Thread: Chavez loses

Pretty close one though. Chavez was trying to pull a Musharraf. Unlimited terms and complete control of government. Lol ... we should end him by reducing how much of his crap oil we buy ...

Very ironic how this guy has a democracy and we don't.

I needed a good laugh.

How about you go live there for a year, and then come back and report to the group how it's a great democracy?

The lesson is who ever gets the most votes wins in a democracy.

Still have 4 more years of him....

Originally Posted by maniclion

Still have 4 more years of him....

I hate that guy. Major instability in SA from him. BTW ... he's not interested in democracy. Chaves is a devout socialist. The WRONG kind of socialist. The kind of socialism that the USSR used to be ... communism with a media spin.

Originally Posted by BigDyl

Very ironic how this guy has a democracy and we don't.

direct democracy only works well with a large pool of educated and active citizens...I have yet to see any nation state yet the possesses this.

Originally Posted by lnvanry

direct democracy only works well with a large pool of educated and active citizens...I have yet to see any nation state yet the possesses this.

It seems to work here in the us for everything else besides the presidency. And besides that a court helped put Bush in power one that voted on party lines.

Originally Posted by NordicNacho

It seems to work here in the us for everything else besides the presidency. And besides that a court helped put Bush in power one that voted on party lines.

I think you might be confused on how our federal system works....There is NEVER a direct democratic vote on anything concerning national legislation.

Its voted on by our local elected officials who represent us. The only proposal we vote on a case by case basis is state and local legislation...and even then many states and cities/townships still do not have public proposal voting. Chicago is an example.

I was watching on the news tonight. I almost stood up and clapped in my parents living room.

Originally Posted by lnvanry

I think you might be confused on how our federal system works....There is NEVER a direct democratic vote on anything concerning national legislation.

Its voted on by our local elected officials who represent us. The only proposal we vote on a case by case basis is state and local legislation...and even then many states and cities/townships still do not have public proposal voting. Chicago is an example.

we do it all the time here in California with Initiatives and we have a larger gdp them 98% of the countries in the world and we run a balanced budget.

Originally Posted by NordicNacho

It seems to work here in the us for everything else besides the presidency. And besides that a court helped put Bush in power one that voted on party lines.

Supposedly we live in a republic represented by an electoral college.


I currently see the system as more of a plutocracy, controlled by the wealthy and elite through lobbyists.

Originally Posted by BigDyl

Supposedly we live in a republic represented by an electoral college.


I currently see the system as more of a plutocracy, controlled by the wealthy and elite through lobbyists.

Which is why you should vote for Obama. He's the best of the lot.

Originally Posted by DOMS

Which is why you should vote for Obama. He's the best of the lot.

And ________ makes him qualified for the position.

Being a first term senator?

Originally Posted by Splash Log

And ________ makes him qualified for the position.

Being a first term senator?

He actually wants change. He doesn't take money from special interest groups. He actually seems to hate special interest groups. He's been been in politics for decades. He's the only politician that talks like he knows what common sense is. He's for a measure, planned, withdrawal from Iraq.

On the downside, he's for universal health care.

Overall, he's a moderate. Which the county needs. I've had enough of extremists.

Originally Posted by Splash Log

And ________ makes him qualified for the position.

Being a first term senator?

Lincoln had 2 years of experience
in congress

Originally Posted by NordicNacho

we do it all the time here in California with Initiatives and we have a larger gdp them 98% of the countries in the world and we run a balanced budget.

exactly...a state level vote.
voting on specific proposals on a national basis doesn't happen here.

Originally Posted by DOMS

He actually wants change. He doesn't take money from special interest groups. He actually seems to hate special interest groups. He's been been in politics for decades. He's the only politician that talks like he knows what common sense is. He's for a measure, planned, withdrawal from Iraq.

On the downside, he's for universal health care.

Overall, he's a moderate. Which the county needs. I've had enough of extremists.

thats factually incorrect. He take plenty of money from interest groups:
Project Vote Smart - Senator Obama - Interest Group Ratings

EVERY US politician takes money from special interest groups...every politician does. Thats how you get elected in national elections. I'm not saying he's a good or bad candidate, I'm stating you are either mislead or naive on your view of his relationship with lobbyists. Its how DC works.

Originally Posted by lnvanry

thats factually incorrect. He take plenty of money from interest groups:
Project Vote Smart - Senator Obama - Interest Group Ratings

EVERY US politician takes money from special interest groups...every politician does. Thats how you get elected in national elections. I'm not saying he's a good or bad candidate, I'm stating you are either mislead or naive on your view of his relationship with lobbyists. Its how DC works.

Okay, so Obama supports abortion. And? I must be missing the part where he's been taking money from them. Am I?

Good for Venezuela.

That said, we need to be tapping our own homegrown oil reserves, so we don't even have to hear anymore about this creep, or the creep from Iran in the news.

Originally Posted by brogers

Good for Venezuela.

That said, we need to be tapping our own homegrown oil reserves, so we don't even have to hear anymore about this creep, or the creep from Iran in the news.

Quote the DOMS:

Originally Posted by DOMS

I'd like to see an even better solution. I'd like the US to team up with Japan and the UK to create a viable alternative. Between the three of them, they'd have an ungodly sum of money and some of the brightest minds on the planet. They could do it.

Then the price of oil would plummet. The Middle East would be worth shit and that Latin fucktard from Venezuela could go fuck himself. God, I'd go down there just to throw some money on the ground and watch them scrabble for it and laugh my ass off.

Originally Posted by DOMS

He actually wants change. He doesn't take money from special interest groups. He actually seems to hate special interest groups. He's been been in politics for decades. He's the only politician that talks like he knows what common sense is. He's for a measure, planned, withdrawal from Iraq.

Ok well I don't consider 7 years in the Illinois Senate and a lil over 2 years as US senator being in politics for decades. So you take out that line and then by your standards have the qualifications to run for President, depending on your assessment of my common sense.

He has less then a decade in a legislative positions which is no preparation for an executive position of this magnitude.

Originally Posted by Splash Log

Ok well I don't consider 7 years in the Illinois Senate and a lil over 2 years as US senator being in politics for decades. So you take out that line and then by your standards have the qualifications to run for President, depending on your assessment of my common sense.

He has less then a decade in a legislative positions which is no preparation for an executive position of this magnitude.

Bush has how many years in politics? And what kind of a job is he doing?

BTW, Obama has been around politics since 1991. Granted, not decades, but close.

Originally Posted by Splash Log

Ok well I don't consider 7 years in the Illinois Senate and a lil over 2 years as US senator being in politics for decades. So you take out that line and then by your standards have the qualifications to run for President, depending on your assessment of my common sense.

He has less then a decade in a legislative positions which is no preparation for an executive position of this magnitude.

Who do you see as the best qualified candidate?

Originally Posted by DOMS

Okay, so Obama supports abortion. And? I must be missing the part where he's been taking money from them. Am I?

That link he posted contains a link to this:

Barack Obama: Campaign Finance/Money - Contributions - Senate 2008

These in particular are the PAC contributions that he received:

Opensecrets.org - PAC Contributions to Obama, Barack (D-IL)

A pittance by most standards... but none the less they exist. I definitely recommend looking at those sites a bit more, they contain some fun figures / facts.

Presidential spending #s - 2008 Presidential Election

Originally Posted by DOMS

I'd like to see an even better solution. I'd like the US to team up with Japan and the UK to create a viable alternative. Between the three of them, they'd have an ungodly sum of money and some of the brightest minds on the planet. They could do it.

Then the price of oil would plummet. The Middle East would be worth shit and that Latin fucktard from Venezuela could go fuck himself. God, I'd go down there just to throw some money on the ground and watch them scrabble for it and laugh my ass off.

Germany has gone much further in the alternatives market than the UK, Germany and Japan have the most advanced research into these areas they would put us to shame if oil suddenly disappeared...

Originally Posted by Eggs

That link he posted contains a link to this:

Barack Obama: Campaign Finance/Money - Contributions - Senate 2008

These in particular are the PAC contributions that he received:

Opensecrets.org - PAC Contributions to Obama, Barack (D-IL)

A pittance by most standards... but none the less they exist.

Fair enough. Small, but countable...for his run on the Senate. However, he has stated, on national teevee, that he will not take money from special interest groups in his bid for president.

Originally Posted by maniclion

Germany has gone much further in the alternatives market than the UK, Germany and Japan have the most advanced research into these areas they would put us to shame if oil suddenly disappeared...

I don't trust Germany. I wouldn't want them involved.