Thread: Bush vetos Stem Cell bill...

I can't hear you...

Damn! You're to quick for me...

I'm all for it. I think it was a poor decision.

Originally Posted by largepkg

I'm all for it. I think it was a poor decision.

One of his many...

Originally Posted by SuperFlex

One of his many...

but...but...I voted for him.

If the embryonic pushers would cut the crap and not force themselves on every stem cell bill we would have much better funding. "Adult" stem cells have been far more productive and the funding and attention should be given as such. And this isnt coming from a religious stand point, if they were going to toss the embryos from those fertiliy clinics anyway then use them but they arent productive, fund them in a couple more years after we have used other stem cells to the best of our abilities

Originally Posted by largepkg

but...but...I voted for him.

me too... Twice! I wasn't going to vote the second term (after finding out what an idiot he is) but I folded due to peer pressure. I regreted it before I even did it... The ONLY reason I went ahead and voted was due to the moral issues. Honestly, I should have gone with my own instincts and stayed neutral on that election...

Originally Posted by bigss75

If the embryonic pushers would cut the crap and not force themselves on every stem cell bill we would have much better funding. "Adult" stem cells have been far more productive and the funding and attention should be given as such. And this isnt coming from a religious stand point, if they were going to toss the embryos from those fertiliy clinics anyway then use them but they arent productive, fund them in a couple more years after we have used other stem cells to the best of our abilities

Don't you think it's possible we're getting better results for adult stem cells because the funding is better? If more time and money is being poured into that then odds are we'll see more results... But hopefully adult stem cells are the way to go! All we need is another excuse for murdering babies...

Originally Posted by SuperFlex

me too... Twice! I wasn't going to vote the second term (after finding out what an idiot he is) but I folded due to peer pressure. I regreted it before I even did it... The ONLY reason I went ahead and voted was due to the moral issues. Honestly, I should have gone with my own instincts and stayed neutral on that election...

Well, it was either him or Mr. Personality(Kerry). I still believe I chose the lesser of two evils.

Originally Posted by largepkg

Well, it was either him or Mr. Personality(Kerry). I still believe I chose the lesser of two evils.

Possibly. But why chose any evil at all...

I know what you'll say, but I'd rather remain innocent in the matter.

Originally Posted by SuperFlex

I know what you'll say, but I'd rather remain innocent in the matter.

US President George W. Bush has used his first veto to block legislation expanding embryonic stem cell research, putting him at odds with top scientists, most Americans and some in his own Republican Party.


"It crosses a moral boundary," Mr Bush said. Mr Bush acted after the US Senate yesterday approved the legislation, which has also been passed by the House of Representatives.
But neither chamber expects to have the two-thirds majority needed to override the veto.
In 2001, Mr Bush allowed scientists to use 78 stem-cell lines then in existence, most of which proved unsuitable for research.
But he opposes expanded federally-funded research because it entails destruction of human embryos.
The president had long vowed to veto the bill because of his deeply held moral beliefs that destroying human life is wrong - even in its earliest form, and even in the interest of research that could lead to potentially life-saving medical breakthroughs.
The president has planned a White House signing ceremony for alternative bioethics legislation known as "The Fetus Farming Prohibition Act."
Present for the announcement were several families with "snowflake babies" - children conceived via donated embryos left over from in vitro fertilisation (IVF) treatments.
The stem cell research endorsed by the Senate yesterday would have used leftover IVF embryos, which opponents say is morally wrong because human life is destroyed in the process.
The president vetoed the Stem Cell Research Enhancement Act despite widespread support by the US public and ardent backers in Congress, who had urged Bush today to reconsider his stance.
The Senate approved the measure by a 63-37 vote -- a margin too small to override a presidential veto.
Stem cell research advocates say the technique shows promise for the treatment of degenerative diseases such as Alzheimer's and Parkinson's, and for diabetes.
The bill would have lifted rules set by Mr Bush in 2001 making federal funds available only for research on a small number of embryonic stem cell lines which existed at that time.
Government money is barred from supporting work on new lines derived from human embryos - a restriction that opponents say hampers overall research.
In London, Martin Rees, the president of the Royal Society - Britain's de facto academy of sciences - said the US policy "is slowing down the global effort to develop therapies for a range of diseases and illnesses".
Democrats expressed dismay over Mr Bush's decision.

"With his swift veto today, the president may think he has put the issue of stem cell research behind him," said US Senator Ted Kennedy.
"But it is not over for the child with diabetes who struggles with endless injections of insulin. It is not over for those who must watch helplessly as a parent or spouse succumbs to the tremors of Parkinson's disease," said Senator Kennedy, a leading Democrat who vowed that politicians would take up the legislation again soon.

Unfortunately, he is letting his religious beliefs interfere with his moral obligation.

Originally Posted by largepkg

Unfortunately, he is letting his religious beliefs interfere with his moral obligation.

Si

Originally Posted by SuperFlex

I'm all for the advancement of medicine, but this is a touchy issue for several reasons...

What do you guys/gals think about it?

I'm open minded about it.

Stem cells arnt living people. So why let humans suffer so that cells remain untouched just cuz he thinks those cells count as living beings?

Everyone is acting like he is banning stem cell research, the drug companies are have been funding it for along time now.

Originally Posted by bigss75

Everyone is acting like he is banning stem cell research, the drug companies are have been funding it for along time now.

And now Arnold is,
Schwarzenegger: State to lend stem cell effort $150 million

Originally Posted by 911=InsideJob

Stem cells arnt living people. So why let humans suffer so that cells remain untouched just cuz he thinks those cells count as living beings?

I am against ending a life no matter how early. Sure 99.999999999999% of people grow up to be pieces of shit anyway, but it's still wrong... I could see this becoming an easy way to justify abortion. That's all I'm saying. Which IS legal murder... Now, when an embryo has died study the heck out of it!

When using donated unfertilized(outside of a womans body) eggs then fertilizing them it's a different story. Why not better our lives... I could also see this opening doors for genetic engineering and cloning.

They'll be coming after the sperm next. . .

http://www.abstinence.net/store/00107.html

Nice tee shirt. . .

first of all I think it was a bad decision, I disagree with it....not horrible though.

The bill was simply going direct federal dollars to it....so his decision doesn't make living human being suffer. Private companies and states can bear the cost...its not going to bring the research to a hault.

Also, stem cell science is purely speculative at this point. It has NO proven benefit....although it does have a strong potential.

Thats why I disagree, but I'm not going to get mad about it. the research will still get done....and let Pfizer and GlaksoSmithKlien put some money into it.

Originally Posted by SuperFlex

Don't you think it's possible we're getting better results for adult stem cells because the funding is better? If more time and money is being poured into that then odds are we'll see more results... But hopefully adult stem cells are the way to go! All we need is another excuse for murdering babies...

Here is a paper from indiana state about adult stem cells http://www.stemcellresearch.org/old/...tStemCells.pdf

Asia has been studing all sorts of stem cell research and so far embryonic still has gotten little results. You drop embyros from funding (which will get its fair share of moeny from drug companies anyway) you have funding for stem cells, thus no need for Bush to veto.

Originally Posted by lnvanry

Also, stem cell science is purely speculative at this point. It has NO proven benefit....although it does have a strong potential.

They might be able to regenarate beta cells from people with type one diabetes actually pretty soon.

Originally Posted by bigss75

They might be able to regenarate beta cells from people with type one diabetes actually pretty soon.

thats my point

Who cares what they have done or havent done!?!?

Even the speculation that it can do such positive things
should have been reason to pass the bill!


Bush receives orders from god...
I think David Koresh had that gift as well -

Buck
Fush

Originally Posted by SuperFlex

I am against ending a life no matter how early. Sure 99.999999999999% of people grow up to be pieces of shit anyway, but it's still wrong... I could see this becoming an easy way to justify abortion. That's all I'm saying. Which IS legal murder... Now, when an embryo has died study the heck out of it!

When using donated unfertilized(outside of a womans body) eggs then fertilizing them it's a different story. Why not better our lives... I could also see this opening doors for genetic engineering and cloning.

I don't think you can't count those embroyos as life. That would mean if a woman died thousands of living beings died with her. You feel me? The way I see it, life only begins when the egg and the sperm get together and start growing.

Originally Posted by maniclion

And now Arnold is,
Schwarzenegger: State to lend stem cell effort $150 million

To clear things up the people of California voted to fund stem cell research. Schwarzenegger was in favor of that bill as well.

Originally Posted by The Monkey Man

Who cares what they have done or havent done!?!?

Even the speculation that it can do such positive things
should have been reason to pass the bill!


Bush receives orders from god...
I think David Koresh had that gift as well -

David Koresh was at my great great grandfathers funeral. Does that make me special?

Originally Posted by bigss75

Here is a paper from indiana state about adult stem cells http://www.stemcellresearch.org/old/...tStemCells.pdf

Asia has been studing all sorts of stem cell research and so far embryonic still has gotten little results. You drop embyros from funding (which will get its fair share of moeny from drug companies anyway) you have funding for stem cells, thus no need for Bush to veto.

Good.