Gun Forum?

[mcguin]

sorry for the double post

[WillBrink]

Originally Posted by mcguin

will, although I have an idea what I want, can you offer any advice as far as shotguns go...what makes do you prefer, etc? I'm looking for something I can use at the range/clay and home defense..I honestly like the tactical shotguns, including mossberg...I'm looking along the lines of a 12g semi or pump

I'm not a big shot gun guy honestly. However, home defense shot guns are different configuration then clay/skeet guns. Skeet guns have long barrels, tactical shot guns have short barrels, different sites, etc. I can't speak for skeet guns, but good choices for home defense shot guns are Remington 870 express or Mossberg 500 series. They are around $300 brand new. Cheap, reliable firepower and what most cops are given. If your budget if higher, there's lots of good choices,* but knowing exactly what it's intended use is, narrows it down. You can't have an optimal clay skeet gun which is also an optimal home/tactical gun. You may need to buy two shotguns.

* = see:

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/...ducts_id/17640

[bio-chem]

what are your thoughts on home defense shot guns?

[WillBrink]

Originally Posted by bio-chem

what are your thoughts on home defense shot guns?

See above. Brands listed.

[bio-chem]

Originally Posted by WillBrink

See above. Brands listed.

let me clarify then.

your thoughts on a shotgun as a home defense tool as compared to a handgun.

[WillBrink]

Originally Posted by bio-chem

let me clarify then.

your thoughts on a shotgun as a home defense tool as compared to a handgun.

That's actually a big debate in the gun community and I not the most qualified person to answer it. You would be amazed how much this gets debated. From a simple ballistics/fire power perspective, the shotgun wins hands down. If that were the only thing that mattered, we would all have LAW rockets...Practical issues of moving around your house with it, bad guy grabbing barrels as you come around the corner, recoil, etc, etc make some feel shot guns are not the optimal choice. Let me say this: the recommendations by those who study/teach this stuff for a civilian on home defense is: you get you and yours into your bed room, lock the door, call 911,* and let who ever is on the other side the door know you are armed and willing to defend. In that scenario, it's hard to go wrong with a 12g shotgun with OObuck loads.

* = thus, the recommended emergency plan is: good door and lock on a bedroom, phone in room, flashlight, gun, and everyone in house knows the plan.

[bio-chem]

Originally Posted by WillBrink

That's actually a big debate in the gun community and I not the most qualified person to answer it. You would be amazed how much this gets debated. From a simple ballistics/fire power perspective, the shotgun wins hands down. If that were the only thing that mattered, we would all have LAW rockets...Practical issues of moving around your house with it, bad guy grabbing barrels as you come around the corner, recoil, etc, etc make some feel shot guns are not the optimal choice. Let me say this: the recommendations by those who study/teach this stuff for a civilian on home defense is: you get you and yours into your bed room, lock the door, call 911,* and let who ever is on the other side the door know you are armed and willing to defend. In that scenario, it's hard to go wrong with a 12g shotgun with OObuck loads.

* = thus, the recommended emergency plan is: good door and lock on a bedroom, phone in room, flashlight, gun, and everyone in house knows the plan.

good thoughts. I always figured racking a pump shotgun loudly would be a pretty intimidating sound to an intruder who didn't know their way around a dark home

[WillBrink]

Originally Posted by bio-chem

good thoughts. I always figured racking a pump shotgun loudly would be a pretty intimidating sound to an intruder who didn't know their way around a dark home

For sane people, sure. What are they doing in your house knowing/suspecting you are home if they are sane?!

Regardless, the High Road forum will have some threads on that topic I am sure, and you can decide from there based on your own experience levels, etc, what's best for you. There are some tried and true guidelines for sure, but within them, there is some room for personal decisions. For example, I don't have a shot gun because almost all my training is on handguns, 1911 handguns in particular, so I would rather go to what I am well trained on vs what I am not, regardless of ballistic differences are between shot guns and handguns, etc. I will say, being really good with a shotgun takes much more training then people understand (due to watching too much TV. etc) but following recommended plan above, takes very little skill with a shotgun.

[Spitfire]

I third the Springfield 1911, I am planing on building a 1911 with a Springfield frame soon.
I have an account at a few gun forums. I find that all inclusive forums are good for a lot of general stuff but I belong to forums specifically for each gun I own. There is no better way to get info on your specific firearm.
Also I agree on getting a Mossberg. I plan on gettin one at the next gun show.
I have been planing on getting a Mossberg 500 with a breaching barrel But I just seen this and might change my mind

As far as home protection- A .45 in the night stand, Mossberg in the closet and a concealable in a holster with a clip on it ready to walk out the door.

As far as a concealable I just got a Kel-tec p11 and love it. Tho I think I might get a new p-3at, its the size of a large wallet. So nice

PS, hello everyone, long time no see

[min0 lee]

Originally Posted by Spitfire

PS, hello everyone, long time no see

[clemson357]

+1 on glocktalk.com

[clemson357]

Originally Posted by WillBrink

There's a reason grunts and cops get DAO glocks, sigs, etc and the high level combat shooters (SWAT, various SOF, FBI HRT, etc) will use 1911s. They are the king of the combat handgun. However, it takes a lot of training to able to shoot them well and safely under pressure. 3lbs or so of SA trigger, external safties, and such demand it. They are not beginner guns. Two, they are tuned guns that require more upkeep and dedication to the platform for them to be reliable. Glocks, sigs, etc, will tolerate little upkeep, 1911s will not. I'm only talking about real tactical combat/SD shooting. If it's just to pull out of your safe once in a while, pop a few rnds at the range, and put it back, no biggie, but you would still be better off putting that $$$ into ammo and a few courses with your good basic easy to run DAO pistol.

I know many people with a bunch of guns, none of which they can shoot very well. I would rather see a person take one good gun, and spend the time and $$$ to get proficient with it. All the years I have been shooting, competing, working with LEO, posting on the topic, etc, etc, know how many guns I own? Four. 3 1911s and one M4 carbine.

Now, that's just my position as I don't view guns as a simple hobby per se but a responsibility and potential life saving tool. There's lots of gun owners (most really) who buy guns they want for the fun of it, shoot it once in a while, and that's cool too.

Just food for thought, so enjoy what ever you decide to purchase. BTW, the SA GI is a solid choice. Many smiths use them as "base guns" for a build out. Thus, you can shoot it for a while and add to it over time and build it up to your personal liking vs getting one with all the bells and whistles to start.

DAMN!!!! You need more guns.

Not just for show or fun, but even just to cover the basics. You definitely need at least a 22, a large caliber rifle, and a shotgun. I bet for the price of one of your 1911s, you could get a Ruger 10/22, and Remington 700 .308, and Remington 870 12 gauage.

[clemson357]

Also, please throw in a Glock. There may come a time when parts become hard to find and you need something indestructible.

[ALBOB]

Originally Posted by mcguin

if you're going for a 1911, spend the money on a kimber custom, or a springfield, or colt...dont go cheap if you're going to go for the 1911...you wont regret it!

I am absolutely NOT flaming you so please don't take it that way. I agree with everything in your post except the word "Kimber". In my opinion Kimbers are the most overrated 1911's on the market. If I'm going to pay over a thousand dollars on a 1911 I'm going to get a top of the line STI. To get the most bang for the buck stick with Springfield Armory.

[ALBOB]

Originally Posted by bio-chem

good thoughts. I always figured racking a pump shotgun loudly would be a pretty intimidating sound to an intruder who didn't know their way around a dark home

This always confused me. Again, no flames, just my curiosty. Why wasn't there a round in the chamber in the first place? Now if there are children in the house I can understand the extra safety consideration. But that aside, if I've got ANY weapon at the ready I want it to be READY.

[bio-chem]

Originally Posted by ALBOB

This always confused me. Again, no flames, just my curiosty. Why wasn't there a round in the chamber in the first place? Now if there are children in the house I can understand the extra safety consideration. But that aside, if I've got ANY weapon at the ready I want it to be READY.

Agreed. I have no problem with that thought. I think my reasoning was simply the intimidation factor. That is pretty much the ultimate get the fuck out because the next thing you will hear will go boom.

[bio-chem]

Originally Posted by clemson357

DAMN!!!! You need more guns.

Not just for show or fun, but even just to cover the basics. You definitely need at least a 22, a large caliber rifle, and a shotgun. I bet for the price of one of your 1911s, you could get a Ruger 10/22, and Remington 700 .308, and Remington 870 12 gauage.

Have you seen the price of the new remington 700's? They are getting pretty damn expensive.

and to each his own. I personally couldn't understand why a guy would need 3 of the same gun model, but then again people question me on why I own 5 snowboards and 2 pairs of ski's. variety for everyone I guess in their own way.

[Spitfire]

Originally Posted by min0 lee

Hey, so... do we know if youre a man or women yet?..

[clemson357]

Originally Posted by bio-chem

Have you seen the price of the new remington 700's? They are getting pretty damn expensive.

and to each his own. I personally couldn't understand why a guy would need 3 of the same gun model, but then again people question me on why I own 5 snowboards and 2 pairs of ski's. variety for everyone I guess in their own way.

Well get a Savage if you can't afford a Remington. Every gun owner needs at least one large caliber rifle.

[bio-chem]

Originally Posted by Spitfire

Hey, so... do we know if youre a man or women yet?..

WOW. where the hell have you been?

and this thread is about guns. it is not about catching up.

im kidding please continue.

[bio-chem]

Originally Posted by clemson357

Well get a Savage if you can't afford a Remington. Every gun owner needs at least one large caliber rifle.

I tend to agree. I own a winchester M70 in .308 myself. I love that gun

[629RWHPstang]

Originally Posted by WillBrink

I'm not a big shot gun guy honestly. However, home defense shot guns are different configuration then clay/skeet guns. Skeet guns have long barrels, tactical shot guns have short barrels, different sites, etc. I can't speak for skeet guns, but good choices for home defense shot guns are Remington 870 express or Mossberg 500 series. They are around $300 brand new. Cheap, reliable firepower and what most cops are given. If your budget if higher, there's lots of good choices,* but knowing exactly what it's intended use is, narrows it down. You can't have an optimal clay skeet gun which is also an optimal home/tactical gun. You may need to buy two shotguns.

* = see:

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/...ducts_id/17640

bump i have a mossberg 500 and great gun

[Spitfire]

Originally Posted by bio-chem

WOW. where the hell have you been?

and this thread is about guns. it is not about catching up.

im kidding please continue.

Hey Hey Hey, I posted about guns first... geez
So, did I miss anything, anyone die or anything?..

[Little Wing]

Originally Posted by bio-chem

Guns > Money


ha hahaha ah. I'm not sure many here are very good with their money. you are asking the wrong crowd.

Warren Zevon Lawyers, Guns and Money

YouTube Video

[bio-chem]

Originally Posted by Spitfire

Hey Hey Hey, I posted about guns first... geez
So, did I miss anything, anyone die or anything?..

im not sure how long you have been gone. not knowing the true identity of Mino suggests a long time though. the only thing you missed is a couple of severely handicapped individuals being banned.

DOMS was made a mod of open chat for about 3 1/2 minutes but the power went to his head and Prince had to take it away. (kidding DOMS, I should let you drive my evo for banning danny)

[WillBrink]

Originally Posted by clemson357

DAMN!!!! You need more guns.

Not just for show or fun, but even just to cover the basics. You definitely need at least a 22, a large caliber rifle, and a shotgun. I bet for the price of one of your 1911s, you could get a Ruger 10/22, and Remington 700 .308, and Remington 870 12 gauage.

Not that I am against having them, but I really have no need for either. I'm not a collector or plinker, I am a shooter, so what ever does not get used or shot, I'm not interested in. Might get a .22 at some point, but I would rather spend money on ammo and courses as I instructed biochem. Last course I took cost over $600 in ammo alone. Regular IDPA matches, range time, etc add up quickly. I would rather see someone own a single Glock, and spend their time on courses and ammo, then by additional guns.

[WillBrink]

Originally Posted by ALBOB

I am absolutely NOT flaming you so please don't take it that way. I agree with everything in your post except the word "Kimber". In my opinion Kimbers are the most overrated 1911's on the market. If I'm going to pay over a thousand dollars on a 1911 I'm going to get a top of the line STI. To get the most bang for the buck stick with Springfield Armory.

I would not give Kimber a penny of my money either. Kimber and Para, totally overrated brands well known for problems.

[WillBrink]

Originally Posted by bio-chem

. I personally couldn't understand why a guy would need 3 of the same gun model, .

Easy, one full sized for competition, hard uses, courses, etc. One commander for CCW, and one back up in case the other two are down, etc. For example, both custom guns are in the shop having some work done, so it's my cheap basic S&W for me right now. Ever put 2000rnd through a gun 2 days? Having a back up is essential if something breaks, and it can and does. I had a slide release break, and all I had to do was go to my bag and grab the back up. Again, people that dont shoot, but plink occasionally and look at their guns in the safe, don't understand what "hard use" is on guns. I may put 1000rnds a month through my guns, and thats low compared to others.

[WillBrink]

Originally Posted by 629RWHPstang

bump i have a mossberg 500 and great gun

I don't know if great is a word i would use, but cheap fire power that gets the job done. A great gun is a benelli m3 super 90 or something.

[bio-chem]

Originally Posted by WillBrink

Easy, one full sized for competition, hard uses, courses, etc. One commander for CCW, and one back up in case the other two are down, etc. For example, both custom guns are in the shop having some work done, so it's my cheap basic S&W for me right now. Ever put 2000rnd through a gun 2 days? Having a back up is essential if something breaks, and it can and does. I had a slide release break, and all I had to do was go to my bag and grab the back up. Again, people that dont shoot, but plink occasionally and look at their guns in the safe, don't understand what "hard use" is on guns. I may put 1000rnds a month through my guns, and thats low compared to others.

It really wasn't meant to be an attack. I think the rest of my post showed that. Hey, I'm a gear junkie. I think if someone has the money for their particular interest they should go nuts. as long as something hasn't become an addiction, and by that it is starting to ruin other parts of their lives then full speed ahead.