Thread: Pope Benedict XVI en route to Africa: Condoms not the answer to preventing AIDS

I really don't understand the big deal to this. Catholics are only to have sex with a spouse. That has always been their stance. They have always preached abstinence.

Whether it's realistic or not isn't the point. Does anyone really expect the Vatican to come out & approve guidelines for what to do while you are breaking one of the churches laws?


Personally I really hope the church doesn't "adapt" to today's values.

Personally, I hope the church just goes away

It needs to adapt.
Abstinence is rarely practiced.

Originally Posted by min0 lee

It needs to adapt.
Abstinence is rarely practiced.

Doesn't seem like a convincing argument.

It's not an argument it's a reality.
Do I like it?
No.

Getting back to the article above I think he's out of touch with the problem Africa has with AIDS, do you really think they will practice abstinence?
My bet is that they will prefer to use a condom and getting laid over not getting laid.

They aren't going to practice abstinence in Africa... they aren't going to use condoms either. In parts of Africa, you are considered less of a man if you use one and there is a myth that unprotected sex with a virgin can cure your AIDS... the continent is messed up and they aren't ready for condoms or abstinence

Originally Posted by min0 lee

It's not an argument it's a reality.
Do I like it?
No.

That's not my point. I know it's not realistic to expect abstinence, but do you really expect the Pope, the head of a world religion, to say "You shouldn't sin, but since I know you're going to, sin this way."

That's like saying "You shouldn't kill, but since murders are going to happen, Catholic murderers should shoot their victims in the head so there is no pain."

No.. he would just say don't kill.

That's not my point. I know it's not realistic to expect abstinence, but do you really expect the Pope, the head of a world religion, to say "You shouldn't sin, but since I know you're going to, sin this way."

Yes, if he did I think he wouldn't look so out of touch with reality.
Face it, what kid today listens to the Pope?

That's like saying "You shouldn't kill, but since murders are going to happen, Catholic murderers should shoot their victims in the head so there is no pain."

No.. he would just say don't kill.

I wouldn't compare the two.

Originally Posted by NeilPearson

They aren't going to practice abstinence in Africa... they aren't going to use condoms either. In parts of Africa, you are considered less of a man if you use one and there is a myth that unprotected sex with a virgin can cure your AIDS... the continent is messed up and they aren't ready for condoms or abstinence

It may help the educated.

Maybe a cure will be in the not too distant future

Originally Posted by busyLivin

That's not my point. I know it's not realistic to expect abstinence, but do you really expect the Pope, the head of a world religion, to say "You shouldn't sin, but since I know you're going to, sin this way."

That's like saying "You shouldn't kill, but since murders are going to happen, Catholic murderers should shoot their victims in the head so there is no pain."

No.. he would just say don't kill.

How about someone who is meant to be an authority figure and a world leader to place health above his other out dated agenda?

If even 1 life could be saved due to the use of condoms then he should be advocating there use. The fact that he hides behind church principles is sad, if thats what he truly believes then its worrying.

Originally Posted by Moondogg

How about someone who is meant to be an authority figure and a world leader to place health above his other out dated agenda?

If even 1 life could be saved due to the use of condoms then he should be advocating there use. The fact that he hides behind church principles is sad, if thats what he truly believes then its worrying.

Outdated agenda? Sex is a choice... we are not animals.

I can't think of another way to say what I've already said, but the ignorance you have is pretty thick... "hiding behind church principles"? What the hell does that even mean? The pope isn't letting people die. They are having sex with multiple partners out of wedlock & spreading a disease. The pope goes to the root of the problem that is "outdated" & now he's responsible for their deaths because he won't approve condoms.. something that works 80% of the time?

Originally Posted by busyLivin

Outdated agenda? Sex is a choice... we are not animals.

I can't think of another way to say what I've already said, but the ignorance you have is pretty thick... "hiding behind church principles"? What the hell does that even mean? The pope isn't letting people die. They are having sex with multiple partners out of wedlock & spreading a disease. The pope goes to the root of the problem that is "outdated" & now he's responsible for their deaths because he won't approve condoms.. something that works 80% of the time?

What do you mean 80% of the time? They are 98% effect when used correctly, and thats against pregnancy, they are even more effective at stopping STI transmission.

Sex is an evolutionary requirement, they are doing what they are hardwired to do. They are an LEDC and do not possess the knowledge that we do about STI's and safe sex. They still have many myths about the use of condoms within their culture and have been given mis-information about the cause of HIV over the years by their governments. They need to be taught about safe sex and how to prevent STI's. However Africa have around 60% of the worlds infected population, couple this with widespread TB and something needs to be done to bring this number down in the short term. Condom use is the answer, not abstinence.

Every thing Busy has said seems logical to me. The Pope's not the minister of health, do you think the head of Islam is going to recommend Pork as the other white meat?

Originally Posted by Moondogg

Sex is an evolutionary requirement

That ought to convince the Pope.

Originally Posted by Dale Mabry

The Pope's not the minister of health, do you think the head of Islam is going to recommend Pork as the other white meat?

Exactly. The Pope isn't a sex-ed teacher, he's a spiritual leader.

Originally Posted by Dale Mabry

Every thing Busy has said seems logical to me. The Pope's not the minister of health, do you think the head of Islam is going to recommend Pork as the other white meat?

Originally Posted by busyLivin

That ought to convince the Pope.

Originally Posted by busyLivin

Exactly. The Pope isn't a sex-ed teacher, he's a spiritual leader.

The Pope is an idiot who has no relevance in the modern world.

Comparing pork consumption to the AIDS epidemic(that has killed MILLIONS!!)?

Anyway both you guys did a good job at ignoring the second half of my post, you know the bit filled with facts and sound reasoning. Shit wait, I forgot religion was involved, sure as hell no room facts and sound reasoning in there.

What a fucking idiot.

Aids will stop spreading in Africa so quickly, as soon as
the organized RAPE parties of angry little men stop.

God damn tool.

Originally Posted by NeilPearson

Personally, I hope the church just goes away

The Catholic church isn't going anywhere

Originally Posted by min0 lee

It needs to adapt.
Abstinence is rarely practiced.

Abstinent Catholic here

Originally Posted by chiquita6683

The Catholic church isn't going anywhere




Abstinent Catholic here

Cool, but you don't find many like you.
I would only wish there were more like you.

Originally Posted by busyLivin

Exactly. The Pope isn't a sex-ed teacher, he's a spiritual leader.

Then he should have not even mentioned it in the first place.

Originally Posted by min0 lee

Then he should have not even mentioned it in the first place.

You're looking for soundbites on me! I know you know what I mean but you're twisting it!

I was responding to Moondogg going on about how the pope should be educating all of Africa about sex.

No twist here, thought you were still on the article.

Originally Posted by busyLivin

You're looking for soundbites on me! I know you know what I mean but you're twisting it!

I was responding to Moondogg going on about how the pope should be educating all of Africa about sex.

He doesnt want to educate people about safe sex, I dont give a shit. But dont go around telling people not to use condoms.

However saying that condoms arnt the answer to stopping the spread of AIDS is like saying that seatbelts dont save lives. Sure in the long term we introduce speed limits, increased policing, better driving instruction, clamp down on drink driving ect.(equivalent of sex education in Africa) but the short term answer is to wear a seatbelt(condom). The popes sugestion of abstinence is like telling people not to drive, sure its the safest option, but its not pratical in the real world and its not going to happen.

Originally Posted by Moondogg

AIDS is like saying that seatbelts dont save lives. Sure in the long term we introduce speed limits, increased policing, better driving instruction, clamp down on drink driving ect.(equivalent of sex education in Africa) but the short term answer is to wear a seatbelt(condom). The popes sugestion of abstinence is like telling people not to drive, sure its the safest option, but its not pratical in the real world and its not going to happen.

FAIL

The pope should shut the fuck up. To say that condoms aren't the absolute solution so we shouldn't promote their use in Africa IS FUCKING ABSURD. It helps, and is a solution, and they should be promoted.

Now I don't expect the Catholic church to condone the use of condoms. But to speak outright against their use in Africa in the midst of an AIDS epidemic IS FUCKING OUTRAGEOUS. Back to my first point: the pope does not have to condone their usage, he just has to shut the fuck up entirely on the subject.

He should get back to work on dying, which is why he was even appointed in the first place: to die quickly. Fucking douchebag.