Thread: creatine questions

I cycle creatine, and will load for the first few days then take 10g before and after working out.

Originally Posted by klc9100

i just got some creapure on sale and figured i would try it.

1> do yall use creatine while on aas? You could, but creatine would be more useful in the post cycle therapy period if you are considering one or the other. The additional benefit would probably be marginal, IMO.

2> do yall cycle creatine, or use it all the time? I cycle it since there are times when the extra water weight and occasional bloating are not desired to me. No real need to cycle it though.

3> do you load it, or just start off with the regular dose? I don't find it beneficial to load it really, I'd just stick to the daily dose

4> what is a good dosage to use?I'd recommend 5g for the average person. If you feel too bloated or like you are carrying too much water weight, cut it back to 3grams. If you aren't noticing it as much as you want, bump it up to 6 or 7 and see if that is better for you. For most, 5g is plenty.

5> do you take it pre w/o, post w/o , or does it even matter? Some people take it before, some after, some intra. All up to you. I personally usually take it after or split into two doses: one half with my preworkout meal and one with my postworkout shake. Pre-workout products have a negligable amount of creatine usually, but intra products such as sizeon would have a heft dose. Also, post-workouts such as torrent, dark matter or postal would have an adequate supply.

yes, i realize i could google this. actually, i did. i found so many different answers/opinions though, i decided to ask you guys.

thanks -

see bolded/italicized answers above. hope that helps man!

|Z|



Orbit Nutrition rep

Originally Posted by klc9100

i just got some creapure on sale and figured i would try it.

1> do yall use creatine while on aas? I don't

2> do yall cycle creatine, or use it all the time? I don't see the need for it

3> do you load it, or just start off with the regular dose? No need to load, just begin with regular dose

4> what is a good dosage to use? 5gm

5> do you take it pre w/o, post w/o , or does it even matter? IMO, it does not matter. Either way the body needs to be saturated

yes, i realize i could google this. actually, i did. i found so many different answers/opinions though, i decided to ask you guys.

thanks -

I think creatine has it place with certain people but I just dont see a NEED for it.

Originally Posted by Conrad415

I think creatine has it place with certain people but I just dont see a NEED for it.

. . the same statement could be made regarding use of Gears

does creatine increase risk of gyno?

i know during my current cycle i had itchy nips and noticeable waterweight under my left arm then i stopped doing creatine and it went away after about a week.

Originally Posted by scaryclown34

does creatine increase risk of gyno?

i know during my current cycle i had itchy nips and noticeable waterweight under my left arm then i stopped doing creatine and it went away after about a week.

I've never heard of creatine affecting gyno

i think i heard somewhere that ppl with higher bf % have a higher risk of getting gyno

Originally Posted by scaryclown34

does creatine increase risk of gyno?

i know during my current cycle i had itchy nips and noticeable waterweight under my left arm then i stopped doing creatine and it went away after about a week.

No. Creatine does not elicit any responses from the endocrine system that would cause any kind of disturbance to homeostasis.

If you got itchy nips from creatine then it could be a highly uncommon, quasi-allergic reaction to it, but its not giving you gyno.

well creatine does cause water retention. and roids cause water retention. im no expert but could it be that AIs and anti estrogens only block water weight from roids cuz its estrogen related and creatine water weight is not from estrogen?


idk if anything else other than estrogen causes water weight all i know is i was taking arimadex EOD and creatine everyday on cycle and couple weeks in i got itchy nips, i took 20 mgs nolva for 3 days started doing adex ED and cut out the creatine and lowerd my doses of roids. the itching went away completely a week after

so theres several things i did it could be any # of them but i was just thinking u want to fight water weight with AIs and Anti Es so wouldnt creatine be counter productive?

Originally Posted by |Z|

see bolded/italicized answers above. hope that helps man!

|Z|



Orbit Nutrition rep

I agree with all of this. I use it on AAS cycle as it does exacerbate the effects of creatine.

Originally Posted by scaryclown34

well creatine does cause water retention. and roids cause water retention. im no expert but could it be that AIs and anti estrogens only block water weight from roids cuz its estrogen related and creatine water weight is not from estrogen?


idk if anything else other than estrogen causes water weight all i know is i was taking arimadex EOD and creatine everyday on cycle and couple weeks in i got itchy nips, i took 20 mgs nolva for 3 days started doing adex ED and cut out the creatine and lowerd my doses of roids. the itching went away completely a week after

so theres several things i did it could be any # of them but i was just thinking u want to fight water weight with AIs and Anti Es so wouldnt creatine be counter productive?

Water retention has nothing to do with gyno. Gyno is a result of the estrogen/testosterone ratio gone array due to suppression. Creatine is nowhere near the estro/test pathways, and has no zero direct influence over it. Gyno isn't water in the chest either, it's fat pocket, which creatine has no effect on.

Creatine is a phosphate. All it does is sit in your blood stream waiting to be used or not be used, it doesn't directly elicit any responses from the endocrine system, but more so acts as a middle man. Our muscles use adenosintriphosphates (ATP) or 1 adenine + 3 phosphates, for forceful contractions. When the muscle consumes ATP, a phosphate breaks off from the ATP and releases it's energy potential, where ATP then becomes ADP or adenosindiphosphate.

The effect of having a high Creatine phosphate concentration in the blood is that once the ATP is broken down to ADP, rather then waiting on the body's Krebb Cycle and Electron Transport Chain to produce more ATP, the Creatine phosphate offers it's phosphate chain to the ADP, thereby, automatically creating another ATP.

None of which has anything to do with estrogen or test production or suppression, which makes the issue of gyno a completely independent matter relative to creatine.

Originally Posted by VolcomX311

Water retention has nothing to do with gyno. Gyno is a result of the estrogen/testosterone ratio gone array due to suppression. Creatine is nowhere near the estro/test pathways, and has no zero direct influence over it. Gyno isn't water in the chest either, it's fat pocket, which creatine has no effect on.

Creatine is a phosphate. All it does is sit in your blood stream waiting to be used or not be used, it doesn't directly elicit any responses from the endocrine system, but more so acts as a middle man. Our muscles use adenosintriphosphates (ATP) or 1 adenine + 3 phosphates, for forceful contractions. When the muscle consumes ATP, a phosphate breaks off from the ATP and releases it's energy potential, where ATP then becomes ADP or adenosindiphosphate.

The effect of having a high Creatine phosphate concentration in the blood is that once the ATP is broken down to ADP, rather then waiting on the body's Krebb Cycle and Electron Transport Chain to produce more ATP, the Creatine phosphate offers it's phosphate chain to the ADP, thereby, automatically creating another ATP.

None of which has anything to do with estrogen or test production or suppression, which makes the issue of gyno a completely independent matter relative to creatine.

that's good shit right there. thanks...

i guess i just have gyno paranoia. but i guess since its something u only once theres no way to tell if u have it before its too late

Does creatine compete for the same pathway as glutamine?

i.e. if true, should they be taken seperately?

Originally Posted by Realtalk

Does creatine compete for the same pathway as glutamine?

i.e. if true, should they be taken seperately?

good question.

ok, so my mono came in yesterday. i started taking it this morning. i was reading on the label and it said taking "high doses" of caffiene would prevent the performance enhancing properties of creatine. i wonder what constitutes a "high dose".

i ususally take 200mg of caffiene preworkout and then a cup or two of coffee when i get to work, about an after my workout.

i wonder if that's gonna make the creatine not work. . .

Originally Posted by klc9100

ok, so my mono came in yesterday. i started taking it this morning. i was reading on the label and it said taking "high doses" of caffiene would prevent the performance enhancing properties of creatine. i wonder what constitutes a "high dose".

i ususally take 200mg of caffiene preworkout and then a cup or two of coffee when i get to work, about an after my workout.

i wonder if that's gonna make the creatine not work. . .

The only relationship between caffeine and creatine, in how they detrimentally effect each other, is a very indirect one and this relationship is ambiguous and contains a ton of mediating variables.

One of PCr’s (phosphocreatine aka creatine phosphate aka creatine mono) primary roles in muscle is to provide the energy to return calcium into muscle stores. In this manner creatine (PCr) assists in muscle relaxation and enhances our athletic performance. Interestingly, caffeine has the opposite effect of allowing calcium to escape from these intracellular calcium storage sites. Caffeine would thus hamper muscle relaxation. In agreement with these findings a recent study has shown that caffeine interferes with creatine’s ability to facilitate muscle relaxation, especially during moments of fatigue. Caffeine "might" therefore, confound the ability of PCr to store away calcium and in doing so nullify part of creatine’s benefit.

In Laymen's terms, strength is both a combination of muscle contraction combined with a "lack" of co-contraction, meaning, when you bicep curl, the more tense or contracted your triceps remain, the more it takes away from the biceps curl. When muscles co-contract, its detrimental to the agonist muscle in the lift. Therefore, in a biceps curl, the more relaxed your triceps remain, the greater force you can produce from your bi's into curling the weight.

Theoretically, caffeine is an antagonist to muscle relaxation, therefore, an agonist of co-contraction and therefore, therefore, detrimental to strength, therefore, therefore, therefore, comes the conclusion that caffeine detrimentally effects creatine.

That said, studies also show that caffeine increases the effects of creatine if used together (say pre-workout). Cumulative use of caffeine is what "could" effect creatine, via promoting co-contraction, as stimulants are antagonistic to muscle relaxation.

All that said, again, these studies use these very general terms such as "increase" or "decrease" without quantifying any variables, so is "decreased," decreased by .0000001%? or .0001%? or 1%? or 2, 3?

Take home message, don't worry about it. The mediating variables off the top of my head are too long to list.