not another Swole thread! quick question about it, should I...

[brennan]

hey guys sorry for the hundreth Swole V2 thread. Just wondering if I should cycle it? and wat's ur thoughts on V12? thanks

[Var]

There's a lot of debate over this one, but I'm convinced that creatine should be cycled.
As far as the San V12...I really like that product. I've been on Swole for 2 or 3 weeks now and I'm not getting the results others have. If I don't see some considerable benefits soon, I'll definitely switch back to the San.

[Rocco32]

How much do you weight Var? Sometimes it helps I've heard to double the dose.

[Mudge]

I have seen nothing that creatine cycling is neccessary, it is not a drug.

[HoldDaMayo]

I sense a challenge coming on...

[firestorm]

Originally posted by Mudge
I have seen nothing that creatine cycling is neccessary, it is not a drug.

Mudge, I've actually read in a few places that you should cycle "creatine" because it could somehow effect your own bodies natural production of it.
Someone else on here and I don't remember who and which thread said that Swole did Not have to be cycled because it is not actually Creatine. It volumizes as Creatine does but not creatine. I don't know bro, I cycle everything except Protein powders.
I say,,,, when in doubt, cycle.

[Dale Mabry]

I concur with Mudge. There is no evidence of negative feedbakc or downgrading of receptors when deealing with creatine. There is, however, a downgrading of the wallet, which is why I tend to take a week or 2 off after being on for a while.

[firestorm]

Otay, I've been out voted.... stay on it brother. hahahaha

[Var]

I'm only 160lbs, so I think the two scoops a day should be enough. As far as cycling goes, I've found that it works for me. My gains start to flatten out after a few months on it. I stop taking it for 2-3 weeks and start making gains again when I go back on. I'm not sugesting that creatine is a drug and should be treated as one. Just saying I've tried this several times and it always works for me...regardless of what research has found so far.

[Var]

Just wanted to clarify something...I'm not saying this product is useless. Just that I dont see how its any better than the SAN V12. I'm getting decent pumps and strength with the Swole. I guess I just expected it to be dramatically different than the V12 after reading the feedback on the forums. Still far better than regular creatine.

[firestorm]

Originally posted by Var
I'm only 160lbs, so I think the two scoops a day should be enough. As far as cycling goes, I've found that it works for me. My gains start to flatten out after a few months on it. I stop taking it for 2-3 weeks and start making gains again when I go back on. I'm not sugesting that creatine is a drug and should be treated as one. Just saying I've tried this several times and it always works for me...regardless of what research has found so far.

I can totally relate to that statement Var. research says this so it must be the word of God. Shit man, if I listened to all the so called "research" I wouldn't be in here asking for "real" peoples opinions on products and routines. One study can say one thing while another can say just the opposite.

[BabsieGirl]

SwoleV.2 does not need to be cycled, which, is a benefit....HOWEVER,

The two compounds, GPA & Glycocyamine, which is used in combinations with Betaine for treatment of certain neurological disorders. Betaine is considered highly beneficial for the liver, as is Taurine, and Taurine is also considered protective for the brain.



To the best of Syntrax knowledge and all available research, the formulation of Swole V.2 is extremely safe even for long term use. Regardless, as with most supplements, it is probably best to take some time off every so often! This is a generalized statement....it's CYA.


Go here to learn more about the ingredients in your supps...

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/PubMed/

[BabsieGirl]

Here....A little Creatine FaQ

Individuals who have a history of kidney or liver dysfunction or who are on medications should check with their physician before using creatine. Creatine use should always be voluntary.
In the muscle, creatine facilitates the production of energy needed for muscle contractions and other essential metabolic functions in the form of creatine phosphate (CP). Creatine monohydrate is used as a supplemental source of creatine because creatine phosphate is readily broken down in the intestinal tract where creatine monohydrate is absorbed unchanged.


Creatine helps the body regenerate ATP, especially in fast twitch muscle fibers (low mitochondrial density fibers). Thus elevated levels of muscle creatine improve our ability to do high force producing activities, especially to failure or lactic acid threshold.
Creatine is produced by the liver, pancreas, and kidneys from three amino acids (methionine, glycine and arginine). To augment muscle creatine content significantly from the diet large amounts of raw animal protein are required that is just not practical or healthy. Individuals with low creatine levels (vegetarians) show the greatest muscle creatine uptake during supplementation.


Creatine shows up in the blood significantly 30-60 minutes after consumption and is taken up in greater amounts by working muscles (like carbohydrate). As a result we focus our consumption of creatine around bouts of training or competition to maximize uptake.
Transport into the cell occurs against a concentration gradient with sodium. Thus you have to dose enough creatine at one time to create a high enough concentration in the extracellular space and we typically consume it with a sports drink that further potentiates uptake due to the actions of insulin.
More creatine is not better when it comes to keeping intramuscular concentrations optimized. Dosing protocol is based on turnover or degradation rate of creatine in skeletal muscle, primarily fast twitch fibers and body mass. The more intense the training and the larger the individual the greater the amount taken per dose.


Creatine is typically used after athletes have finished vertical growth or who have exhibited consistent wo0 lbs. use 10 g. before and 7.5 g. after activity.
HARD GAINERS
About 2-3 hours after training a third dose can be into the recovery phase (after activity) on the hardest days of training or add between breakfast and lunch. Typically this is about 2.5-7.5 g. depending upon weight.

CYCLE QUANTITY
You can cycle the number of servings taken relative to the intensity of the training bout. For example: Go full dose early in the week and back off 2.5-5 grams on the pre or post activity dose towards the end of the week. When training is intense, but short we use pre and drop post dose. When intensity is low, but volume is moderate to high we use post and drop pre dose.

OFF DAYS
When severe muscle soreness is experienced on off lifting days use a post activity dose after stretching or some physical activity designed to increase blood flow to sore muscles that is not to invasive (work in cold pool-light loading).

PRACTICE
During the athletes taking the most reps in practice and competition will use creatine before practice and before or after lifting depending upon if they lift before or after practice to help maintain the quality of gains attained in the off season. Again light days typically require half doses before or after depending upon the intensity or volume.

COMPETITION
Because resistance training loads are reduced prior to competition use in the three days before competition should be focused on pre and post practice/warm up or stretch. As the intensity of the load in the days prior to training is reduced so can the quantity of creatine consumed. If the cumulative stress of the season has left an athlete feeling chronically fatigued then we may use the taper days before competition to load creatine into the muscle with active rest loads using full doses (pre and post activity). Because the length of the active rest loads are short in duration pre and post dose may require some more time between consumption (2 hrs. or so). Typically we back off the post work dose.

On the day of competition many athletes like the ergogenic effect they get from creatine and use it before competition with a sports drink and after competition with a liquid meal for recovery. Pre and post workout doses are used that are typical of what the athlete has used during training. Don't try anything new on the day of competition that the athlete has not worked with during training!

SEDENTARY
If you are not doing any significant work loads or competing do not waste your time or money consuming creatine. Many creatine retailers recommend daily consumption regardless of activity to move more product. You do not have to take creatine every day of your life once you start!

WASH OUT
When natural breaks in between seasons occur we recommend that athletes cycle off creatine completely. As they resume off-season training loads or change training modes we recommend cycling down or off doses during the initial two weeks of training to force adaptations to these new loads without the aid of creatine then going back to full doses on week three. This cycling or periodization of creatine use relative to load will help ensure that you continue to respond to benefits of creatine. This cycling will also force your genetic capacity to facilitate work under suboptimal conditions to be developed. This will come in handy under the most grueling of metabolic circumstances. Don't let any supplements use become a biochemical crutch that circumvents your own genetic potential to do work.

G.I. DISTURBANCES
When you start to use creatine some individuals experience gastric disturbances. Your body will adapt to this in a short time. You can lessen the initial gastric stress by dissolving creatine in a warm beverage or diluting it in a larger volume of liquid (liter). Allowing more time between the pre and post dose also helps. Sensitive individuals may take the second dose with a meal initially. Dilution over liquid will be less invasive then taking a pill or capsule form of creatine with regards to gastric distress.

Avoid cork habits in the weight room, but have hit a point in their resistance training where they are struggling to make gains. Some elite athletes in lactic acid or high power output sports also use creatine to enhance their performance during competition and training vs. trying to gain weight.

USE FOR RESISTANCE TRAINING

One level scoop (11 cc) equals 5 grams. Mixing creatine with an isotonic sports drink can help improve uptake by working muscles. Make sure you rinse the contain you mix in to ensure you have taken in the correct dose.