest 87. Seventy-four of the 3,299 inmates for whom the date of arrest was available were 17 or younger at the time of the arrest.

# A total of 51 women were on death row as of the end of last year, compared with 36 in 1992.

# Among inmates on death row at the end of 2002 for whom information was available, 64 percent had a prior felony conviction, including 8 percent with a previous homicide conviction.

# Twelve percent of the 6,912 men and women who were under a death sentence between 1977 and 2002 were executed, 4 percent died from other causes, and 33 percent had their capital sentences reduced to lesser penalties for various reasons.

Eleven states revised statutory provisions relating to the death penalty during 2002. Five states changed their statutes to allow jurors rather than judges to determine the presence of aggravating factors. One state authorized lethal injection as a method of execution; one raised the minimum age for which the death penalty can be given and one revised its code to exclude the mentally retarded from capital sentencing or execution. One state had portions of its death penalty statute overturned by the U.S. Supreme Court.
http://usgovinfo.about.com/cs/census...xecution02.htm

No to the death penalty, no way should someone have it out of punishment that easy. What if that's part of their whole master plan to have someone put them to death? What if they just want to commit suicide but want to go out in a glorious fashion? No you don't get off that easy no way sit in your cell and suffer, there are people sitting in prison for years for a joint they have to suffer, why should someone else get off easy for murdering 20 cops?

I say yes to both. As far as abortion goes, what about a woman who was brutally raped and bearing the child will be an everyday reminder of what she went through? And if that situation is "ok" then who is to say whether or not a womans situation is a permissible one, and how will they possibly arrive at that decision without taking their own beliefs into consideration?

everyone who is against abortion should get their very own crack baby.

Originally Posted by maniclion

No to the death penalty, no way should someone have it out of punishment that easy. What if that's part of their whole master plan to have someone put them to death? What if they just want to commit suicide but want to go out in a glorious fashion? No you don't get off that easy no way sit in your cell and suffer, there are people sitting in prison for years for a joint they have to suffer, why should someone else get off easy for murdering 20 cops?

Yeah, but what about the killers who deserve the death penalty but don't have this mentality? Ted Bundy appealed his death sentence multiple times, and claimed to have found God in order to avoid the death penalty.

Originally Posted by TheCurse

everyone who is against abortion should get their very own crack baby.

riiiiiiiiiiight..... Most abortions are done by middle class non crack smoking women. Poor woman can't afford it.

I votes incorrectly...I am against DP and a little gray on abortion. Making it illegal it not right, but I would never endorse anyone to to get it done. The answer to abortion lies in education not in legislation.

DP actions lie with the victims family not the state. If someone rapes and killed my daughter I would take care of it...even if I went to prison for it. Besides more death row inmates are hated by the prison population and would be killed in there. I heard an interview w/ an ex con who spoke of a "code" and certain things were unaccpetable: serial killing/child crimes/Jeffry Dohmar type stuff... He was killed in prison FYI.

Yes foreman it is possible for republicans to think this way

Originally Posted by gococksDJS

Yeah, but what about the killers who deserve the death penalty but don't have this mentality? Ted Bundy appealed his death sentence multiple times, and claimed to have found God in order to avoid the death penalty.

See if there were no death penalty he wouldn't have had anything to keep his time occupied, but since there is he kept his mind off his imprisonment by fighting his impending death. I say solitary confinement for life would give them plenty of time to dwell on what rotten assholes they are.

Let's see: kill the innocent and let the murderers live.

Great fucking logic.

Originally Posted by lnvanry

riiiiiiiiiiight..... Most abortions are done by middle class non crack smoking women. Poor woman can't afford it.

I votes incorrectly...I am against DP and a little gray on abortion. Making it illegal it not right, but I would never endorse anyone to to get it done. The answer to abortion lies in education not in legislation.

DP actions lie with the victims family not the state. If someone rapes and killed my daughter I would take care of it...even if I went to prison for it. Besides more death row inmates are hated by the prison population and would be killed in there. I heard an interview w/ an ex con who spoke of a "code" and certain things were unaccpetable: serial killing/child crimes/Jeffry Dohmar type stuff... He was killed in prison FYI.

Yes foreman it is possible for republicans to think this way

what makes humans so damn special? we can slaughter animals all we want in any numbers. look at what humans do to the planet. we fit the definition of a parasite to a T. we will continue to use and abuse our host until there is nothing left. there are currently 6 billion humans on this planet. that number is projected to increase to 9 billion by 2050. the planet cannot sustain that population period. but the humans are so self righteous we think it is our right to overpopulate in the name of 'human rights' and cause any other species to go extinct that gets in our way.
pretty short sighted to think this is 'good' and 'just'.

Originally Posted by cfs3

Let's see: kill the innocent and let the murderers live.

Great fucking logic.

Kill the innocent that may live lives of agony(raped AIDS woman, crank babies upon several other possibilties)let live in agony murderers of innocents. That's my logic.
If you feel so strongly about innocents dying then stop jerking off, everyone of your sperms could have been used to fertilize an egg for a childless woman and that's hundreds of thousands of babies at a time. I think a woman should have a choice.

Originally Posted by lnvanry

riiiiiiiiiiight..... Most abortions are done by middle class non crack smoking women. Poor woman can't afford it.

I votes incorrectly...I am against DP and a little gray on abortion. Making it illegal it not right, but I would never endorse anyone to to get it done. The answer to abortion lies in education not in legislation.

DP actions lie with the victims family not the state. If someone rapes and killed my daughter I would take care of it...even if I went to prison for it. Besides more death row inmates are hated by the prison population and would be killed in there. I heard an interview w/ an ex con who spoke of a "code" and certain things were unaccpetable: serial killing/child crimes/Jeffry Dohmar type stuff... He was killed in prison FYI.

Yes foreman it is possible for republicans to think this way

Who's having abortions (income)?
Women with family incomes less than $15,000 obtain 28.7% of all abortions; Women with family incomes between $15,000 and $29,999 obtain 19.5%; Women with family incomes between $30,000 and $59,999 obtain 38.0%; Women with family incomes over $60,000 obtain 13.8%.

Who's having abortions (age)?
52% of women obtaining abortions in the U.S. are younger than 25: Women aged 20-24 obtain 32% of all abortions; Teenagers obtain 20% and girls under 15 account for 1.2%.

Looks like about 50-50 to me......

Originally Posted by maniclion

What if that's part of their whole master plan to have someone put them to death?

What if their master plan was to get rent for free for the rest of their lives.

Originally Posted by lnvanry

riiiiiiiiiiight..... Most abortions are done by middle class non crack smoking women. Poor woman can't afford it.

I votes incorrectly...I am against DP and a little gray on abortion. Making it illegal it not right, but I would never endorse anyone to to get it done. The answer to abortion lies in education not in legislation.

DP actions lie with the victims family not the state. If someone rapes and killed my daughter I would take care of it...even if I went to prison for it. Besides more death row inmates are hated by the prison population and would be killed in there. I heard an interview w/ an ex con who spoke of a "code" and certain things were unaccpetable: serial killing/child crimes/Jeffry Dohmar type stuff... He was killed in prison FYI.

Yes foreman it is possible for republicans to think this way

http://www.cbrinfo.org/Resources/fastfacts.html
Abortion coverage:
48% of all abortion facilities provide services after the 12th week of pregnancy. 9 in 10 managed care plans routinely cover abortion or provide limited coverage. About 14% of all abortions in the United States are paid for with public funds, virtually all of which are state funds. 16 states (CA, CT, HI, ED, IL, MA , MD, MD, MN, MT, NJ, NM, NY, OR, VT, WA and WV) pay for abortions for some poor women.


Again you might be wrong on this one Invanry

Originally Posted by TheCurse

everyone who is against abortion should get their very own crack baby.

then everyone who is for abortion should watch one happen in person.

Originally Posted by busyLivin

then everyone who is for abortion should watch one happen in person.

Been their done that, no surgical procedure is pretty to watch.

Originally Posted by Dale Mabry

What if their master plan was to get rent for free for the rest of their lives.

Well they can do that with many other felonies so where is the line drawn?

Originally Posted by ForemanRules

Again you might be wrong on this one Invanry

Wrong on what...that was personal reflective statement...There were no facts

and what do mean by "Again"

Originally Posted by TheCurse

what makes humans so damn special? we can slaughter animals all we want in any numbers. look at what humans do to the planet. we fit the definition of a parasite to a T. we will continue to use and abuse our host until there is nothing left. there are currently 6 billion humans on this planet. that number is projected to increase to 9 billion by 2050. the planet cannot sustain that population period. but the humans are so self righteous we think it is our right to overpopulate in the name of 'human rights' and cause any other species to go extinct that gets in our way.
pretty short sighted to think this is 'good' and 'just'.

So what do you suggest? Controlled parenting? Who will set the limits to the number of children a family can have? Will they just abort a child conceived after the parents exceed the set number? If anyone proposed a plan to control the population, how would they possibly enforce it? There are so many different angles to consider. What about orthodox catholics who do not believe in birth control? Can they no longer have sex for fear of their future child being aborted because they already have the maximum number of children allowed? If there was a law that controlled the number of children that parents could have and it was actually strictly enforced, that would mean one of 3 things. Any child conceived after the max number allowed would be aborted, a man would get a vasectomy after having the max number of children or a woman would get her tubes tied after the max number, so do you see any chance of someone's personal rights being violated if it was actually enforced? And if you start making exceptions by letting some parents have more children than others, you would have to base that on a certain reason, not just on randomness, meaning you basically have the beginning of a caste system. You say that humans think we have the right to overpopulate, but this means we think we have the right to bear as many offspring as we wish, and I think I do have that right. Would you let someone tell you how many kids you could or couldn't have?

I am against both.

Originally Posted by BigDyl

I am against both.

Hopefully this never happens to anyone, but what if you had a wife or girlfriend who was brutally raped and beaten within an inch of her life, and was experiencing extreme post-traumatic stress syndrome and couldn't sleep, eat, or go about daily life and sunk into a deep depression, and it got worse when she learned she would be bearing the child of the man who violated her, would you still be against it?

Originally Posted by lnvanry

Wrong on what...that was personal reflective statement...There were no facts

and what do mean by "Again"

You have a short memory when it comes to things you have said so I will let you see your quote again

Originally Posted by lnvanry
riiiiiiiiiiight..... 1.Most abortions are done by middle class non crack smoking women. 2.Poor woman can't afford it.

I votes incorrectly...I am against DP and a little gray on abortion. Making it illegal it not right, but I would never endorse anyone to to get it done. The answer to abortion lies in education not in legislation.

DP actions lie with the victims family not the state. If someone rapes and killed my daughter I would take care of it...even if I went to prison for it. Besides more death row inmates are hated by the prison population and would be killed in there. I heard an interview w/ an ex con who spoke of a "code" and certain things were unaccpetable: serial killing/child crimes/Jeffry Dohmar type stuff... He was killed in prison FYI.

Yes foreman it is possible for republicans to think this way






You were possibly wrong about 1 and 2.....refer to the stats I posted.... ....and stop twisting my words.... do you think this is Fox news?

Originally Posted by gococksDJS

Hopefully this never happens to anyone, but what if you had a wife or girlfriend who was brutally raped and beaten within an inch of her life, and was experiencing extreme post-traumatic stress syndrome and couldn't sleep, eat, or go about daily life and sunk into a deep depression, and it got worse when she learned she would be bearing the child of the man who violated her, would you still be against it?

Of course I'm not against it in extreme situations. I don't know if it should be forced, so maybe I'm on the fence....

Originally Posted by BigDyl

Of course I'm not against it in extreme situations. I don't know if it should be forced, so maybe I'm on the fence....

I know exactly what you mean. If I tell myself I am for it, I can easily think of situations that would make me contradict myself, and if I tell myself I am against it, i can also think of situations that would also make me contradict myself.