My Solar H2O and 13kw per day PV System

maniclion · 07-25-2008, 06:58 PM

16 total 200watt Kyocera modules with south tilt

Outback Grit-tie 3000 watt 48vdc inverter, 80 amp MPPT controller mounted on a Midnite Solar Stretched E-Panel. First bank of batteries 4500 watts of storage. Backed up circuits include fridge, living room tv, computer with cable router and wireless router, hall lights and bathroom lights, and hot water recirc pump. It will act as UPS with instant switching to batteries if utility power goes down....The breaker panel also has 2 outlets for me to plug into if I am in the garage barbecuing after the electricity goes out, I can have a tv and lamp outside while the rest of the neighborhood sits in darkness.....

2 Sunearth EP32(4'x8') solar water heating panels will provide enough hot water for 3 people to shower twice a day plus 2 loads of white laundry(only laundry we wash in hot water all else is cold/cold)

This is a 120 gallon tank to store the solar heated water, it has a Steca controller to set the optimum temperatures and regulate the pump. It has a 240v connection to heat water on cloudy days. If the utility goes down the pump and control will run off of the batteries

lucifuge · 07-25-2008, 07:01 PM

nice...
if I may be so bold, how much does a set up like this cost?

CORUM · 07-25-2008, 07:14 PM

you got some nice solar stuff, how much all this setting you back? i live in the california desert sun is not a problem for me! lol

BoneCrusher · 07-25-2008, 07:55 PM

Well done manic. Are you generating enough to sell back to the power company yet?

maniclion · 07-25-2008, 08:19 PM

$25k because I work for the supplier and know the installers really well. It's a $40k system for the average homeowner....

I'm not selling back but I'll cut my bill my 60-70%. I'm also getting ridge venting to cut the temperature in my attic way down so i can then use less air conditioning. We will be getting split unit A/C's next and hopefully cut our electric usage way down so we don't have to get anymore PV. If I do I will be putting the next ones over my deck for sunshading.....plus the wiring for that won't have to drop through my attic so it'll be a cinch to install....

maniclion · 07-25-2008, 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BoneCrusher

Well done manic. Are you generating enough to sell back to the power company yet?

Hawaiian Electric doesn't buy back any extra so we design systems to make just enough to meet the homes electric needs....no use putting extra modules up just so they can charge your neighbors for the free energy you're dumping onto their grid....

lucifuge · 07-25-2008, 08:23 PM

so, for an average consumer, it'll take at least ten years for the savings to pay for the expense......
no offense, but that kinda sucks

maniclion · 07-25-2008, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucifuge

so, for an average consumer, it'll take at least ten years for the savings to pay for the expense......
no offense, but that kinda sucks

not when the modules last 25+ years thats 15 years of money in your pocket. I was paying $800 for electricity so 3 years will have mine paid off and for 22 years I'll be pocketing $10,000 each year or more if the cost of electricity goes up.....and it will.

BoneCrusher · 07-25-2008, 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maniclion

not when the modules last 25+ years thats 15 years of money in your pocket. I was paying $800 for electricity so 3 years will have mine paid off and for 22 years I'll be pocketing $10,000 each year or more if the cost of electricity goes up.....and it will.

You're a good American.

lucifuge · 07-25-2008, 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maniclion

not when the modules last 25+ years thats 15 years of money in your pocket. I was paying $800 for electricity so 3 years will have mine paid off and for 22 years I'll be pocketing $10,000 each year or more if the cost of electricity goes up.....and it will.

yeah, after I posted that I started thinking about the cost going up...
another plus is that it has to drastically improve your property value.

NeilPearson · 07-25-2008, 08:51 PM

Or you could wait 5 years and get the same system for less than half... just guessing though

maniclion · 07-25-2008, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeilPearson

Or you could wait 5 years and get the same system for less than half... just guessing though

That was my thinking when i got in the business 6 years ago but waiting for PV to advance and price to go down is like waiting for drastic improvements in computer processor technology. They can only squeeze so much out of the silicon cells each year and I need to start saving money now.... Just like I could wait for the latest fastest processor to be obsolete and cheaper but I want to play the latest games now.....

Jeeper · 07-26-2008, 11:22 AM

Any tax break for the install?

maniclion · 07-26-2008, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeeper

Any tax break for the install?

$5000 state and $2000 federal, plus a $1000 rebate from my utility company for the hot water system and about $1500 from the state....

danzik17 · 07-26-2008, 01:54 PM

So did it only cost you a net 10k about?

maniclion · 07-26-2008, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by danzik17

So did it only cost you a net 10k about?

You could say that but the 15k I saved is going into my split a/c units to make this system able to handle my entire electrical load or close to it....electricity is at .28 cents per kWh and climbing.....

**Prince** · 07-26-2008, 02:58 PM

so, you spent $25k, how long do you estimate it will take to get that money back via savings on your electric bill?

KelJu · 07-26-2008, 02:58 PM

Isn't hawaii requiring all homes to have solar water heaters by 2010?

maniclion · 07-26-2008, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prince

so, you spent $25k, how long do you estimate it will take to get that money back via savings on your electric bill?

2 - 2.5 years. I figure even when I get my tax credits and rebate the cost of my Split Air conditioner units will factor in at $15,000. So right now my last 2 electric bills were close to $900 and the rates just went up again. So $900 x 12 months = $10,000. I'll probably cut 70-80% of my bill out when I get the split air based on most conservative calculations, but I'm really hoping I cut 100%. If I save $8500 per year it'll be 3 years, but I really think I'll be able to zero out my buy back from the utility, the good thing about our program here is if I have a few month's where I over produce with solar I can let the extra roll-over for month's when I don't meet my needs and it'll even out that way.

The panels will last 25-30 years so I'll have 20+ years of saving $10-$15,000 on electric bills each year based on inflation and cost of oil rising. We plan to save every dime of that and invest in mutual funds and CD's. We borrowed $225,000 for all of the stuff we're getting so the mortgage will be paid off by our solar savings alone. We got 2 BMW's, solar water heating, PV, my GF's daughters first 2 years of college, split A/C, all of our debt paid off, a really nice 2 week vacation and other small things out of the deal. I don't see how anyone could argue it's not worth it? We own our home so this means all of our income will be for cellphone, water, cable, gas, food and other necessary expenses, the rest which will be more than 60% is disposable, we'll save or invest half and the rest will let us live a nice lifestyle....

maniclion · 07-26-2008, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KelJu

Isn't hawaii requiring all homes to have solar water heaters by 2010?

All newly build homes will have to have solar water heating or tankless propane/nat. gas if solar isn't applicable. It's not a good decision in the long run. They are canceling the tax credit and rebates for Solar Thermal H2O heating which means people who already have their home built will not get any incentive to put Solar water in except for those who have extreme electric bills. We fought against the bill tooth and claw but they just couldn't see it from our view point....hopefully we are wrong and this doesn't hurt the massive movement for people getting Solar Water Heating installed, we lead the nation in per capita installs of Solar H2O thermal and PV last time I checked.....

**Prince** · 07-26-2008, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maniclion

The panels will last 25-30 years so I'll have 20+ years of saving $10-$15,000 on electric bills each year based on inflation and cost of oil rising.

do you really plan on living there that long?

Little Wing · 07-26-2008, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maniclion

$5000 state and $2000 federal, plus a $1000 rebate from my utility company for the hot water system and about $1500 from the state....

i was wondering about this too.

maniclion · 07-26-2008, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prince

do you really plan on living there that long?

For the rest of my life? The home has been in my GF's family for a long time and she would never sell it, plus I have a great job that I love and it keeps me interested.....

**Prince** · 07-26-2008, 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maniclion

For the rest of my life? The home has been in my GF's family for a long time and she would never sell it, plus I have a great job that I love and it keeps me interested.....

circumstances do change...I believe the average American stays in a house 5-7 years, which is why I ask, but who knows.

Little Wing · 07-26-2008, 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prince

circumstances do change...I believe the average American stays in a house 5-7 years, which is why I ask, but who knows.

Manic is not an average American.

that statistic sounds wrong. so many people i know have been in their homes 30 years or more. raised families and have retired while still living in the same house.

maniclion · 07-27-2008, 04:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prince

circumstances do change...I believe the average American stays in a house 5-7 years, which is why I ask, but who knows.

Trust me she would never ever sell this home even if it becomes worth 2 million dollars....Japanese families are that way the family home is their castle, the only reason her Grandfather moved is because they routed a highway through his first house, he then built a new one and lived in it for 45 years. This property has been in her family for 60 years from when her grand father bought it for her great grand mother.

**Prince** · 07-27-2008, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Little Wing

Manic is not an average American.

that statistic sounds wrong. so many people i know have been in their homes 30 years or more. raised families and have retired while still living in the same house.

that was true a couple of generations ago, not today.

Little Wing · 07-27-2008, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prince

that was true a couple of generations ago, not today.

probably in part due to the cost of heating, cooling, and powering older homes. i see this trend online a lot.

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07-25-2008, 06:58 PM	#1
maniclion Cartographer of the Mind Elite Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Mens Incognita Posts: 20,437 Photos: 10	My Solar H2O and 13kw per day PV System 16 total 200watt Kyocera modules with south tilt Outback Grit-tie 3000 watt 48vdc inverter, 80 amp MPPT controller mounted on a Midnite Solar Stretched E-Panel. First bank of batteries 4500 watts of storage. Backed up circuits include fridge, living room tv, computer with cable router and wireless router, hall lights and bathroom lights, and hot water recirc pump. It will act as UPS with instant switching to batteries if utility power goes down....The breaker panel also has 2 outlets for me to plug into if I am in the garage barbecuing after the electricity goes out, I can have a tv and lamp outside while the rest of the neighborhood sits in darkness..... 2 Sunearth EP32(4'x8') solar water heating panels will provide enough hot water for 3 people to shower twice a day plus 2 loads of white laundry(only laundry we wash in hot water all else is cold/cold) This is a 120 gallon tank to store the solar heated water, it has a Steca controller to set the optimum temperatures and regulate the pump. It has a 240v connection to heat water on cloudy days. If the utility goes down the pump and control will run off of the batteries "We are like tenant farmers chopping down the fence around our house for fuel when we should be using Natures inexhaustible sources of energy — sun, wind and tide. ... I'd put my money on the sun and solar energy. What a source of power! I hope we don't have to wait until oil and coal run out before we tackle that." Thomas Edison: In conversation with Henry Ford and Harvey Firestone

07-25-2008, 08:19 PM	#5
maniclion Cartographer of the Mind Elite Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Mens Incognita Posts: 20,437 Photos: 10	$25k because I work for the supplier and know the installers really well. It's a $40k system for the average homeowner.... I'm not selling back but I'll cut my bill my 60-70%. I'm also getting ridge venting to cut the temperature in my attic way down so i can then use less air conditioning. We will be getting split unit A/C's next and hopefully cut our electric usage way down so we don't have to get anymore PV. If I do I will be putting the next ones over my deck for sunshading.....plus the wiring for that won't have to drop through my attic so it'll be a cinch to install.... "We are like tenant farmers chopping down the fence around our house for fuel when we should be using Natures inexhaustible sources of energy — sun, wind and tide. ... I'd put my money on the sun and solar energy. What a source of power! I hope we don't have to wait until oil and coal run out before we tackle that." Thomas Edison: In conversation with Henry Ford and Harvey Firestone

07-26-2008, 01:54 PM	#15
danzik17 Gender: MALE Elite Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Connecticut Posts: 3,074	So did it only cost you a net 10k about? Ron Paul 2012 Journal: danzik17's Log - 4-6 Week Strength/Bulk Journal: Sub 10% by April <old>

07-26-2008, 02:58 PM	#17
Prince IronMagLabs Owner Administrator Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Colorado Posts: 37,405 Photos: 356	so, you spent $25k, how long do you estimate it will take to get that money back via savings on your electric bill? BOARD SPONSORS: MassNutrition.com - Discount Supplement Superstore IronMagLabs.com - Bodybuilding Nutrition AlltheWhey.com - Bulk Protein Powders & Supplements CEMProducts.com - Research Chemicals & Supplements MusclesProd.com - Steroids, Bodybuilding & Training Blog Maximizer.com - Maximum Strength for Maximum Performance MikeGetsRipped.com - The Original 'Get Ripped' Blog ProteinRoutine.com - Experiments in Healthy Living Follow on Twitter Join Facebook Group Befriend on Myspace

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07-25-2008, 07:01 PM	#2
lucifuge 100 Proof Chaos Elite Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: 1313 Mockingbird Lane Posts: 1,474 Photos: 14	nice... if I may be so bold, how much does a set up like this cost?

07-25-2008, 07:14 PM	#3
CORUM Registered User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: California Posts: 557	you got some nice solar stuff, how much all this setting you back? i live in the california desert sun is not a problem for me! lol

07-25-2008, 07:55 PM	#4
BoneCrusher Lift or Die Elite Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Austin Texas Posts: 8,589	Well done manic. Are you generating enough to sell back to the power company yet?

07-25-2008, 08:23 PM	#7
lucifuge 100 Proof Chaos Elite Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: 1313 Mockingbird Lane Posts: 1,474 Photos: 14	so, for an average consumer, it'll take at least ten years for the savings to pay for the expense...... no offense, but that kinda sucks

07-25-2008, 08:51 PM	#11
NeilPearson Registered User Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 2,518	Or you could wait 5 years and get the same system for less than half... just guessing though

07-26-2008, 11:22 AM	#13
Jeeper Registered User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Phoenix Posts: 175	Any tax break for the install?

07-26-2008, 02:58 PM	#18
KelJu Thats Dr. Keke to you! Elite Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: In my imagination. Posts: 10,162 Photos: 2	Isn't hawaii requiring all homes to have solar water heaters by 2010?