Thread: You want Big Brother tracking you?

Originally Posted by ALBOB

Just the fact that someone thinks this is a good idea is a bit scary.


Gas tax on miles, not gallons, tested
PORTLAND, Ore., March 25 (UPI) -- Oregon is testing the idea of collecting highway funds through a tax on miles driven, rather than gasoline consumed.

Eighty percent of Oregon's highway money comes from its 24-cents-per-gallon gas tax. If the state promotes reducing gasoline consumption and consumers tend to buy the fuel-efficient vehicles, including hybrids, highway revenues would take a hit, The New York Times reported.

The test program uses a global positioning system to track miles driven, using a black box to calculate how many miles are clocked in-state, out of state and during rush hour.

The experiment is designed to increase state revenue for road maintenance without raising gasoline taxes, but critics say collecting GPS records poses new privacy issues.

"The existence of such a database, which would, for the first time in history, allow for the creation of detailed daily itineraries of every driver, raises obvious privacy concerns," said David L. Sobel, general counsel at the Electronic Privacy Information Center, a civil liberties group in Washington.

Taxman
Harrison


Let me tell you how it will be
There's one for you, nineteen for me
'cause I'm the taxman,
yeah, I'm the taxman

Should five percent appear too small
Be thankful I don't take it all
'cause I'm the taxman,
yeah, I'm the taxman

If you drive a car, I'll tax the street
If you try to sit, I'll tax your seat
If you get too cold, I'll tax the heat
If you take a walk, I'll tax your feet
Taxman

'Cause I'm the taxman,
Yeah, I'm the taxman

Don't ask me what I want it for
If you don't want to pay some more
'cause I'm the taxman,
yeah, I'm the taxman

Now my advice for those who die
Declare the pennies on your eyes
'cause I'm the taxman,
yeah, I'm the taxman
And you're working for no one but me

Originally Posted by ForemanRules

Taxman
Harrison


Let me tell you how it will be
There's one for you, nineteen for me
'cause I'm the taxman,
yeah, I'm the taxman

Should five percent appear too small
Be thankful I don't take it all
'cause I'm the taxman,
yeah, I'm the taxman

If you drive a car, I'll tax the street
If you try to sit, I'll tax your seat
If you get too cold, I'll tax the heat
If you take a walk, I'll tax your feet
Taxman

'Cause I'm the taxman,
Yeah, I'm the taxman

Don't ask me what I want it for
If you don't want to pay some more
'cause I'm the taxman,
yeah, I'm the taxman

Now my advice for those who die
Declare the pennies on your eyes
'cause I'm the taxman,
yeah, I'm the taxman
And you're working for no one but me

Did you install it yet? ....





































bitch.

I will move to another country before I install that on my car. I will probably end up leaving anyway. Conservatives want to push their fucking religion down my throat and give my tax money to big business in the form of subsidies; cool-aid drinking liberals want to push their political correctness down my throat and tax me and give it to the worthless scum non-working class.

Originally Posted by KelJu

I will move to another country before I install that on my car. I will probably end up leaving anyway. Conservatives want to push their fucking religion down my throat and give my tax money to big business in the form of subsidies; cool-aid drinking liberals want to push their political correctness down my throat and tax me and give it to the worthless scum non-working class.

It seems it's becoming increasingly difficult just to get lost. Even for a while. That's why I don't carry a cell phone at times....who needs a technological leash?

I'm a big fan of the constitutional right to privacy however the power to tax is a mighty one. The right to privacy is already under a full blown assault thanks to our gov. keeping us safe from drugs, immigrants, terrorists...etc. The overblown concern for Safety is turning us soft.

...and Big Brother could not be happier.

Remember, You have nothing to worry about if you have nothing to hide.

I don't really care about privacy issues. Put a microchip in me and track where I am by satellite.... I don't really care.

So they know I drive on some highway... who cares. What are they going to do with that information anyway?

It wouldn't make sense to have a state income tax in Oregon, it makes more sense to spy on people and tax the hell out of their mileage, especially since i imagine the public transportation system there sucks.

Originally Posted by KelJu

I will move to another country before I install that on my car. I will probably end up leaving anyway. Conservatives want to push their fucking religion down my throat and give my tax money to big business in the form of subsidies; cool-aid drinking liberals want to push their political correctness down my throat and tax me and give it to the worthless scum non-working class.

Originally Posted by Decker

It seems it's becoming increasingly difficult just to get lost. Even for a while. That's why I don't carry a cell phone at times....who needs a technological leash?

I'm a big fan of the constitutional right to privacy however the power to tax is a mighty one. The right to privacy is already under a full blown assault thanks to our gov. keeping us safe from drugs, immigrants, terrorists...etc. The overblown concern for Safety is turning us soft.

...and Big Brother could not be happier.

Remember, You have nothing to worry about if you have nothing to hide.

-But, the government doesn't keep us safe.
-The government hasn't put a dent in the drug problem, it has gotten worse.
-Immigration is a joke, the government can't guard shit.
-The government will soon see how their war on terror is going when we lose another huge American symbol.
-Safety is an illusion
-Our constitutional rights use to be the only thing we had that was real, and it is being taken away little by little.

Originally Posted by NeilPearson

I don't really care about privacy issues. Put a microchip in me and track where I am by satellite.... I don't really care.

So they know I drive on some highway... who cares. What are they going to do with that information anyway?

They will tax you.

I suppose in a minimalist sort of way as long as I'm not hounded or in jail b/c the gov. knows my whereabouts, my associations, my medical history, my economic history or my politics well then I'm as right as rain. Nothing to hide, no worries.

Then we have a problem. . .unless you got nothing to hide.

Originally Posted by NeilPearson

I don't really care about privacy issues. Put a microchip in me and track where I am by satellite.... I don't really care.

So they know I drive on some highway... who cares. What are they going to do with that information anyway?

Good little slave

Originally Posted by KelJu

-But, the government doesn't keep us safe.
-The government hasn't put a dent in the drug problem, it has gotten worse.
-Immigration is a joke, the government can't guard shit.
-The government will soon see how their war on terror is going when we lose another huge American symbol.
-Safety is an illusion
-Our constitutional rights use to be the only thing we had that was real, and it is being taken away little by little.

I agree. How does eviscerating the Bill of Rights or attacking Iraq keep us safe? I don't know, but plenty of people deem those courses of action as necessary to our protection.

I'm of the opinion that an elitest class of businessmen/politicians routinely screw the american people by exploiting governmental power and governmental contracts. Enter the Wars or police actions of the US. These military excursions provide massive transmissions of public wealth into private hands. That's how the Bush family built it's fortune. That's how the Cheneys' built their fortunes too. And if there's no credible threat, then dammit we'll create one.

This 'get rich quick' wealth transferrance results in ridiculous public justifications for privatized piracy: the Domino theory, Iraq was terrorist comet headed right for the US, Grenada and Libya are going to invade...just as nicaragua could also attack us.

A healthy distrust of government is sadly missing these days.

Originally Posted by Decker

They will tax you.

I suppose in a minimalist sort of way as long as I'm not hounded or in jail b/c the gov. knows my whereabouts, my associations, my medical history, my economic history or my politics well then I'm as right as rain. Nothing to hide, no worries.

Then we have a problem. . .unless you got nothing to hide.

It is about power and control my friend. You don't have to use power to need it, sometimes just having it is enough. Years ago, when the "People" had the power in the US, the country excelled in almost everything. The Government was lean and America was the embodiment of democracy. Now the government is fat, bloated, and way too powerful. The government is sucking up money just to waste it, and getting fatter. The American people have been tricked into giving away their power little by little in exchange for the illusion of safety.
"Keep feeding us money and don't question us, and we will protect you from the evil communist", the government says.
"Keep feeding us money and allow us to control everything about your life, and we will protect you from the terrorist", the government says.

Well I don't need or want the government’s god damn protection. I might die from a terrorist attack tomorrow, but at least I would have died free. I might die in a car accident today from not wearing my seatbelt, but I would have died living life as I saw fit.

I do not fear death. I fear failure. I fear unhappiness. I fear being 70 years old looking back on my life with regret, because I was scared to live my life the way I wanted to.
This is my personal opinion that anyone who would give away their civil liberties while begging for the government’s protecting just to feel "safe" is a complete and total pussy.

Originally Posted by KelJu

It is about power and control my friend. You don't have to use power to need it, sometimes just having it is enough. Years ago, when the "People" had the power in the US, the country excelled in almost everything. The Government was lean and America was the embodiment of democracy. Now the government is fat, bloated, and way too powerful. The government is sucking up money just to waste it, and getting fatter. The American people have been tricked into giving away their power little by little in exchange for the illusion of safety.
"....

In the abstract, a large centralized government is a huge problem. It is not responsive to the people for which It is created. Also, it is too much of a seductive tool for personal aggrandizement of power and wealth.

Just look at the projected Trillions that will be spent in the Iraq debacle. And here's the current justification: To eliminate the threat of WMDs and Al Qaeda, the US will change 5000 years of ethnic and religious differences in the Middle East by imposing democratic elections at the end of a gun barrel.

No pie-in-the-sky, starry eyed dreaming there. Just billions to be made.

I'm sure this is a voluntary program...or a reward program.

For all the privacy/paranoid/conspiracy people (yes I agree privacy is a good thing but on this case the 3 are all against the "blackbox") have you thought about the current tracking?...

Most phones come w/ GPS. Almost ALL truck drivers have GPS already. If you are worried about the gov't tracking you....its too late

Originally Posted by lnvanry

Most phones come w/ GPS. Almost ALL truck drivers have GPS already. If you are worried about the gov't tracking you....its too late

The phone system is a receiver, not transmitter.

Truckers know they're being tracked by their company.

Is the program voluntary/reward?

I don't see the problem if it is.

Originally Posted by lnvanry

Is the program voluntary/reward?

I don't see the problem if it is.

The way I read the article is that it's a form of punishment for doing the right thing. People are buying fuel efficient cars. When they buy fuel efficiant cars they buy less gas. When people buy less gas they pay less gasoline tax. When people pay less gasoline tax the politicians get less $$$. The politicians then have to find/invent new, sofisticated ways of fleecing the public........................who are trying to do the right thing.

P.S. For it to work it would have to be mandatory.

Originally Posted by ALBOB

The way I read the article is that it's a form of punishment for doing the right thing. People are buying fuel efficient cars. When they buy fuel efficiant cars they buy less gas. When people buy less gas they pay less gasoline tax. When people pay less gasoline tax the politicians get less $$$. The politicians then have to find/invent new, sofisticated ways of fleecing the public........................who are trying to do the right thing.

P.S. For it to work it would have to be mandatory.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Taxation/revenue enhancement is not discretionary or voluntary...unless you incorporate outside the US.

Originally Posted by ALBOB

The way I read the article is that it's a form of punishment for doing the right thing. People are buying fuel efficient cars. When they buy fuel efficiant cars they buy less gas. When people buy less gas they pay less gasoline tax. When people pay less gasoline tax the politicians get less $$$. The politicians then have to find/invent new, sofisticated ways of fleecing the public........................who are trying to do the right thing.

P.S. For it to work it would have to be mandatory.

if your interpretation is true/accurate than thats fucked up....THat shit would never fly in my state....Then again most of the people drive SUV/trucks in my town

Originally Posted by lnvanry

if your interpretation is true/accurate than thats fucked up....THat shit would never fly in my state....Then again most of the people drive SUV/trucks in my town

I think you are confused, because the proposed Oregon plan rewards SUV drivers and punishes people who drive fuel efficient cars buy making the tax based on miles driven, not gas consumed.

Sounds like they just need to go with a state sales tax and stop punishing green buyers.

So how many tax dollars will this thing actually cost to implement...

And by the time they get the bugs out of the system and
get some accurate numbers, will we still be burning diesel feul?

maybe they could use the existing system
and simply report the mileages to the GOVT if the private company
wants to be part of a pilot analysis program!?!?

Designed to help shape a better system of roads, travel, transportation technology, ETC...





There is no need for Lo-Jacking -

Lenina Huxley: It was a brilliant idea by Dr. Cocteau.
that an organic microchip is sewn into the skin.
Sensors all over the city
can zero in on anyone, at any time.

Alfredo Garcia: I can't even conceive of what
police officers did before it was developed.

John Spartan: We worked for a living.
This fascist crap makes me want to puke.

Chief George Earle: What do you think you're scratching caveman?
You really think we'd let you go without control?
Your code was implanted the minute you were thawed.

John Spartan: Why don't you just shove a leash up my ass?!

Chief George Earle: You dirty Meat Eater!
I cannot begin to digest how you ever wore a badge!?
Your going back John Spartan, oh yes, youre going back!

Originally Posted by ALBOB

The phone system is a receiver, not transmitter.

Truckers know they're being tracked by their company.

Some nextels are GPS ready and they do transmit.

I happen to install GPS systems in cars and people love me for it.

Ironically I installed 5 networkcar GPS units for Off Track Betting today.

Originally Posted by ALBOB

Just the fact that someone thinks this is a good idea is a bit scary.


Gas tax on miles, not gallons, tested
PORTLAND, Ore., March 25 (UPI) -- Oregon is testing the idea of collecting highway funds through a tax on miles driven, rather than gasoline consumed.

Eighty percent of Oregon's highway money comes from its 24-cents-per-gallon gas tax. If the state promotes reducing gasoline consumption and consumers tend to buy the fuel-efficient vehicles, including hybrids, highway revenues would take a hit, The New York Times reported.

The test program uses a global positioning system to track miles driven, using a black box to calculate how many miles are clocked in-state, out of state and during rush hour.

The experiment is designed to increase state revenue for road maintenance without raising gasoline taxes, but critics say collecting GPS records poses new privacy issues.

"The existence of such a database, which would, for the first time in history, allow for the creation of detailed daily itineraries of every driver, raises obvious privacy concerns," said David L. Sobel, general counsel at the Electronic Privacy Information Center, a civil liberties group in Washington.

will never happen...that is totally retarded.

Originally Posted by LAM

will never happen...that is totally retarded.

A proposed bill/law/tax being retarded doesn't mean it is any less likely to happen in my opinion, heh.

Originally Posted by LAM

will never happen...that is totally retarded.

When has that little technicality ever stood between a politician and our $$$?