Thread: WTF were the Jays thinking?

They're trying to shake things up I guess. Isn't that the same team that let Delgado go a few yeasrs back?

That is beyond shaking things up.... He is a reliever who has proven nothing other then one year. Relievers are a whacky bunch.... prolly the only closer that you feel pretty confident about is Mariano Riveria. Plus there are still Talks with AJ burnett.... and they still need some solid bats.

I dunno I am really confused by this decision.

Kind of like the White Sox signing Thome before finishing with Konerko? I see what they're doing, but it sends mixed signals to players.

Hello my fellow Canadian (Iain)

I like the signing, taking all things into consideration. I'll give you two articles, one linked and the other pasted. Im too lazy to do much else.

1) http://www.hardballtimes.com/daily/a...ryan-worth-it/

2) Defending Ryan's dealposted: Sunday, November 27, 2005 | Feedback

The landmark B.J. Ryan deal is the talk of the baseball industry, with executives from other teams stunned by how much the Blue Jays doled out to the lefty closer with 42 career saves.
Old friend Ken Rosenthal lays out all the reasons why the deal appears to be insanity. Since J.P. Ricciardi, the Blue Jays general manager, is not yet discussing the contract, let me take a stab at what his explanation will be:

1. The Blue Jays believe they will contend in the next couple of years and they need someone better than Miguel Batista at closer to do so, particularly in the meatgrinder AL East. Signing an erratic Kyle Farnsworth or an aging Todd Jones might have been a solution for 2006, but not for the long-term, and Ryan is the best closer on the market who is closer to his 30th birthday (he's 29, as of today) than his 35th birthday.

2. The Blue Jays knew they were not going to sign Billy Wagner. Conventional wisdom is that Wagner is going to land with the Mets, Phillies, Braves or Red Sox; if the Jays wanted a major upgrade at closer, it would have to be Ryan ... or Ryan. He was their only option.

3. Toronto was scared to death of what the losers in the Billy Wagner sweepstakes would do. The Mets or the Phillies, in particular, undoubtedly would have turned their attention to Ryan, the next-best-thing on the market, and during the subsequent Ryan negotiations, the market correction from the Wagner deal would have been in effect. In other words, if the Wagner negotiations played out and the Mets had won with a four-year, $44 million contract, then Ryan would have become the centerpiece of a major bidding war and the lefty's agent would have insisted that his client get at least four years and $36 million. At the outset. Paul Hoynes reports in his notebook that Ryan already had a four-year offer in hand, from the Cleveland Indians, and may have gone to a fifth year, had they been given a chance.

4. The Blue Jays believe they have to overpay for free agents this winter in order to change the perception of their club, in much the same way the Mets believed that signing Pedro Martinez would shift the thinking about their team.

It's hard to imagine that only a dozen years ago, Toronto was a place where free agents like Paul Molitor wanted to be; the team had won a championship, fans flocked to SkyDome, and the organization was thriving. When Blue Jays left-hander Jimmy Key became a free agent after the 1992 season and was courted by the Yankees, the question being asked then was whether Key would leave a great situation in Toronto and venture to the doldrums of the Bronx. He wound up taking an offer from the Yankees, of four years and $17 million, that was above and beyond the perceived market for pitchers at that time. Gene Michael, the general manager at the time, has always believed that the Key signing represented a turning point in how free agents viewed the Yankees.

The strike of '94-'95 devastated the Blue Jays, who have not been part of the postseason since 1993 and have posted winning records in only 4 of the last 12 seasons. Toronto is now widely viewed as a place where free agents don't go, and so maybe the Blue Jays believe that their $47 million is being spent on a talented lefty and organizational credibility. That's part of the reason why the Mets overpaid for Pedro, and it's got to be part of the reason why the Jays are overpaying for Ryan.

Given all those dynamics, I'm betting that Ricciardi will say that he felt he had to move fast, be aggressive, take a chance, make a pre-emptive strike. A question that executives often ask agents, at the outset of negotiations, is this: What would it take for us to close this negotiation, right now?

The answer from Ryan's side might have been five years and $47 million. And Ricciardi bit.

This deal represents an enormous gamble for the Blue Jays, because unlike the Red Sox or the Yankees, Toronto doesn't have the kind of budget to simply paper over its mistakes. If Ryan stinks or he gets hurt, the financial obligation to a pitcher with the one-season track record as closer will cripple the team. The same could be said if the Blue Jays sign A.J. Burnett to a 50-plus million dollar deal and Burnett doesn't pan out.

Ricciardi is taking his shot, and when you're operating in a mid-level market, you've only got one or two bullets to fire. Ricciardi might get a few phone calls from exasperated peers, but he's got reasons for making his play, right now.

The Ryan signing might help the Jays land Burnett, writes Bob Elliott. Peter Schmuck says he's seen crazy deals before. The Braves are in Billy Wagner chase the, but it's hard to imagine Atlanta will be willing to throw out a five-year offer for the lefty.

Originally Posted by IainDaniel

Well yesterday the Blue Jays sign B.J. Ryan to the largest contract for a reliever in MLB history. He has had one good year last year finishing 26 of 31 save attempts.

Am I the only one going WTF are they doing with a limited payroll to be dishing out close to 10 mill a season to a closer?

He had 36 saves

Well I give the Jays credit for going out and doing something. Seems like all they have done in recent years is slash payroll.

The problem I have with the Jays throwing all this money at a closer is, since their starting pitching sucks ass goblins (outside Roy Halladay), how many save chances will BJ Ryan actually get?

I dont think the rotation is as bad as you say. Actually I know it isnt.

Halladay is argueably the best pitcher in the AL
Lilly was an allstar 2 yrs ago and has been a solid #3 throughout his career
Chacin was a ROY contender, had 13w and 3.72ERA.
Towers had 13w and a 3.71ERA
Bush should be a solid 3
Batista might go back into the rotation. Always been a solid mid-rotaion guy. Good for 200 innings

AND we will get a #2. I bet it will be Burnett or a trade for Zito.

And our bullpen is one of the best in the majors. So, if you meant to say Toronto should have some of the best pitching in the league, I agree

Originally Posted by IainDaniel

Well yesterday the Blue Jays sign B.J. Ryan to the largest contract for a reliever in MLB history. He has had one good year last year finishing 26 of 31 save attempts.

Am I the only one going WTF are they doing with a limited payroll to be dishing out close to 10 mill a season to a closer?

For once it wasn't the Yanks inflating the market.

Looks like this evening the Jays will annouce that they have inked AJ Burnett to a 5 yr $55 mill Deal.

Now they need to find some bats

Is Toronto becoming the Yankees of the north?

LOL

They started this trend back in there Hay day.... The early 90's Back to Back World Series

Dave Winfield, Paul Moliter, David Cone

But they were drawing 4 million plus fans a game then. Hasn't been the same since the strike.

We def' need a big bat, slide wells to the #3

Looks like the Jays are still going to be busy this off season...

Yesterday the Jays traded Dave Bush, outfield prospect Gabe Gross and a player to be named later to Milwaukee for, Lyle Overbay, a left-handed hitter who is eligible for arbitration, batted .276 with 19 homers and 72 runs-batted in last year.

Wonder what will be happening to Eric Hinske and Shae Hillenbrand?

Obviouly it still looks like the Jays have some dealing to do.

A bit of overpayment for Overbay, but he's solid and dirt cheap for the next 3 years. This deal gives us the best right side of the diamond defensivly in the majors. I don't like giving up ZJ. I would have preferred Shea + Bush, which was rumored.

Yeah, JP still has some work to do. Our infield is way too crowded. I just nope it's not the reported Hudson + Batista for Wilkerson

Where did you hear that?

Can't remember, it was legit though.

The Jays and Cards are in a battle for Nomar too....

Ah well no worries about wilkerson now.... He was traded Yesterday.

Nomar eh? Did he even do anything with the Cubs?

Originally Posted by IainDaniel

Nomar eh? Did he even do anything with the Cubs?

No. He missed most of 2005 with a torn groin and was mildly productive when he did play.

Originally Posted by I Are Baboon

No. He missed most of 2005 with a torn groin and was mildly productive when he did play.

Yeah I thought he was out a good chunk of last year with an injury. Hasn't been the same, since his beantown days.

Even the last two years in Boston his production was nose diving.

Think he's regretting turning down a 4 year/$60 million offer from Boston in early 2004?

lol.... yep. but who would have speculated the injuries