Thread: Plasma Expandor and Glutamine

Aw come on, no one has anything to say? That's a first.

Is Plasma Expandor a good choice? Or should i just stick with basic creatine powder?

Beyond that i was planning on finally supplementing with Glutamine... is that all i need?

plasma expander is a creatine product?
as far as i understand most of those are crap

and glutamine is good, but just remember that u do no NEED anything, they're called supplements for a reason...

hehe i think i stole the phrase 'they're called supplements for a reason...' from somebody, prob w8 or DP lol

Well sure i dont need anything... but i'd like all the help i can get.

Yeah Plasma Expandor is a creatine product. Apparently it has a transport effect without the sugar. GoPro had a couple threads in which he chronicled his use of it, had some great results.

Plasma Expandor is a great creatine product, but for a quick bulk you may want something with more sugar and cals like Cell Tech, which is basically quality creatine with sugar (but it has cals which is needed to bulk).

Glutamine is great but needs to be used at 20+ g per day.

Mainly you need more calories from protein, carbs, and EFAs. You also need to train for size...heavy, basic, intense and short!

Originally posted by gopro
Plasma Expandor is a great creatine product, but for a quick bulk you may want something with more sugar and cals like Cell Tech, which is basically quality creatine with sugar (but it has cals which is needed to bulk).

Glutamine is great but needs to be used at 20+ g per day.

Mainly you need more calories from protein, carbs, and EFAs. You also need to train for size...heavy, basic, intense and short!

Blech, Cell Tech? Isn't that stuff like 90g of sugar a scoop?

Originally posted by Monolith
Blech, Cell Tech? Isn't that stuff like 90g of sugar a scoop?

Right but if your bulking and it's post workout shouldn't hurt none execpt in th wallet I'd rather buy some dextrose and put that with some reg powder creatine and save the cash.Also when I bulk I eat as soon as I wake up but it's a problem since I never really feel like eating when I wake up(unless it's junk food) so I make a weight gainer shake in the morning whey+peanut butter+oat meal+fruit also use this at night somtimes

If you buy cell tech, you deserve to be beaten with a blunt object. Repeatedly. Or PE, for that matter.

My guess is you are also wasting your time and money with Glutatime as well.

Originally posted by Twin Peak
My guess is you are also wasting your time and money with Glutatime as well.

Why is Glutamine a waste of time/money?

My *understanding* of the science/research is that it is a promising supplement if used at the proper time and at the proper dose.

But, in practice, the bodybuilding community has yet to figure out what those are.

So, for example, many people (myself included) have used it with little or no results. And, annecdotaly, I have used it at various different dosages (including over 20g per day), with NO results.

Compound that with the fact that it is relatively expensive (at the higher doses especially) and I think most people are better off saving their money for a better product, or for when the science is figured out (which probably isn't that far off).

On the otherhand Prince, if you, or anyone else has used it AND experienced significant differences, then by all means please continue.

Notice I didn't say the phrase that you used to paraphrase my statement: "Why is Glutamine a waste of time/money?"

Normally, I use my words very precisely. Also, there was context. You took my statement a bit out of context, and reshaped it, as well.

Here, the context was someone not previously familiar with this product who has in the past used nothing but whey protein (thus meaning there are lots of other supplements he could spend his money on).

Lastly, I stated: My guess is you

Word choice....context...both very important.

Why would you use gultamine while bulking anyway wouldn't you get more than enough through your diet?

Twin Peak, I did not take your words out of context.

You said: "My guess is you are also wasting your time and money with Glutatime as well."

I asked: "Why is Glutamine a waste of time/money?"

It's pretty straight forward, you implied that using Glutamine is a waste of time/money, and I simply asked why you you believe that. Maybe you meant that it's a waste of time and money based on his knowledge and experience, but if you did you were not clear in that post.

Maybe some day you will be capable of answering a simple question with out being an arrogant asshole, but I doubt it.

Cheers

Originally posted by Prince
Twin Peak, I did not take your words out of context.

You said: "My guess is you are also wasting your time and money with Glutatime as well."

I asked: "Why is Glutamine a waste of time/money?"

It's pretty straight forward, you implied that using Glutamine is a waste of time/money, and I simply asked why you you believe that. Maybe you meant that it's a waste of time and money based on his knowledge and experience, but if you did you were not clear in that post.

Maybe some day you will be capable of answering a simple question with out being an arrogant asshole, but I doubt it.

Cheers

Thank you.

The lost art of reading comprehension. Once upon a time, it was commonplace. Today, it has become an art. So unfortunate.

So many arrogant jerks amongst us, oh how I wish we were all so superior in our intellects, so unfortunate.

Originally posted by Prince
So many arrogant jerks amongst us, oh how I wish we were all so superior in our intellects, so unfortunate.

Yeah, but not to worry - me and TP keep you all in line.

I have no worries.

Yeah, that's a Good Thing [TM]

Stress is bad, mmmkay?...

Ok fellas...

1- there is nothing wrong with Cell Tech...just because we all hate their advertising that does not make the product bad...some people don't want to buy their dextrose and creatine seperately, and if you have the extra cash, Cell Tech is fine...it contains SKW creatine, which is the best, and 75 g of dextrose per serving...this is great for someone to use post workout if bulking.

2- for Twin Peak...no disrespect at all my friend, but I'm sick and tired of you and TCD (not in this thread, but in others) saying that glutamine is worthless while bulking and that it did nothing for you...just because you guys have not seen benefits from it does not mean it is universal truth...I have seen tremendous gains from glutamine and so have my clients...I have every one of my serious clients on the stuff and they all do better when using it...perhaps it does not work so great for everyone, just like creatine, but I have seen it work first hand over and over very consistently, so don't call it useless...just say it didn't work for ME!

And before you get huffy, remember, there is NO DISRESPECT meant toward you in this post...after all, you are a neighbor of mine...

I appreciate all the replies!

TP.

I think im gonna take a neutral approach - i'm going to pick up some glutamine powder and take it for 2 weeks. That's all i'm going to use... no creatine, no nothin. Diet will stay the same too. So this stuff will be the one and only variable. If i notice a difference, i might keep using it. If not, i won't.

Originally posted by Monolith
I appreciate all the replies!

TP.

I think im gonna take a neutral approach - i'm going to pick up some glutamine powder and take it for 2 weeks. That's all i'm going to use... no creatine, no nothin. Diet will stay the same too. So this stuff will be the one and only variable. If i notice a difference, i might keep using it. If not, i won't.

1-two weeks is not enough time to make a determination
2-make sure you are using a quality brand
3-make sure you are taking at least 20 g on training days and at least 10 g on off days
4-if you use regular l-glutamine make sure you take it on a completely empty stomach
5-use it at the right times...morning, before training, after training, before bed

Originally posted by gopro
Ok fellas...

1- there is nothing wrong with Cell Tech...just because we all hate their advertising that does not make the product bad...some people don't want to buy their dextrose and creatine seperately, and if you have the extra cash, Cell Tech is fine...it contains SKW creatine, which is the best, and 75 g of dextrose per serving...this is great for someone to use post workout if bulking.

2- for Twin Peak...no disrespect at all my friend, but I'm sick and tired of you and TCD (not in this thread, but in others) saying that glutamine is worthless while bulking and that it did nothing for you...just because you guys have not seen benefits from it does not mean it is universal truth...I have seen tremendous gains from glutamine and so have my clients...I have every one of my serious clients on the stuff and they all do better when using it...perhaps it does not work so great for everyone, just like creatine, but I have seen it work first hand over and over very consistently, so don't call it useless...just say it didn't work for ME!

And before you get huffy, remember, there is NO DISRESPECT meant toward you in this post...after all, you are a neighbor of mine...

No disresepct taken.

1) I never said Celltech was poor quality. Indeed it is average (lots of other equal products out there). My problem with celltech is not even the advertising, its the price. You can by and equal product for half the price, or you can by quality creatine and bulk dextrose for 1/6th the price. So if someone has the money to burn....by all means. But EVERYONE would be better off buying a cheaper product and spending the extra money on other supplements, their significant other, or throwing the money out teh car window.

2) I am shocked that you are "sick and tired" of me stating as much. It is SHOCKING since I don't think I have ever done so before. If I have, please show me.

That said, again, my statement was misconstrued. I NEVER said it was USELESS. I only said it was a waste of money FOR MONOLITH. That is my opinion and I stand by it. I also said that for the price, he could better spend that money on supplements that will have a greater impact. I also said:

- The research looks good for glutamine.
- Its just not properly used yet (again for the price, context people).
- I believe that in the near future, it will be better understood.

Now, GP, I also said that if someone uses it already, with success, keep going.

Also, you should never get "sick and tired" of anyone stating something like I have on a product or a particulat supplement. Varying opinions, my friend, are indeed a good thing, as there are few universal truths in this business.

Finally, GP, if you'd like to discuss/debate this further, I'd be happy to. But if Prince wants to address this, I shall not comment further, since apparantly he cannot do so without namecalling. This is the third discussion that Prince has started using derogatory languange. So from now on I will not respond to any of his posts.

BTW, I agree with GP that with a product like glutamine, 2 weeks is not enough time to tell. Which, BTW, is part of the reason why I think it is (CURRENTLY) not worth the money.

Originally posted by Twin Peak
No disresepct taken.

1) I never said Celltech was poor quality. Indeed it is average (lots of other equal products out there). My problem with celltech is not even the advertising, its the price. You can by and equal product for half the price, or you can by quality creatine and bulk dextrose for 1/6th the price. So if someone has the money to burn....by all means. But EVERYONE would be better off buying a cheaper product and spending the extra money on other supplements, their significant other, or throwing the money out teh car window.

I WASN'T REALLY REFERRING TO YOU ABOUT CELL TECH

2) I am shocked that you are "sick and tired" of me stating as much. It is SHOCKING since I don't think I have ever done so before. If I have, please show me.

SORRY, I WAS REALLY LUMPING YOU IN WITH TCD

That said, again, my statement was misconstrued. I NEVER said it was USELESS. I only said it was a waste of money FOR MONOLITH. That is my opinion and I stand by it. I also said that for the price, he could better spend that money on supplements that will have a greater impact. I also said:

- The research looks good for glutamine.
- Its just not properly used yet (again for the price, context people).
- I believe that in the near future, it will be better understood.

COMPELETLY DISAGREE...GLUTAMINE IS ONE OF THE FIRST SUPPS BODYBUILDERS SHOULD TAKE...BEFORE CREATINE, PROHORMONES, ETC. IT WOULD BE A GREAT CHOICE FOR MONOLITH OR ANYONE ELSE. ITS NOT EVEN THAT EXPENSIVE. BESIDES...ANYONE WHO IS WILLING TO SHELL OUT THE DOUGH FOR 1-TEST OR 1-AD SHOULD NOT COMPLAIN ABOUT PRICE.

Now, GP, I also said that if someone uses it already, with success, keep going.

Also, you should never get "sick and tired" of anyone stating something like I have on a product or a particulat supplement. Varying opinions, my friend, are indeed a good thing, as there are few universal truths in this business.

I AM SICK AND TIRED...WHY...BECAUSE THE MAJORITY OF PEOPLE TALK OUT OF THEIR ASS. I MAY KNOW A LITTLE ABOUT FIXING CARS, BUT I AM NO MECHANIC. I AM CERTAINLY NOT GOING TO SAY TO A GOOD MECHANIC..."NO, YOU ARE TAKING APART MY ENGINE INCORRECTLY. I READ AN ARTICLE ABOUT THIS!" I DO THIS FOR A LIVING. DAY IN AND DAY OUT. THIS IS NOT MY HOBBY, IT IS MY LIFE. I CONSIDER MYSELF MORE QUALIFIED THAN ANYONE ELSE ACCEPT FOR OTHERS THAT DO WHAT I DO OR MORE.

Finally, GP, if you'd like to discuss/debate this further, I'd be happy to. But if Prince wants to address this, I shall not comment further, since apparantly he cannot do so without namecalling. This is the third discussion that Prince has started using derogatory languange. So from now on I will not respond to any of his posts.

WELL, I CAN'T ANSWER FOR PRINCE, BUT I DON'T REALLY WANT TO DISCUSS THIS FURTHER ANYWAY B/C THERE IS NOTHING TO DISCUSS.

My God.

How can you compare glutamine to 1-AD/1-T?!

Two weeks of either two of those compounds will yield a shit-load more muscle growth than ten weeks of glutamine.

Anyway, here's a post of mine from WBB - my opinion on the topic. I think this pretty much sums up my stance on the stuff.

"For even remote muscle enhancing effects from glutamine you need to take really high amounts (into the 30-50g region a day), and the cost really start to mount up quickly.

If you have the money to burn, then knock yourself out.

The only time i would use glutamine is during the latter stages of dieting down.

Most commercial wheys include added glutamine anyway. And if you're in calorie surplus and eating enough protein, a small 5g of glutamine here and there won't make head-nor-tail difference. In fact, i'm sure i've read somewhere by mauro Pascale that the body can synthesize up to 150g of glutamine a day from the available EAAs anyway. I can't remember where i read it though, sorry, nor can i recall if it was an actual Mauro pascale quote.

It is an inessential amino acid that is only really required in higher amounts during intense stress. More stress than i imagine the 40-60 minute weight lifting session is going to generate. The only exisitng proof to show that glutamine promotes protein synthesis, glycogen replenishment and anything else remotely anabolic to a significant degree was done intravenously. oral glutamine mostly gets taken up by the epithelial cells in the gut (although that makes glutamine quite decent for intestinal health). Which is why you really need to take large amounts.

The peptide versions apparently aid in getting more past the gut, so you won't need to take quite as much, but these versions tend to be a bit more pricey, so the overall cost is more or less the same. For me, far too much to warrant purchase for these aims.

It can boost gluthione (or however it is spelled) levels to some degree too, but there are cheaper ways of achieving this.

A few grams on an empty stomach has been shown to produce a hGH response - nothing major, but can be useful during the latter stages of a cut when you're trying to rid your more stubborn bodyfat. Which i why i have a 500g tub sitting upstairs waiting to be used for this very reason. I'm not pinning much on it though."

Hey schmuck.

Its Dr. Mauro Di Pasquale.

Thanks as always TCD. I knew you'd put your 2 cents in!

By the way...I am not "comparing" 1-Test to glutamine, just questioning the cost to benefit ratio, especially long term. Plus, some people are not willing to "manipulate" their hormones as 1-Test may as well be considered a steroid.

Originally posted by Twin Peak
Hey schmuck.

Its Dr. Mauro Di Pasquale.

I must say that this post just cracked me up!

Originally posted by gopro
Thanks as always TCD. I knew you'd put your 2 cents in!

By the way...I am not "comparing" 1-Test to glutamine, just questioning the cost to benefit ratio, especially long term. Plus, some people are not willing to "manipulate" their hormones as 1-Test may as well be considered a steroid.

BTW, GP, I never intended to imply that Mono should use 1-test or any PH. Indeed, my comments were devoid of PHs, and I do not recommend them for someone relatively new to hardcore training.

Also, some of us get our PHs for free, making them quite cost effective.